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On November 29 2020 12:02 Comedy wrote:
You would of had to have played both games to an expert level to understand on a deeper level why one is less than the other, but in the end, any such opinion will always be subjective. But Korea agrees, at least.
Yep, they decided: League of Legends
User was banned for this post.
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On November 29 2020 12:02 Comedy wrote:
You would of had to have played both games to an expert level to understand on a deeper level why one is less than the other, but in the end, any such opinion will always be subjective. But Korea agrees, at least.
only the viewers, not the players (and that's probably because they never gave sc2 a chance)
TY, Stats, Inno and others said they enjoy sc2 more and even Flash said he really liked sc2.
Did they not understand bw on a deeper level? 🤔
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On November 29 2020 18:32 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2020 12:02 Comedy wrote:
You would of had to have played both games to an expert level to understand on a deeper level why one is less than the other, but in the end, any such opinion will always be subjective. But Korea agrees, at least. only the viewers, not the players (and that's probably because they never gave sc2 a chance) TY, Stats, Inno and others said they enjoy sc2 more and even Flash said he really liked sc2. Did they not understand bw on a deeper level? 🤔
Holly lack of context batman. Please stop throwing such things around, otherwise people might start to believe it at face value and another internet myth arises.
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On November 29 2020 10:11 Jealous wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2020 10:02 Husyelt wrote:On November 29 2020 09:41 Comedy wrote:On November 29 2020 08:59 jomino wrote:On November 29 2020 08:34 Comedy wrote:On November 29 2020 05:15 marcesr wrote:
I have warned of this development a long time ago. Koreans have overharvested their fishing grounds. A smart regulator would have prevented that.
They drove the global audience away from Starcraft, the market shrank drastically and now even semi-pro foreigners have a chance to compete with what is left of the Korean scene. Unfortunately this development comes way too late as Starcraft's decline was sealed when Koreans regularly made top 16 in every major global tournament. starcraft 2 wouldn't have declined if the game managed to capture attention the same way brood war has done for 20 years and still going. The dissapointment of the game can't be ignored. Even now that it is a finished product, there are a lot of dissapointing unit interactions and strategies still in play. This is funny, because the Brood War Scene crashed like no other. Why didnt Gameplay safe this game? I'm not sure what you mean when GSL finals gets 3k viewers in korea and 200k tune in to watch ASL. And that is after the entire BW scene collapsed and tried to switch to starcraft 2, and came back years later after the entire pro scene and league structure for brood war has been eradicated. Few days ago the news of OGN the tv channel that hosted starleagues and proleague closing hit. Did you really just make an account to say this? lol.. You have to take into account other statistics though as well, for instance: Afreeca GSL vs ASL Finals youtube viewer count that currently sits at SC2 307K views BW 121K views Usually the SC2 GSL finals get about 100k views by the end of the first day as well Probably because the majority watch Afreeca SL finals on ... Afreeca? Hello?
Also comparing the BW ENGLISH vods to the SC2 ENGLISH vods. 90% of Koreans watch the restreams of progamers. Few koreans watch the Tastosis cast.
How is it everytime that you guys conveniently leave out 90% of korean BW viewers when you count this shit. Do you REALLY believe that when ASL gets 200k+, and SC2 barely gets 10k viewers, that somehow SC2 has more vod views than BW in total across ALL streams, restreams and korean stream, on afreeca as well??
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Northern Ireland24971 Posts
On November 29 2020 10:41 Husyelt wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2020 10:18 WombaT wrote:On November 29 2020 10:02 Husyelt wrote:On November 29 2020 09:41 Comedy wrote:On November 29 2020 08:59 jomino wrote:On November 29 2020 08:34 Comedy wrote:On November 29 2020 05:15 marcesr wrote:
I have warned of this development a long time ago. Koreans have overharvested their fishing grounds. A smart regulator would have prevented that.
They drove the global audience away from Starcraft, the market shrank drastically and now even semi-pro foreigners have a chance to compete with what is left of the Korean scene. Unfortunately this development comes way too late as Starcraft's decline was sealed when Koreans regularly made top 16 in every major global tournament. starcraft 2 wouldn't have declined if the game managed to capture attention the same way brood war has done for 20 years and still going. The dissapointment of the game can't be ignored. Even now that it is a finished product, there are a lot of dissapointing unit interactions and strategies still in play. This is funny, because the Brood War Scene crashed like no other. Why didnt Gameplay safe this game? I'm not sure what you mean when GSL finals gets 3k viewers in korea and 200k tune in to watch ASL. And that is after the entire BW scene collapsed and tried to switch to starcraft 2, and came back years later after the entire pro scene and league structure for brood war has been eradicated. Few days ago the news of OGN the tv channel that hosted starleagues and proleague closing hit. Did you really just make an account to say this? lol.. You have to take into account other statistics though as well, for instance: Afreeca GSL vs ASL Finals youtube viewer count that currently sits at SC2 307K views BW 121K views Usually the SC2 GSL finals get about 100k views by the end of the first day as well I’m not sure why comparing SC2’s popularity via its popularity in Korea vs BW which isn’t so much a game as a cultural phenomenon over there is really that worthwhile an exercise. It’s hard enough to trap lightning in a bottle once, never mind to repeat the trick, indeed some of the various factors involved I think make it nearly impossible. Be it PC bang culture, be it the subsequent development of accessible VoIP chat or whatever, all sorts of factors. I don’t think it’s coincidental that team games became way more popular when you could play and talk to your friends easily. Prior to that, I don’t think playing 1v1 games felt as isolating, because the alternative of that easy social experience didn’t actually exist yet. I mean going on a tangent but some people seem to want to call SC2 a failure when I’m not sure it was actually possible for it to replicate its success in Korea, and via other metrics it’s done pretty well, and exceptionally well if we consider it vs other 1v1 focused games in general, and RTS games in general. Again, I was only focusing on the mr.funguy's " GSL only gets 3k viewers" comment. Which is simply not true. And I don't think any RTS that sells 3 million units in its first month will ever be considered a failure. Let alone having a healthy pro scene 10 years on that continues push the games limits.
Aye not really sure why I replied to your post with what I said rather than others haha.
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hAs KoReAn StArCraFt HiT rOcK bOtToM
yeah just look at asus rog. Byun beating serral and Maru beating back Reynor and we have another Korean vs Korean finals
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And all that while super dead tired!
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On November 30 2020 04:25 SamirDuran wrote:
hAs KoReAn StArCraFt HiT rOcK bOtToM
yeah just look at asus rog. Byun beating serral and Maru beating back Reynor and we have another Korean vs Korean finals
Did you read og's post? Morbidius is one of the most "elitist" of the korean fans here on TL.
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Czech Republic12129 Posts
On November 30 2020 04:49 Lambertus wrote:
And all that while super dead tired!
And all that with them Terran wrists, knees, shoulders and heels!
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With the conclusion of the most recent tournament, should we rename this thread to "Has European StarCraft hit rock bottom?" Only 37% of the ro8 were Europeans, while the rest were Koreans. Even then, those 3 EU guys are ro8 regulars. Those guys couldn't even manage to beat koreans who were playing during non-optimal time, ping, and broken wrists/back (seriously, why are Korean T's so fragile?). With no new EU blood making it through, the EU scenes look like it's heading towards the same direction as the NA and KR scene.
Seriously though, we should just accept that the top of sc2 is super competitive at the moment and any of the top guys can win any given tournament depending on their condition that day/weekend.
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There was a fantastic interview by stats and ty where they discuss the worrying state of korean sc2. But you can see the game is also highly imbalanced. The fact that tier 4 foreigners are taking down tier 1 koreans shows the state of the game. Thats what happens when a company stops investing in a game that isn't profitable and you lose people like David Kim. For allllll the problems with WoL or HoTs, it was never this imbalanced (among races but also between early-mid-late game).
User was warned for this post.
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Czech Republic12129 Posts
On November 30 2020 08:00 luxon wrote:
There was a fantastic interview by stats and ty where they discuss the worrying state of korean sc2. But you can see the game is also highly imbalanced. The fact that tier 4 foreigners are taking down tier 1 koreans shows the state of the game. Thats what happens when a company stops investing in a game that isn't profitable and you lose people like David Kim. For allllll the problems with WoL or HoTs, it was never this imbalanced (among races but also between early-mid-late game).
Well the issue with the interview is that the Korean scene has been dead and locked in this state for at least 3 years now. Probably even more. THe region lock didn't help, just killed the lower and mediocre Koreans faster because they were Korean and as such they are genetically better at SC2. (remember, the region lock is still a thing) So it's a nice thing they talk about it now, but it's way too late. It's like discussing the Titanic state when all the life boats were already launched and the ship is broken into the two parts and 80 % under the water 
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On November 30 2020 08:00 luxon wrote:
There was a fantastic interview by stats and ty where they discuss the worrying state of korean sc2. But you can see the game is also highly imbalanced. The fact that tier 4 foreigners are taking down tier 1 koreans shows the state of the game. Thats what happens when a company stops investing in a game that isn't profitable and you lose people like David Kim. For allllll the problems with WoL or HoTs, it was never this imbalanced (among races but also between early-mid-late game).
Tier 4 foreigners taking down tier 1 koreans? Which ones?
And you think LotV's current state to be the most imbalanced in the history of Sc2?
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On November 30 2020 08:00 luxon wrote:
There was a fantastic interview by stats and ty where they discuss the worrying state of korean sc2. But you can see the game is also highly imbalanced. The fact that tier 4 foreigners are taking down tier 1 koreans shows the state of the game. Thats what happens when a company stops investing in a game that isn't profitable and you lose people like David Kim. For allllll the problems with WoL or HoTs, it was never this imbalanced (among races but also between early-mid-late game).
David Kim was the guy that had the bright idea of throwing all known balance principles off by deciding to launch the 12 worker start. David Kim admitted to being diamond max during late wol/early hots and still thought he could decide about balance. Under David Kim we have seen some of the most abusive metas in history prevail for months on end.
David Kim is very good at PR, but this game is better off without him.
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Czech Republic12129 Posts
On November 30 2020 08:15 Steelghost1 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2020 08:00 luxon wrote:
There was a fantastic interview by stats and ty where they discuss the worrying state of korean sc2. But you can see the game is also highly imbalanced. The fact that tier 4 foreigners are taking down tier 1 koreans shows the state of the game. Thats what happens when a company stops investing in a game that isn't profitable and you lose people like David Kim. For allllll the problems with WoL or HoTs, it was never this imbalanced (among races but also between early-mid-late game). David Kim was the guy that had the bright idea of throwing all known balance principles off by deciding to launch the 12 worker start. David Kim admitted to being diamond max during late wol/early hots and still thought he could decide about balance. Under David Kim we have seen some of the most abusive metas in history prevail for months on end. David Kim is very good at PR, but this game is better off without him.
Can you provide the sources for the following:
1) David Kim decided to use the 12 worker start
2) David Kim was diamond
Thank you.
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Seeker
Where dat snitch at?37015 Posts
Alright... I think it's time we lock this thread seeing as how ASUS ROG just answered the question for us.
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EPT
