• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 07:21
CEST 13:21
KST 20:21
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview4[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies21Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO12 Preview2herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2026)6Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO4 & Finals Preview5
Community News
Weekly Cups (May 18-25): MaxPax wins doubles0Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League4Weekly Cups (May 11-17): Classic wins double0Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO8 Results2Weekly Cups (May 4-10): Clem, MaxPax, herO win1
StarCraft 2
General
herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview Weekly Cups (May 18-25): MaxPax wins doubles Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO12 Preview Weekly Cups (May 11-17): Classic wins double
Tourneys
GSL Code S Season 2 (2026) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule !
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players
External Content
Welcome to the External Content forum Mutation # 527 Hell Train The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 526 Rubber and Glue
Brood War
General
Every Matchup's Top 5 Winrates (all ASLs & KSLs) Pros React To: ASL S21 Finals BW General Discussion Very long shot - StarCraft x A7X video Pros React to: TvT Masterclass in FlaSh vs Light
Tourneys
Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [BSL22] WB Final & LB Semis - Saturday 21:00 CEST [ASL21] Grand Finals [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
Any training maps people recommend? Muta micro map competition [G] Hydra ZvZ: An Introduction Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread ZeroSpace Megathread Path of Exile Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Trading/Investing Thread Dating: How's your luck? European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development streaming software
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Customization Drives Loyalty…
TrAiDoS
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 3163 users

Code S RO10 - Group B, Day 2 Preview - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
20 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 2 All
Charoisaur
Profile Joined August 2014
Germany16065 Posts
April 22 2022 10:13 GMT
#21
On April 22 2022 18:43 Balnazza wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2022 17:34 Charoisaur wrote:
On April 22 2022 15:35 Balnazza wrote:
On April 22 2022 06:39 JJH777 wrote:
On April 22 2022 06:07 Balnazza wrote:
On April 22 2022 00:42 JJH777 wrote:
On April 21 2022 21:19 Balnazza wrote:
On April 21 2022 12:09 JJH777 wrote:
On April 21 2022 09:09 Balnazza wrote:
Weird idea, but Maru could also just play better, would solve that problem quite easily...


If Maru playing at his peak level is the only thing stopping Zerg dominance in everything then there are some serious issues.


Maru lost against a zerg and a protoss btw. And no, Maru doesn't need to play his peak to break Zerg dominance, but he needs to play at his peak to beat Dark, Rogue, Serral and Reynor, when they are at their best.
I know some people might oppose to that, but Maru isn't some kind of god that is 10 levels ahead of everyone else. He is a great player, but so are others. At the moment, he isn't bringing his A-game, while people like Creator or RagnaroK really stepped up, kind of like Ryung stepped up during IEM. It happens, you know? Or how does this work? The game is only balanced if Maru playing with one hand on the balls is still winning everything?

Sorry, but if we are in a situation were people improving just gets shrugged off as balance and everything sucks anyway, then Starcraft 2 indeed has a deep problem community-wise.


Was your original post in reply to angry_maia? That's how I interpreted it. If so I don't know why you are so focused on Maru's results. One players results shouldn't be the only thing that changes whether the game looks balanced.


Players results never really say much about balance, unless you very extreme scenarios. But basing any balance discussion on 10 players is just silly. It is just disrespectful towards RagnaroK and Creator to say their runs are just the result of balance and excuse the performance of Maru like that (Ryung and ByuN are great players, but it isn't that big of an upset if they miss GSL playoffs, that is why I focus on Maru here).
It just urks me that people actually think Maru is that much of a God in the game that he alone is an indicator for balance (aka. if he loses balance is off). He isn't. And when he underperforms like in this group, you can call him out for it.


Creator deserves the result. I think it's insane to not acknowledge that Zerg has been doing better than the other races for years now though. Zerg basically never does truly bad in any event. Even when they lose they are inevitably in the top 4 or finals. When is the last time Zerg actually completely missed a tournament playoff? I think you'd have to go back to 2017 to find an example of that. Meanwhile it happens to T/P regularly.


Zerg is doing fantastic - mostly because it has the most top players left. That is all that there is to say about it. sorry, but neither Serral, Reynor, Rogue or Dark qualify as a "patch zerg". But just both of the top korean zergs missing playoffs would be quite the coincidence. How often did terran miss playoffs completly when Innovation/TY/GuMiho were still around on top of Maru? How often did Protoss miss playoffs when there was Stats on top of herO/Zest/Trap?
I wouldn't say SC2 is "dead" by no means, but it is clear as rain that there isn't much fluctuation with new players anymore. Any player, especially in korea, that retires or drops of, is more or less just a big for his race. Some players step up, but who was the last player with no prior success that had a breakthrough into the top-ranks? Clem/MaxPax in Europe for sure, but in korea?
If Zerg was that overpowered, Armani and Solar shouldn't have dropped out in the first round. Zerg also wouldn't have been the least represented race in GSL, but rather some nonames would have kicked established players left and right. None of that did happen.

I just can't hear this 'Zerg players are just better' argument anymore because it's based on the results of those Zergs in the last few years during which Zerg has been overpowered for long periods of time. If you buff Protoss hard right now, in 3 years we could say the same about Protoss players, same with terran.
I don't think Dark / Rogue / Serral / Reynor are patchzergs but their results have clearly been boosted a bit by the state of their race.
Also Zerg has also lost a top Zerg in soO and Stats and INnoVation weren't exactly winning championships before they had to go to military so this argument is a bit disingenious imo


But we are not talking about "boosted results". We are apparently only talking about "lul, Zerg not beatable, otherwise Maru would win everything". It just is completly unjustified that apparently your achievements are only worth something when you are terran. I mean, just take this thread. It is neither about what an underperformance Maru delievered nor the great uprise (re-uprise?) of Creator - it is about how everything is only balance, no personal skill involved whatsoever.
And I really, really, just hate that. Especially since the same people wouldn't make a peep if Maru would just win everything. Terran OP? Nah, he is just Flash 2.0!

Well if it's just one guy winning everything and the rest of the race would be doing mediocre it would be a different scenario.

But I agree with you that we shouldn't focus on balance this much and dismiss player achievements.

Many of the coolest moments in sc2 happen due to worker harassment
Prev 1 2 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
GSL
09:30
2026 Season 2: Ro8 Group B
Zoun vs RogueLIVE!
Maru vs TBD
SHIN vs TBD
Ryung 416
IntoTheiNu 297
CranKy Ducklings SOOP33
Rex26
GSL EN (SOOP)0
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Ryung 416
Lowko197
TKL 44
Rex 26
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 12201
Calm 5479
Hyuk 757
Horang2 381
Jaedong 368
BeSt 367
EffOrt 295
Mini 254
Leta 231
ZerO 197
[ Show more ]
Pusan 157
Light 120
Soulkey 113
Last 112
ToSsGirL 88
ggaemo 78
hero 64
Aegong 56
Shinee 54
Rush 49
Mind 39
scan(afreeca) 38
Sharp 34
JYJ 34
soO 33
Sea.KH 20
sorry 19
Terrorterran 19
Free 18
zelot 13
910 13
JulyZerg 13
Barracks 11
GoRush 10
Sacsri 9
Movie 7
Noble 6
Icarus 5
ajuk12(nOOB) 5
Dota 2
Dendi380
XcaliburYe149
canceldota54
Counter-Strike
olofmeister1846
x6flipin216
allub166
markeloff75
kRYSTAL_63
Other Games
B2W.Neo759
Mew2King154
Pyrionflax137
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 1019
Other Games
gamesdonequick541
Counter-Strike
PGL293
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 13
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 14
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis1922
• Jankos1401
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Spring Champion…
39m
SKillous vs Strange
Lambo vs Strange
Ryung vs Strange
Lambo vs Ryung
Ryung vs SKillous
Lambo vs SKillous
OSC
7h 39m
Cham vs Percival
ShoWTimE vs Lambo
Krystianer vs sebesdes
Cure vs Babymarine
SKillous vs Arrogfire
Gerald vs MindelVK
goblin vs TBD
Jumy vs HonMonO
Replay Cast
12h 39m
Maestros of the Game
1d 1h
Replay Cast
1d 12h
RSL Revival
1d 19h
Lambo vs SHIN
Solar vs Rogue
herO vs Clem
Maestros of the Game
1d 23h
IPSL
2 days
ZZZero vs WorsT
Julia vs eOnzErG
BSL
2 days
TerrOr vs Dewalt
Bonyth vs eOnzErG
Replay Cast
2 days
[ Show More ]
RSL Revival
2 days
Maestros of the Game
3 days
OSC
3 days
IPSL
3 days
Dragon vs Artosis
dxtr13 vs Hawk
BSL
3 days
Wardi Open
4 days
Monday Night Weeklies
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
WardiTV Spring Champion…
4 days
Maestros of the Game
5 days
The PondCast
5 days
Maestros of the Game
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
WardiTV Spring Champion…
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

ASL Season 21
2026 GSL S1
Heroes Pulsing #1

Ongoing

2026 KK StarCraft Pro League
BSL Season 22
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
KK 2v2 League Season 1
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
SCTL 2026 Spring
WardiTV Spring 2026
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: King of Kings
YSL S3
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Maestros of the Game 2
Bounty Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.