On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
They shld jes bring back some of the BW units for old times sake. Lurker/scourge, reaver/dark archon (might hafta create a new skill to replace feedback) and ofc the dreaded science vessel (with lockdown perhaps?)/valkyrie or siegetanks with 70 dmg plz.
Then do no balance for half a year (2 seasons). Then perhaps we can watch more fun games.
The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone.
*facepalm*
The skill ceiling of SC2 has not been reached and likely never will. Someone can always get faster and more precise.
Obviously nobody has hit a cap in any console FPS either. You can always shave off a millisecond in reactions or so. That doesn't mean that the skill increments don't become insignificantly small and inconsistent as the skill level goes up.
It's definitely seems hard to be decisively better than your opponent in present top tier SC2. At which point that becomes a significant problem is up to debate though.
The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone.
*facepalm*
The skill ceiling of SC2 has not been reached and likely never will. Someone can always get faster and more precise.
The skill ceiling has not been reached because Blizzard keeps changing stuff around, but other than that the game and its strategies has been figured out and since the units are soooo easy to use that doesnt require any skill whatsoever.
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
They shld jes bring back some of the BW units for old times sake. Lurker/scourge, reaver/dark archon (might hafta create a new skill to replace feedback) and ofc the dreaded science vessel (with lockdown perhaps?)/valkyrie or siegetanks with 70 dmg plz.
Then do no balance for half a year (2 seasons). Then perhaps we can watch more fun games.
skill ceiling has reached? what? last week, we just saw maru dropping a ghost so that when the toss army is chasing a kiting bio, the toss army will auto onto the ghost, giving the bio time to retreat and kite better. We haven't seen anything like this before. We only just started to have warp prism HT drops and ghost medivac drop emp. We had a warp prism blink stalker into sentries forcefield ramp in a PL game etc
If Brood War had used the SC2 tournament structure with many premier tournaments every year, with longer series, that percentage for Brood War would have easily been higher.
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
16/25 tournament wins come from players who have been in finals repeatetly.
Put another way, it have had different 17 champions out of 25 tournament -_-
Sounds like BW OSL: 21 different champions in 33 tournaments. Difference: 4.3%. Time to make a huge thing out of it, lol.
Count in time period -_-. BW was over 10 years. Lots of champs retired long before new champions even begin playing.
SC2 EVERY SINGLE CHAMPION IS STILL ACTIVE!!!! <---- so urmmm i do believe the skill ceiling have been reached.
So you are saying they are not comparable because of the timeperiode difference leading to certain effects, and then you go on and draw a conclusion based on the comparison. Yeah, well done...
Not to mention: Skill ceiling has been reached my ass:
This is one of your 1 time champions. Game looks exactly like end of WoL TvT, right? Polt won because the skillceiling had been reached at that time and "anybody" could win at this point. Yeah lol.
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
16/25 tournament wins come from players who have been in finals repeatetly.
Put another way, it have had different 17 champions out of 25 tournament -_-
Sounds like BW OSL: 21 different champions in 33 tournaments. Difference: 4.3%. Time to make a huge thing out of it, lol.
Count in time period -_-. BW was over 10 years. Lots of champs retired long before new champions even begin playing.
SC2 EVERY SINGLE CHAMPION IS STILL ACTIVE!!!! <---- so urmmm i do believe the skill ceiling have been reached.
So you are saying they are not comparable because of the timeperiode difference leading to certain effects, and then you go on and draw a conclusion based on the comparison. Yeah, well done...
This is one of your 1 time champions. Game looks exactly like end of WoL TvT, right? Polt won because the skillceiling had been reached at that time and "anybody" could win at this point. Yeah lol.
i just counted it myself and it should be around 30/60 winners and 46/120 possible finalists. anyone has a statistic for sc2 on that matter?^^
edit: : we have 16/22 possible winners (with the 2 osls) and 30/44 possible finalists
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
16/25 tournament wins come from players who have been in finals repeatetly.
Put another way, it have had different 17 champions out of 25 tournament -_-
Sounds like BW OSL: 21 different champions in 33 tournaments. Difference: 4.3%. Time to make a huge thing out of it, lol.
its 21 in 40 OSL/MSL together.
isnt it 30 in 60 OSL/MSL together?^^
yeah, just counted it. Should be 28/55 or something like that.
On October 11 2013 20:33 Kheve wrote:
On October 11 2013 20:31 Big J wrote:
On October 11 2013 20:27 Kheve wrote:
On October 11 2013 20:11 Big J wrote:
On October 11 2013 19:00 Kheve wrote:
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
16/25 tournament wins come from players who have been in finals repeatetly.
Put another way, it have had different 17 champions out of 25 tournament -_-
Sounds like BW OSL: 21 different champions in 33 tournaments. Difference: 4.3%. Time to make a huge thing out of it, lol.
Count in time period -_-. BW was over 10 years. Lots of champs retired long before new champions even begin playing.
SC2 EVERY SINGLE CHAMPION IS STILL ACTIVE!!!! <---- so urmmm i do believe the skill ceiling have been reached.
So you are saying they are not comparable because of the timeperiode difference leading to certain effects, and then you go on and draw a conclusion based on the comparison. Yeah, well done...
This is one of your 1 time champions. Game looks exactly like end of WoL TvT, right? Polt won because the skillceiling had been reached at that time and "anybody" could win at this point. Yeah lol.
i just counted it myself and it should be around 30/60 winners and 46/120 possible finalists. anyone has a statistic for sc2 on that matter?^^
edit: : we have 16/22 possible winners (with the 2 osls) and 30/44 possible finalists
Yes and now if we were to take a comparable amount of sc1 majors within around the same time period say from 2006 to 2010, I think the statistics would show that the skill ceiling in sc1 becomes even way higher than sc2. say maybe of 20 majors OSL/MSL/WCG i think we might find maybe around around 9/20 winners and even lower for finalist say 14/40.
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
16/25 tournament wins come from players who have been in finals repeatetly.
Put another way, it have had different 17 champions out of 25 tournament -_-
Sounds like BW OSL: 21 different champions in 33 tournaments. Difference: 4.3%. Time to make a huge thing out of it, lol.
its 21 in 40 OSL/MSL together.
isnt it 30 in 60 OSL/MSL together?^^
yeah, just counted it. Should be 28/55 or something like that.
On October 11 2013 20:33 Kheve wrote:
On October 11 2013 20:31 Big J wrote:
On October 11 2013 20:27 Kheve wrote:
On October 11 2013 20:11 Big J wrote:
On October 11 2013 19:00 Kheve wrote:
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
16/25 tournament wins come from players who have been in finals repeatetly.
Put another way, it have had different 17 champions out of 25 tournament -_-
Sounds like BW OSL: 21 different champions in 33 tournaments. Difference: 4.3%. Time to make a huge thing out of it, lol.
Count in time period -_-. BW was over 10 years. Lots of champs retired long before new champions even begin playing.
SC2 EVERY SINGLE CHAMPION IS STILL ACTIVE!!!! <---- so urmmm i do believe the skill ceiling have been reached.
So you are saying they are not comparable because of the timeperiode difference leading to certain effects, and then you go on and draw a conclusion based on the comparison. Yeah, well done...
This is one of your 1 time champions. Game looks exactly like end of WoL TvT, right? Polt won because the skillceiling had been reached at that time and "anybody" could win at this point. Yeah lol.
i just counted it myself and it should be around 30/60 winners and 46/120 possible finalists. anyone has a statistic for sc2 on that matter?^^
edit: : we have 16/22 possible winners (with the 2 osls) and 30/44 possible finalists
Yes and now if we were to take a comparable amount of sc1 majors within around the same time period say from 2006 to 2010, I think the statistics would show that the skill ceiling in sc1 becomes even way higher than sc2. say maybe of 20 majors OSL/MSL/WCG i think we might find maybe around around 9/20 winners and even lower for finalist say 14/40.
That would be a bit unfair no? If you wanna compare two similar timespans you have to take the first 3 years of broodwar aswell i think
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
16/25 tournament wins come from players who have been in finals repeatetly.
Put another way, it have had different 17 champions out of 25 tournament -_-
Sounds like BW OSL: 21 different champions in 33 tournaments. Difference: 4.3%. Time to make a huge thing out of it, lol.
its 21 in 40 OSL/MSL together.
isnt it 30 in 60 OSL/MSL together?^^
yeah, just counted it. Should be 28/55 or something like that.
On October 11 2013 20:33 Kheve wrote:
On October 11 2013 20:31 Big J wrote:
On October 11 2013 20:27 Kheve wrote:
On October 11 2013 20:11 Big J wrote:
On October 11 2013 19:00 Kheve wrote:
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
16/25 tournament wins come from players who have been in finals repeatetly.
Put another way, it have had different 17 champions out of 25 tournament -_-
Sounds like BW OSL: 21 different champions in 33 tournaments. Difference: 4.3%. Time to make a huge thing out of it, lol.
Count in time period -_-. BW was over 10 years. Lots of champs retired long before new champions even begin playing.
SC2 EVERY SINGLE CHAMPION IS STILL ACTIVE!!!! <---- so urmmm i do believe the skill ceiling have been reached.
So you are saying they are not comparable because of the timeperiode difference leading to certain effects, and then you go on and draw a conclusion based on the comparison. Yeah, well done...
This is one of your 1 time champions. Game looks exactly like end of WoL TvT, right? Polt won because the skillceiling had been reached at that time and "anybody" could win at this point. Yeah lol.
i just counted it myself and it should be around 30/60 winners and 46/120 possible finalists. anyone has a statistic for sc2 on that matter?^^
edit: : we have 16/22 possible winners (with the 2 osls) and 30/44 possible finalists
Yes and now if we were to take a comparable amount of sc1 majors within around the same time period say from 2006 to 2010, I think the statistics would show that the skill ceiling in sc1 becomes even way higher than sc2. say maybe of 20 majors OSL/MSL/WCG i think we might find maybe around around 9/20 winners and even lower for finalist say 14/40.
That would be a bit unfair no? If you wanna compare two similar timespans you have to take the first 3 years of broodwar aswell i think
Thats true. But i think the results would not differ by too much. However im too lazy to check out on it.
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
On October 11 2013 18:00 Bacillus wrote: During the last 9 GSL related tournaments we've had 16 different finalists out of possible 18. After the current tournament it'll be 18 out of 20. After 2011 MvP is the only player able to make it to multiple finals.
The three players with multiple championships are MvP, Nestea and MC. All of them had their first championships by the season 4, early on in 2011 and only MvP has won GSL since July 2011.
Regardless of what MvP was in his prime, the present situation isn't looking nice at all.
This shows sc2 has become the LOL of rts. The skill ceiling is reached pretty quickly and pretty much by anyone. Had someone else dominated after MVP, I would agree that the skill ceiling had been raised. The fact is they didnt dominated but rather just like MVP except now there are more MVP level player.
EPT
