Yoe Flash Wolves' PartinG will be unable to compete in the upcoming season of Proleague, according to a report from DailyEsports. The former SK Telecom T1 player was originally set to compete in Proleague as a part of the Startale-Yoe alliance, but contract regulations have barred him from the tournament.
Contrary to previous reports, PartinG did not leave SK Telecom T1 at the end of his contract as a free agent. KeSPA regulations require a player to play on a team for at least five years to obtain free agent status (clarification via DES reporter Kenzi). As PartinG left SK Telecom before this period, KeSPA has designated him as a player who has 'arbitrarily left' left his team. In such cases, the player's contract is suspended while all rights to player remain with his original team.
According to DES, PartinG is only eligible to play for SK Telecom T1, unless SKT puts in a request to the KeSPA chairman to free PartinG from the restriction.
Furthermore, Rain and FanTaSy are also said to fall under the same restriction, although their contracts had ended in September. Though both players have played with SK Telecom for over five years, neither player had filled the requisite five years since their previous free agency.
TL;DR: PartinG, Rain, and Fantasy cannot compete in Proleague this season, unless it is for SK Telecom T1. The reason is that they did not leave SKT as free agents, leaving their Proleague rights remaining with SKT. This is due to KeSPA regulations where players must fill a certain length of time on their contracts before being eligible for free agency status.
Seems like the rule originally existed to stop players from leaving teams and joining other teams mid-season? That said, 4 years to obtain free agency is like such a long time in esports years :[
What if It's all a set up in collaboration with Coach Oov?
Parting doesn't want to play in Proleague, but he wants to join YFW and get all the benefits and freedoms that it entails. He needs an excuse to get out of playing in PL for YFW, so he calls up Oov and they set this up.
Well, that's pretty big stamp on Startale's chances this season. 4 years is quite a lot though, but i guess, this is pretty old rule.
On the other hand, i don't think that either Yoe won't be able to pay transfer fee or they won't find a solution if they really want to, PartinG, Rain, and Soulkey are pretty big faces of KeSPA throughout last years.
On November 13 2014 12:41 Cheren wrote: This shouldn't apply to Rain and fantasy at all, they've been on SKT way more than 4 years.
how in the world would Rain and Fantasy fall under this provision? They've been with SKT for a long time.
either way, this rule is dumb in every way. especially now, in a climate where SC isn't the dominant esport and players change teams all the time. when people are fleeing kespa teams for the freedom of foreign tournaments, now probably isn't the best time to arbitrarily prevent people from playing in proleague.
Can't Yoe and whoever else give SKT that bullshit transfer fee, and then SKT gives them the money back? Fucking KeSPA -.-' Again with their ridiculous hoops that people have to jump through.
Typical KeSPA move, randomly screwing over the people who they make money off of for no respectable reason, because they have total control over the eSports scene in Korea and can get away with it. Sad to see such betrayal by the people who are 'supposed' to be supporting you. I'm gonna go tweet at them that they suck for this thing with parting. I totally recommend that, unless it's like, against TL rules for me to do that, in which case I'd prefer if you edited that part of my post to say "Mod Edit: Lumi was being way too cool for his own good"
On November 13 2014 12:49 DarkPlasmaBall wrote: Can't Yoe and whoever else give SKT that bullshit transfer fee, and then SKT gives them the money back? Fucking KeSPA -.-' Again with their ridiculous hoops that people have to jump through.
It's not like this stuff is non-existent in sports or even other esports, lol. You can't play in UCL if you played for other team and got transferred until next season, for example. Or even Riot's leagues are blocking you from playing if you got transferred to other team for 4 weeks, which is half of season + preventing you from playing for them in Challenger Series, if it's not LCS team.
Only problem is 4 years ban, but i guess, KeSPA just have some love to number 4, that's it, if you didn't match 4 in one place, get 4 in another.
On November 13 2014 12:53 Waxangel wrote: added clarification to main article: basically I've been told that you need to fill 5 years IN BETWEEN each free agency period
this would be a reasonable policy if this were baseball or a sport you can play for 15+ years -_-
Lmao.
Well, at least we will know soon™, do Yoe want to be relevant in Proleague or no :D
On November 13 2014 12:55 The_Red_Viper wrote: I wonder how this worked with EGTL and Jaedong?
KeSPA ALWAYS called that a loan
EG stayed as far away from clarifying or addressing this technicality as they could. KeSPA DOES acknowledge that JD is a proper EG player for his second (current) contract. In short, JD may or may not have been loan player on EG during the EG-TL Proleague. He is definitely a EG player now.
On November 13 2014 12:49 DarkPlasmaBall wrote: Can't Yoe and whoever else give SKT that bullshit transfer fee, and then SKT gives them the money back? Fucking KeSPA -.-' Again with their ridiculous hoops that people have to jump through.
It's not like this stuff is non-existent in sports or even other esports, lol. You can't play in UCL if you played for other team and got transferred until next season, for example. Or even Riot's leagues are blocking you from playing if you got transferred to other team for 4 weeks, which is half of season + preventing you from playing for them in Challenger Series, if it's not LCS team.
Only problem is 4 years ban, but i guess, KeSPA just have some love to number 4, that's it, if you didn't match 4 in one place, get 4 in another.
Except this KeSPA rule isn't just a transfer penalty, and KeSPA is notorious for abusing its power.
Hopefully the teams are able to sort things out for the good of the players.
On November 13 2014 12:52 Lumi wrote: Typical KeSPA move, randomly screwing over the people who they make money off of for no respectable reason
Yes... "randomly screwing over people." Not saying I agree with the rule, but it was clearly defined in their contracts. So, they either chose to ignore it or just didn't read it, which is a huge mistake when you're dealing with an organization like Kespa, who are known for being very strict with their rules.
I seem to remember way back when 'Free Agency' was first news for BW, the transfer fee was something ridiculous like half the player's salary or something. Does that still apply?
On November 13 2014 13:14 Fanatic-Templar wrote: I seem to remember way back when 'Free Agency' was first news for BW, the transfer fee was something ridiculous like half the player's salary or something. Does that still apply?
Or maybe I'm misremembering, it was a while back.
There are just so many absurd KeSPA stories, it's hard to keep track.
I remember back when KeSPA disqualified Leta in BW because he asked to pause the game because his monitor broke, but typed "pp" instead of "ppp". Except he couldn't see his screen anymore so he didn't know he had forgotten a p... and KeSPA gave Leta/ his team a loss for that game, which ended up resulting in them ultimately losing the series. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/brood-war/92204-spoilers-leta-and-kespa-controversy
On November 13 2014 12:22 Waxangel wrote: Seems like the rule originally existed to stop players from leaving teams and joining other teams mid-season? That said, 4 years to obtain free agency is like such a long time in esports years :[
That basically means don't play for any other team and just retire. Who else is affected by this? Soulkey? Innovation? Dear?
They have to play for KESPA five years before they gain free agency. Yet, if they are not performing to your standards you can release them on what... an annual basis?
I wonder what will happen with Gumiho. He doesn't have free agency either, not that he is interested in Proleague. But technically doesn't his new team have to pay a fee as well?
Not letting some of the most popular players in PL play over a technicality is incredibly stupid and it doesn't make sense money wise They'll find a way to let them play....
Ludicrous. This doesn't ever deserve coherent counter-arguments. SKT are being sore losers, throwing their weight around just because they're made of money. Shameful.
Hmm. Does nobody else think that SKT is behind this? Innovation and Dear can come back no problem, but Parting, Rain, and Fantasy get blacklisted? If Kespa is just being their usual tyrannical self, why not come down equally hard on everybody?
On November 13 2014 13:48 pure.Wasted wrote: Hmm. Does nobody else think that SKT is behind this? Innovation and Dear can come back no problem, but Parting, Rain, and Fantasy get blacklisted? If Kespa is just being their usual tyrannical self, why not come down equally hard on everybody?
SKT and Samsung almost certainly paid the transfer fees for Innovation and Dear, assuming this rule applied to their situations.
On November 13 2014 13:48 pure.Wasted wrote: Hmm. Does nobody else think that SKT is behind this? Innovation and Dear can come back no problem, but Parting, Rain, and Fantasy get blacklisted? If Kespa is just being their usual tyrannical self, why not come down equally hard on everybody?
Inno and Dear are now playing for other KeSPA teams. Rain, Fanta and PartinG are not.
I'm sure if Fanta ends up joining another KeSPA team it'll be fine for him.
On November 13 2014 13:48 pure.Wasted wrote: Hmm. Does nobody else think that SKT is behind this? Innovation and Dear can come back no problem, but Parting, Rain, and Fantasy get blacklisted? If Kespa is just being their usual tyrannical self, why not come down equally hard on everybody?
Inno and Dear are now playing for other KeSPA teams. Rain, Fanta and PartinG are not.
I'm sure if Fanta ends up joining another KeSPA team it'll be fine for him.
Oh, fuck me, of course that would be it. But the strange thing is... I imagine that financially, PartinG playing in PL is better for Kespa than not. He has his fans, he plays good games, lots of rivalries and drama and all that. And now he'll be bringing in foreign viewers as well. All good for Kespa, I would think. If PartinG just up and leaves Korea, what do they stand to gain from it? Nothing that I can see.
All right SKT, I'm sorry I said that stuff before. I didn't mean it.
On November 13 2014 13:48 pure.Wasted wrote: Hmm. Does nobody else think that SKT is behind this? Innovation and Dear can come back no problem, but Parting, Rain, and Fantasy get blacklisted? If Kespa is just being their usual tyrannical self, why not come down equally hard on everybody?
Inno and Dear are now playing for other KeSPA teams. Rain, Fanta and PartinG are not.
I'm sure if Fanta ends up joining another KeSPA team it'll be fine for him.
Oh, fuck me, of course that would be it. But the strange thing is... I imagine that financially, PartinG playing in PL is better for Kespa than not. He has his fans, he plays good games, lots of rivalries and drama and all that. And now he'll be bringing in foreign viewers as well. All good for Kespa, I would think. If PartinG just up and leaves Korea, what do they stand to gain from it? Nothing that I can see.
All right SKT, I'm sorry I said that stuff before. I didn't mean it.
No doubt you're right about that. But you can guarantee KeSPA will enforce their rules regardless. Iron fist!
On November 13 2014 14:23 Yakikorosu wrote: I hope they get rid of this absurd rule. It might have made sense in BW but all this would accomplish is hurt the popularity of SPL.
It's an archaic rule from Brood War, and it made sense during that era because KeSPA didn't want rich teams poaching all the talent and players having power to force transfers like spoiled football players. KeSPA's BW had a 10+ year life span, so having a 4 or 5 year period before "free agency" (that is, a player terminating his own contract instead of the team terminating it—based on how the events read—outside KeSPA's regular free agent period) made sense at the time. During that time, no players joined foreign teams so something like this never happened. Paying transfer fees made sense to allow the player to play for another team in Proleague. It's comparable to Champions League eligibility in football.
It's an oversight that they didn't adjust the rule for SC2, and I'd be surprised if they don't come to an agreement in this matter. KeSPA has relaxed their views on foreign teams and tournaments lately, and they don't want to mess up their positive vibes with a handful of players.
However, we don't know the full story regarding the contracts of the players in question. Did their contracts end? Did they just terminate their own contract? Did they quit? Did they reach a buy out of their contracts? We don't know. Simply blaming KeSPA without knowing the details is absurd.
And no I'm not agreeing with KeSPA. I am saying they have every right to enforce their own rules and their rules are based on reason however out of date, even though I think they should change it.
On November 13 2014 13:48 pure.Wasted wrote: Hmm. Does nobody else think that SKT is behind this? Innovation and Dear can come back no problem, but Parting, Rain, and Fantasy get blacklisted? If Kespa is just being their usual tyrannical self, why not come down equally hard on everybody?
Inno and Dear are now playing for other KeSPA teams. Rain, Fanta and PartinG are not.
I'm sure if Fanta ends up joining another KeSPA team it'll be fine for him.
Oh, fuck me, of course that would be it. But the strange thing is... I imagine that financially, PartinG playing in PL is better for Kespa than not. He has his fans, he plays good games, lots of rivalries and drama and all that. And now he'll be bringing in foreign viewers as well. All good for Kespa, I would think. If PartinG just up and leaves Korea, what do they stand to gain from it? Nothing that I can see.
All right SKT, I'm sorry I said that stuff before. I didn't mean it.
You really think KeSPA cares about common sense?
On November 13 2014 14:39 lichter wrote: People are overreacting.
It's an archaic rule from Brood War, and it made sense during that era because KeSPA didn't want rich teams poaching all the talent and players having power to force transfers like spoiled football players. KeSPA's BW had a 10+ year life span, so having a 4 or 5 year period before "free agency" (that is, a player terminating his own contract instead of the team terminating it—based on how the events read—outside KeSPA's regular free agent period) made sense at the time. During that time, no players joined foreign teams so something like this never happened. Paying transfer fees made sense to allow the player to play for another team in Proleague. It's comparable to Champions League eligibility in football.
It's an oversight that they didn't adjust the rule for SC2, and I'd be surprised if they don't come to an agreement in this matter. KeSPA has relaxed their views on foreign teams and tournaments lately, and they don't want to mess up their positive vibes with a handful of players.
However, we don't know the full story regarding the contracts of the players in question. Did their contracts end? Did they just terminate their own contract? Did they quit? Did they reach a buy out of their contracts? We don't know. Simply blaming KeSPA without knowing the details is absurd.
And no I'm not agreeing with KeSPA. I am saying they have every right to enforce their own rules and their rules are based on reason however out of date, even though I think they should change it.
I thought the official and accepted reason for PartinG, Rain, SoulKey and FanTa leaving was that they didn't renew their contracts?
On November 13 2014 14:39 lichter wrote: People are overreacting.
It's an archaic rule from Brood War, and it made sense during that era because KeSPA didn't want rich teams poaching all the talent and players having power to force transfers like spoiled football players. KeSPA's BW had a 10+ year life span, so having a 4 or 5 year period before "free agency" (that is, a player terminating his own contract instead of the team terminating it—based on how the events read—outside KeSPA's regular free agent period) made sense at the time. During that time, no players joined foreign teams so something like this never happened. Paying transfer fees made sense to allow the player to play for another team in Proleague. It's comparable to Champions League eligibility in football.
It's an oversight that they didn't adjust the rule for SC2, and I'd be surprised if they don't come to an agreement in this matter. KeSPA has relaxed their views on foreign teams and tournaments lately, and they don't want to mess up their positive vibes with a handful of players.
However, we don't know the full story regarding the contracts of the players in question. Did their contracts end? Did they just terminate their own contract? Did they quit? Did they reach a buy out of their contracts? We don't know. Simply blaming KeSPA without knowing the details is absurd.
And no I'm not agreeing with KeSPA. I am saying they have every right to enforce their own rules and their rules are based on reason however out of date, even though I think they should change it.
I thought the official and accepted reason for PartinG, Rain, SoulKey and FanTa leaving was that they didn't renew their contracts?
The press release is vague as usual. As far as I know it doesn't say whether the contract was terminated and by whom, or if it just ran out. Saying "the contract ended" is vague because it doesn't explain why it ended. Of course, we'll likely never find out for sure.
On November 13 2014 16:40 Magnet wrote: Yay for technicalities that keep the best/most entertaining players out of premiere leagues. A great idea overall. 10/10.
exactly. It's basically hurting themselves. But that's the problem with big organisations (especially if they are government-regulated), they stick to their rules no matter if the are still coherent with the actual outside world and changing those rules usually takes forever...
On November 13 2014 16:40 Magnet wrote: Yay for technicalities that keep the best/most entertaining players out of premiere leagues. A great idea overall. 10/10.
exactly. It's basically hurting themselves. But that's the problem with big organisations (especially if they are government-regulated), they stick to their rules no matter if the are still coherent with the actual outside world and changing those rules usually takes forever...
I'm not convinced KeSPA won't come around and change this before the season begins. Parting (and Fantasy and Rain, I guess?) is a big name in Proleague and unless they're really stupid they'll do their best to get him to play. I hope so, at least.
On November 13 2014 17:21 Musicus wrote: haha this is fucking ridiculous and why would SKT not file a ruquest to release these restrictions on their ex-players...
Because they are more part of the problem than the solution in this case?
On November 13 2014 16:40 Magnet wrote: Yay for technicalities that keep the best/most entertaining players out of premiere leagues. A great idea overall. 10/10.
exactly. It's basically hurting themselves. But that's the problem with big organisations (especially if they are government-regulated), they stick to their rules no matter if the are still coherent with the actual outside world and changing those rules usually takes forever...
I'm not convinced KeSPA won't come around and change this before the season begins. Parting (and Fantasy and Rain, I guess?) is a big name in Proleague and unless they're really stupid they'll do their best to get him to play. I hope so, at least.
That might very well be the case. However, since they had to change their ruleset with kind of a retroactive effect (if it were to be applied to the upcoming season), I guess they'd take the "easy" way and make SKT1 to let the players' Pl rights go...
all so vague. let's just hope for the best. I for once am crossing fingers for it to happen, since I really want those players in next PL!
On November 13 2014 12:52 Lumi wrote: Typical KeSPA move, randomly screwing over the people who they make money off of for no respectable reason
Yes... "randomly screwing over people." Not saying I agree with the rule, but it was clearly defined in their contracts. So, they either chose to ignore it or just didn't read it, which is a huge mistake when you're dealing with an organization like Kespa, who are known for being very strict with their rules.
Sorry but this kind of thinking makes me mad. It's not because something is written in a contract that it's valid. It's clearly an abusive clause to limit 15 years old teenagers for 4 years without any compensation. Having non-competition clauses is ok and understandable but in any normal jurisdiction 4 years would be judged as unenforceable, in many countries it should require a financial compensation during the stated period of time. Judging by what is told it's not even in their contract but in the rules of the tournament. This is complete bullshit. What the hell a tournament (Proleage) has to do with the commercial status of a player! The problem is that Kespa is managing the teams as well as the tournaments with the power to screw any player at any moment in any way. I'm pretty sure that even in Korea all this bullshit would not stand a chance in a court, but nobody can attack Kespa because they could still annoy you for years in a million of other ways.
JESUS FKING CHRIST! God damned Kespa jail i hope they all die! Seriously, when everyone is trying to save this game by growing the scene, encouraging new teams in PL, encouraging new tournaments, encouraging korean players to go abroad and expand their careers, Kespa seems to be doing everything it can to keep its dictatorship alive inside its own 8x10 prison cell. Listen to negative edge, SC is NOT the dominant esport anymore, it is struggling to stay afloat! If you put sh1t like this on the map it only helps people retire faster or switch faster to LoL/Dota2! And the icing on the cake is Rain and fantasy, having played more than 5 years at that team and STILL tied to that team because they were not free agents before? That is some serious bullcr@p, especially since most players in KR were moving through direct team transfers, not leaving team as free agent then joining another team. Kespa needs to seriously get a reality check........they are stopping this game from growing..... Also 5 years, when the full life of a progamer at the top (proleague) level can sometimes be below that? utter nonsense!
One more event that makes me think that kespa players leaving their team and looking for foreign teams are somewhat fed up to some degree...
Please Kespa, step into modern esports and don't be so restrictive about what your player can do. It'll feel bad as you let some monopoly/power let go, but it'll be good as you won't appear like the bad guys of esports...
kespa prolly cant back out out f this rule for contractual reasons. SKT wont hurt its chances of winning AND wont put themselves in a weak spot to negotiate other contracts with other players for no reason. If Startale wants Parting to play in proleague they'll have to give SKT a reason to (ie: money).
This is absolutely ridicilous, if not just downright stupid. Another example of how Kespa abuses the rights of players with completely over-the-top, senslessly restrictive rules. This is just so wrong, how can players be treated this way :/
Nice to see WCS get changed so heavily to give these folks more points lol. The hell is wrong with them. They do so much cool stuff and then this kinda crap pops up.
Everyone knows that e-sport years are something similar to dog years. My impression is that one rl years equals roughly 4 e-sport years. Hence Kespa should consider these players as free agents anyway...
On November 13 2014 19:09 ineversmile wrote: 5 years in a country with mandatory military service. Yeah, that might as well be an "until the end of your career" clause for most players.
Unless you're Flash/Life/Maru/any young prodigy that starts at 14/15 years old
wooops Parting probably didn't foresaw he would be playing in proleague once leaving Kespa, when he signed the Kespa contract with the intention of only staying there for a year.
Well that's not going to help their reputation among Korean community, sucks for ST/yFW tho. With all the recent changes in rosters I think that this pretty much locks down the top 4 for playoffs.
On November 13 2014 12:52 Lumi wrote: Typical KeSPA move, randomly screwing over the people who they make money off of for no respectable reason, because they have total control over the eSports scene in Korea and can get away with it. Sad to see such betrayal by the people who are 'supposed' to be supporting you. I'm gonna go tweet at them that they suck for this thing with parting. I totally recommend that, unless it's like, against TL rules for me to do that, in which case I'd prefer if you edited that part of my post to say "Mod Edit: Lumi was being way too cool for his own good"
how is it a kespa move? what the hell are you talking about? it was in the contract that parting signed, he was fully aware of it. and anyway, kespa will let him play in proleague if skt waive the rights to him. kespa does what kespa is made for: protect their teams and scene.
It's the same thing with Jangbi, isn't it? Even though he is retired, samsung still "owns" him.. His case is worse tho, they owe him money and didn't let him go to another team.. zzz
Hopefully PartinG will be able to negotiate something with SKT1 so they release him as a free agent. It would be a pity for someone of his caliber to not play in PL. Plus we still need the Bomber, Life and PartinG reunion to happen
On November 13 2014 20:24 REyeM wrote: Does anyone have any info about GuMiho and him being a sniper for MVP? I would assume that this means that he won't be able to play either.
On November 13 2014 20:24 REyeM wrote: Does anyone have any info about GuMiho and him being a sniper for MVP? I would assume that this means that he won't be able to play either.
On November 13 2014 20:24 REyeM wrote: Does anyone have any info about GuMiho and him being a sniper for MVP? I would assume that this means that he won't be able to play either.
On November 13 2014 20:24 REyeM wrote: Does anyone have any info about GuMiho and him being a sniper for MVP? I would assume that this means that he won't be able to play either.
On November 13 2014 20:24 REyeM wrote: Does anyone have any info about GuMiho and him being a sniper for MVP? I would assume that this means that he won't be able to play either.
You should become a free agent after your contract expires. If they team wants to keep you longer they should sign you to a longer contract. Imagine any other sport signing a 1 year contract with someone and essentially saying well we can terminate at any time but you can join another team for the rest of your career.
If SKT wanted them to stay for 5 years then they should get signed to a 5 year contract. Seems simple to me.
On November 13 2014 22:00 MrMatt wrote: You should become a free agent after your contract expires. If they team wants to keep you longer they should sign you to a longer contract. Imagine any other sport signing a 1 year contract with someone and essentially saying well we can terminate at any time but you can join another team for the rest of your career.
If SKT wanted them to stay for 5 years then they should get signed to a 5 year contract. Seems simple to me.
Yeah, that's completely mind boggling. How in hell can a team own a players' rights after the contract expires and for so long?
This just seems to screw players on an insane level.
On November 13 2014 12:40 oo_Wonderful_oo wrote: Well, that's pretty big stamp on Startale's chances this season. 4 years is quite a lot though, but i guess, this is pretty old rule.
On the other hand, i don't think that either Yoe won't be able to pay transfer fee or they won't find a solution if they really want to, PartinG, Rain, and Soulkey are pretty big faces of KeSPA throughout last years.
On November 13 2014 20:24 REyeM wrote: Does anyone have any info about GuMiho and him being a sniper for MVP? I would assume that this means that he won't be able to play either.
why do i never read anything where kespa actually helped a player out?
i mean they are supposed to be there to protect the players i though? i haven never read kespa fights for player living conditions, or kespa fights for wages
its always the fans that suffer due to some desire to follow rules and orders with no thought given to any form of morality.
On November 13 2014 20:24 REyeM wrote: Does anyone have any info about GuMiho and him being a sniper for MVP? I would assume that this means that he won't be able to play either.
On November 13 2014 20:24 REyeM wrote: Does anyone have any info about GuMiho and him being a sniper for MVP? I would assume that this means that he won't be able to play either.
On November 13 2014 23:06 MrTortoise wrote: why do i never read anything where kespa actually helped a player out?
i mean they are supposed to be there to protect the players i though? i haven never read kespa fights for player living conditions, or kespa fights for wages
its always the fans that suffer due to some desire to follow rules and orders with no thought given to any form of morality.
they're not there for player rights. they organize tournaments and secure production and help teams get sponsorships. but they won't fight for player rights unless it would be so bad as to seriously hurt their reputation in korea.
That's why every transfer window is a joke now and there are more and more superteams and outsiders, lol. Imagine if KT were still building super teams like in early 00's.
Pls, PartinG, play for T1. This time you can be 2nd Protoss here.
On November 13 2014 23:11 Ctone23 wrote: The classic Non-Compete clause..
Shame.
Can you believe that contracts like those also exist for casters?
I can believe it, actually. Kespa's negotiating position is strong and apparently no one pushed back on a 5 year contract which might as well be 15 years in terms of esports. Do negotiations even happen or does the Kespa team offer a take-or-leave contract? EDIT: Curious, not sarcastic.
Fuck Kespa. 5 years is like the whole career of a progamer, some don't even last that long. Basically what they are saying is that we OWN you. This is so typical of Korean culture though. Dealt with Samsung and other Korean companies before totally unrelated to e-sports, but those are whole other stories for another day. Kespa still haven't learned that they are no longer the 800lb gorilla they were in SC1.
so basically Yoe FW will have to pay SKT1 the buyout price? and if they can't afford it, then Parting won't be in ProLeague. this could backfire for them as Parting is probably one of the top 3 most popular players
On November 13 2014 23:06 MrTortoise wrote: why do i never read anything where kespa actually helped a player out?
i mean they are supposed to be there to protect the players i though? i haven never read kespa fights for player living conditions, or kespa fights for wages
its always the fans that suffer due to some desire to follow rules and orders with no thought given to any form of morality.
KeSPA established minimum salaries in LoL just a few weeks ago. There's not enough money or viewership in SC2 to do the same.
These rules are really stupid IMO. 5 years, WTF?! There is no other organisation with so strict rules. Even in sports you don't have ridiculous rules, like these... And if you consider average lendgth of SC progamer career, these rule appear even more stupid. Shame on you Kespa!
On November 14 2014 03:19 w3c.TruE wrote: These rules are really stupid IMO. 5 years, WTF?! There is no other organisation with so strict rules. Even in sports you don't have ridiculous rules, like these... And if you consider average lendgth of SC progamer career, these rule appear even more stupid. Shame on you Kespa!
Well, technically, in some sports you're getting banned by national federations while transferring from one country to another if they can't negotiate, for 1-2 years. But not five, yep, that's too much.
I can't believe that Kespa won't step in to correct this. It could not possibly be in there interests to let one of the teams basically fail and get wiped all season, and end up with only 7 teams again (like it looked like it would be for a while). Neither of those two effects would be beneficial to the longevity of proleague. I know Kespa are rules lawyers, but surely even they see that 8 competitive teams is a major boon.
you see for all this KESPA hyper, THIS is why most of us always hated kespa so so much 5 years ? oh yeah ... seriously ... thats a logical timeperiod in esport
Sometimes I wonder. Is it KeSPA or NKeSPA ? There is no need for such rules. So now KeSPA, unlike the rest of the world, "thinks" that Parting is part of SKT and not the Flash Wolves. I thought that they became a little bit better since SC2... Now I'm not so sure.
On November 13 2014 13:48 pure.Wasted wrote: Hmm. Does nobody else think that SKT is behind this? Innovation and Dear can come back no problem, but Parting, Rain, and Fantasy get blacklisted? If Kespa is just being their usual tyrannical self, why not come down equally hard on everybody?
INnoVation and Dear left STX SouL after the team left KeSPA, didn't they? So the rule probably didn't affect them at all. Their team was probably considered "disbanding" at this stage in regard to KeSPA ruling.
Overall I hope they figure something out. It's an idiotic rule and if PartinG can't play, it's bad for almost everyone.
Also the regulations are arguably not in favour of the players, I do not think that neither Parting nor Rain weren't aware of this. Afaik both of them left SKT1 in order to not play Proleague, but to attend more foreign tournaments. So this is basically what they wanted - or am I wrong?
Wow. 5 years, in a field that's as volatile as E-sports? That's absurd. KeSPA has some serious player-hostile rules, but we knew that already of course.
It does seem like a totally uneccessarilt draconian rule, surely to stop a player switching teams mid-season would be more than enough.
My 2 cents feel like KESPA is going to shoot itself in the foot sooner or later, if it's not in the process of doing so already.
I've always wondered why you never saw KESPA players streaming ladder practice mid season, then was told that they are not allowed to do so contractually due to KESPA, can anyone confirm?
The tigher you squeeze KESPA, all the more will slip through your fingers..
KeSPA has a very old mentality. They seem more representative of North Korean attitudes and practices than of a more progressive and modern, perhaps younger generation of South Koreans. I could be romanticizing South Korea - it's just hard to imagine them being, especially in modern generations, as ridiculous as North Korea. But, like North Korea, KeSPA seems to think that the shittiest publicity is great publicity because they want to be powerful and command respect, and completely forego the notion of being amicable or interested in working with others. It's that desperate insecurity to appear strong and independent, and a typical streak of control freakdom.
On November 15 2014 16:58 Lumi wrote: KeSPA has a very old mentality. They seem more representative of North Korean attitudes and practices than of a more progressive and modern, perhaps younger generation of South Koreans. I could be romanticizing South Korea - it's just hard to imagine them being, especially in modern generations, as ridiculous as North Korea. But, like North Korea, KeSPA seems to think that the shittiest publicity is great publicity because they want to be powerful and command respect, and completely forego the notion of being amicable or interested in working with others. It's that desperate insecurity to appear strong and independent, and a typical streak of control freakdom.
They sure as hell don't represent /my/ eSports.
Its upsetting and all, but comparing a rigid contractual clause to a death camp masquerading itself as a country run by aliens approximating humans but not quite succeeding isnt really the way to go.
On November 17 2014 06:45 hansonslee wrote: I hope KeSPA took a look at Flash v PartinG in HSC. That rivalry can bring in a LOT of views and create really fun storylines.
yeah. dick move if they uphold those completely unreasonable clauses.
On November 17 2014 06:45 hansonslee wrote: I hope KeSPA took a look at Flash v PartinG in HSC. That rivalry can bring in a LOT of views and create really fun storylines.
yeah. dick move if they uphold those completely unreasonable clauses.
I don't think so. If they make an exception for parting vs flash it would be unfair for other players. They should just modify the exiting clauses.
This is such a stupid clause. I don't understand what they want to prevent from that. I hope every team and players will say something about that and not stay quiet. A petition maybe.
On November 15 2014 16:58 Lumi wrote: KeSPA has a very old mentality. They seem more representative of North Korean attitudes and practices than of a more progressive and modern, perhaps younger generation of South Koreans. I could be romanticizing South Korea - it's just hard to imagine them being, especially in modern generations, as ridiculous as North Korea. But, like North Korea, KeSPA seems to think that the shittiest publicity is great publicity because they want to be powerful and command respect, and completely forego the notion of being amicable or interested in working with others. It's that desperate insecurity to appear strong and independent, and a typical streak of control freakdom.
They sure as hell don't represent /my/ eSports.
Its upsetting and all, but comparing a rigid contractual clause to a death camp masquerading itself as a country run by aliens approximating humans but not quite succeeding isnt really the way to go.
Also Lumi seems ignorant about South Korean business practises in general. You don't have to look that far north to see structures similar to Kespa.
On November 17 2014 06:45 hansonslee wrote: I hope KeSPA took a look at Flash v PartinG in HSC. That rivalry can bring in a LOT of views and create really fun storylines.
yeah. dick move if they uphold those completely unreasonable clauses.
I don't think so. If they make an exception for parting vs flash it would be unfair for other players. They should just modify the exiting clauses.
not exception, do away with it and make them more reasonable. esports is a beautiful flower that needs to grow and not get stifled by bullshit rules in its early stages.
On November 15 2014 16:58 Lumi wrote: KeSPA has a very old mentality. They seem more representative of North Korean attitudes and practices than of a more progressive and modern, perhaps younger generation of South Koreans. I could be romanticizing South Korea - it's just hard to imagine them being, especially in modern generations, as ridiculous as North Korea. But, like North Korea, KeSPA seems to think that the shittiest publicity is great publicity because they want to be powerful and command respect, and completely forego the notion of being amicable or interested in working with others. It's that desperate insecurity to appear strong and independent, and a typical streak of control freakdom.
They sure as hell don't represent /my/ eSports.
Its upsetting and all, but comparing a rigid contractual clause to a death camp masquerading itself as a country run by aliens approximating humans but not quite succeeding isnt really the way to go.
Its upsetting and all, but comparing a country to a death camp and the leaders of the country to aliens isn't really the way to go.
the best thing is that rains new manager pengwin cant even stop laughing talking about this stupid stupid kespa rule ... when talking about "5 years" in sc2 damn he rly cant stop laughing ^^ kespa is just a bad bad joke
This is so nostalgic. Kespa making stupid rules to screw over players, people complaining about it...it's like the glory days of Broodwar all over again!
It's a rule that clearly needs to be reformed in light of changes in the scene.
However, surely SKT should just put in a request to the KeSPA chairman to free all three players from the restriction for... well for the fans.
It seems to be the standard line for KeSPA players to frame their actions/successes/failures in terms of the fans, is this a convention that KeSPA teams can get away with flouting without some sort of reaction? What has the Korean community's reaction been to SKT exploiting this rule to keep 3 players -including the great and storied BW hero Fantasy- out of proleague? Is KeSPA blamed instead? Or do the Korean fans not see this clusterf**k as a clusterf**k?
since proLeague is the worst format anyways its not that bad but Kespa is fubar beyond anything.. 4 years.. SUUURE - how long does SC2 even exist? 4 years? mhm. something doesnt add up here not that we need more Protss :/
On December 17 2014 02:57 SeriousLus wrote: since proLeague is the worst format anyways its not that bad but Kespa is fubar beyond anything.. 4 years.. SUUURE - how long does SC2 even exist? 4 years? mhm. something doesnt add up here not that we need more Protss :/
I'd have to contradict you there being as you're wrong. ProLeague is the best format. Nya nya nya nya nya - and, as further evidence of my point - nya nya.
On December 17 2014 02:57 SeriousLus wrote: since proLeague is the worst format anyways its not that bad but Kespa is fubar beyond anything.. 4 years.. SUUURE - how long does SC2 even exist? 4 years? mhm. something doesnt add up here not that we need more Protss :/
You realize KeSPA was in Broodwar before SC2, right?
Have to be pretty strange to leave a team like SKT T1 in the first place in my opinion. Also when there company sponsors pro league it is a kinda fuck you to them as well
Oh well they come and win money in foreigner tournaments. Plus there is 2x individual leagues in Korea again, not like there wont be anything to do.
On December 17 2014 17:45 Pandemona wrote: Have to be pretty strange to leave a team like SKT T1 in the first place in my opinion. Also when there company sponsors pro league it is a kinda fuck you to them as well
Oh well they come and win money in foreigner tournaments. Plus there is 2x individual leagues in Korea again, not like there wont be anything to do.
Considering the amount of players who left SKT at the same time I suspect life isn't all good and shiny in the SKT house
Five years a bit long... but the ruling that he can't play this year seems fair to me. The contract prolly says 5 years and if you break a contract, well, you should know what you're getting into. That said: Rain, Fantasy, and Partings fault even if the rule is unfair.
On December 23 2014 00:09 -y0shi- wrote: Can anyone explain this to me? Other people switch teams all the time, why is it that only parting gets fucked? I dont get it
EPT
PartinG is only eligible to play for SK Telecom T1, unless SKT puts in a request to the KeSPA chairman to free PartinG from the restriction.
FanTaSy are also said to fall under the same restriction, although their contracts had ended in September. Though both players have played with SK Telecom for over five years, neither player had filled the requisite five years since their previous free agency.
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