[T] New Ideas: Units, UI, Gameplay - Page 23

NiGoL

1868 Posts

November 25 2008 17:35 GMT

#441

On November 23 2008 11:05 Sadist wrote:
Starcraft 2 with Ingame korean commentating similar to that of Madden or NBA Live

how sick would that be, maybe even if its just select words........ that would be awesome

yaa that wold be so amazing!

SirTea

United States48 Posts

November 25 2008 23:35 GMT

#442

Mana Shield - Might need a better name (Mind Shield ?), but this should be descriptive enough. When activated the Archon will take damage on his mana supply instead of his shield.
Initially I thought this would require the archon to have a pretty low mana supply, so as to not make this ability too strong - but a poster on the BNet forums came up with an elegant solution;

You wouldn't have to limit the energy to 100, all you would have to do is balance energy with less shields so:

SCI Archon = 350 shields, no energy
SC2 Twilight Archon = 150 shields, 200 energy

so it stays as a heavy assault unit as long as it doesn't use any of the abilities (besides the 'Energy shield' which is always on).... if it uses the abilities then it becomes weaker.

so if you have a group of Twilight Archons, some use their abilities (getting weaker) while others simply attack as normal.

This would mean that Twilight Archons regain "shields" at twice the standard rate, correct?
+1 energy and +1 shield.

WoodenSpider

United States85 Posts

November 27 2008 18:30 GMT

#443

hey yeah, the siphon mana thing is a little too much, though. means you could have invincible archons with a little micro. though that would mean that you have to wait like 3 and a half minutes to get archons up to their full sheild level.

I like the idea, would make archons more of a flexible unit. could even become like a second backbone unit like the stalker.

Mazer

Canada1086 Posts

November 28 2008 17:23 GMT

#444

Not sure if this has been mentioned before, but allowing in game observers to be able to follow a player's first person view would be really cool.

Ki_Do

Korea (South)981 Posts

November 30 2008 21:51 GMT

#445

Not sure if this has been mentioned be4 but why not implement Autobuy/Infinite Unit Queue without costing money for each unit after teh first one, it can be set off tho.
Thus players can focus more on strategy T.T isnt this part of this so called evolution?

Magonushi

United States1 Post

December 01 2008 22:46 GMT

#446

This may have already been suggested but for trading resources between players why not have all trade amounts trickle into the receiving party's pockets rather than be transfered instantaneously? With play-testing this could be balanced to counter problems with early game imbalances while retaining late game usefulness.

The rate could be based on resources/second or percent/second. To avoid artificial rates all resources would have to be drained the moment of the trade. This means that if your team is going to trade between one another, then for the length of the transaction time some of your team's collective resources are unusable.

InRaged

1047 Posts

December 03 2008 03:47 GMT

#447

On November 12 2008 03:42 FrozenArbiter wrote:
I want to talk about the archon.

[rest of the post omitted]

Yeah, immolation definitely fits archon. I remember, archons had ability that makes them deal double damage on their first attack, no? Even if blizz thought about giving them some very powerful ability, than it surely viable

I wanna play a bit on your concept, though. I hope you don't mind ;P

"We need focus!.."

Conceptually, this energy cloud that surrounds Archon is both his Shield and Mana. He manipulates this cloud to attack his enemies and once in a while, when the energy becomes especially tense and obstinate he releases it, which in effect literally melts everything that happens to be nearby.
Now, how it could be implemented.

Twilight Archon
"We burn!.."

Stats:
10 hp
250 energy (i.e. shied)

If his energy is lower than 250 it will regenerate until it's 250 points again, just like the rest of the protoss.
If it's higher than 250 it will decrease until it's 250 points again.
energy limit: 500.

Siphon Mana:
AoE spell that takes up to 200 energy points (that is, both mana and shields) from any unit inside the area, including your own units, and gives it to the caster. Doesn't cost energy, but has delay after cast

This energy is divided among targets, i.e.: if there's only 1 infestor with full mana points, he will lose 200 points; if there are 3 medievacs it will drain 67 mana points from each of them; if there's 10 protoss units, it will take 20 shield points from each of them (if they have any, of course).

Energy Burn / Energy Outburst / Immolation (whatever fits better):
For the cost of 300 energy points deals vast amount of damage around the caster
All I can say, it should be bigger than 3x damage of his regular attack.

Trivia:
- First of, the fact that Siphon Mana works on your own regular units makes it both interesting and tricky to use
- Siphon Mana is reminiscent of EMP (or even EMP + reverse shield battery), but EMP is gone so it's fine.
- If we gonna make Energy Burn very powerful, we should also somewhat mark visually archons that have enough energy to cast it, so opponent can better adapt to it. Dark Archon from Brood War can be utilized for that, that is, if Archon has more than 300 energy he would change his color to red :3 That makes sense! ;P

fonger

United Kingdom1218 Posts

December 03 2008 07:21 GMT

#448

I'll preface this by saying that I have spent about 15 minutes scanning through every post in this thread, but I'm not particularly interested in new unit ideas etc so I haven't read these in depth. Apologies if this has already been posted and I've missed it.

Macro Mechanic Suggestion:

My suggestion is that each production building (thinking Terran and Protoss here) have its own stockpile of resources, which will need to be replenished periodically by the player to ensure a smooth production flow. Perhaps the player would need to assign a worker to a "supply run" between a nearby supply depot or pylon and a production building.

Catch is that - depending on the distance between the supply structure (depot/pylon) and the production building, the worker will tend to restock too fast unless manually toggled between production buildings at appropriate intervals.

I don't pretend to have thought through all the possible negative implications, but I can see a potential "logical" flaw in that these workers would need to carry significantly more to the buildings on each run than they do on a mining run.

Perhaps it could be made noob-friendly by having the SCV that finishes the building automatically and immediately start a supply run to that building.

Edit: god, upon reflection this looks awful o.o I think I'll stick to playing.

Klockan3

Sweden2866 Posts

December 03 2008 17:49 GMT

#449

Colossus:

Make it behave exactly as now, just give it another ability:
Old scarabs! Just limit it to 1 scarab per colossi (Upgraded to 2?) and it do not fire them automatically, its an ability to fire. Also since its in a much stronger vessel etc the scarabs costs ~25 minerals +~25 gas now and take much longer to build.

Liquid`Jinro

Sweden33719 Posts

December 03 2008 17:55 GMT

#450

On November 26 2008 02:35 SassO wrote:

Show nested quote +

yaa that wold be so amazing!

Haha I agree wholeheartedly

Hopefully Blizzard does too, they could make it an easter egg or something.

"Plaaaaaaaguuuuuuuuuuu"

@InRaged, I love the idea of being able to "overcharge" the Archon's mana! I'm unsure how I feel about the other two spells but I'm almost sure I'd prefer that version of the archon to the current one

NiGoL

1868 Posts

December 03 2008 23:07 GMT

#451

On December 04 2008 02:55 FrozenArbiter wrote:

Show nested quote +

Haha I agree wholeheartedly

agree'd about the archon part! haha

dabman

United States17 Posts

December 04 2008 10:23 GMT

#452

One recent idea I had was a Protoss 'deflector' unit that would be a hard counter against range units. The deflector would be a slow-moving mid-game ground unit with no weapons of its own, but would have the ability to deflect ranged damage fired upon itself towards the nearest ground/air unit up to a limited distance (say, half the range of a siege tank). The unit would be very difficult to use effectively, but there are many quirks that could lead to interesting play:

1) An early mutalisk harass could be countered by the deflector if it was correctly positioned near the location being attacked. Mutalisks would be vulnerable since their attacks could unintentionally ricochet onto the deflector. Defending units with ranged ground attack could also attack the deflectors and have their shots ricochet up to attacking air units. Cannons could even extend their range by attacking deflectors positioned closer to the attacking air units.

2) Any mass marine/hydra push could be temporarily halted if deflectors successfully block ramp/access to base.

3) Tank pushes would have an interesting change of strategy with deflectors on the field. The Protoss army would want to be a good distance away from its own deflectors so it would not receive the ricocheted siege tank damage, but if they stayed too far away then the Terran could launch a melee assault on the deflectors to take them out. There would be additional micro involved with stopping the tanks from auto-firing on the deflectors if they get close enough to deflect back the damage. This would lead to lots of pivotal moments where attacking could suddenly switch from beneficial to harmful for either race.

4) A line of deflectors could be organized to deflect attacks in a chain-like manner. There would have to be a limit to the number of deflections possible, but it would be interesting to see this used. This would take a lot of skill to perform properly, and there is plenty of room for this to backfire.

The deflector could have its ability as always passive, immobile when activated (like siege tank), or have it limited to a Psi counter similar to the wraith's cloak. The deflections could hit friendly or enemy units, but could slightly favor attacking enemy units if that tweaking was necessary to make it an effective unit.

I think this unit would add to gameplay because it allows for a normally disadvantaged mix of units to fight successfully against a superior group if certain conditions in micro are performed properly. It also allows for for the transfer of damage between normally unaccessible dimensions of battle (ranged ground-only units being able to hit air units via deflector). This type of counter-intuitive feature mirrors the many hidden tricks in SC that have been revealed after years of pro-play: archons friendly-firing so splash damage can kill cloaked units, etc. The last reason deflectors would add to gameplay is the fact that the unit's ability could potentially be used for the opponent's benefit. This is similar to spider mine placements hurting Terran, general force positioning, baiting, and splash damage.

Liquid`Jinro

Sweden33719 Posts

December 04 2008 12:11 GMT

#453

Just a quick idea that randomly came to me; should terran addons be able to lift-off themselves? I say this because many people talk about how the new addon system can allow you to switch tech faster (ie if you have a reactor addon for your rax but you want to switch to metal, you can land the fac next to the reactor and it will still work).

However, at least in SC, buildings are kinda clumsy and it's a hassle to fly them around (imo). + It'd allow for cool building floats :D

Klockan3

Sweden2866 Posts

December 04 2008 14:28 GMT

#454

On December 04 2008 21:11 FrozenArbiter wrote:
Just a quick idea that randomly came to me; should terran addons be able to lift-off themselves? I say this because many people talk about how the new addon system can allow you to switch tech faster (ie if you have a reactor addon for your rax but you want to switch to metal, you can land the fac next to the reactor and it will still work).

However, at least in SC, buildings are kinda clumsy and it's a hassle to fly them around (imo). + It'd allow for cool building floats :D

Imagine using that to create large floating walls following your siege tanks around and then deploying for combat!

That way you could wall your enemy into his own base np!

Badjas

Netherlands2038 Posts

December 04 2008 15:17 GMT

#455

Talking about that twilight archon unit, the name inspired me to the following idea:

Regardless of abilities and other configuration, it would be cool if this unit would be completely invisible when standing idle. Not even detectors could see it. Then when it does anything, it will become normally visible. Of course regaining complete invisiblity when returning to idle would need a 'cooldown'.

This would open up some strategies with ambushing or other surprises.. perhaps a twilight archon would be too costly a unit making related strategies not feasible. But the concept could be applied to any unit, but it would fit a twilight archon, lore wise.

Liquid`Jinro

Sweden33719 Posts

December 04 2008 16:03 GMT

#456

I think normal invisiblity would be enough haha ;P
It'd be kinda meh if it could just cloak at 5 hp and NOTHING could detect, then decloak when full shield.

Badjas

Netherlands2038 Posts

December 05 2008 08:09 GMT

#457

You have a point there FrozenArbiter.. Let's refine:

A cooldown to turn undetectable is necessary. When being attacked, it will stay normal for a while longer. So this makes it possible to chase them down. To become undetectable, they'd have to be sitting silent without being attacked for a certain amount of time. say, 8 seconds? Perhaps they could become cloaked after 2 seconds of being completely idle, as an intermediate step... balance dependent.

If this is unusable in regular starcraft II, at least let us map edit it in :-D then we'll see at any point later if it can be a strategy / tactics element. (I guess this last remark can be appended to every item on this wish list thread hehe)

LonelyMargarita

1845 Posts

December 06 2008 00:00 GMT

#458

On December 05 2008 00:17 Badjas wrote:
Talking about that twilight archon unit, the name inspired me to the following idea:

Regardless of abilities and other configuration, it would be cool if this unit would be completely invisible when standing idle. Not even detectors could see it. Then when it does anything, it will become normally visible. Of course regaining complete invisiblity when returning to idle would need a 'cooldown'.

This would open up some strategies with ambushing or other surprises.. perhaps a twilight archon would be too costly a unit making related strategies not feasible. But the concept could be applied to any unit, but it would fit a twilight archon, lore wise.

So I just wall him into his base with a couple of these, and he can never get out with ground units? Or I put one at every expo and he can never expand? Sounds a bit imba to me...

Liquid`Jinro

Sweden33719 Posts

December 06 2008 05:09 GMT

#459

Hehe, I'm not a fan of perma-cloak but those issues could be solved by having them have 0 collision size while in that state. They could be in some other dimension or something.

I don't really love the idea (it just seems a bit weird to be completely undetectable..) but I don't think those are things that'd stop it from working

Speaking of the map editor, I hope you are able to really go nuts in terms of what you can add to a melee map. As an example, the WC3 map Centaur Grove has 2 warp-gates which can take you across the map - I hope we'll see such things in SC2 maps as well (hell, I think we should be able to place areas with faster healing or faster mana regeneration etc in melee maps). And yes, I realize this is probably a turn around from whatever I used to think over a year ago when SC2 was just announced ;o

Freedom is good, if it doesn't work, nobody will put it in maps.

And before I sleep I have to - yet again - profess my love for the Demon unit from Armies of Exigo. It has a teleport spell which can take it anywhere on the map (travel time varies depending on how far you go) and it's *amazing*.
Please, please, please, please, pleaaaaaaaaaaase give this ability to either terran (the thor, should probably be a lift-off animation instead of teleport tho) or protoss (the archon). (Don't give it to the zerg because I don't want to have to play zerg and this ability would seriously force me to)

maybenexttime

Poland5552 Posts

December 11 2008 13:28 GMT

#460

How about a destroyable neutral Xel-Naga building that cloaks your units in a certain radius when there's a psi unit nearby? ;]

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[T] New Ideas: Units, UI, Gameplay - Page 23

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