On August 15 2013 02:49 renaissanceMAN wrote: This JimmiC kid getting destroyed by tb.
Its fun to watch. I like his excuses of “OMG TB your such a passive aggressive(TB is mostly aggressive) drama queen. You should EXPECT me to jump on the hate train when you make an announcement I don’t like. This is the internet and hating on people is what we do. I man, seriously, why would you disrespect your fans(the fans are watching TB rip him apart and feel totally respected) by posting this crap. Your so fake famous.”
Its pretty funny, though I bet the guy doesn’t even know its funny.
I think it's funny that you are such a fanboy you just agree with tb. He's mad at others and responding to me. I never talked bad about axiom. Read my posts. Different senses of humor I guess. Or at least perspectives.
Fanboy is the word people use to describe someone when they lost the argument on the internet. Its like “white knight”, it means nothing and is just some cheap ad hominine attack for people who have run out of things to say.
I am a fan of TB, though I don’t agree with everything he says and he does shoot his mouth of from time to time. However, I find that refreshing and think people need to be called out of there BS every once and a while. I like their team and I was sad they had to drop out of the finals. But I am also an adult and know that stuff like this happens in life and things come up unexpectedly. The people posting “but couldn’t they have known before hand” either lack life experience or have unreasonable expectations of what people can predict. Shit happens and people who claim it is unprofessional are just taking cheap shots because they can. And I think it is good that TB calls them out on it and I like how aggressive he is about it. It means that he gives a shit.
On August 15 2013 03:09 TotalBiscuit wrote: Alright, I'm gonna wrap this up with my opinion on how ridiculous the hate Axiom is getting is.
My view on this is frankly pragmatic. Take and ATC are not suffering in any way. Millenium was confirmed as our replacement some time ago in private, which has been announced today. The roster has not suffered and the tournament will happen as normal, just like any other tournament that has a cancellation and has to find substitutes. Millenium are popular and will no doubt bring in the French crowd that otherwise might not have watched the event, balancing out the lost numbers from Axiom players not participating. The net cost to Take and ATC is zero, who are still paying out the same regardless, they are just paying it out to a different team. The tournament will go ahead as planned with a roster change, there is no disruption to the event.
On Axioms side, we have provided the following. 14 weeks of competition at unholy hours of the night for our players with no prize money. Our players have essentially worked hard for something they will no longer receive. Our sponsors will not receive exposure in the finals as we had hoped, so they are losing out. The team in general suffers, the tournament does not. ATC also received many hours of free casting from myself and the sponsors benefited from that significantly, with views 3-5x higher on average than the other English streams and an additional 20-30,000 views per series from VoDs hosted on the TotalBiscuit Starcraft Youtube channel, giving exceptional sponsor ROI Acer and Intel that would otherwise not have existed. Teams also received sponsor ROI due to use of the virtual jersey in all matches, software we developed specifically to help everyone.
So, after all that, my opinion of this is that the backlash on Axiom is unwarranted and makes little logical sense, when Axiom are the ones who put a lot into this tournament and are suffering due to a combination of unforeseen and unfortunate circumstances. If anything I would have hoped for support from the community in a difficult time for the team, but for the most part it seems that will not be happening. As always, we will endure that and push on regardless.
TB, sell a t-shirt or something else related to the team and you have two sales. Just make sure it comes it itty-bitty girls sizes or I can’t get my girlfriend one without getting in trouble(never buy oversized cloths for your girlfriend).
On August 15 2013 03:09 TotalBiscuit wrote: Alright, I'm gonna wrap this up with my opinion on how ridiculous the hate Axiom is getting is.
My view on this is frankly pragmatic. Take and ATC are not suffering in any way. Millenium was confirmed as our replacement some time ago in private, which has been announced today. The roster has not suffered and the tournament will happen as normal, just like any other tournament that has a cancellation and has to find substitutes. Millenium are popular and will no doubt bring in the French crowd that otherwise might not have watched the event, balancing out the lost numbers from Axiom players not participating. The net cost to Take and ATC is zero, who are still paying out the same regardless, they are just paying it out to a different team. The tournament will go ahead as planned with a roster change, there is no disruption to the event.
On Axioms side, we have provided the following. 14 weeks of competition at unholy hours of the night for our players with no prize money. Our players have essentially worked hard for something they will no longer receive. Our sponsors will not receive exposure in the finals as we had hoped, so they are losing out. The team in general suffers, the tournament does not. ATC also received many hours of free casting from myself and the sponsors benefited from that significantly, with views 3-5x higher on average than the other English streams and an additional 20-30,000 views per series from VoDs hosted on the TotalBiscuit Starcraft Youtube channel, giving exceptional sponsor ROI Acer and Intel that would otherwise not have existed. Teams also received sponsor ROI due to use of the virtual jersey in all matches, software we developed specifically to help everyone.
So, after all that, my opinion of this is that the backlash on Axiom is unwarranted and makes little logical sense, when Axiom are the ones who put a lot into this tournament and are suffering due to a combination of unforeseen and unfortunate circumstances. If anything I would have hoped for support from the community in a difficult time for the team, but for the most part it seems that will not be happening. As always, we will endure that and push on regardless.
If you said that, and released all the info at the same time as the announcement, Axiom would have been the recipient of a lot less 'hate'.
(I don't really think it's hate, it's just disappointment and most people got annoyed because of speculation they had to resort to due to lack of information available until TaKe posted his own statement. Remember that when Genna announced it, people here weren't even informed that Millenium would be definitely replacing. I believe the 'hate' could have been mostly avoided if you let TaKe go ahead with the announcement first, or published the detailed reasons that have now come out, and if you didn't take a swing at MVP)
On August 15 2013 03:09 TotalBiscuit wrote: Alright, I'm gonna wrap this up with my opinion on how ridiculous the hate Axiom is getting is.
My view on this is frankly pragmatic. Take and ATC are not suffering in any way. Millenium was confirmed as our replacement some time ago in private, which has been announced today. The roster has not suffered and the tournament will happen as normal, just like any other tournament that has a cancellation and has to find substitutes. Millenium are popular and will no doubt bring in the French crowd that otherwise might not have watched the event, balancing out the lost numbers from Axiom players not participating. The net cost to Take and ATC is zero, who are still paying out the same regardless, they are just paying it out to a different team. The tournament will go ahead as planned with a roster change, there is no disruption to the event.
On Axioms side, we have provided the following. 14 weeks of competition at unholy hours of the night for our players with no prize money. Our players have essentially worked hard for something they will no longer receive. Our sponsors will not receive exposure in the finals as we had hoped, so they are losing out. The team in general suffers, the tournament does not. ATC also received many hours of free casting from myself and the sponsors benefited from that significantly, with views 3-5x higher on average than the other English streams and an additional 20-30,000 views per series from VoDs hosted on the TotalBiscuit Starcraft Youtube channel, giving exceptional sponsor ROI Acer and Intel that would otherwise not have existed. Teams also received sponsor ROI due to use of the virtual jersey in all matches, software we developed specifically to help everyone.
So, after all that, my opinion of this is that the backlash on Axiom is unwarranted and makes little logical sense, when Axiom are the ones who put a lot into this tournament and are suffering due to a combination of unforeseen and unfortunate circumstances. If anything I would have hoped for support from the community in a difficult time for the team, but for the most part it seems that will not be happening. As always, we will endure that and push on regardless.
holy shit are you taking pr lessons from sundance? did noone in you support group tell you that some posters on reddit and the tl forum, dont make up the whole community? your posting behavior reminds me of something the farcry 3 villian said. Anyways the content you produce is greate, your team has a lot of enjoyable players and maybe someday you will get someone to handle your pr. that would be nice.
On August 15 2013 03:24 BlueFlames wrote: holy shit are you taking pr lessons from sundance? did noone in you support group tell you that some posters on reddit and the tl forum, dont make up the whole community? your posting behavior reminds me of something the farcry 3 villian said. Anyways the content you produce is greate, your team has a lot of enjoyable players and maybe someday you will get someone to handle your pr. that would be nice.
They have no money to travel and they need more players. At this time to say they need a PR guy is dumb. The money they have should go to supporting the players they have now, and finding more to round out their roster. A lot of the stuff said by TB's post seems pretty obvious to me, I don't understand why others don't see it that way.
On August 15 2013 03:09 TotalBiscuit wrote: Alright, I'm gonna wrap this up with my opinion on how ridiculous the hate Axiom is getting is.
My view on this is frankly pragmatic. Take and ATC are not suffering in any way. Millenium was confirmed as our replacement some time ago in private, which has been announced today. The roster has not suffered and the tournament will happen as normal, just like any other tournament that has a cancellation and has to find substitutes. Millenium are popular and will no doubt bring in the French crowd that otherwise might not have watched the event, balancing out the lost numbers from Axiom players not participating. The net cost to Take and ATC is zero, who are still paying out the same regardless, they are just paying it out to a different team. The tournament will go ahead as planned with a roster change, there is no disruption to the event.
On Axioms side, we have provided the following. 14 weeks of competition at unholy hours of the night for our players with no prize money. Our players have essentially worked hard for something they will no longer receive. Our sponsors will not receive exposure in the finals as we had hoped, so they are losing out. The team in general suffers, the tournament does not. ATC also received many hours of free casting from myself and the sponsors benefited from that significantly, with views 3-5x higher on average than the other English streams and an additional 20-30,000 views per series from VoDs hosted on the TotalBiscuit Starcraft Youtube channel, giving exceptional sponsor ROI Acer and Intel that would otherwise not have existed. Teams also received sponsor ROI due to use of the virtual jersey in all matches, software we developed specifically to help everyone.
So, after all that, my opinion of this is that the backlash on Axiom is unwarranted and makes little logical sense, when Axiom are the ones who put a lot into this tournament and are suffering due to a combination of unforeseen and unfortunate circumstances. If anything I would have hoped for support from the community in a difficult time for the team, but for the most part it seems that will not be happening. As always, we will endure that and push on regardless.
holy shit are you taking pr lessons from sundance? did noone in you support group tell you that some posters on reddit and the tl forum, dont make up the whole community? your posting behavior reminds me of something the farcry 3 villian said. Anyways the content you produce is greate, your team has a lot of enjoyable players and maybe someday you will get someone to handle your pr. that would be nice.
Didn't someone tell you that when he talks about people he don't literary mean everyone either? Also he's built a brand of doing this very thing, and he's been doing it for years. He don't need you to tell him how to act in public, like it or not.
I was quite disappointed at first (as the announcement was so close to the final date and there was little news). As news continued to break I'm satisfied with the outcome and looking forward to the live event!
Best of luck to Axiom going forward.
On August 15 2013 03:24 Waxangel wrote: Liquid the hidden winners, avoiding the semi-final nightmare match of Team MVP (assuming all seeds are bumped up one level)
TL paid Axiom to withdraw?? Good thing I just sharpened my pitchfork!
On August 15 2013 01:46 FFGenerations wrote: sounds like 1) they make a loss of several $1000 by attending , and 2) that their player/s don't particularly feel comfortable with going/feel shitty . which is what the post said.
And they could not have foreseen this before because...?
Things we could not have foreseen
1) WCS. Acer Teamstory Cup began before WCS even existed
2) CranKs injury getting to the point where he would have to do some serious recoup prior to Season 2 GSTL.
3) Having 4 players instead of 5 after Miya retired and being unable to hire another Zerg
4) Travelocity and Kayak fucking us out of several thousand dollars to the point where our travel budget was depleted way before it should have been.
If even I knew long before the league started that they'd get $1.500 for traveling if they qualified, how could they not? ATC made it clear from the beginning and it's the team manager's job to get all the necessary information before they sign up for the leage.
This is bollocks. Don't pretend to know more than you really do. You literally have no idea what's been going on behind the scenes, stop fucking pretending.
Having only three uninjured players is a good reason, I don't think anybody would be resentful knowing that. Personally, I didn't know Crank's injury was that bad during my posting.
However in what regards is it bollocks expecting the manager of a team to know the terms of the competition the team enters, especially since they were publically available?
On August 15 2013 03:24 BlueFlames wrote: holy shit are you taking pr lessons from sundance? did noone in you support group tell you that some posters on reddit and the tl forum, dont make up the whole community? your posting behavior reminds me of something the farcry 3 villian said. Anyways the content you produce is greate, your team has a lot of enjoyable players and maybe someday you will get someone to handle your pr. that would be nice.
PR, short for Pandering Repeatedly
How much would it cost to hire someone to do the pr for all the stuff you do, and how much time would you gain by that? Just curious.
On August 15 2013 03:09 TotalBiscuit wrote: Alright, I'm gonna wrap this up with my opinion on how ridiculous the hate Axiom is getting is.
My view on this is frankly pragmatic. Take and ATC are not suffering in any way. Millenium was confirmed as our replacement some time ago in private, which has been announced today. The roster has not suffered and the tournament will happen as normal, just like any other tournament that has a cancellation and has to find substitutes. Millenium are popular and will no doubt bring in the French crowd that otherwise might not have watched the event, balancing out the lost numbers from Axiom players not participating. The net cost to Take and ATC is zero, who are still paying out the same regardless, they are just paying it out to a different team. The tournament will go ahead as planned with a roster change, there is no disruption to the event.
On Axioms side, we have provided the following. 14 weeks of competition at unholy hours of the night for our players with no prize money. Our players have essentially worked hard for something they will no longer receive. Our sponsors will not receive exposure in the finals as we had hoped, so they are losing out. The team in general suffers, the tournament does not. ATC also received many hours of free casting from myself and the sponsors benefited from that significantly, with views 3-5x higher on average than the other English streams and an additional 20-30,000 views per series from VoDs hosted on the TotalBiscuit Starcraft Youtube channel, giving exceptional sponsor ROI Acer and Intel that would otherwise not have existed. Teams also received sponsor ROI due to use of the virtual jersey in all matches, software we developed specifically to help everyone.
So, after all that, my opinion of this is that the backlash on Axiom is unwarranted and makes little logical sense, when Axiom are the ones who put a lot into this tournament and are suffering due to a combination of unforeseen and unfortunate circumstances. If anything I would have hoped for support from the community in a difficult time for the team, but for the most part it seems that will not be happening. As always, we will endure that and push on regardless.
If you said that, and released all the info at the same time as the announcement, Axiom would have been the recipient of a lot less 'hate'.
(I don't really think it's hate, it's just disappointment and most people got annoyed because of speculation they had to resort to due to lack of information available until TaKe posted his own statement. Remember that when Genna announced it, people here weren't even informed that Millenium would be definitely replacing. I believe the 'hate' could have been mostly avoided if you let TaKe go ahead with the announcement first, or published the detailed reasons that have now come out, and if you didn't take a swing at MVP)
On August 15 2013 03:43 Waxangel wrote: no amount of money can replace the enjoyment of being mean to people on the internet
How much do you want to ban TB from TL and enjoy the subsequent hissy fit that would happen ?
I am totally willing to start a collect on this !
On August 15 2013 03:22 mikkmagro wrote:Remember that when Genna announced it, people here weren't even informed that Millenium would be definitely replacing
A person like you would have guessed though. They all live in Europe (bar ForGG but he is coming back soon), were in the mix up until the very end and can afford almost any deplacement - even more so if they have streaming rights.
On August 15 2013 03:43 Waxangel wrote: no amount of money can replace the enjoyment of being mean to people on the internet
Stop sniping at TB
You have it backwards, Wax lives for when TB posts. His mouth waters for the drama and amusement that will follow. He would have summoned him earlier if possible, but lacks such magic powers.
On August 15 2013 03:43 Waxangel wrote: no amount of money can replace the enjoyment of being mean to people on the internet
Stop sniping at TB
But it's always amusing to see someone raise the sniping TB batsignal to see how fast he responds. The khaldor sniping batsignal is getting almost as strong as khaldor can be very quick to respond in some live report threads.
On August 15 2013 01:46 FFGenerations wrote: sounds like 1) they make a loss of several $1000 by attending , and 2) that their player/s don't particularly feel comfortable with going/feel shitty . which is what the post said.
And they could not have foreseen this before because...?
5) The start date of GSTL Season 2.
this topic is now about the next GSTL
Can we make it about people that pretend to have inside knowledge of the scene and use it to criticise people that work in eSports? Because this thread is full of that.
You can't expect people not to be disappointed, and most of the time, people start 'pretending to have inside knowledge', because they have to resort to speculation because the PR is poor. Same reason why the lack of SC2 at MLG Colombus blew up.
You can be disappointed all you please but there's a difference between that and flat out attacking the organisation for perceived incompetence, dishonesty or whatever.
Frankly if we'd known it was acceptable to toss out the begging bowl like MVP, who evidently needed to do it despite having way more sponsors than we do, then maybe we'd have done that, but that wouldn't have solved the fact that 1/4 of our lineup is physically unfit to compete.
Wow you just lost all my respect, firing shots at MVP like that. However I will still support the players.
I won't really commit to saying that the team will be 100% Korean but I would like the team to serve both TB and my hopes of bettering the state of eSports in Korea. At present many Korean SC2 players do not actually receive a salary or receive a small salary that does not really support a stable career.
- Axiom Team manager/"owner"
Frankly if we'd known it was acceptable to toss out the begging bowl like MVP, who evidently needed to do it despite having way more sponsors than we do, then maybe we'd have done that, but that wouldn't have solved the fact that 1/4 of our lineup is physically unfit to compete.
- Axiom PR guy
this was due to their international travel sponsor dropping support recently
- Team MVP
But then I'm also sure that TB knows exactly how much MVP get from their sponsors, and what the money is/can be used for as well. I'm sure he wouldn't be making any assumptions about MVP, doing the sort of thing he hates others doing. Mo sponsors, mo money! Let's ignore the fact that MVP is also more than just SC2, and the sponsors seem to sponsor all the MVP teams, such as the LoL teams. I'm sure all the MVP players get mega salaries and the state of Korean SC2 is much better than it was about a year ago when Axiom was created, and teams are closing down and holding fundraisers for kicks.
EPT
