• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 02:08
CEST 08:08
KST 15:08
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists11[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Fresh Flow9[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash10[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy21
Community News
2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers11Maestros of the Game 2 announced32026 GSL Tour plans announced10Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail0MaNa leaves Team Liquid19
StarCraft 2
General
2026 GSL Tour plans announced Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool MaNa leaves Team Liquid Maestros of the Game 2 announced
Tourneys
2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) SEL Doubles (SC Evo Bimonthly) $5,000 WardiTV TLMC tournament - Presented by Monster Energy
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 521 Memorable Boss The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 520 Moving Fees Mutation # 519 Inner Power
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Pros React To: Tulbo in Ro.16 Group A Data needed BW General Discussion ASL21 General Discussion
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Ro16 Group B [ASL21] Ro16 Group A [ASL21] Ro24 Group F
Strategy
What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Any training maps people recommend? Fighting Spirit mining rates Muta micro map competition
Other Games
General Games
General RTS Discussion Thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Starcraft Tabletop Miniature Game
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Canadian Politics Mega-thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT] Tokyo Olympics 2021 Thread
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
[G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Reappraising The Situation T…
TrAiDoS
lurker extra damage testi…
StaticNine
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1779 users

Code S RO10 - Group B, Day 2 Preview - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
20 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 2 All
Charoisaur
Profile Joined August 2014
Germany16062 Posts
April 22 2022 10:13 GMT
#21
On April 22 2022 18:43 Balnazza wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2022 17:34 Charoisaur wrote:
On April 22 2022 15:35 Balnazza wrote:
On April 22 2022 06:39 JJH777 wrote:
On April 22 2022 06:07 Balnazza wrote:
On April 22 2022 00:42 JJH777 wrote:
On April 21 2022 21:19 Balnazza wrote:
On April 21 2022 12:09 JJH777 wrote:
On April 21 2022 09:09 Balnazza wrote:
Weird idea, but Maru could also just play better, would solve that problem quite easily...


If Maru playing at his peak level is the only thing stopping Zerg dominance in everything then there are some serious issues.


Maru lost against a zerg and a protoss btw. And no, Maru doesn't need to play his peak to break Zerg dominance, but he needs to play at his peak to beat Dark, Rogue, Serral and Reynor, when they are at their best.
I know some people might oppose to that, but Maru isn't some kind of god that is 10 levels ahead of everyone else. He is a great player, but so are others. At the moment, he isn't bringing his A-game, while people like Creator or RagnaroK really stepped up, kind of like Ryung stepped up during IEM. It happens, you know? Or how does this work? The game is only balanced if Maru playing with one hand on the balls is still winning everything?

Sorry, but if we are in a situation were people improving just gets shrugged off as balance and everything sucks anyway, then Starcraft 2 indeed has a deep problem community-wise.


Was your original post in reply to angry_maia? That's how I interpreted it. If so I don't know why you are so focused on Maru's results. One players results shouldn't be the only thing that changes whether the game looks balanced.


Players results never really say much about balance, unless you very extreme scenarios. But basing any balance discussion on 10 players is just silly. It is just disrespectful towards RagnaroK and Creator to say their runs are just the result of balance and excuse the performance of Maru like that (Ryung and ByuN are great players, but it isn't that big of an upset if they miss GSL playoffs, that is why I focus on Maru here).
It just urks me that people actually think Maru is that much of a God in the game that he alone is an indicator for balance (aka. if he loses balance is off). He isn't. And when he underperforms like in this group, you can call him out for it.


Creator deserves the result. I think it's insane to not acknowledge that Zerg has been doing better than the other races for years now though. Zerg basically never does truly bad in any event. Even when they lose they are inevitably in the top 4 or finals. When is the last time Zerg actually completely missed a tournament playoff? I think you'd have to go back to 2017 to find an example of that. Meanwhile it happens to T/P regularly.


Zerg is doing fantastic - mostly because it has the most top players left. That is all that there is to say about it. sorry, but neither Serral, Reynor, Rogue or Dark qualify as a "patch zerg". But just both of the top korean zergs missing playoffs would be quite the coincidence. How often did terran miss playoffs completly when Innovation/TY/GuMiho were still around on top of Maru? How often did Protoss miss playoffs when there was Stats on top of herO/Zest/Trap?
I wouldn't say SC2 is "dead" by no means, but it is clear as rain that there isn't much fluctuation with new players anymore. Any player, especially in korea, that retires or drops of, is more or less just a big for his race. Some players step up, but who was the last player with no prior success that had a breakthrough into the top-ranks? Clem/MaxPax in Europe for sure, but in korea?
If Zerg was that overpowered, Armani and Solar shouldn't have dropped out in the first round. Zerg also wouldn't have been the least represented race in GSL, but rather some nonames would have kicked established players left and right. None of that did happen.

I just can't hear this 'Zerg players are just better' argument anymore because it's based on the results of those Zergs in the last few years during which Zerg has been overpowered for long periods of time. If you buff Protoss hard right now, in 3 years we could say the same about Protoss players, same with terran.
I don't think Dark / Rogue / Serral / Reynor are patchzergs but their results have clearly been boosted a bit by the state of their race.
Also Zerg has also lost a top Zerg in soO and Stats and INnoVation weren't exactly winning championships before they had to go to military so this argument is a bit disingenious imo


But we are not talking about "boosted results". We are apparently only talking about "lul, Zerg not beatable, otherwise Maru would win everything". It just is completly unjustified that apparently your achievements are only worth something when you are terran. I mean, just take this thread. It is neither about what an underperformance Maru delievered nor the great uprise (re-uprise?) of Creator - it is about how everything is only balance, no personal skill involved whatsoever.
And I really, really, just hate that. Especially since the same people wouldn't make a peep if Maru would just win everything. Terran OP? Nah, he is just Flash 2.0!

Well if it's just one guy winning everything and the rest of the race would be doing mediocre it would be a different scenario.

But I agree with you that we shouldn't focus on balance this much and dismiss player achievements.

Many of the coolest moments in sc2 happen due to worker harassment
Prev 1 2 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
00:00
GSL CK #3: Rogue vs SHIN
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
-ZergGirl 120
StarCraft: Brood War
GuemChi 5755
BeSt 1527
scan(afreeca) 562
Hyuk 532
Sharp 54
soO 35
NaDa 25
Bale 17
SilentControl 12
Larva 11
[ Show more ]
Icarus 6
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm140
League of Legends
JimRising 655
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K926
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King232
Other Games
summit1g10505
C9.Mang0451
febbydoto23
Trikslyr22
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick722
Counter-Strike
PGL113
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH296
• practicex 34
• Dystopia_ 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Lourlo1077
• Rush1077
• Stunt521
Upcoming Events
The PondCast
3h 52m
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
4h 52m
CranKy Ducklings
17h 52m
Escore
1d 3h
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
1d 4h
OSC
1d 8h
Korean StarCraft League
1d 20h
CranKy Ducklings
2 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
2 days
IPSL
2 days
WolFix vs nOmaD
dxtr13 vs Razz
[ Show More ]
BSL
2 days
UltrA vs KwarK
Gosudark vs cavapoo
dxtr13 vs HBO
Doodle vs Razz
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
3 days
Ladder Legends
3 days
BSL
3 days
StRyKeR vs rasowy
Artosis vs Aether
JDConan vs OyAji
Hawk vs izu
IPSL
3 days
JDConan vs TBD
Aegong vs rasowy
Replay Cast
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Wardi Open
4 days
Afreeca Starleague
4 days
Bisu vs Ample
Jaedong vs Flash
Monday Night Weeklies
4 days
RSL Revival
4 days
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
Barracks vs Leta
Royal vs Light
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
5 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-04-15
RSL Revival: Season 4
NationLESS Cup

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
StarCraft2 Community Team League 2026 Spring
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: W3
Escore Tournament S2: W4
Acropolis #4
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.