Crank and MMA's accounts regarding SlayerS - Page 51

QTIP.

United States2113 Posts

October 23 2012 02:36 GMT

#1001

Even in muddled situations like this where both parties have made mistakes and are jointly responsible for a degrading relationship, I still sympathize with the players more than team management/sponsors. It's the people that are practicing the game 10 hours a day and chasing their dreams against an unfathomable amount of competition that get my vote.

Sure, funding for tournaments and financial support for players would not be possible without sponsors, and management can certainly help to facilitate a players needs... but it all starts with the willpower, dedication, and passion of the players.

Best of luck to MMA and Crank.

shockaslim

United States1105 Posts

October 23 2012 02:37 GMT

#1002

It sounds like Jessica is the Yoko Ono of the Starcraft community.

Shival

Netherlands643 Posts

October 23 2012 02:38 GMT

#1003

On October 23 2012 11:36 tMomiji wrote:

Show nested quote +

On October 23 2012 11:30 Shival wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:25 th3_great wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:23 KaienFEMC wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:10 tMomiji wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:08 Shival wrote:

On October 23 2012 10:54 tMomiji wrote:

On October 23 2012 10:52 Shival wrote:

On October 23 2012 10:50 tMomiji wrote:

On October 23 2012 10:49 Shival wrote:
[quote]

He's off the hook for lying and showing no respect to any staff at Slayers nor the facilities they provided?

I guess it depends on whether you think they deserve respect or not.

True, although in South Korea, if one is your elder you're pretty much expected to show respect. They even have pretty much a seperate way of saying lots of words to show respect (jondaemal).

Ahh, cultural differences and expectations of society once again come up; that explains why the Korean scene is reacting (mostly) the way they are.

Exactly why people should read up on culture differences before commenting on this 'drama'. It would negate alot of the comments here.

I tend to forget about that fact myself. Silly me. Still don't think it justified how Jessica acted though and I doubt anything will sway me otherwise; sorry~ Eh heh.

Spicing it up a little bit. The majority of Taiwanese community sees Jessica as an over-protective mother that puts in too much personal emotion into the management of the team. They see Alicia as a spoiled kid and they did not really appreciate Alicia and Crank's response towards Jessica's claim (MMA's response is not yet translated to Chinese).
I think most Asian community will share similar view to this incident.

One interesting view point from the Chinese community is that the whole thing is a business strategy to legitimize BoxeR's new appointment as SKT1 head coach. Jessica is trying to create an image of the team disappointed BoxeR, and BoxeR didn't join SKT1 because of money. Thinking about it, I believe Jessica did mention this in her interview, just not as bluntly.

that second point is actually a very interesting theory

Not to burst both of your bubbles, but that theory already has been aired a couple of times on various threads.

Curses!! XD Well I'm off to sleep now, and I hope this does cool down.

...I just realized this is my 666th post. So I guess I'll do something. -ahem-

Let us all follow in Shival's example and remain level-headed and reasonable in this discussion. Let us not flame one another, because every time you flame someone, Liquid`HerO cries.

[image loading]

Please think of Liquid`HerO.

...Or something.

(Gosh I hope he doesn't mind me reposting this, but he already posted it on his twitter so...)

Have a good night!

lambac0re

United States77 Posts

October 23 2012 02:38 GMT

#1004

On October 23 2012 11:36 QTIP. wrote:
Even in muddled situations like this where both parties have made mistakes and are jointly responsible for a degrading relationship, I still sympathize with the players more than team management/sponsors. It's the people that are practicing the game 10 hours a day and chasing their dreams against an unfathomable amount of competition that get my vote.

Sure, funding for tournaments and financial support for players would not be possible without sponsors, and management can certainly help to facilitate a players needs... but it all starts with the willpower, dedication, and passion of the players.

Best of luck to MMA and Crank.

Boxer is the epitome of chasing one's dream.
MMA and Crank, especially Crank, all I can say is that they were chasing money.

Vei

United States2845 Posts

October 23 2012 02:40 GMT

#1005

On October 23 2012 05:34 Waxangel wrote:
There's no new 'facts' in the phone call, it's pretty much just an issue of whether you think Crank was excessively rude or justified.

And how can anyone decide this from an isolated call, not knowing any context of their private history. Added onto that, a history of players not getting along well with Jessica at all, for all of SlayerS' career it seems.

Why do we never hear about anything like from ST, IM, EG, mouz, etc.? Why is 90% of Korean drama Jessica-centric and the other 10% from TSL/Coach Lee? It CANNOT be coincidence, with such consistency over the YEARS, literal years, that this has been going on.

m4inbrain

1505 Posts

October 23 2012 02:41 GMT

#1006

On October 23 2012 11:32 Talin wrote:

Show nested quote +

On October 23 2012 11:27 m4inbrain wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:23 Ansinjunger wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:19 m4inbrain wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:13 Talin wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:12 m4inbrain wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:10 Shival wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:09 m4inbrain wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:07 KaienFEMC wrote:

On October 23 2012 10:55 Talin wrote:
[quote]

In a way that clearly doesn't contribute much to the end result. There are other players playing on the exact same terms as Taeja in that context (same team, same sponsors), and their performance is orders of magnitude below his.

There are countless similar obvious examples that point to the same thing - a player's results are his own, and all other factors do not amount to much overall. Good coaching is the only thing that can truly contribute, but that trend has barely scratched the surface in Starcraft 2.

I can't believe I am reading this. Acknowledgement of support is not a custom. You are given the "opportunity" to show your "hard work" because there were support at your back. Nobody is trying to deny a player's effort, but the way you show no appreciation for sponsorships and team supports makes me sad.

By his logic, being on a team actually would make matters worse for you, so, yeah..

Huh? You lost me completely with that reasoning.

Talin said, that a good team-enviroment has no impact on your, uhm, ability to play the game.

No, he didn't.

On October 23 2012 11:12 m4inbrain wrote:
Maybe im too tired to get my words straight, if so, im sorry.

Clearly.

Let me help you.

If a team wins GSTL (accomplished by playing good Starcraft), then yes, it is the players' accomplishments, alongside maybe the coaches that worked with players during their preparation.

None of these things accomplish a GSTL victory. There are plenty of teams in Korea that have all these things, and no titles to speak of.

Last quote as answer to "Ah, and what about the environment provided by the manager? The house provided by the manager? The pc's provided by the manager? The coaches provided by the manager? Do I need to go on?"

If "he" really did not, he may want to rethink the way he argues.

Edit: not to mention the quotes about psychological stuff, which i did not bother to quote.

I've got the entire quote chain open, and GSTL comes up (using the Find function) only in the quotes you pulled out of context. It's like you're saying Talin said that players don't use computers to win at video games. Good one.

Its about his "argument" that a good team-enviroment/manager/etc does not have an impact on your ability to win.

But you made that argument up.

Okay. Assuming i did get something wrong, which may be - just clear it up then. Whats your view on what i said?

Show nested quote +

No, it was about the psychological benefits of "living extravagantly" (or to be more general, about the players' level of comfort). Which I said I'd take into account only if it matches what actually happens in the world of Starcraft.

Meh, this thread is slowly losing its entertainment value.

Actually, here youre right. I mixed up enviroment (as in nice house) and enviroment. I saw living extravagant = good enviroment. My bad.

Edit: meh, im too bad at multiquoting -.-

Disengaged

United States6994 Posts

October 23 2012 02:41 GMT

#1007

Well, after reading.

What I got from it is that Jessica is evil.

norjoncal

89 Posts

October 23 2012 02:42 GMT

#1008

Jessica sounds like TB when Turpster left WOW Radio for the WOW Insider podcast.
Jessica releases phone conversion TB hijacks WOW Insiders feed on WOW Radio and goes off on Turpster and WOW Insider.

Herry

England681 Posts

October 23 2012 02:42 GMT

#1009

What a complete fucking shambles. Honestly...don't they understand the meaning of the word team? everyone just sat in their own corner blaming everyone else. such a shame. I feel sorry for Boxer, he must have lost so much money because of everyone's selfishness.

Zocat

Germany2229 Posts

October 23 2012 02:43 GMT

#1010

On October 23 2012 11:33 Golbat wrote:
I knew Jessica was just twisting the truth. I'm glad that it's all come out, but i'm sad that it had to end this way. I hope that this isn't the end of Boxer's playing career though. That would be the worst of all.

Jessica twisting the thruth?

ESF admitted the boycott. Head coach stepped down.
Alicia is a known liar now.
MMA believed Manager J, even after he had a clearing talk with Boxer who explained the situation to him. MMA also didnt pay his own personal coach (Coach Ryu) the agreed upon share. Keep in mind that he (MMA) also introduced Coach Ryu as his own personal coach (so it's not that SlayerS hired Coach Ryu and assigned him to MMA).
Crank lied to get out of SlayerS (see Cella's statement for reinforcement). He also acted immature, disrespectful and rude towards Jessica (like she said).

Crank complained (multiple times) to Jessica & Boxer that the atmosphere in the team was bad. They promised to change it but nothing happened.

rasers

Sweden691 Posts

October 23 2012 02:43 GMT

#1011

I don't get why everything Jessica said now is wrong just because these 2 say something different BUT ok.

Goshdarnit

United States540 Posts

October 23 2012 02:44 GMT

#1012

On October 23 2012 05:26 tubs wrote:

Show nested quote +

It's sad for me to say this, but in the past few weeks, the only interesting things to me in SC2 were the rise of a new star in SKT Rain, and this Slayers drama.

Really interested in the translation of the phone call, whenever it arrives.

Man was that whole Life thing boring. GSL royal roaders an championships are always a snorefest, right guys?

mikedebo

Canada4341 Posts

October 23 2012 02:45 GMT

#1013

On October 23 2012 11:44 Goshdarnit wrote:

Show nested quote +

Man was that whole Life thing boring. GSL royal roaders an championships are always a snorefest, right guys?

That was the first GSL championships I actually stayed up all night to watch!! And the main thing that kept me awake was

+ Show Spoiler +

wanting to see if MVP was actually going to mech EVERY game! lol

Shival

Netherlands643 Posts

October 23 2012 02:46 GMT

#1014

On October 23 2012 11:41 m4inbrain wrote:

Show nested quote +

On October 23 2012 11:32 Talin wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:27 m4inbrain wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:23 Ansinjunger wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:19 m4inbrain wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:13 Talin wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:12 m4inbrain wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:10 Shival wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:09 m4inbrain wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:07 KaienFEMC wrote:
[quote]

I can't believe I am reading this. Acknowledgement of support is not a custom. You are given the "opportunity" to show your "hard work" because there were support at your back. Nobody is trying to deny a player's effort, but the way you show no appreciation for sponsorships and team supports makes me sad.

By his logic, being on a team actually would make matters worse for you, so, yeah..

Huh? You lost me completely with that reasoning.

Talin said, that a good team-enviroment has no impact on your, uhm, ability to play the game.

No, he didn't.

On October 23 2012 11:12 m4inbrain wrote:
Maybe im too tired to get my words straight, if so, im sorry.

Clearly.

Let me help you.

If a team wins GSTL (accomplished by playing good Starcraft), then yes, it is the players' accomplishments, alongside maybe the coaches that worked with players during their preparation.

None of these things accomplish a GSTL victory. There are plenty of teams in Korea that have all these things, and no titles to speak of.

Its about his "argument" that a good team-enviroment/manager/etc does not have an impact on your ability to win.

But you made that argument up.

Okay. Assuming i did get something wrong, which may be - just clear it up then. Whats your view on what i said?

Show nested quote +

Actually, here youre right. I mixed up enviroment (as in nice house) and enviroment. I saw living extravagant = good enviroment. My bad.

Edit: meh, im too bad at multiquoting -.-

If I may weigh in on the situation, as they are my words. "Living extravagantly" means both actually, both a good environment and the players comfort. Why I wrote extravagantly is because they were living extravagantly compared to the other SC2 korean teams out there.

Disengaged

United States6994 Posts

October 23 2012 02:47 GMT

#1015

On October 23 2012 11:44 Goshdarnit wrote:

Show nested quote +

Man was that whole Life thing boring. GSL royal roaders an championships are always a snorefest, right guys?

Who?

Trolololololol

gLFu_Ayr

United States23 Posts

October 23 2012 02:47 GMT

#1016

One thing is clear about this whole incident. Jessica is a b... ad person.

babylon

8765 Posts

October 23 2012 02:48 GMT

#1017

On October 23 2012 11:43 rasers wrote:

Show nested quote +

I don't get why everything Jessica said now is wrong just because these 2 say something different BUT ok.

GOLBAT used CONFUSE RAY!

But it failed!

lambac0re

United States77 Posts

October 23 2012 02:49 GMT

#1018

On October 23 2012 11:41 Disengaged wrote:
Well, after reading.

What I got from it is that Jessica is evil.

Alright, comments like this are really starting to irk me.
Let's take a look at Slayers history. Boxer founded the team with Jessica's support. There are multiple documented sources that suggest that if it weren't for Jessica, Boxer wouldn't even have switched into SC2.

Let's also not forget all the success that Slayers has achieved - including TWO GSTL championships, a feat that no team has yet been able to duplicate.
Who was the manager of the team during all this time? That's right Jessica.

Even when times got tough and and shit started hitting the fan, when Boxer wanted to quit completely, who was it that suggested he transfer to SK Telecom T1 to recover his passion? That's right Jessica again.

From Cella's tweets, when the team started to go downhill and players were leaving en masse, Boxer and Jessica made it a point to take care of him, asking him if he would like their help in finding a new job - he refused because Cella felt it was his responsibility to look after the players.

In short for all you Jessica haters out there, Slayers wouldn't even have been possible without her, and here you all her blaming her exclusively for it's downfall.

m4inbrain

1505 Posts

October 23 2012 02:49 GMT

#1019

On October 23 2012 11:46 Shival wrote:

Show nested quote +

On October 23 2012 11:41 m4inbrain wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:32 Talin wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:27 m4inbrain wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:23 Ansinjunger wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:19 m4inbrain wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:13 Talin wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:12 m4inbrain wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:10 Shival wrote:

On October 23 2012 11:09 m4inbrain wrote:
[quote]

By his logic, being on a team actually would make matters worse for you, so, yeah..

Huh? You lost me completely with that reasoning.

Talin said, that a good team-enviroment has no impact on your, uhm, ability to play the game.

No, he didn't.

On October 23 2012 11:12 m4inbrain wrote:
Maybe im too tired to get my words straight, if so, im sorry.

Clearly.

Let me help you.

If a team wins GSTL (accomplished by playing good Starcraft), then yes, it is the players' accomplishments, alongside maybe the coaches that worked with players during their preparation.

None of these things accomplish a GSTL victory. There are plenty of teams in Korea that have all these things, and no titles to speak of.

Its about his "argument" that a good team-enviroment/manager/etc does not have an impact on your ability to win.

But you made that argument up.

Okay. Assuming i did get something wrong, which may be - just clear it up then. Whats your view on what i said?

There are more quotes as i said, about the psychological benefits of having a good enviroment, which he refused to look through.

Show nested quote +

You again. ^^

Im getting lost now, i dont even know if i got something wrong now. Maybe i should just let it rest and watch the rest of the Day9daily, then go to sleep.

Ansinjunger

United States2451 Posts

October 23 2012 02:49 GMT

#1020

On October 23 2012 11:43 Zocat wrote:

Show nested quote +

It's interesting that Jessica didn't mention the thing with Coach Ryu Won before. I wonder what the actual truth is, not as told by her.