EPTGSL to host tournament showcasing new balance - Page 7
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
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Phredxor
New Zealand15075 Posts
On November 02 2016 03:15 FFW_Rude wrote: Elentos ? If it's true that they replaced those who don't accept with other players and that's why we have lots of toss maybe put it in the OP to reduce the whiners ? Sadly i doubt that'd stop them. | ||
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Elentos
55456 Posts
Yeah first they'd have to read that part before posting. | ||
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DekkuM
United States149 Posts
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LuckyGnomTV
Russian Federation367 Posts
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BronzeKnee
United States5211 Posts
On October 31 2016 21:53 Jer99 wrote: We should run our own tournament with our own balance patch Do you remember the pm you sent me during the Lotv beta? But yeah it is about time for the community to take over balancing and if TL leads the way, I guarantee the community will follow. | ||
Jer99
Canada8157 Posts
On November 02 2016 05:58 BronzeKnee wrote: Do you remember the pm you sent me during the Lotv beta? But yeah it is about time for the community to take over balancing and if TL leads the way, I guarantee the community will follow. i do not remember what was it about? checked my inbox and i don't have any sent/received to you, and i typically don't delete any PMs | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On November 02 2016 03:23 Elentos wrote: Yeah first they'd have to read that part before posting. i thought about it but didn't write it :p And seeing the posts just bellow yours... well... | ||
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TheWinks
United States572 Posts
On November 02 2016 03:15 FFW_Rude wrote: Elentos ? If it's true that they replaced those who don't accept with other players and that's why we have lots of toss maybe put it in the OP to reduce the whiners ? This doesn't really change anything. If they can't seem to schedule the tournament to accommodate a diverse group of players, they should just cancel it and make other plans where they could get a diverse group of players. | ||
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Uvantak
Uruguay1381 Posts
I’d be thankful if when people think of StarCraft, they remembered that there was once a player called Jaedong. This is a incredibly strong quote, I'm sure JD has spent a great deal of time thinking of his legacy and how does it fit on the greater scale of human history. | ||
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Kevin_Sorbo
Canada3217 Posts
probably wont watch much of it since its so P heavy. However its great to see there are forces at work in Korea trying to keep the game alive. | ||
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BronzeKnee
United States5211 Posts
On November 02 2016 06:19 Jer99 wrote: i do not remember what was it about? checked my inbox and i don't have any sent/received to you, and i typically don't delete any PMs Sorry it was Zeromus and not you who pmed me. I am often confused, this time apparently because you both are on the TL strategy team I guess. But anyway, I've been saying the community should rally around a single balance mod and just move on from Blizzard since the beginning of the LOTV Beta when Blizzard was busy adjusting the Lurker range while completely dismissing double harvesting... And now that Starleague is dead, it is really the perfect time. We really can't bleed out much more before we go into a complete death spiral. If TL led the charge, then the community would follow. Don't forget that Counterstrike and the MOBA genre were originally community ideas, and created by members of the community. We deserve better than what Blizzard's design team is coming up with. Starcraft deserves better. | ||
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Jett.Jack.Alvir
Canada2250 Posts
I think we should just stick to giving our opinion and let Blizzard decide who to listen to. CS and mobas were community driven, but to get them polished to a great game required Riot et. al. As great as a community can become, it doesn't have the organizational structure to develop something like SC2 or LoL. It's a lofty idea, but hardly feasible considering our resources. | ||
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BronzeKnee
United States5211 Posts
On November 02 2016 13:56 Jett.Jack.Alvir wrote: Interesting idea BronzeKnee, but we hardly ever agree on anything, so I don't see a mod succeeding if everyone is trying to get their own agenda developed. I think we should just stick to giving our opinion and let Blizzard decide who to listen to. CS and mobas were community driven, but to get them polished to a great game required Riot et. al. As great as a community can become, it doesn't have the organizational structure to develop something like SC2 or LoL. It's a lofty idea, but hardly feasible considering our resources. Yeah, my guess is you would have said the same thing when LOTV came out. And now Proleague is dead. Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results is one definition of insanity, but that is exactly what you are suggesting we do. And I disagree with your assessment of CS and DOTA, it never took anyone but Gooseman, Cliffe and Icefrog respectively before they became great. "There are two primary choices in life: to accept conditions as they exist, or accept the responsibility for changing them." - Denis Waitley It is time to accept responsibility. I am a custom map maker for WC3, and I'd be happy to help do some of the technical work for SC2. Sadly, I don't have the clout to lead this endeavor. But TL does. And we have literally nothing to lose, and everything to gain. | ||
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gingerfluffmuff
Austria4570 Posts
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Raineeb
Philippines39 Posts
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opisska
Poland8852 Posts
On November 02 2016 15:01 BronzeKnee wrote: Yeah, my guess is you would have said the same thing when LOTV came out. And now Proleague is dead. Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results is one definition of insanity, but that is exactly what you are suggesting we do. And I disagree with your assessment of CS and DOTA, it never took anyone but Gooseman, Cliffe and Icefrog respectively before they became great. "There are two primary choices in life: to accept conditions as they exist, or accept the responsibility for changing them." - Denis Waitley It is time to accept responsibility. I am a custom map maker for WC3, and I'd be happy to help do some of the technical work for SC2. Sadly, I don't have the clout to lead this endeavor. But TL does. And we have literally nothing to lose, and everything to gain. Well, Starbow was a huge effort in this direction, people sunk apparently thousands of man-hours into development and it still hasn't taken off hugely. I think that the problem is essentially that if the people on TL who want to change the game the most start working on it, the result will be pretty much BW 2.0 and that already has a pretty good competitor in actual BW. And then you have to understand that while BW does have a following, it's not really a lot of people and the potential to grow isn't big. This kinda runs in circles for years. The essentially problem is that the thing that SC2 did well in order to gain new players are mostly exactly those you would like to undo. Where will you get the players then? | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On November 02 2016 08:49 TheWinks wrote: This doesn't really change anything. If they can't seem to schedule the tournament to accommodate a diverse group of players, they should just cancel it and make other plans where they could get a diverse group of players. You really think a tournament planned like this one can be postponed ? They rented the studio, created and niomt a trophee. Have investor and sponsor money already etc... You just can't postpone everything. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On November 02 2016 17:01 opisska wrote: Well, Starbow was a huge effort in this direction, people sunk apparently thousands of man-hours into development and it still hasn't taken off hugely. I think that the problem is essentially that if the people on TL who want to change the game the most start working on it, the result will be pretty much BW 2.0 and that already has a pretty good competitor in actual BW. And then you have to understand that while BW does have a following, it's not really a lot of people and the potential to grow isn't big. This kinda runs in circles for years. The essentially problem is that the thing that SC2 did well in order to gain new players are mostly exactly those you would like to undo. Where will you get the players then? This really doesn't belong here but still: I disagree with you on this, the main problem is not what the changes would be. Most casual players simply wouldn't give a damn about any of that. Is there high ground advantage? Who cares! What these mods really lack is all the features and accessibility. If you want to play those you need to do more than simply click "play". You don't have matchmaking and thus you do not win/lose 50% of your games. People state that the arcade system is one of the reasons sc2 never took off, but who really plays arcade maps in the year 2016 when there are tons adn tons of easily accessible games out there with more "polish" ? This might be ignorant about dota2's arcade scene and if it is tell me, but i actually doubt that it's much different there (ofc the basic playerbase is bigger in that game) | ||
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opisska
Poland8852 Posts
On November 02 2016 22:51 The_Red_Viper wrote: This really doesn't belong here but still: I disagree with you on this, the main problem is not what the changes would be. Most casual players simply wouldn't give a damn about any of that. Is there high ground advantage? Who cares! What these mods really lack is all the features and accessibility. If you want to play those you need to do more than simply click "play". You don't have matchmaking and thus you do not win/lose 50% of your games. People state that the arcade system is one of the reasons sc2 never took off, but who really plays arcade maps in the year 2016 when there are tons adn tons of easily accessible games out there with more "polish" ? This might be ignorant about dota2's arcade scene and if it is tell me, but i actually doubt that it's much different there (ofc the basic playerbase is bigger in that game) Starbow did eventually implement a matchmaking system, no? It is through another piece of software, so it's not as one-click as normal ladder, but it's not really the hassle of normal Arcade either. In any case, the accessibility thing is solvable with enough effort. You have a key point though - today there is just so much available in terms of games. The whole success of CS/DOTA came in the time when the offer was so much smaller, so even though they were just "custom games" for something else, they drew in so many people who didn't have much else good to play. The landscape now is just so much different. Additionally, one has to take into account that DOTA was a radically different game than Warcraft, with different objectives and gameplay. Any "modified SC2" will have to deal with the biggest competitor, that is SC2 itself. | ||
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