Kingdom Come: Serral Sweeps the 2018 Circuit at WCS Montreal
By: Wax
"Inevitable" is the word most associated with Serral's 2018 WCS Circuit run, but after the events of WCS Montreal, I couldn't help but be surprised anyway. 'He did it. The kid actually f***ing did it.' Four tournaments, four finals, four championships. A WCS Circuit GRAND SLAM.
Unlike Maru's GSL Code S sweep, there aren't eight years of precedent that tells you how historic it is (the last time someone even won TWO Code S tournaments back to back was in 2011). In fact, Neeb's WCS 2017 run where he won three out of four tournaments might even fool an outsider into thinking this kind of excellence is somehow normal.
But StarCraft II fans will know that this, is indeed, an unprecedented degree of domination. We know it because Serral's 2018 stats are right up there with Korean elites such as Maru, INnoVation, and Dark. We know because Serral's peers have admitted and bowed to his greatness time and time again. We know it because of the feeling in our guts when we watch Serral play on the Circuit—when we're thinking 'these guys don't stand a chance.'
Serral's WCS Circuit sweep has been unusually thorough. Typically, an all-conqeuring player still leaves you with a few questions you might respectfully pose; a few lingering doubts to reasonably have. In Serral's case, he's gone up against virtually all the top-tier players in the foreign scene and defeated them all. At WCS Montreal, he shutdown any speculation that the unpredictable nature of ZvZ could be his downfall. He won the tournament in an ALL ZvZ run, with Scarlett, Lambo, and Reynor all taking their best shots and coming up short.
For me, as with many, the most memorable moment of WCS Montreal was during the finals. Serral had gone down 2-3 against Reynor in the grand finals, and the backstage production staff had begun to murmur. 'Oh s***, is Serral actually shook?' was the vibe in the air as the camera zoomed in on Serral grasping his head with one hand. Uh, no? I could only shake my head at these silly casuals. They had followed the Circuit but hadn't seen Serral come back from 2-3 behind against Stats in the GSL vs. The World finals. Lo and behold, Serral came through with one of the most ridiculous comebacks of the year in game six before closing the series out in game seven.
At the end of the 2018 WCS Circuit, I'm left with two pressing questions: 'WHY?' and 'HOW?'
WHY wasn't Serral able to record even a single finals sweep? That's really the only 'blemish' left on his WCS 2018 resume. 4-2, 4-2, 4-1, 4-3, 4-3—everything but a 4-0 adorns his finals record. It's probably just variance—I figure we just happen to live in the sole, unique timeline of the multiverse where Serral didn't achieve a finals sweep in 2018. Still, there may be some underlying tendencies, habits, or patterns in Serral's series planning that have prevented him from utterly dominating a finals from start to finish. Finding those weaknesses (real or imaginary) will be an important homework assignment for anyone who will take on Serral at BlizzCon.
The other question is HOW did Serral get this good? The simple answer would be that he had a year of full-time practice after graduating from high school. Certainly, being able to devote more time to playing StarCraft II would have been beneficial. But it doesn't explain at all how Serral reached a level that's so much higher than his peers. Yes, the foreign scene has occasionally produced great players, but Serral is on a different level. Some of the funniest (and saddest) tournament moments from the 2018 Circuit were when MaNa's pre-finals interview was literally him asking for mercy, or when HeRoMarinE implied on multiple occasions that he had planned for the tournament right up to Serral. When Serral was asked how he managed to beat Maru in the GSL vs. The World team-match despite the limited number of top-tier Terrans to practice against in Europe (a complaint of EU Terrans themselves), he replied 'theorycrafting and thinking about how to play the game.' Thanks, Joona. I'm sure everyone took that advice to heart.
While we may not be able to understand the nature of Serral's abilities, at least we can still appreciate them. Let's take an event-by-event look back at this WCS 2018 run.
Path: 2-1 vs Namshar, 2-0 vs Stephano, 3-0 vs MaSa, 3-0 vs Nerchio, 3-1 vs SpeCial, 4-2 vs ShoWTimE (17-4 map score)
The tournament that started it all and the only tournament where Serral did not enter as the clear favorite. TL.net's power rank for the tournament went Neeb #1, Elazer #2, and Serral #3. It was reasonable-ish at the time—Serral had been showing incredible form in online qualifiers, but had lost the WCS Europe Challenger finals 2-3 to Elazer. Also, Neeb had to be respected after winning three-of-four WCS Circuit tournaments in 2017. In reality, Leipzig turned out to be the beginning of many inconsistent performances for Neeb and Elazer. Meanwhile, Serral looked unstoppable on his way to his first major championship, capping things off by taking out ShoWTimE 4-2 in the finals.
WCS Austin Path: 2-0 vs Clem, 2-0 vs TLO, 3-0 vs Kelazhur, 3-0 vs HeRoMarinE, 3-1 vs Lambo, 4-2 vs MaNa (17-3 map score)
During the five month gap between Leipzig and Austin, Serral furthered the divide between himself and the rest of the foreigner pack. He took top four at IEM, third place at WESG, and generally made anyone non-Korean look silly in Nation Wars V. I like to think that with a time machine, future ShoWTimE would go back and tell his then-self 'You're doing FINE. Serral is going to go beat everyone at GSL vs. The World. He's just that good.' It would have saved him a lot of grief after games like this (I guess time-traveler ShoWTimE could also just have mailed off Serral's military enlistment form a year early or done any number of not-so-lame things). Anyway, Serral lived up to his reputation at WCS Austin, rampaging his way to a second championship. MaNa did put up a spirited resistance in the finals, but nonetheless fell 2-4.
Path: 2-0 vs MaNa, 2-0 vs Bly, 3-2 vs Scarlett, 3-0 vs Reynor, 3-0 vs HeRoMarinE, 4-1 vs Has (17-3 map score)
After sharing the spotlight with MaNa at Austin, Serral had his thunder stolen again as StarCraft II's perennial joke-character Has made a miraculous run to the grand finals. That was probably a good thing, because otherwise than Has' run, Valencia was one of the more by-the-books tournaments in recent memory. With the exception of Has, everyone who was supposed to win mostly won. Valencia was probably Serral's best chance to pick up a sweep, but he dropped a game when his all-in ran up against Has' own cheese.
Path: 2-0 vs Stephano, 2-0 vs Denver, 3-1 vs JonSnow, 3-2 vs Scarlett, 3-2 vs Lambo, 4-3 vs Reynor (17-8 map score [shameful!])
At, WCS Montreal it almost felt like Serral was changing things up for the sake of it. After winning the first three Circuit events by crushing the opposition, he went Neeb-style at Montreal by clutching out victory after nerve-wracking victory.
While I can't say Serral's interview ability noticeably improved throughout the year, he did give us his own version of an "are you not entertained?" moment by delivering the WCS Circuit game of the year against Reynor.
Total: 24-0 in matches, 68-18 in map score (79.07% win rate)
'Why's my name not on the trophy? Did they actually think someone ELSE was going to win?'
And thus ended the reign of king Serral—at least as it regards the 2018 WCS Circuit. Serral's shocking championship run at GSL vs. The World proved that his skills are not for Circuit use only, and that he's a serious contender to claim the 2018 Global Championship. The wait between the final WCS Circuit/Korea event and the Global Finals is always hard to endure, but this year we've been left feeling particularly impatient.
Even in the face of all-encompassing darkness, the foreign scene has always had hope going into BlizzCon. Even in 2014, when no foreigner qualified at all, there was hope that the future would be brighter. Four years later, things are bright indeed. For the first time ever, the foreign scene looks ahead to BlizzCon with not just hope, but confidence.
I thought you had forgotten! Good writeup and grats to Serral.
What is even more impressive is that he has done it all on his own. He doesn't really have a team full of excellent players to practice with and coach him, feed him, etc.
I think it's pretty telling that he simply thought about the game by himself to overcome Maru. Every other player in Korea are trying to figure it out for months but Serral already had the answers.
Maru might win BlizzCon given the team house situation and of course skill. But Serral is a strong hope. I am frothing for a Maru-Serral finals.
Thanks Wax, great write-up and to hell those elitists that keep saying this is not at all newsworthy. I'm sick of this. Amazing story by Serral and amazing storytelling by Wax.
Obligatory whine why is this writeup on region lock king so much more detailed and longer than Marus? Why? It makes me cry everytime. Sorry just sorry it needed to be said in the most(it totally didnt need to be) way.
I wonder (and still waiting for an interviewer to ask) about the impact of having a pro older brother playing and if Protosser is active in Serrals career with planning, player scouting, strats and stuff like that?
Looking at Serrals results from 2017 I think any player would be pleased with that. Serral/Results 2018 have been beyond what most think is even possible, I really did not expect him dominating this much considering the very big, but probably justified, zerg nerf at the beginning of the year.
I was thinking back on MVP and how he dominated the european scene, but when I then checked Liquipedia he had one WCS EU win (the korean dominance in EU was big at that time), memories and facts are not always the same... Mvp (player)/Results
On September 18 2018 21:29 DomeGetta wrote: Obligatory whine why is this writeup on region lock king so much more detailed and longer than Marus? Why? It makes me cry everytime. Sorry just sorry it needed to be said in the most(it totally didnt need to be) way.
Damn, Maru's fanboys who generally don't even realize he"s dominating a totally crippled korean scene are annoying.
On September 18 2018 21:29 DomeGetta wrote: Obligatory whine why is this writeup on region lock king so much more detailed and longer than Marus? Why? It makes me cry everytime. Sorry just sorry it needed to be said in the most(it totally didnt need to be) way.
Damn, Maru's fanboys who generally don't even realize he"s dominating a totally crippled korean scene are annoying.
LOL was a joke post but commmon bro lets have one blizzcon where we(foreigners) dont get a giant turd dropped on our heads b4 we say the korean scene is "crippled" rofl.
On September 18 2018 23:09 jinroairwings wrote: So what if he won a bunch of coin flip games. I'd say that is just getting lucky on the coin flip multiple times in a row.
On September 18 2018 22:55 MockHamill wrote: I think we have entered into a new Flash vs Jaedong era. Only question is who is Flash is and who is Jaedong.
I think we have to be in just about the first ever situation where a player has won 5 premier tournaments in under a year and still is apparently 2nd only, while some are still claiming he is not even as good as a bunch of other players too. Very sad for Serral, he should be number 1 but keeps being rejected.
On September 18 2018 22:55 MockHamill wrote: I think we have entered into a new Flash vs Jaedong era. Only question is who is Flash is and who is Jaedong.
I think we have to be in just about the first ever situation where a player has won 5 premier tournaments in under a year and still is apparently 2nd only, while some are still claiming he is not even as good as a bunch of other players too. Very sad for Serral, he should be number 1 but keeps being rejected.
He needs to prove himself against the best players on earth rather than just the best na/eu players before he gets that kind of respect.
On September 18 2018 22:55 MockHamill wrote: I think we have entered into a new Flash vs Jaedong era. Only question is who is Flash is and who is Jaedong.
I think we have to be in just about the first ever situation where a player has won 5 premier tournaments in under a year and still is apparently 2nd only, while some are still claiming he is not even as good as a bunch of other players too. Very sad for Serral, he should be number 1 but keeps being rejected.
He would be first if not for the fact that another player won the hardest tournament there is, three times in a row. I think serral is the best zerg in the world but you cannot just ignore gsl completely for what it is.
On September 18 2018 22:55 MockHamill wrote: I think we have entered into a new Flash vs Jaedong era. Only question is who is Flash is and who is Jaedong.
I think we have to be in just about the first ever situation where a player has won 5 premier tournaments in under a year and still is apparently 2nd only, while some are still claiming he is not even as good as a bunch of other players too. Very sad for Serral, he should be number 1 but keeps being rejected.
He needs to prove himself against the best players on earth rather than just the best na/eu players before he gets that kind of respect.
On September 18 2018 22:55 MockHamill wrote: I think we have entered into a new Flash vs Jaedong era. Only question is who is Flash is and who is Jaedong.
I think we have to be in just about the first ever situation where a player has won 5 premier tournaments in under a year and still is apparently 2nd only, while some are still claiming he is not even as good as a bunch of other players too. Very sad for Serral, he should be number 1 but keeps being rejected.
He needs to prove himself against the best players on earth rather than just the best na/eu players before he gets that kind of respect.
On September 18 2018 22:55 MockHamill wrote: I think we have entered into a new Flash vs Jaedong era. Only question is who is Flash is and who is Jaedong.
I think we have to be in just about the first ever situation where a player has won 5 premier tournaments in under a year and still is apparently 2nd only, while some are still claiming he is not even as good as a bunch of other players too. Very sad for Serral, he should be number 1 but keeps being rejected.
He needs to prove himself against the best players on earth rather than just the best na/eu players before he gets that kind of respect.
On September 18 2018 22:55 MockHamill wrote: I think we have entered into a new Flash vs Jaedong era. Only question is who is Flash is and who is Jaedong.
I think we have to be in just about the first ever situation where a player has won 5 premier tournaments in under a year and still is apparently 2nd only, while some are still claiming he is not even as good as a bunch of other players too. Very sad for Serral, he should be number 1 but keeps being rejected.
He needs to prove himself against the best players on earth rather than just the best na/eu players before he gets that kind of respect.
On September 18 2018 22:55 MockHamill wrote: I think we have entered into a new Flash vs Jaedong era. Only question is who is Flash is and who is Jaedong.
I think we have to be in just about the first ever situation where a player has won 5 premier tournaments in under a year and still is apparently 2nd only, while some are still claiming he is not even as good as a bunch of other players too. Very sad for Serral, he should be number 1 but keeps being rejected.
He needs to prove himself against the best players on earth rather than just the best na/eu players before he gets that kind of respect.
Ha, again this. GSL vs The World is NOT a GSL, it's an invitational event where most of it's participants does not even prepare that much. Please be less tacky, Serral is No.2, until proven otherwise in Blizzcon.
On September 19 2018 05:45 BretZ wrote: what a monster. wonder if it's a feat that will ever be topped
how can you top winning 4 of 4?
Since he won all his matches in the WCS Circuit, the only way to top this would be to have a better map score or to win more than 4 in a row (which is of course not possible in one year, and we don´t know if Serral is going to win more next year)
But i am a little bit concerned for Blizzcon, am i the only one ? Sure it was all ZvZ, but Serral looked...vulnerable, in each match in the playoffs. For the first time this year. Before i always had the feeling he is just way better than his opponents, but this time around it was a close call several times. Of course it was more entertaining, but still, i hope he just didn´t train that much before Montreal or anything, otherwise it may be that his skill dropped a little. Or he just found the inner Neeb, like it was said in the great (thanks Waxangel) article. If Serral wants to conquer Blizzcon i feel even HE has to step up his game a bit compared to Montreal. I really hope he does. Maru vs. Serral with both in top form would just be epic.
On September 19 2018 07:55 Rob-Zero wrote: Sure it was all ZvZ, but Serral looked...vulnerable, in each match in the playoffs.
I would say the same for Maru. Maru has shown weaknesses to Stat's collosus timing in TvP. Maru had his 2 tank 2 medivac push completely crushed by Leenock, Reynor and Serral so he'll need a new game plan for TvZ.
A Maru vs Serral finals would be great but it'll be fairly unlikely.
I think it can fairly be said that Serral is the second best in the world but on the other hand, I don't think it would be ridiculous to say that players like TY or Dark could hypothetically sweep WCS Circuit as well (even though I think that'd be improbable). I would say that he's probably a top 5 player though and is on par with players like Rogue and Dark.
Sorry to be clearer I am mainly pointing out that in any other period of time Serral would be outright clear no.1 from that many premier wins in that timeframe. He is basically at Bonjwa status now.
But there are two Bonjwas at once effectively.
Of course I won't reiterate what some have said regarding the teamhouse situation but it's just unfortunate for Serral to be in the darkest timeline where his accomplishments are belittled by some despite his clearly prolific run regardless of BlizzCon outcomes as he has already proven himself with 4 WCS and a GSL in one year.
On September 19 2018 05:45 BretZ wrote: what a monster. wonder if it's a feat that will ever be topped
how can you top winning 4 of 4?
Since he won all his matches in the WCS Circuit, the only way to top this would be to have a better map score or to win more than 4 in a row (which is of course not possible in one year, and we don´t know if Serral is going to win more next year)
But i am a little bit concerned for Blizzcon, am i the only one ? Sure it was all ZvZ, but Serral looked...vulnerable, in each match in the playoffs. For the first time this year. Before i always had the feeling he is just way better than his opponents, but this time around it was a close call several times. Of course it was more entertaining, but still, i hope he just didn´t train that much before Montreal or anything, otherwise it may be that his skill dropped a little. Or he just found the inner Neeb, like it was said in the great (thanks Waxangel) article. If Serral wants to conquer Blizzcon i feel even HE has to step up his game a bit compared to Montreal. I really hope he does. Maru vs. Serral with both in top form would just be epic.
2 things: 1. progamers are collectively looking for weaknesses in his play and try to exploit those 2. Serral's special power is to win clutch games when it matters the most which many other players lack
On September 19 2018 10:16 Anc13nt wrote: I think it can fairly be said that Serral is the second best in the world but on the other hand, I don't think it would be ridiculous to say that players like TY or Dark could hypothetically sweep WCS Circuit as well (even though I think that'd be improbable). I would say that he's probably a top 5 player though and is on par with players like Rogue and Dark.
Dark sweeping WCS circuit would be improbable? Have you seen his winrate against foreigners?
On September 19 2018 10:53 Dave4 wrote: Sorry to be clearer I am mainly pointing out that in any other period of time Serral would be outright clear no.1 from that many premier wins in that timeframe. He is basically at Bonjwa status now.
But there are two Bonjwas at once effectively.
Of course I won't reiterate what some have said regarding the teamhouse situation but it's just unfortunate for Serral to be in the darkest timeline where his accomplishments are belittled by some despite his clearly prolific run regardless of BlizzCon outcomes as he has already proven himself with 4 WCS and a GSL in one year.
There are 3 Bonjwa's currently. Special won Copa America 3 times in a row.
On September 19 2018 10:53 Dave4 wrote: Sorry to be clearer I am mainly pointing out that in any other period of time Serral would be outright clear no.1 from that many premier wins in that timeframe. He is basically at Bonjwa status now.
But there are two Bonjwas at once effectively.
Of course I won't reiterate what some have said regarding the teamhouse situation but it's just unfortunate for Serral to be in the darkest timeline where his accomplishments are belittled by some despite his clearly prolific run regardless of BlizzCon outcomes as he has already proven himself with 4 WCS and a GSL in one year.
While Maru dominates top koreans, Serral dominates top foreigners. But we have 2 bonjwas. Not spitting on Serral, but until he dominates at least 1 GSL Code S, then he cannot be banjo.
On September 19 2018 10:53 Dave4 wrote: Sorry to be clearer I am mainly pointing out that in any other period of time Serral would be outright clear no.1 from that many premier wins in that timeframe. He is basically at Bonjwa status now.
But there are two Bonjwas at once effectively.
Of course I won't reiterate what some have said regarding the teamhouse situation but it's just unfortunate for Serral to be in the darkest timeline where his accomplishments are belittled by some despite his clearly prolific run regardless of BlizzCon outcomes as he has already proven himself with 4 WCS and a GSL in one year.
While Maru dominates top koreans, Serral dominates top foreigners. But we have 2 bonjwas. Not spitting on Serral, but until he dominates at least 1 GSL Code S, then he cannot be banjo.
winning 1 GSL makes you a bonjwa? Sniper bonjwa confirmed.
On September 19 2018 10:53 Dave4 wrote: Sorry to be clearer I am mainly pointing out that in any other period of time Serral would be outright clear no.1 from that many premier wins in that timeframe. He is basically at Bonjwa status now.
But there are two Bonjwas at once effectively.
Of course I won't reiterate what some have said regarding the teamhouse situation but it's just unfortunate for Serral to be in the darkest timeline where his accomplishments are belittled by some despite his clearly prolific run regardless of BlizzCon outcomes as he has already proven himself with 4 WCS and a GSL in one year.
Lol but u did reiterate it. No one is belittling anything..its called realism. He hasnt won a gsl rofl. He hasnt even been competetive in one.
4 wcs is something..its not nothing but it in NO WAY puts u in a conversation as bonjwa lmao. Was Taeja a bonjwa after his prolific summer? No not even brought up cause hes just an evil korean taking advantage of weaker foreigners..but because serral is white hes a god for crushing foreigners..the circular logic is real.
On September 19 2018 10:53 Dave4 wrote: Sorry to be clearer I am mainly pointing out that in any other period of time Serral would be outright clear no.1 from that many premier wins in that timeframe. He is basically at Bonjwa status now.
But there are two Bonjwas at once effectively.
Of course I won't reiterate what some have said regarding the teamhouse situation but it's just unfortunate for Serral to be in the darkest timeline where his accomplishments are belittled by some despite his clearly prolific run regardless of BlizzCon outcomes as he has already proven himself with 4 WCS and a GSL in one year.
While Maru dominates top koreans, Serral dominates top foreigners. But we have 2 bonjwas. Not spitting on Serral, but until he dominates at least 1 GSL Code S, then he cannot be banjo.
winning 1 GSL makes you a bonjwa? Sniper bonjwa confirmed.
On September 19 2018 10:53 Dave4 wrote: Sorry to be clearer I am mainly pointing out that in any other period of time Serral would be outright clear no.1 from that many premier wins in that timeframe. He is basically at Bonjwa status now.
But there are two Bonjwas at once effectively.
Of course I won't reiterate what some have said regarding the teamhouse situation but it's just unfortunate for Serral to be in the darkest timeline where his accomplishments are belittled by some despite his clearly prolific run regardless of BlizzCon outcomes as he has already proven himself with 4 WCS and a GSL in one year.
When people say "Winning a GSL" they mean winning a LEAGUE. (The L part). The Season. Not a tournament. You know that yet you continue to troll by saying "and he won a GSL".
Serral is great. They way you try to promote him is trollish and insincere.
Serral has played as well as a very good Korean. He hasn't beaten the best repeatedly. His accomplishments do not yet compare with Maru's.
On September 19 2018 10:53 Dave4 wrote: Sorry to be clearer I am mainly pointing out that in any other period of time Serral would be outright clear no.1 from that many premier wins in that timeframe. He is basically at Bonjwa status now.
But there are two Bonjwas at once effectively.
Of course I won't reiterate what some have said regarding the teamhouse situation but it's just unfortunate for Serral to be in the darkest timeline where his accomplishments are belittled by some despite his clearly prolific run regardless of BlizzCon outcomes as he has already proven himself with 4 WCS and a GSL in one year.
Lol but u did reiterate it. No one is belittling anything..its called realism. He hasnt won a gsl rofl. He hasnt even been competetive in one.
4 wcs is something..its not nothing but it in NO WAY puts u in a conversation as bonjwa lmao. Was Taeja a bonjwa after his prolific summer? No not even brought up cause hes just an evil korean taking advantage of weaker foreigners..but because serral is white hes a god for crushing foreigners..the circular logic is real.
Look I don't like to keep arguments going like this, but I think you'd find Serrals undefeated run across 5 premier tournaments eclipses Taejas run.
Serral did win a GSL tournament which is one of the five above, you need to check your facts - and yes he crushed more than just foreigners, he took out Innovation, Dark and Stats in that one run which is ridiculous for any player in the world. Even Maru was unable to do this which is why he dropped out - but Serral beat Maru as well during this run in a 1v1. So no he doesn't just kill foreigners, and yes he is certainly in the Bonjwas discussion after a sustained run like this.
On September 19 2018 10:53 Dave4 wrote: Sorry to be clearer I am mainly pointing out that in any other period of time Serral would be outright clear no.1 from that many premier wins in that timeframe. He is basically at Bonjwa status now.
But there are two Bonjwas at once effectively.
Of course I won't reiterate what some have said regarding the teamhouse situation but it's just unfortunate for Serral to be in the darkest timeline where his accomplishments are belittled by some despite his clearly prolific run regardless of BlizzCon outcomes as he has already proven himself with 4 WCS and a GSL in one year.
Lol but u did reiterate it. No one is belittling anything..its called realism. He hasnt won a gsl rofl. He hasnt even been competetive in one.
4 wcs is something..its not nothing but it in NO WAY puts u in a conversation as bonjwa lmao. Was Taeja a bonjwa after his prolific summer? No not even brought up cause hes just an evil korean taking advantage of weaker foreigners..but because serral is white hes a god for crushing foreigners..the circular logic is real.
Look I don't like to keep arguments going like this, but I think you'd find Serrals undefeated run across 5 premier tournaments eclipses Taejas run.
Serral did win a GSL tournament which is one of the five above, you need to check your facts - and yes he crushed more than just foreigners, he took out Innovation, Dark and Stats in that one run which is ridiculous for any player in the world. Even Maru was unable to do this which is why he dropped out - but Serral beat Maru as well during this run in a 1v1. So no he doesn't just kill foreigners, and yes he is certainly in the Bonjwas discussion after a sustained run like this.
Yes he won a GSL, afreeca and gom before count these as gsls. They do however not count as code s, which is the tournament people reference usually when they talk about gsl. Winning GSL vs the world is a great feat, downplaying that is a little silly. But it's no code s. You mentioned before how preparation tournaments and weekend tournaments have different skill sets and one can make an argument for how a weekender is "harder" in some regards. I think that is true, but i still think that overall pretty much anybody would still argue that preparation tournaments are the pinnacle of competition due to the preparation you can put into each match. In theory you should be able to play your absolute a game because of this. That is not the only difference between serral's gsl and maru's code s titles though, gsl vs the world was a tournament without qualifiers but popularity vote. We still got a strong lineup, but the tournament didn't try to get the actual best players into it. I think there are people downplaying what serral achieved this year, but you seem to overhype it which isn't much better either.
On September 20 2018 01:45 Poopi wrote: I don’t think Maru can stop Serral atm, TvZ is just too hard. The hardest opponent for Serral will probably be Stats.
You're forgetting Reynor, best chance to beat a EU zerg prodigy is another EU zerg prodigy.
On September 18 2018 22:55 MockHamill wrote: I think we have entered into a new Flash vs Jaedong era. Only question is who is Flash is and who is Jaedong.
I think we have to be in just about the first ever situation where a player has won 5 premier tournaments in under a year and still is apparently 2nd only, while some are still claiming he is not even as good as a bunch of other players too. Very sad for Serral, he should be number 1 but keeps being rejected.
He needs to prove himself against the best players on earth rather than just the best na/eu players before he gets that kind of respect.
On September 20 2018 01:45 Poopi wrote: I don’t think Maru can stop Serral atm, TvZ is just too hard. The hardest opponent for Serral will probably be Stats.
You're forgetting Reynor, best chance to beat a EU zerg prodigy is another EU zerg prodigy.
Reynor didn’t qualify by losing to Serral at WCS.
Rogue had troubles against Serral in the past so I don’t think him or Dark would be that hard for Serral.
On September 18 2018 22:55 MockHamill wrote: I think we have entered into a new Flash vs Jaedong era. Only question is who is Flash is and who is Jaedong.
I think we have to be in just about the first ever situation where a player has won 5 premier tournaments in under a year and still is apparently 2nd only, while some are still claiming he is not even as good as a bunch of other players too. Very sad for Serral, he should be number 1 but keeps being rejected.
He needs to prove himself against the best players on earth rather than just the best na/eu players before he gets that kind of respect.
Ha, again this. GSL vs The World is NOT a GSL, it's an invitational event where most of it's participants does not even prepare that much. Please be less tacky, Serral is No.2, until proven otherwise in Blizzcon.
I had no intention of 'proving' that Serral is No 1., but rather pointing out that Serral indeed has proven himself against the best players on Earth.
...and what makes you think that professional gamers don't prepare for a KRW 30 million tournament?
On September 19 2018 10:16 Anc13nt wrote: I think it can fairly be said that Serral is the second best in the world but on the other hand, I don't think it would be ridiculous to say that players like TY or Dark could hypothetically sweep WCS Circuit as well (even though I think that'd be improbable). I would say that he's probably a top 5 player though and is on par with players like Rogue and Dark.
Dark sweeping WCS circuit would be improbable? Have you seen his winrate against foreigners?
On September 19 2018 10:53 Dave4 wrote: Sorry to be clearer I am mainly pointing out that in any other period of time Serral would be outright clear no.1 from that many premier wins in that timeframe. He is basically at Bonjwa status now.
But there are two Bonjwas at once effectively.
Of course I won't reiterate what some have said regarding the teamhouse situation but it's just unfortunate for Serral to be in the darkest timeline where his accomplishments are belittled by some despite his clearly prolific run regardless of BlizzCon outcomes as he has already proven himself with 4 WCS and a GSL in one year.
Lol but u did reiterate it. No one is belittling anything..its called realism. He hasnt won a gsl rofl. He hasnt even been competetive in one.
4 wcs is something..its not nothing but it in NO WAY puts u in a conversation as bonjwa lmao. Was Taeja a bonjwa after his prolific summer? No not even brought up cause hes just an evil korean taking advantage of weaker foreigners..but because serral is white hes a god for crushing foreigners..the circular logic is real.
Look I don't like to keep arguments going like this, but I think you'd find Serrals undefeated run across 5 premier tournaments eclipses Taejas run.
Serral did win a GSL tournament which is one of the five above, you need to check your facts - and yes he crushed more than just foreigners, he took out Innovation, Dark and Stats in that one run which is ridiculous for any player in the world. Even Maru was unable to do this which is why he dropped out - but Serral beat Maru as well during this run in a 1v1. So no he doesn't just kill foreigners, and yes he is certainly in the Bonjwas discussion after a sustained run like this.
No actually. I dont at all based on Taeja having to beat other Koreans in those tournaments he won. I think its a much better comparison in fact than to try to size Serral up to Maru. You are literally agreeing with me with your words lol..serral beat inno dark and stats in one single day tournament..this is a "unbelievable" feat as you say..and one that every code s competitor faces every season plus some if they want to win 1 code s. Maru won 3? My point is you cant put a single one of Serrals accomplishments in the same league as winning code S even one time. Gsl vs the world is by far the most impressive thing but it doesnt compare to code s..not even 1 nevermind 3. Blizzcon is an opportunity for 100 to put urself in the conversation..the amount of prep going in is tremendous unlike a super tournament or a gsl vs the world. Im hyped to watch. And obviously we will have to see him in code S at some point which im also hyped to watch
On September 19 2018 10:53 Dave4 wrote: Sorry to be clearer I am mainly pointing out that in any other period of time Serral would be outright clear no.1 from that many premier wins in that timeframe. He is basically at Bonjwa status now.
But there are two Bonjwas at once effectively.
Of course I won't reiterate what some have said regarding the teamhouse situation but it's just unfortunate for Serral to be in the darkest timeline where his accomplishments are belittled by some despite his clearly prolific run regardless of BlizzCon outcomes as he has already proven himself with 4 WCS and a GSL in one year.
Lol but u did reiterate it. No one is belittling anything..its called realism. He hasnt won a gsl rofl. He hasnt even been competetive in one.
4 wcs is something..its not nothing but it in NO WAY puts u in a conversation as bonjwa lmao. Was Taeja a bonjwa after his prolific summer? No not even brought up cause hes just an evil korean taking advantage of weaker foreigners..but because serral is white hes a god for crushing foreigners..the circular logic is real.
Look I don't like to keep arguments going like this, but I think you'd find Serrals undefeated run across 5 premier tournaments eclipses Taejas run.
Serral did win a GSL tournament which is one of the five above, you need to check your facts - and yes he crushed more than just foreigners, he took out Innovation, Dark and Stats in that one run which is ridiculous for any player in the world. Even Maru was unable to do this which is why he dropped out - but Serral beat Maru as well during this run in a 1v1. So no he doesn't just kill foreigners, and yes he is certainly in the Bonjwas discussion after a sustained run like this.
Okay enough - it's getting absurd. You realize TaeJa won 5 tournaments in 2013 just like Serral while beating top tier koreans in 4 of them unlike Serral who did it in 1? And even with that most people didn't think he's the best in the world because people are realistic when it comes to koreans. (I don't even want to mention the b-word because that's completely absurd)
I know I'm just getting baited here but I think the comparison to TaeJa is pretty good which is why I respond.
On September 19 2018 10:53 Dave4 wrote: Sorry to be clearer I am mainly pointing out that in any other period of time Serral would be outright clear no.1 from that many premier wins in that timeframe. He is basically at Bonjwa status now.
But there are two Bonjwas at once effectively.
Of course I won't reiterate what some have said regarding the teamhouse situation but it's just unfortunate for Serral to be in the darkest timeline where his accomplishments are belittled by some despite his clearly prolific run regardless of BlizzCon outcomes as he has already proven himself with 4 WCS and a GSL in one year.
Lol but u did reiterate it. No one is belittling anything..its called realism. He hasnt won a gsl rofl. He hasnt even been competetive in one.
4 wcs is something..its not nothing but it in NO WAY puts u in a conversation as bonjwa lmao. Was Taeja a bonjwa after his prolific summer? No not even brought up cause hes just an evil korean taking advantage of weaker foreigners..but because serral is white hes a god for crushing foreigners..the circular logic is real.
Look I don't like to keep arguments going like this, but I think you'd find Serrals undefeated run across 5 premier tournaments eclipses Taejas run.
Serral did win a GSL tournament which is one of the five above, you need to check your facts - and yes he crushed more than just foreigners, he took out Innovation, Dark and Stats in that one run which is ridiculous for any player in the world. Even Maru was unable to do this which is why he dropped out - but Serral beat Maru as well during this run in a 1v1. So no he doesn't just kill foreigners, and yes he is certainly in the Bonjwas discussion after a sustained run like this.
Okay enough - it's getting absurd. You realize TaeJa won 5 tournaments in 2013 just like Serral while beating top tier koreans in 4 of them unlike Serral who did it in 1? And even with that most people didn't think he's the best in the world because people are realistic when it comes to koreans. (I don't even want to mention the b-word because that's completely absurd)
I know I'm just getting baited here but I think the comparison to TaeJa is pretty good which is why I respond.
And Taeja played Terran, when was the last time some foreigner banjo was Terran? And he was probably the best lategame TvP player out there, god I miss Summer Taeja
I think Serral is more than a Bonjwa. He himself is the reason of foreigner skill rising up rapidly. Everyone in foreign scene is ripping their guts to try to beat Serral, practicing their asses off. This is the real value of that player. It's obvious especially in ZvZ. To be honest foreign ZvZ is much better and more skilled than Korean version of this matchup, so I'm really calm about Serral vs Rogue or Serral vs Dark at Blizzcon.
For me, Maru and Serral are both no1. U say Serral dominated potentially weaker - foreign scene, but in the other hand Maru dominated lagging Korean scene, which is not what it used to be back in a day. There are really only few players there that are competitive. Korean Zergs are far behind foreigner Zergs where it comes to understanding of current meta. When u watch Serral play and compare it to Rogue's or Dark's or soO''s it's pretty much obvious that he understands his race much better. That's only my opinion, so don't be harsh on that.
On September 18 2018 22:55 MockHamill wrote: I think we have entered into a new Flash vs Jaedong era. Only question is who is Flash is and who is Jaedong.
I think we have to be in just about the first ever situation where a player has won 5 premier tournaments in under a year and still is apparently 2nd only, while some are still claiming he is not even as good as a bunch of other players too. Very sad for Serral, he should be number 1 but keeps being rejected.
Tfw 4 WCS and a GSL vs the world are being rated as more prestigious than 3 GSL code S and a WESG. Some people are insane.
On September 21 2018 14:38 hiroshOne wrote: For me, Maru and Serral are both no1. U say Serral dominated potentially weaker - foreign scene, but in the other hand Maru dominated lagging Korean scene, which is not what it used to be back in a day. There are really only few players there that are competitive.
What you say is true, but the korean scene is still much greater then it's foreign counterpart in terms of skill. I don't see how this is debatable.
Take Serral out of the picture and the best foreigners have done this year is Neeb's GSL run. IEM Katowice, WeSG, GSL vs the World were all landslides.
On September 22 2018 05:04 hiroshOne wrote: U forgot about Reynor who knocked out Classic- top tier korean protoss- out of Code S.
And that's it. One BO3!!! HOLY MOLY! What a bonjwa! (also their first match was won by Classic) \ Edit> let's be fair, Reynor didn't show much this year in terms of "vs. Koreans", Neeb showed us more. He has a bright future ahead, that's for sure, but ATM we can freely forget him in these relations IMO.
On September 22 2018 05:04 hiroshOne wrote: U forgot about Reynor who knocked out Classic- top tier korean protoss- out of Code S.
And that's it. One BO3!!! HOLY MOLY! What a bonjwa! (also their first match was won by Classic) \ Edit> let's be fair, Reynor didn't show much this year in terms of "vs. Koreans", Neeb showed us more. He has a bright future ahead, that's for sure, but ATM we can freely forget him in these relations IMO.
I think Reynor has done very well against koreans this year all things considered, and for sure much more than any one had expected in his first half season as a professional gamer. He has not won every single match obviously, but he has certainly made a splash, and he has won more than one Bo3 against koreans, online as well as offline, so no need to disrespect his performance like that. Give the guy the credit he deserves.
You are all missing the point and the bigger picture here. The picture is, no matter the reasons, that more and more fireigners are equally matched vs koreans. And it feels it's a consisten rise of players that can do that. You can argue if it's because foreigners are getting better, or koreans are doing worse, but the fact is that it's happening.
On September 22 2018 16:02 hiroshOne wrote: You are all missing the point and the bigger picture here. The picture is, no matter the reasons, that more and more fireigners are equally matched vs koreans. And it feels it's a consisten rise of players that can do that. You can argue if it's because foreigners are getting better, or koreans are doing worse, but the fact is that it's happening.
Yah Im not so sure here. This year kind of feels like last year except Serral is Neeb and he did a bit better vs the other foreigners. Neebs run in code S is impressive / Serrals gsl vs the world as well. Real question is will we see a foreigner beat a korean @ blizzcon in the bracket stage for the first time ever? Im gonna go with no. We have seen the gatekeeper level of code s Koreans fall off a bit (thx region lock) but the top level Koreans are as good if not better than ever. Ill be rooting to see a foreigner go deep but I wouldnt bet money on it.
Another day another tournament won by Serral - this time Qlash invitational. 27-3 overall score. The guy is so far ahead of this game. 2018 the Year of Serral.
On September 25 2018 23:10 Dave4 wrote: Another day another tournament won by Serral - this time Qlash invitational. 27-3 overall score. The guy is so far ahead of this game. 2018 the Year of Serral.
On September 25 2018 23:10 Dave4 wrote: Another day another tournament won by Serral - this time Qlash invitational. 27-3 overall score. The guy is so far ahead of this game. 2018 the Year of Serral.
I think Serral is more than a Bonjwa. He himself is the reason of foreigner skill rising up rapidly. Everyone in foreign scene is ripping their guts to try to beat Serral, practicing their asses off. This is the real value of that player. It's obvious especially in ZvZ. To be honest foreign ZvZ is much better and more skilled than Korean version of this matchup, so I'm really calm about Serral vs Rogue or Serral vs Dark at Blizzcon.
For me, Maru and Serral are both no1. U say Serral dominated potentially weaker - foreign scene, but in the other hand Maru dominated lagging Korean scene, which is not what it used to be back in a day. There are really only few players there that are competitive. Korean Zergs are far behind foreigner Zergs where it comes to understanding of current meta. When u watch Serral play and compare it to Rogue's or Dark's or soO''s it's pretty much obvious that he understands his race much better. That's only my opinion, so don't be harsh on that.
I understand why foreigners are very biased to their players. Koreans been winning every single blizzcon, took 95% of tournies whenever they attend. And Blizzard decided to make system 'Region lock', which means Korean GSL players can't attend WCS Circuit, cuz they will take all money again, and kill foreign scene. Blizzard wants to give foreign scene a chance to grow vs Koreans. Neeb winning Kespa Cup? Serral winning GSLvsWorld? Not enough. The problem is rest foreigners can't win anything vs Koreans. That's all. Foreign fans always have been desperate on having a foreign player better than Koreans. It's very natural.
And bonjwa, isn't something that can be achieved that so so so easily like you said.
If someone wins, GSL 6 times in a row, and take blizzcons 2 years in a row, then we can say he is more than a 'bonjwa'.
On October 06 2018 03:05 Dave4 wrote: He is certainly in the B discussion. I think a win at BlizzCon would affirm this as first non Korean Bonjwa... Almost a year undefeated
Winning minor league 4 times doesn't make you bonjwa. Serral got defeated 0-3 by Classic in IEM world championship, and 0-3 by Maru in WESG as well. Are you new to starcraft scene? Then welcome. But sorry, if you claim Serral's achievement in minor leagues is bonjwa level, then there should be more than 10 people deserved to be called bonjwa in sc2 history.
On October 06 2018 03:05 Dave4 wrote: He is certainly in the B discussion. I think a win at BlizzCon would affirm this as first non Korean Bonjwa... Almost a year undefeated
Winning minor league 4 times doesn't make you bonjwa. Serral got defeated 0-3 by Classic in IEM world championship, and 0-3 by Maru in WESG as well. Are you new to starcraft scene? Then welcome. But sorry, if you claim Serral's achievement in minor leagues is bonjwa level, then there should be more than 10 people deserved to be called bonjwa in sc2 history.
On October 11 2018 05:07 RandomOnlyTheHumanLf wrote:
On October 06 2018 03:05 Dave4 wrote: He is certainly in the B discussion. I think a win at BlizzCon would affirm this as first non Korean Bonjwa... Almost a year undefeated
Winning minor league 4 times doesn't make you bonjwa. Serral got defeated 0-3 by Classic in IEM world championship, and 0-3 by Maru in WESG as well. Are you new to starcraft scene? Then welcome. But sorry, if you claim Serral's achievement in minor leagues is bonjwa level, then there should be more than 10 people deserved to be called bonjwa in sc2 history.
Let's give him foreigner banjo title
I agree. For all the foreign fan bois. We gotta make one for them.
EPT![[image loading]](/staff/Waxangel/WCS2018/serralmontrealtrophy.jpg)
Serral/Results
That would be fun 
