• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 17:18
CEST 23:18
KST 06:18
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Season 1 - Final Week8[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, Rogue, Classic, GuMiho0
Community News
Weekly Cups (July 14-20): Final Check-up0Esports World Cup 2025 - Brackets Revealed19Weekly Cups (July 7-13): Classic continues to roll8Team TLMC #5 - Submission re-extension4Firefly given lifetime ban by ESIC following match-fixing investigation17
StarCraft 2
General
Heaven's Balance Suggestions (roast me) Magnus Carlsen and Fabi review Clem's chess game. Who will win EWC 2025? Why doesnt SC2 scene costream tournaments RSL Season 1 - Final Week
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series $5,100+ SEL Season 2 Championship (SC: Evo)
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars Mutation # 482 Wheel of Misfortune Mutation # 481 Fear and Lava Mutation # 480 Moths to the Flame
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion Corsair Pursuit Micro? BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Pro gamer house photos Flash Announces (and Retracts) Hiatus From ASL
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL 2v2] ProLeague Season 3 - Friday 21:00 CET The Casual Games of the Week Thread BWCL Season 63 Announcement
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers I am doing this better than progamers do.
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok) Path of Exile CCLP - Command & Conquer League Project
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Games Industry And ATVI Stop Killing Games - European Citizens Initiative
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Ping To Win? Pings And Their…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 795 users

StarCraft II: DeepMind Demonstration: Jan 24 - Page 18

Forum Index > SC2 General
585 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 16 17 18 19 20 30 Next All
pvsnp
Profile Joined January 2017
7676 Posts
January 24 2019 19:46 GMT
#341
Given the way neural nets learn, I fully expect AlphaStar to be completely invincible in the very near future.
Denominator of the Universe
TL+ Member
gophersnake
Profile Joined July 2018
48 Posts
January 24 2019 19:46 GMT
#342
You have to consider that if it is capped to 180-200 apm, if it allocates ALL 200 actions to blinking stalkers in a few second window you will get a ridiculous APM spike, it's for sure the most difficult hurdle to overcome in terms of creating a machine that can play the game versus humans in a "fair" way.
Musicus
Profile Joined August 2011
Germany23576 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-01-24 19:46:24
January 24 2019 19:46 GMT
#343
On January 25 2019 04:45 IshinShishi wrote:
if its 310 pure effective apm then its still inhuman

actually that is Serral level

Maru and Serral are probably top 5.
Garrl
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Scotland1972 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-01-24 19:46:52
January 24 2019 19:46 GMT
#344
this is a place where that zoomhack also comes into play which I see, of course, none of them are mentioning.
Serimek
Profile Joined August 2011
France2274 Posts
January 24 2019 19:47 GMT
#345
On January 25 2019 04:46 Musicus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 25 2019 04:45 IshinShishi wrote:
if its 310 pure effective apm then its still inhuman

actually that is Serral level

https://twitter.com/retjah/status/959047573930696704


But Serral does not have a zoomhack and he has hands.
SC2 is the best game to watch and was the best to play before I grew old and slow...
Aeromi
Profile Blog Joined August 2012
France14458 Posts
January 24 2019 19:47 GMT
#346
So AlphaStar is like AlphaGo, it wants to win and does not care how given how game 5 went.
https://twitter.com/DrAeromi | Updates on live tournaments: @StarCrafteSport
Acrofales
Profile Joined August 2010
Spain17979 Posts
January 24 2019 19:47 GMT
#347
I mean, decisionmaking on blink stalker micro at an individual stalker, constantly, all over the map, is obviously superhuman level microing. That said, it's an AI, we don't expect it to play like a human.

Another superhuman play you saw was the timing on making the observer: a human almost certainly wouldn't see the blurred dark templar crossing the map until they are very near his base. Whereas alphastar has 100% map awareness.
peanuts
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
United States1225 Posts
January 24 2019 19:48 GMT
#348
The micro is incredibly interesting, the overdroning to immediately saturate/handle any workers killed from harassment was intriguing, and the army movement was brilliant. But overall, it seems like it's just exploiting its inherent ability to control units better/have persistent awareness of its FOV, and leveraging that to get into micro intensive situations and win.
Writer"My greatest skill is my enjoyment of the game" - Grubby | @TL_Peanuts
Poopi
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
France12796 Posts
January 24 2019 19:48 GMT
#349
On January 25 2019 04:46 Musicus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 25 2019 04:45 IshinShishi wrote:
if its 310 pure effective apm then its still inhuman

actually that is Serral level

https://twitter.com/retjah/status/959047573930696704

Fun thing is that Lambo had the same ePM in his games against Maru.
Shows how much they hyped Serral on even silly things :D.
WriterMaru
Zaros
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United Kingdom3692 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-01-24 19:48:59
January 24 2019 19:48 GMT
#350
On January 25 2019 04:46 Musicus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 25 2019 04:45 IshinShishi wrote:
if its 310 pure effective apm then its still inhuman

actually that is Serral level

https://twitter.com/retjah/status/959047573930696704


No it isnt, are everyone of serral's 310 actions perfectly calculated and precise. no.
Cyro
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom20285 Posts
January 24 2019 19:49 GMT
#351
On January 25 2019 04:45 Zaros wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 25 2019 04:44 Brutaxilos wrote:
On January 25 2019 04:37 Majick wrote:
Blizzcon 2019 Ro16:

15 AlphaStar Agents
Serral

Honestly though, if AlphaStar can beat Mana 5-0 in 2 weeks of training, Serral doesn't stand a chance.


It hasnt had 2 weeks it has had 200 years


put it back in the hyperbolic time chamber
"oh my god my overclock... I got a single WHEA error on the 23rd hour, 9 minutes" -Belial88
Dav1oN
Profile Joined January 2012
Ukraine3164 Posts
January 24 2019 19:49 GMT
#352
On January 25 2019 04:46 Garrl wrote:
this is a place where that zoomhack also comes into play which I see, of course, none of them are mentioning.


exactly, it needs to see the same way as a player does, only one screen
In memory of Geoff "iNcontroL" Robinson 11.09.1985 - 21.07.2019 A tribute to incredible man, embodiment of joy, esports titan, starcraft community pillar all in one. You will always be remembered!
rednusa
Profile Joined October 2012
651 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-01-24 19:49:35
January 24 2019 19:49 GMT
#353
Any idea the whereabouts the live segment is being recorded?
renaissanceMAN
Profile Joined March 2011
United States1840 Posts
January 24 2019 19:49 GMT
#354
On January 25 2019 04:48 peanuts wrote:
The micro is incredibly interesting, the overdroning to immediately saturate/handle any workers killed from harassment was intriguing, and the army movement was brilliant. But overall, it seems like it's just exploiting its inherent ability to control units better/have persistent awareness of its FOV, and leveraging that to get into micro intensive situations and win.


I feel like Artosis and Rotterdam are kind of over-hyping it to the point where they're overlooking the ridiculous inhuman micro.
On August 15 2013 03:43 Waxangel wrote: no amount of money can replace the enjoyment of being mean to people on the internet
Brutaxilos
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States2624 Posts
January 24 2019 19:49 GMT
#355
On January 25 2019 04:45 Zaros wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 25 2019 04:44 Brutaxilos wrote:
On January 25 2019 04:37 Majick wrote:
Blizzcon 2019 Ro16:

15 AlphaStar Agents
Serral

Honestly though, if AlphaStar can beat Mana 5-0 in 2 weeks of training, Serral doesn't stand a chance.


It hasnt had 2 weeks it has had 200 years

Yea, but 2 weeks of real life time. If we do a showmatch at Blizzcon, thats like another 40 or so weeks? So the equivalent of 4 millennia of training?
Jangbi favorite player. Forever~ CJ herO the King of IEM. BOMBERRRRRRRR. Sexy Boy Rogue. soO #1! Oliveira China Represent!
JyB
Profile Joined January 2012
France466 Posts
January 24 2019 19:49 GMT
#356
Again, just outmicroing with zoom hack. Boring.
BisuDagger
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Bisutopia19231 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-01-24 19:50:40
January 24 2019 19:50 GMT
#357
When you talk about years played, SC2 players are really in their infancy. You are never a year away from a patch. This is coupled with the fact that we don't have truly dominant players in SC2 yet. Winning for a year or two is as good as it has gotten. I would have found this more interesting had SC2 had 5 more years between its last patch or if this were trained in Brood War. In Brood War their is at least a definitive player with the most well rounded skill set in Macro, Micro, and Strategy. *Note: I'm not comparing the games at all in terms of content.
ModeratorFormer Afreeca Starleague Caster: http://afreeca.tv/ASL2ENG2
Musicus
Profile Joined August 2011
Germany23576 Posts
January 24 2019 19:50 GMT
#358
On January 25 2019 04:48 Zaros wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 25 2019 04:46 Musicus wrote:
On January 25 2019 04:45 IshinShishi wrote:
if its 310 pure effective apm then its still inhuman

actually that is Serral level

https://twitter.com/retjah/status/959047573930696704


No it isnt, are everyone of serral's 310 actions perfectly calculated and precise. no.

We need that Kappa emote allowed on TL already, does not cut in anymore.
Maru and Serral are probably top 5.
fLyiNgDroNe
Profile Joined September 2005
Belgium4001 Posts
January 24 2019 19:50 GMT
#359
they are saying like letting AI figuring out strats and humans learning from it is a good thing. No its not. Mistakes and new meta is what makes it super exciting.
Drone is a way of living
renaissanceMAN
Profile Joined March 2011
United States1840 Posts
January 24 2019 19:50 GMT
#360
"it's got an average human/pro apm"

Can't recall the last time I saw Serral's APM peak above 700 even in intense fights.
On August 15 2013 03:43 Waxangel wrote: no amount of money can replace the enjoyment of being mean to people on the internet
Prev 1 16 17 18 19 20 30 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 12h 42m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
UpATreeSC 325
Reynor 152
Nathanias 149
JuggernautJason68
StarCraft: Brood War
Free 45
Shine 20
Dota 2
syndereN742
XaKoH 483
League of Legends
Grubby6129
Counter-Strike
fl0m2362
Fnx 1081
Stewie2K710
flusha389
Super Smash Bros
PPMD61
Liquid`Ken19
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu694
Other Games
summit1g7197
FrodaN2828
tarik_tv2306
monkeys_forever114
Trikslyr50
Sick34
Organizations
Other Games
BasetradeTV100
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 22 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• kabyraGe 219
• Hupsaiya 50
• musti20045 34
• davetesta19
• LUISG 18
• Kozan
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Migwel
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• Eskiya23 28
• 80smullet 17
• Diggity4
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota22976
League of Legends
• TFBlade1548
Other Games
• imaqtpie1676
• Shiphtur379
Upcoming Events
Esports World Cup
12h 42m
ByuN vs Astrea
Lambo vs HeRoMaRinE
Clem vs TBD
Solar vs Zoun
SHIN vs Reynor
Maru vs TriGGeR
herO vs Lancer
Cure vs ShoWTimE
Esports World Cup
1d 12h
Esports World Cup
2 days
Esports World Cup
3 days
CranKy Ducklings
4 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
4 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
4 days
Bonyth vs Sziky
Dewalt vs Hawk
Hawk vs QiaoGege
Sziky vs Dewalt
Mihu vs Bonyth
Zhanhun vs QiaoGege
QiaoGege vs Fengzi
FEL
5 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
5 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
5 days
Bonyth vs Zhanhun
Dewalt vs Mihu
Hawk vs Sziky
Sziky vs QiaoGege
Mihu vs Hawk
Zhanhun vs Dewalt
Fengzi vs Bonyth
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Xiamen Invitational
Championship of Russia 2025
Murky Cup #2

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL20 Non-Korean Championship
CC Div. A S7
Underdog Cup #2
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25

Upcoming

CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
RSL Revival: Season 2
SEL Season 2 Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
FEL Cracov 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
HCC Europe
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.