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On November 22 2013 18:09 Shottaz wrote:
The ladder was almost perfect during WoL, all I wished for was real MMR values shown.
-MMR Decay
-Unranked and ranked
-Can no longer get demoted during season
I feel like a scrub saying this but i've always been Diamond, I got into Masters a few times so I was mid-high Diamond for the most part, now i'm Platinum. Fair enough it's only a badge but imagine how the low Diamond players feel in Gold!
Never mind the Gold league players who are now in Bronze.
On November 23 2013 02:29 DinoMight wrote:
I just read on Battle.net that a Bliz Technical support guy has confirmed that Blizzard is aware of the issue and working to fix it.
Any chance on a source?
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On November 23 2013 03:13 wrekkless wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 02:29 DinoMight wrote:
I just read on Battle.net that a Bliz Technical support guy has confirmed that Blizzard is aware of the issue and working to fix it. Any chance on a source?
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/10636803688
Although battle.net is blocked at my job so I can't really look too much into it. But i saw on my phone that a Blizzard Tech support guy noted that Blizzard is 100% aware of the issue.
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Wow, I feel better now, knowing that the ladder is actually skewed at the moment.
Demotion aside, I do faced a lot of better players in the sense that they are not necessarily better mechanically, but I do get punished hard for my silly mistakes, e.g. bad scouting, less than ideal wall off, not evacuating drones, not setting up queens ramp off, going 8 lings instead of 8 drones, not stopping a cannon from getting up due to not manually microing drones, not splitting armies when dropped, losing my queen to 12 run-by lings, dying to all-ins before muta switch, losing 20 banelings to 3 widow mines shots, not watching the minimap when 20 speed lings ran by etc.
Any one of these dumb mistakes will variably costed me the game TT. I feel like I really need to push harder before I can get back my former league.
Yea, the ladder really got harder nowadays.
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On November 21 2013 05:34 iamcaustic wrote:EDIT: Gonna add the conversation with korona in here, since it's particularly relevant about how and why these graphs are the way they are. Also keep note that the first bar is actually 2013 Season 3, not 2013 Season 4 as stated in the image, so the differences are inflated a bit as the new league offsets were introduced for 2013 Season 4. I made a clerical error, but even comparing data from August 6th 2013 (Season 4) shows the same concept of disparity, just less extreme.
Here's my fancy attempt at graphs, based on AM region 1v1 data from nios.kr (June 1st, 2013 vs. November 18th, 2013). Basically demonstrates the changes in percentile thresholds at this point in time compared to the middle of this year. Basically, if you got demoted this season, don't feel too bad about it. Chances are your MMR overall skill didn't actually drop significantly. Instead, it seems like we're looking at a combination of a reduced player base and built-in MMR decay: Show nested quote +On November 21 2013 06:44 korona wrote:On November 21 2013 06:22 iamcaustic wrote:
p.s. I also offered data from August 6th after your correction that June 1st was still 2013 Season 3, not 2013 Season 4 (I misremembered by just over a week). We can still see the disparity with the new data, but that's generally moot since the whole MMR decay thing has been explained. Do we know when MMR decay was introduced? MMR decay was introduced either when HotS launched or patch 2.0.x that was applied to WoL one month earlier. I saw its effects on some users' data already during the first two HotS seasons, but could not deduct the reason & did not spent more time to investigate. In start of the last season it got evident that there is a decay mechanism (lots of occurrences in S14 data). My first thought was that it has to be a bug in the ladder system as drops seemed too steep. But after more investigation it is clearly an intended feature (It would be interesting to know how they chose the current max decay value). Also Blizzard has not commented the issue publicly nor denied it. Start dates for HotS seasons: --- Initial offsets --- S12: 2013-03-12 S13: 2013-05-01 --- Offsets changed --- S14: 2013-06-10 S15: 2013-08-26 S16: 2013-11-11 For those interested, they can read more about MMR decay here.
Heya guys, just a reminder that if you liked my graphs, the post has been updated with some important information from korona. While the data doesn't lie, some of the original conclusions weren't wholly accurate so be sure to read the updated stuff. 
Just a friendly PSA since I see korona posting like a broken record in this thread. 
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On November 22 2013 18:09 Shottaz wrote:
The ladder was almost perfect during WoL, all I wished for was real MMR values shown.
-MMR Decay
-Unranked and ranked
-Can no longer get demoted during season
I feel like a scrub saying this but i've always been Diamond, I got into Masters a few times so I was mid-high Diamond for the most part, now i'm Platinum. Fair enough it's only a badge but imagine how the low Diamond players feel in Gold!
I'm finding it pretty funny how I keep running into 300apm zerg monsters in Gold league of all places.
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yeah i feel with you ... i m in platin right now. i could hold my rank compared to last season, so i m lucky i guess, but now i m facing very strong opponents, have 70-91 Winratio. Sometimes i just get overrolled by former masters which not could promote to dia/master again however ... i think the graph above is very nice and shows exactly how harder it is to reach higher leagues right now ...
so i know league shouldn't matter, but it is a big motivationfactor imo. I really hope blizzard will change something soon, but maybe the want exaclty what happens right now ... they want a more competitive ladder in the higher stages ... i don't know ... we ll see
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I didnt play single match last season. This season I started playing again. First it put me into gold. Then after some games I got to plat. Currently I have 29 wins and 3 losses in 1v1 ladder. And I used to be in master league since wol. (In hots always in master) After games end some angry nerds start insulting me and saying im smurf or I dropped myself to lowerleagues to crush noobs. What I can to blizzard ladder system 
About ladder getting harder. I have to agree. Even tho im not so good anymore in wol you could do mass hellion everygame and won all games until plat. You could 4 gate to diamond.
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On November 26 2013 22:25 TheBloodyDwarf wrote:I didnt play single match last season. This season I started playing again. First it put me into gold. Then after some games I got to plat. Currently I have 29 wins and 3 losses in 1v1 ladder. And I used to be in master league since wol. (In hots always in master) After games end some angry nerds start insulting me and saying im smurf or I dropped myself to lowerleagues to crush noobs. What I can to blizzard ladder system About ladder getting harder. I have to agree. Even tho im not so good anymore in wol you could do mass hellion everygame and won all games until plat. You could 4 gate to diamond.
You could 4 gate to GM*
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LOL now this makes so much fucking sense, I was easily a gold player before this season, now i'm struggling like hell to beat bronze/silver players. I could just make more stuff and a move my way into gold but then all of a sudden people got better or something, then I realised like half of the silver players are ex-plat and i'm so confused.
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On November 26 2013 23:19 iAmBiGbiRd wrote:Show nested quote +On November 26 2013 22:25 TheBloodyDwarf wrote:I didnt play single match last season. This season I started playing again. First it put me into gold. Then after some games I got to plat. Currently I have 29 wins and 3 losses in 1v1 ladder. And I used to be in master league since wol. (In hots always in master) After games end some angry nerds start insulting me and saying im smurf or I dropped myself to lowerleagues to crush noobs. What I can to blizzard ladder system About ladder getting harder. I have to agree. Even tho im not so good anymore in wol you could do mass hellion everygame and won all games until plat. You could 4 gate to diamond. You could 4 gate to GM*
Well, I have never heard of guy who only did 4gate and got into gm. But the point was that I could do all kind of stupid things and still won. My opponents apm was 60-70 in plat but now I mostly see 120-170
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I'm feeling the same, lot's of ex-master/diamond players. I'm playing in EU, just started again, silver league. About 50% of my lost games were against people with 200+ APM, which is more than double mine. I think the ladder system needs a lot of work to make the competition fairer for the lesser skilled and new players. It really isn't fun to get crushed by that sort of players, especially if you've just started and try to work yourself up the leagues. I think ex-master/diamond players should get matched with diamond/master players earlier (when they're still silver/gold league) and only in cases of low win % drop that hard.
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Damn! I just started playing again too. Was Plat for the longest time in WoL. Maybe played around 10 Ladder Matches in HotS Overall. Last one was in Feburary.
Wanted to give the game another shot (as written in my YALB)... this thread is not very motivational.
Luckily i don't give a fuck and will try anyways
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United States12240 Posts
On November 23 2013 03:16 DinoMight wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 03:13 wrekkless wrote:On November 23 2013 02:29 DinoMight wrote:
I just read on Battle.net that a Bliz Technical support guy has confirmed that Blizzard is aware of the issue and working to fix it. Any chance on a source? http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/10636803688Although battle.net is blocked at my job so I can't really look too much into it. But i saw on my phone that a Blizzard Tech support guy noted that Blizzard is 100% aware of the issue.
Battle.net MVPs (I'm one also) are not official sources and should not be taken as such. If it's not a blue post, it didn't come from Blizzard.
Anyway, I was in the same group communication where we discussed the ladder state with some of the CMs, and they never said they were going to make a statement about it. The other MVPs who assumed so were in error.
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I was diamond on NA but didn't play HotS, but I got placed into silver in HotS. I've quickly become plat. Hopefully I can get diamond back. Certainly, I'm very surprised to have a much harder time against gold/plat players. Some are really terrible, but others aren't. Either Sc2 has lost tons of ladder players or the bnet is screwed as always.
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doesn't this help raise the overall skill of the region though? I've always felt that top ranked players skill also improves with the average skill of the region. Maybe it will make people more motivated to train harder in order to reach the next league, it's certainly had that effect on me.
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On November 27 2013 02:37 Excalibur_Z wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 03:16 DinoMight wrote:On November 23 2013 03:13 wrekkless wrote:On November 23 2013 02:29 DinoMight wrote:
I just read on Battle.net that a Bliz Technical support guy has confirmed that Blizzard is aware of the issue and working to fix it. Any chance on a source? http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/10636803688Although battle.net is blocked at my job so I can't really look too much into it. But i saw on my phone that a Blizzard Tech support guy noted that Blizzard is 100% aware of the issue. Battle.net MVPs (I'm one also) are not official sources and should not be taken as such. If it's not a blue post, it didn't come from Blizzard. Anyway, I was in the same group communication where we discussed the ladder state with some of the CMs, and they never said they were going to make a statement about it. The other MVPs who assumed so were in error.
I take it the statement made that they see it as a "major issue" is true though?
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Today I was watching Kas' stream and after his placement matches he was placed in Gold...enough said
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United States12240 Posts
On November 27 2013 03:46 Ignorant prodigy wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2013 02:37 Excalibur_Z wrote:On November 23 2013 03:16 DinoMight wrote:On November 23 2013 03:13 wrekkless wrote:On November 23 2013 02:29 DinoMight wrote:
I just read on Battle.net that a Bliz Technical support guy has confirmed that Blizzard is aware of the issue and working to fix it. Any chance on a source? http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/10636803688Although battle.net is blocked at my job so I can't really look too much into it. But i saw on my phone that a Blizzard Tech support guy noted that Blizzard is 100% aware of the issue. Battle.net MVPs (I'm one also) are not official sources and should not be taken as such. If it's not a blue post, it didn't come from Blizzard. Anyway, I was in the same group communication where we discussed the ladder state with some of the CMs, and they never said they were going to make a statement about it. The other MVPs who assumed so were in error. I take it the statement made that they see it as a "major issue" is true though?
I don't believe that is accurate, but we can't assume anything without an official Blizzard statement on the matter.
As I pointed out in the MMR Decay thread, there is a balance between the system mechanics, which are working properly, and the community perception, which is now pretty frustrated. I don't know if it's serious enough to warrant a change, let alone an acknowledgement, and there is no reason to assume that any greater community outrage will spark either of those.
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just played a guy in gold league who is 95-4 win loss ration. Needless to say I got crushed. Not sure why they wouldn't have been promoted earlier. He seemed to Average out his record with Unranked matches so at first glance it looked like 50% win ratio.
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EPT![[image loading]](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BZaXMeoCMAEd2k3.png)
