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On March 11 2014 00:53 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2014 00:46 TotalBiscuit wrote:On March 11 2014 00:41 Promethelax wrote:On March 11 2014 00:36 GreenMash wrote:On March 11 2014 00:35 nkr wrote:bit disappointing seeing mYi not getting an invite despite them being the current ESL champions beating acer and mousesports  they should go through the qualis tho ^_^; This is based of the last season of ATC. Myi never played ATC before They played, and lost, in the qualifiers last season actually. Got destroyed by Check. Fixed that for you  On a separate note I'd love to see the merc rule removed this time around. I don't honestly think that mercs have any place in team leagues, especially all-kill which are so susceptible to star-player stompings. It doesn't reward having a deep wellrounded roster, it rewards picking up the strongest ringer you can find. Imho, you either do a full partnership with another team or you play alone, you don't just cherry-pick a really strong player. We saw what happened to WW when they couldn't bring San, they got wrecked in the finals. I agree and we purposely never picked up a merc despite often being short on players last season.
If anything, I'd say mercing puts the team doing it in a bad light anyway. If your victories are handed to you by a player that isn't even on your team, how does that 1) make the rest of your team feel and 2) make you look to the viewers? If not for Checks strong performance last season, I'd say WW had no right to get to the playoffs and even Check wasn't able to stop them getting rolled in said playoffs without San to back him up.
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On March 11 2014 00:46 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2014 00:41 Promethelax wrote:On March 11 2014 00:36 GreenMash wrote:On March 11 2014 00:35 nkr wrote:bit disappointing seeing mYi not getting an invite despite them being the current ESL champions beating acer and mousesports they should go through the qualis tho ^_^; This is based of the last season of ATC. Myi never played ATC before They played, and lost, in the qualifiers last season actually. Got destroyed by Check. Fixed that for you On a separate note I'd love to see the merc rule removed this time around. I don't honestly think that mercs have any place in team leagues, especially all-kill which are so susceptible to star-player stompings. It doesn't reward having a deep wellrounded roster, it rewards picking up the strongest ringer you can find. Imho, you either do a full partnership with another team or you play alone, you don't just cherry-pick a really strong player. We saw what happened to WW when they couldn't bring San, they got wrecked in the finals.
I don't see the distinction between Check and WW last season. I don't see it at all.
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On March 11 2014 00:32 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2014 00:29 Acer.Scarlett` wrote:On March 11 2014 00:28 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Axiom hasn't actually confirmed for this so it's a little confusing why we are listed, I think assumptions have been made. I'll talk to TakeTV and get it all sorted out though, I just don't want people blaming us if something changes because we haven't officially agreed to play yet. I think those are all the teams that didn't get eliminated last season o.o Empire also has too few to play atm Yeah, I think the announcement needs rewording to say "these teams have been invited" (which we actually haven't yet, officially as far as I know) or "these teams are eligible". Saying anything else is not true yet. Again I'm sure this will all be sorted out but it reflects poorly on teams if they are perceived as "pulling out" of an event they hadn't agreed to yet in the first place. Basically Axiom participation is reliant on travel compensation agreements for the finals since flying an entire team from Korea is very expensive and not something we can afford to do without adequate travel support.
To be fair, you did post in the SSC thread that this ATC was yours (Axiom's). Of course, it doesn't make it official but if TakeTV did jump the gun, you did as well.
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On March 11 2014 00:53 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2014 00:46 TotalBiscuit wrote:On March 11 2014 00:41 Promethelax wrote:On March 11 2014 00:36 GreenMash wrote:On March 11 2014 00:35 nkr wrote:bit disappointing seeing mYi not getting an invite despite them being the current ESL champions beating acer and mousesports they should go through the qualis tho ^_^; This is based of the last season of ATC. Myi never played ATC before They played, and lost, in the qualifiers last season actually. Got destroyed by Check. Fixed that for you On a separate note I'd love to see the merc rule removed this time around. I don't honestly think that mercs have any place in team leagues, especially all-kill which are so susceptible to star-player stompings. It doesn't reward having a deep wellrounded roster, it rewards picking up the strongest ringer you can find. Imho, you either do a full partnership with another team or you play alone, you don't just cherry-pick a really strong player. We saw what happened to WW when they couldn't bring San, they got wrecked in the finals. I agree and we purposely never picked up a merc despite often being short on players last season.
I agree too. Merc rules is not good for a Team league, You have to fight with your own forces.
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On March 11 2014 00:53 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2014 00:46 TotalBiscuit wrote:On March 11 2014 00:41 Promethelax wrote:On March 11 2014 00:36 GreenMash wrote:On March 11 2014 00:35 nkr wrote:bit disappointing seeing mYi not getting an invite despite them being the current ESL champions beating acer and mousesports they should go through the qualis tho ^_^; This is based of the last season of ATC. Myi never played ATC before They played, and lost, in the qualifiers last season actually. Got destroyed by Check. Fixed that for you On a separate note I'd love to see the merc rule removed this time around. I don't honestly think that mercs have any place in team leagues, especially all-kill which are so susceptible to star-player stompings. It doesn't reward having a deep wellrounded roster, it rewards picking up the strongest ringer you can find. Imho, you either do a full partnership with another team or you play alone, you don't just cherry-pick a really strong player. We saw what happened to WW when they couldn't bring San, they got wrecked in the finals. I agree and we purposely never picked up a merc despite often being short on players last season.
But you already had TaeJa!
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On March 11 2014 01:11 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2014 00:32 TotalBiscuit wrote:On March 11 2014 00:29 Acer.Scarlett` wrote:On March 11 2014 00:28 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Axiom hasn't actually confirmed for this so it's a little confusing why we are listed, I think assumptions have been made. I'll talk to TakeTV and get it all sorted out though, I just don't want people blaming us if something changes because we haven't officially agreed to play yet. I think those are all the teams that didn't get eliminated last season o.o Empire also has too few to play atm Yeah, I think the announcement needs rewording to say "these teams have been invited" (which we actually haven't yet, officially as far as I know) or "these teams are eligible". Saying anything else is not true yet. Again I'm sure this will all be sorted out but it reflects poorly on teams if they are perceived as "pulling out" of an event they hadn't agreed to yet in the first place. Basically Axiom participation is reliant on travel compensation agreements for the finals since flying an entire team from Korea is very expensive and not something we can afford to do without adequate travel support. To be fair, you did post in the SSC thread that this ATC was yours (Axiom's). Of course, it doesn't make it official but if TakeTV did jump the gun, you did as well.
Fun trashtalk should not be regarded or punished like this. Nobody in their right mind would take that as a commitment. Our social media team talks about ATC too. Do you prefer radio silence regarding the term ATC because speaking about it could indicate participation?
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On March 11 2014 01:13 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2014 01:11 vthree wrote:On March 11 2014 00:32 TotalBiscuit wrote:On March 11 2014 00:29 Acer.Scarlett` wrote:On March 11 2014 00:28 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Axiom hasn't actually confirmed for this so it's a little confusing why we are listed, I think assumptions have been made. I'll talk to TakeTV and get it all sorted out though, I just don't want people blaming us if something changes because we haven't officially agreed to play yet. I think those are all the teams that didn't get eliminated last season o.o Empire also has too few to play atm Yeah, I think the announcement needs rewording to say "these teams have been invited" (which we actually haven't yet, officially as far as I know) or "these teams are eligible". Saying anything else is not true yet. Again I'm sure this will all be sorted out but it reflects poorly on teams if they are perceived as "pulling out" of an event they hadn't agreed to yet in the first place. Basically Axiom participation is reliant on travel compensation agreements for the finals since flying an entire team from Korea is very expensive and not something we can afford to do without adequate travel support. To be fair, you did post in the SSC thread that this ATC was yours (Axiom's). Of course, it doesn't make it official but if TakeTV did jump the gun, you did as well. Fun trashtalk should not be regarded or punished like this. Nobody in their right mind would take that as a commitment.
What he said.
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On March 11 2014 00:53 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2014 00:46 TotalBiscuit wrote:On March 11 2014 00:41 Promethelax wrote:On March 11 2014 00:36 GreenMash wrote:On March 11 2014 00:35 nkr wrote:bit disappointing seeing mYi not getting an invite despite them being the current ESL champions beating acer and mousesports they should go through the qualis tho ^_^; This is based of the last season of ATC. Myi never played ATC before They played, and lost, in the qualifiers last season actually. Got destroyed by Check. Fixed that for you On a separate note I'd love to see the merc rule removed this time around. I don't honestly think that mercs have any place in team leagues, especially all-kill which are so susceptible to star-player stompings. It doesn't reward having a deep wellrounded roster, it rewards picking up the strongest ringer you can find. Imho, you either do a full partnership with another team or you play alone, you don't just cherry-pick a really strong player. We saw what happened to WW when they couldn't bring San, they got wrecked in the finals. I agree and we purposely never picked up a merc despite often being short on players last season.
So you deny hiring Pirate- and Mustacheterran?
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Crossing my fingers for a Brat_OK appearance!
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On March 11 2014 01:16 Musicus wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2014 00:53 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:On March 11 2014 00:46 TotalBiscuit wrote:On March 11 2014 00:41 Promethelax wrote:On March 11 2014 00:36 GreenMash wrote:On March 11 2014 00:35 nkr wrote:bit disappointing seeing mYi not getting an invite despite them being the current ESL champions beating acer and mousesports they should go through the qualis tho ^_^; This is based of the last season of ATC. Myi never played ATC before They played, and lost, in the qualifiers last season actually. Got destroyed by Check. Fixed that for you On a separate note I'd love to see the merc rule removed this time around. I don't honestly think that mercs have any place in team leagues, especially all-kill which are so susceptible to star-player stompings. It doesn't reward having a deep wellrounded roster, it rewards picking up the strongest ringer you can find. Imho, you either do a full partnership with another team or you play alone, you don't just cherry-pick a really strong player. We saw what happened to WW when they couldn't bring San, they got wrecked in the finals. I agree and we purposely never picked up a merc despite often being short on players last season. So you deny hiring Pirate- and Mustacheterran?
Both of those guys are on the payroll.
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Just saw that only the two best teams go to Krefeld this time unlike the previous seasons where the top 4 was invited. I guess it's for reducing the costs and I understand that but it's still a little disappointing.
Also, I couldn't agree more with TB. The ace player rule has to go, just like the dumb super revive rule was removed last season. Oh and if I may ask, please, don't put anymore the number of maps won over the map average to determine the ranking in case of a tie. That's just fucked up.
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Great to see the series continue, gogo #teamteaja !
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On March 11 2014 01:15 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2014 01:13 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:On March 11 2014 01:11 vthree wrote:On March 11 2014 00:32 TotalBiscuit wrote:On March 11 2014 00:29 Acer.Scarlett` wrote:On March 11 2014 00:28 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Axiom hasn't actually confirmed for this so it's a little confusing why we are listed, I think assumptions have been made. I'll talk to TakeTV and get it all sorted out though, I just don't want people blaming us if something changes because we haven't officially agreed to play yet. I think those are all the teams that didn't get eliminated last season o.o Empire also has too few to play atm Yeah, I think the announcement needs rewording to say "these teams have been invited" (which we actually haven't yet, officially as far as I know) or "these teams are eligible". Saying anything else is not true yet. Again I'm sure this will all be sorted out but it reflects poorly on teams if they are perceived as "pulling out" of an event they hadn't agreed to yet in the first place. Basically Axiom participation is reliant on travel compensation agreements for the finals since flying an entire team from Korea is very expensive and not something we can afford to do without adequate travel support. To be fair, you did post in the SSC thread that this ATC was yours (Axiom's). Of course, it doesn't make it official but if TakeTV did jump the gun, you did as well. Fun trashtalk should not be regarded or punished like this. Nobody in their right mind would take that as a commitment. What he said.
Sorry, maybe the tone of my post came out wrong. Of course, the post in SSC is not a commitment of any sorts. I guess what I am trying to say is the wording on the TakeTV post is not a big issue. Yes, technically the wording can be misleading but I am sure that if you do withdraw within reasonable time frame due to whatever circumstance, people would understanding. It is usually the last minute pull outs that gets the hate.
Anyways, hope that their travel compensation is good so Axiom can join.
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On March 11 2014 01:23 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2014 01:15 TotalBiscuit wrote:On March 11 2014 01:13 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:On March 11 2014 01:11 vthree wrote:On March 11 2014 00:32 TotalBiscuit wrote:On March 11 2014 00:29 Acer.Scarlett` wrote:On March 11 2014 00:28 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Axiom hasn't actually confirmed for this so it's a little confusing why we are listed, I think assumptions have been made. I'll talk to TakeTV and get it all sorted out though, I just don't want people blaming us if something changes because we haven't officially agreed to play yet. I think those are all the teams that didn't get eliminated last season o.o Empire also has too few to play atm Yeah, I think the announcement needs rewording to say "these teams have been invited" (which we actually haven't yet, officially as far as I know) or "these teams are eligible". Saying anything else is not true yet. Again I'm sure this will all be sorted out but it reflects poorly on teams if they are perceived as "pulling out" of an event they hadn't agreed to yet in the first place. Basically Axiom participation is reliant on travel compensation agreements for the finals since flying an entire team from Korea is very expensive and not something we can afford to do without adequate travel support. To be fair, you did post in the SSC thread that this ATC was yours (Axiom's). Of course, it doesn't make it official but if TakeTV did jump the gun, you did as well. Fun trashtalk should not be regarded or punished like this. Nobody in their right mind would take that as a commitment. What he said. Sorry, maybe the tone of my post came out wrong. Of course, the post in SSC is not a commitment of any sorts. I guess what I am trying to say is the wording on the TakeTV post is not a big issue. Yes, technically the wording can be misleading but I am sure that if you do withdraw within reasonable time frame due to whatever circumstance, people would understanding. It is usually the last minute pull outs that gets the hate. Anyways, hope that their travel compensation is good so Axiom can join.
It is in fact a big issue since it is an official announcement post and not a casual off-hand reference.
And no, people wouldn't be understanding. They were certainly not understanding last time, caused my wife to retire and basically killed her interest in Starcraft permanently, when our "crime" was to merely prove the miscommunication regarding travel compensation. You are going to have to forgive me if I don't trust the community anymore when it comes to ATC.
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Think I'll wait for further information before I start to feel it
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I think mercing is also detrimental to the pro-player base. If a teams wants to comepete in clan leagues, it has to accept that they need a well-rounded roster for that. However, by allowing mercs Teams have no incentive to have more than a few star players as they can fill up their roster for cheap if necessary.
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Not this again...
just figure it out and let people now if you participate before the league starts.
no need to start this discussion again.
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Vega will win with new Elfi addition!
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The owners/managers of the three most influential teams of the ATC are speaking out here against the merc rule. Surely there must be a more direct way for feedback?
And while you are at it, maybe H2H should be more important than map wins (map diff > H2H > map wins)
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EPT
