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On October 17 2014 17:10 TigerKarl wrote:
16 koreans kills it.
I think it makes it better.
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1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
On October 17 2014 22:31 Wintex wrote:I think it makes it better.
maybe he means 32 koreans would be better
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your Country52797 Posts
On October 17 2014 22:45 lichter wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2014 22:31 Wintex wrote:On October 17 2014 17:10 TigerKarl wrote:
16 koreans kills it. I think it makes it better. maybe he means 32 koreans would be better
maybe he meant 31 koreans and 1 non-korean just so we can watch him get humiliated
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On October 17 2014 23:21 The_Templar wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2014 22:45 lichter wrote:On October 17 2014 22:31 Wintex wrote:On October 17 2014 17:10 TigerKarl wrote:
16 koreans kills it. I think it makes it better. maybe he means 32 koreans would be better maybe he meant 31 koreans and 1 non-korean just so we can watch him get humiliated
Huk could do it. 100% no sweat.
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On October 17 2014 14:20 Yakikorosu wrote:
People will always hate on Protoss unless they do something to become a fan favorite but I don't agree that Classic is at any risk of being a flash in the pan like Sniper or Seed. He almost made it to the RO8 in Season 1 this year, losing to his teammates Rain and PartinG in the RO16, did great in the KeSPA Cup, etc. He's just not a fan favorite--people have fallen in love with herO so they sneer at Classic losing in the RO32 in S3 when herO didn't even make it INTO Code S that season.
The only Protoss in the world you can say is clearly stronger than Classic is Zest. Who else? All you've got left is talented Korea-based players that didn't achieve much this year like Rain, herO (whose main accomplishments are losing in the finals of two big tournaments and winning the weakest IEM in memory where he beat nothing but foreigners and MC), PartinG and sOs (okay, sOs accomplished ONE thing this year but that was a long time ago), and players who've made their names beating up Europeans like MC, San and StarDust.
Polt is my favorite player and I am VERY worried for him going up against Classic.
MC made his name by taking 2 GSL titles ...
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On October 18 2014 01:21 Thax wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2014 14:20 Yakikorosu wrote:
People will always hate on Protoss unless they do something to become a fan favorite but I don't agree that Classic is at any risk of being a flash in the pan like Sniper or Seed. He almost made it to the RO8 in Season 1 this year, losing to his teammates Rain and PartinG in the RO16, did great in the KeSPA Cup, etc. He's just not a fan favorite--people have fallen in love with herO so they sneer at Classic losing in the RO32 in S3 when herO didn't even make it INTO Code S that season.
The only Protoss in the world you can say is clearly stronger than Classic is Zest. Who else? All you've got left is talented Korea-based players that didn't achieve much this year like Rain, herO (whose main accomplishments are losing in the finals of two big tournaments and winning the weakest IEM in memory where he beat nothing but foreigners and MC), PartinG and sOs (okay, sOs accomplished ONE thing this year but that was a long time ago), and players who've made their names beating up Europeans like MC, San and StarDust.
Polt is my favorite player and I am VERY worried for him going up against Classic. MC made his name by taking 2 GSL titles ...
Obviously I meant in recent times--i.e., what they did to earn the name he has NOW. The last of MC's GSL titles, as legitimate as they were, was three and a half years ago. I guess you could also say that San "made his name" by having Tastosis constantly make fun of him in early 2011 after he accidentally blocked his own natural with cannons.
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On October 18 2014 04:11 Yakikorosu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2014 01:21 Thax wrote:On October 17 2014 14:20 Yakikorosu wrote:
People will always hate on Protoss unless they do something to become a fan favorite but I don't agree that Classic is at any risk of being a flash in the pan like Sniper or Seed. He almost made it to the RO8 in Season 1 this year, losing to his teammates Rain and PartinG in the RO16, did great in the KeSPA Cup, etc. He's just not a fan favorite--people have fallen in love with herO so they sneer at Classic losing in the RO32 in S3 when herO didn't even make it INTO Code S that season.
The only Protoss in the world you can say is clearly stronger than Classic is Zest. Who else? All you've got left is talented Korea-based players that didn't achieve much this year like Rain, herO (whose main accomplishments are losing in the finals of two big tournaments and winning the weakest IEM in memory where he beat nothing but foreigners and MC), PartinG and sOs (okay, sOs accomplished ONE thing this year but that was a long time ago), and players who've made their names beating up Europeans like MC, San and StarDust.
Polt is my favorite player and I am VERY worried for him going up against Classic. MC made his name by taking 2 GSL titles ... Obviously I meant in recent times--i.e., what they did to earn the name he has NOW. The last of MC's GSL titles, as legitimate as they were, was three and a half years ago. I guess you could also say that San "made his name" by having Tastosis constantly make fun of him in early 2011 after he accidentally blocked his own natural with cannons.
By that logic Polt didn't do anything to earn his name but beat up some Americans and the occasional wandering Chinese.
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On October 18 2014 04:30 Thax wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2014 04:11 Yakikorosu wrote:On October 18 2014 01:21 Thax wrote:On October 17 2014 14:20 Yakikorosu wrote:
People will always hate on Protoss unless they do something to become a fan favorite but I don't agree that Classic is at any risk of being a flash in the pan like Sniper or Seed. He almost made it to the RO8 in Season 1 this year, losing to his teammates Rain and PartinG in the RO16, did great in the KeSPA Cup, etc. He's just not a fan favorite--people have fallen in love with herO so they sneer at Classic losing in the RO32 in S3 when herO didn't even make it INTO Code S that season.
The only Protoss in the world you can say is clearly stronger than Classic is Zest. Who else? All you've got left is talented Korea-based players that didn't achieve much this year like Rain, herO (whose main accomplishments are losing in the finals of two big tournaments and winning the weakest IEM in memory where he beat nothing but foreigners and MC), PartinG and sOs (okay, sOs accomplished ONE thing this year but that was a long time ago), and players who've made their names beating up Europeans like MC, San and StarDust.
Polt is my favorite player and I am VERY worried for him going up against Classic. MC made his name by taking 2 GSL titles ... Obviously I meant in recent times--i.e., what they did to earn the name he has NOW. The last of MC's GSL titles, as legitimate as they were, was three and a half years ago. I guess you could also say that San "made his name" by having Tastosis constantly make fun of him in early 2011 after he accidentally blocked his own natural with cannons. By that logic Polt didn't do anything to earn his name but beat up some Americans and the occasional wandering Chinese.
It's true for some more than others. For example, since HotS came out, Polt's match winrate against only Koreans and only in offline games (the setting for the top premier tournaments) is a solid 55.5%. MC's winrate under those same standards is 40.5%. So yeah, ever since HotS came out, MC loses to Koreans much more often than he beats them.
But the point of my post is not to hate on MC. If you read what I was posting about I was arguing against the article's and many posters' assumptions that unless Classic wins Blizzcon, he's just another "patchtoss" and doesn't deserve respect as a top player. I still stand by my statement that over the course of 2014, except for Zest, there's no Protoss you can point to and say "he's clearly played better in 2014 than Classic."
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On October 18 2014 06:21 Yakikorosu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2014 04:30 Thax wrote:On October 18 2014 04:11 Yakikorosu wrote:On October 18 2014 01:21 Thax wrote:On October 17 2014 14:20 Yakikorosu wrote:
People will always hate on Protoss unless they do something to become a fan favorite but I don't agree that Classic is at any risk of being a flash in the pan like Sniper or Seed. He almost made it to the RO8 in Season 1 this year, losing to his teammates Rain and PartinG in the RO16, did great in the KeSPA Cup, etc. He's just not a fan favorite--people have fallen in love with herO so they sneer at Classic losing in the RO32 in S3 when herO didn't even make it INTO Code S that season.
The only Protoss in the world you can say is clearly stronger than Classic is Zest. Who else? All you've got left is talented Korea-based players that didn't achieve much this year like Rain, herO (whose main accomplishments are losing in the finals of two big tournaments and winning the weakest IEM in memory where he beat nothing but foreigners and MC), PartinG and sOs (okay, sOs accomplished ONE thing this year but that was a long time ago), and players who've made their names beating up Europeans like MC, San and StarDust.
Polt is my favorite player and I am VERY worried for him going up against Classic. MC made his name by taking 2 GSL titles ... Obviously I meant in recent times--i.e., what they did to earn the name he has NOW. The last of MC's GSL titles, as legitimate as they were, was three and a half years ago. I guess you could also say that San "made his name" by having Tastosis constantly make fun of him in early 2011 after he accidentally blocked his own natural with cannons. By that logic Polt didn't do anything to earn his name but beat up some Americans and the occasional wandering Chinese. It's true for some more than others. For example, since HotS came out, Polt's match winrate against only Koreans and only in offline games (the setting for the top premier tournaments) is a solid 55.5%. MC's winrate under those same standards is 40.5%. So yeah, ever since HotS came out, MC loses to Koreans much more often than he beats them. But the point of my post is not to hate on MC. If you read what I was posting about I was arguing against the article's and many posters' assumptions that unless Classic wins Blizzcon, he's just another "patchtoss" and doesn't deserve respect as a top player. I still stand by my statement that over the course of 2014, except for Zest, there's no Protoss you can point to and say "he's clearly played better in 2014 than Classic."
I actually found my own winrates quoted above quite interesting, so I looked up every Blizzcon player's records in HotS against Koreans in offline matches (on Aligulac, of course):
TaeJa - 69.4%
INnoVation - 67.6%
Zest - 65.4%
herO(jOin) - 64.3%
Classic - 64.1%
Life - 62.7%
Bomber - 59.8%
San - 58.9%
soO - 58.5%
Jaedong - 56.6%
MMA - 56.2%
jjakji - 55.9%
Polt - 55.5%
HyuN - 55.4%
StarDust - 50%
MC - 40.5%
So yeah, I guess TaeJa is pretty good.
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On October 17 2014 06:00 Zealously wrote:
Let the "guess the next article"-game begin!
Well soO will obviously be second
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On October 18 2014 06:33 Yakikorosu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2014 06:21 Yakikorosu wrote:On October 18 2014 04:30 Thax wrote:On October 18 2014 04:11 Yakikorosu wrote:On October 18 2014 01:21 Thax wrote:On October 17 2014 14:20 Yakikorosu wrote:
People will always hate on Protoss unless they do something to become a fan favorite but I don't agree that Classic is at any risk of being a flash in the pan like Sniper or Seed. He almost made it to the RO8 in Season 1 this year, losing to his teammates Rain and PartinG in the RO16, did great in the KeSPA Cup, etc. He's just not a fan favorite--people have fallen in love with herO so they sneer at Classic losing in the RO32 in S3 when herO didn't even make it INTO Code S that season.
The only Protoss in the world you can say is clearly stronger than Classic is Zest. Who else? All you've got left is talented Korea-based players that didn't achieve much this year like Rain, herO (whose main accomplishments are losing in the finals of two big tournaments and winning the weakest IEM in memory where he beat nothing but foreigners and MC), PartinG and sOs (okay, sOs accomplished ONE thing this year but that was a long time ago), and players who've made their names beating up Europeans like MC, San and StarDust.
Polt is my favorite player and I am VERY worried for him going up against Classic. MC made his name by taking 2 GSL titles ... Obviously I meant in recent times--i.e., what they did to earn the name he has NOW. The last of MC's GSL titles, as legitimate as they were, was three and a half years ago. I guess you could also say that San "made his name" by having Tastosis constantly make fun of him in early 2011 after he accidentally blocked his own natural with cannons. By that logic Polt didn't do anything to earn his name but beat up some Americans and the occasional wandering Chinese. It's true for some more than others. For example, since HotS came out, Polt's match winrate against only Koreans and only in offline games (the setting for the top premier tournaments) is a solid 55.5%. MC's winrate under those same standards is 40.5%. So yeah, ever since HotS came out, MC loses to Koreans much more often than he beats them. But the point of my post is not to hate on MC. If you read what I was posting about I was arguing against the article's and many posters' assumptions that unless Classic wins Blizzcon, he's just another "patchtoss" and doesn't deserve respect as a top player. I still stand by my statement that over the course of 2014, except for Zest, there's no Protoss you can point to and say "he's clearly played better in 2014 than Classic." I actually found my own winrates quoted above quite interesting, so I looked up every Blizzcon player's records in HotS against Koreans in offline matches (on Aligulac, of course): TaeJa - 69.4% INnoVation - 67.6% Zest - 65.4% herO(jOin) - 64.3% Classic - 64.1% Life - 62.7% Bomber - 59.8% San - 58.9% soO - 58.5% Jaedong - 56.6% MMA - 56.2% jjakji - 55.9% Polt - 55.5% HyuN - 55.4% StarDust - 50% MC - 40.5% So yeah, I guess TaeJa is pretty good.
You're putting Classic on the same tier as Rain in 2014? I wouldn't even put Classic on the same tier as PartinG, my third favorite P this year.
S1, Classic got ro16, PartinG got ro8 (lost to soO), Rain got ro4 (lost to Zest). S2, Classic won the finals, PartinG got ro16 (lost to Classic and soO), Rain got ro16. S3, Classic got ro32 (last place against Effort and Shine), PartinG got ro16 (lost to Innovation), Rain got ro8.
That's an average of ro16 for Classic, 13.3 for PartinG, and 9.3 for Rain. If that's not enough, most of Classic's success comes from the Code S he won, whereas the others show consistency, and, in PartinG's case, having two of his three runs stopped by that GSL's winners and the third stopped by the runner up means he actually did worse than he should have done. On top of that, PartinG got second (behind Zest) at GSL GC, while Classic was struggling to string wins together over Polt at Cologne, despite how well Blink dominance suited his aggressive playstyle. And in Proleague Rain was consistently picked as ace over Classic.
Classic isn't even in the running for being in the running for best P in Korea for me. I'd probably take herO over him, and I don't even like herO.
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On October 18 2014 08:47 pure.Wasted wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2014 06:33 Yakikorosu wrote:On October 18 2014 06:21 Yakikorosu wrote:On October 18 2014 04:30 Thax wrote:On October 18 2014 04:11 Yakikorosu wrote:On October 18 2014 01:21 Thax wrote:On October 17 2014 14:20 Yakikorosu wrote:
People will always hate on Protoss unless they do something to become a fan favorite but I don't agree that Classic is at any risk of being a flash in the pan like Sniper or Seed. He almost made it to the RO8 in Season 1 this year, losing to his teammates Rain and PartinG in the RO16, did great in the KeSPA Cup, etc. He's just not a fan favorite--people have fallen in love with herO so they sneer at Classic losing in the RO32 in S3 when herO didn't even make it INTO Code S that season.
The only Protoss in the world you can say is clearly stronger than Classic is Zest. Who else? All you've got left is talented Korea-based players that didn't achieve much this year like Rain, herO (whose main accomplishments are losing in the finals of two big tournaments and winning the weakest IEM in memory where he beat nothing but foreigners and MC), PartinG and sOs (okay, sOs accomplished ONE thing this year but that was a long time ago), and players who've made their names beating up Europeans like MC, San and StarDust.
Polt is my favorite player and I am VERY worried for him going up against Classic. MC made his name by taking 2 GSL titles ... Obviously I meant in recent times--i.e., what they did to earn the name he has NOW. The last of MC's GSL titles, as legitimate as they were, was three and a half years ago. I guess you could also say that San "made his name" by having Tastosis constantly make fun of him in early 2011 after he accidentally blocked his own natural with cannons. By that logic Polt didn't do anything to earn his name but beat up some Americans and the occasional wandering Chinese. It's true for some more than others. For example, since HotS came out, Polt's match winrate against only Koreans and only in offline games (the setting for the top premier tournaments) is a solid 55.5%. MC's winrate under those same standards is 40.5%. So yeah, ever since HotS came out, MC loses to Koreans much more often than he beats them. But the point of my post is not to hate on MC. If you read what I was posting about I was arguing against the article's and many posters' assumptions that unless Classic wins Blizzcon, he's just another "patchtoss" and doesn't deserve respect as a top player. I still stand by my statement that over the course of 2014, except for Zest, there's no Protoss you can point to and say "he's clearly played better in 2014 than Classic." I actually found my own winrates quoted above quite interesting, so I looked up every Blizzcon player's records in HotS against Koreans in offline matches (on Aligulac, of course): TaeJa - 69.4% INnoVation - 67.6% Zest - 65.4% herO(jOin) - 64.3% Classic - 64.1% Life - 62.7% Bomber - 59.8% San - 58.9% soO - 58.5% Jaedong - 56.6% MMA - 56.2% jjakji - 55.9% Polt - 55.5% HyuN - 55.4% StarDust - 50% MC - 40.5% So yeah, I guess TaeJa is pretty good. You're putting Classic on the same tier as Rain in 2014? I wouldn't even put Classic on the same tier as PartinG, my third favorite P this year. S1, Classic got ro16, PartinG got ro8 (lost to soO), Rain got ro4 (lost to Zest). S2, Classic won the finals, PartinG got ro16 (lost to Classic and soO), Rain got ro16. S3, Classic got ro32 (last place against Effort and Shine), PartinG got ro16 (lost to Innovation), Rain got ro8. Mp That's an average of ro16 for Classic, 13.3 for PartinG, and 9.3 for Rain. If that's not enough, most of Classic's success comes from the Code S he won, whereas the others show consistency, and, in PartinG's case, having two of his three runs stopped by that GSL's winners and the third stopped by the runner up means he actually did worse than he should have done. On top of that, PartinG got second (behind Zest) at GSL GC, while Classic was struggling to string wins together over Polt at Cologne, despite how well Blink dominance suited his aggressive playstyle. And in Proleague Rain was consistently picked as ace over Classic. Classic isn't even in the running for being in the running for best P in Korea for me. I'd probably take herO over him, and I don't even like herO.
You can't just add up the numbers in rounds and average them. That's not indicative of anything--by that logic finishing in ro16 twice is as impressive as a ro32 finish followed by a championship. That makes no sense.
I think Zest is clearly the best Protoss in the world in 2014. After that I have a very hard time picking between herO, Rain, sOs, PartinG and Classic. Rain's overall career has certainly been more impressive than Classic's but his 2014? Personally I don't think there is a great argument for that.
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On October 18 2014 09:13 Yakikorosu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2014 08:47 pure.Wasted wrote:On October 18 2014 06:33 Yakikorosu wrote:On October 18 2014 06:21 Yakikorosu wrote:On October 18 2014 04:30 Thax wrote:On October 18 2014 04:11 Yakikorosu wrote:On October 18 2014 01:21 Thax wrote:On October 17 2014 14:20 Yakikorosu wrote:
People will always hate on Protoss unless they do something to become a fan favorite but I don't agree that Classic is at any risk of being a flash in the pan like Sniper or Seed. He almost made it to the RO8 in Season 1 this year, losing to his teammates Rain and PartinG in the RO16, did great in the KeSPA Cup, etc. He's just not a fan favorite--people have fallen in love with herO so they sneer at Classic losing in the RO32 in S3 when herO didn't even make it INTO Code S that season.
The only Protoss in the world you can say is clearly stronger than Classic is Zest. Who else? All you've got left is talented Korea-based players that didn't achieve much this year like Rain, herO (whose main accomplishments are losing in the finals of two big tournaments and winning the weakest IEM in memory where he beat nothing but foreigners and MC), PartinG and sOs (okay, sOs accomplished ONE thing this year but that was a long time ago), and players who've made their names beating up Europeans like MC, San and StarDust.
Polt is my favorite player and I am VERY worried for him going up against Classic. MC made his name by taking 2 GSL titles ... Obviously I meant in recent times--i.e., what they did to earn the name he has NOW. The last of MC's GSL titles, as legitimate as they were, was three and a half years ago. I guess you could also say that San "made his name" by having Tastosis constantly make fun of him in early 2011 after he accidentally blocked his own natural with cannons. By that logic Polt didn't do anything to earn his name but beat up some Americans and the occasional wandering Chinese. It's true for some more than others. For example, since HotS came out, Polt's match winrate against only Koreans and only in offline games (the setting for the top premier tournaments) is a solid 55.5%. MC's winrate under those same standards is 40.5%. So yeah, ever since HotS came out, MC loses to Koreans much more often than he beats them. But the point of my post is not to hate on MC. If you read what I was posting about I was arguing against the article's and many posters' assumptions that unless Classic wins Blizzcon, he's just another "patchtoss" and doesn't deserve respect as a top player. I still stand by my statement that over the course of 2014, except for Zest, there's no Protoss you can point to and say "he's clearly played better in 2014 than Classic." I actually found my own winrates quoted above quite interesting, so I looked up every Blizzcon player's records in HotS against Koreans in offline matches (on Aligulac, of course): TaeJa - 69.4% INnoVation - 67.6% Zest - 65.4% herO(jOin) - 64.3% Classic - 64.1% Life - 62.7% Bomber - 59.8% San - 58.9% soO - 58.5% Jaedong - 56.6% MMA - 56.2% jjakji - 55.9% Polt - 55.5% HyuN - 55.4% StarDust - 50% MC - 40.5% So yeah, I guess TaeJa is pretty good. You're putting Classic on the same tier as Rain in 2014? I wouldn't even put Classic on the same tier as PartinG, my third favorite P this year. S1, Classic got ro16, PartinG got ro8 (lost to soO), Rain got ro4 (lost to Zest). S2, Classic won the finals, PartinG got ro16 (lost to Classic and soO), Rain got ro16. S3, Classic got ro32 (last place against Effort and Shine), PartinG got ro16 (lost to Innovation), Rain got ro8. Mp That's an average of ro16 for Classic, 13.3 for PartinG, and 9.3 for Rain. If that's not enough, most of Classic's success comes from the Code S he won, whereas the others show consistency, and, in PartinG's case, having two of his three runs stopped by that GSL's winners and the third stopped by the runner up means he actually did worse than he should have done. On top of that, PartinG got second (behind Zest) at GSL GC, while Classic was struggling to string wins together over Polt at Cologne, despite how well Blink dominance suited his aggressive playstyle. And in Proleague Rain was consistently picked as ace over Classic. Classic isn't even in the running for being in the running for best P in Korea for me. I'd probably take herO over him, and I don't even like herO. You can't just add up the numbers in rounds and average them. That's not indicative of anything--by that logic finishing in ro16 twice is as impressive as a ro32 finish followed by a championship. That makes no sense.
Which is exactly why I went on to explain what makes PartinG's 13.6 FAR more impressive than Classic's 16.
I think Zest is clearly the best Protoss in the world in 2014. After that I have a very hard time picking between herO, Rain, sOs, PartinG and Classic. Rain's overall career has certainly been more impressive than Classic's but his 2014? Personally I don't think there is a great argument for that.
You're being silly if you think that the limited accomplishments of an aggressive Protoss like Classic during an era that heavily favored Protoss aggression are in any way comparable to the greater accomplishments of Rain, who as a defensive Protoss actually DID NOT BENEFIT from the imbalanced state of the game in 2014. A lot of people gave him flak for calling Terran "broodlord/infestor," but from his perspective, he was absolutely right. Protoss only had a huge edge if they were willing to exploit the unpredictability of the race to its highest potential, and Rain isn't the kind of player to do that. In a lesser player, we might call that a weakness. But the fact that his results in Code S and Proleague were so much better than Classic's despite of this handicap is a monumental testament to his skill and consistency.
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United Kingdom31935 Posts
When will the next one come out? So hyped
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I'm guessing MMA is next *bites lip*
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On October 17 2014 22:45 lichter wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2014 22:31 Wintex wrote:On October 17 2014 17:10 TigerKarl wrote:
16 koreans kills it. I think it makes it better. maybe he means 32 koreans would be better
64 koreans would be even better!
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formatting and graphic design of the "road to blizzcon" are awesome!
*bliss*
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classic was a bw terran. so he has mechanical abilities allowing him to do anything. i never consider(ed) him a cheesy player.
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On October 17 2014 18:24 graNite wrote:
soO has to be 2nd :D
but are they counting down or up?
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EPT
