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On October 23 2012 07:44 Series7 wrote:
It's clear from reading the accounts that Crank and MMA were not entirely innocent in this, actually did quite a few things deserving of some kind of sanction.
However, I don't think that the kinds of things that they did should have been unexpected. These guys aren't experienced and responsible adults, they're pretty young, and they're going to make mistakes and be immature and irresponsible about things.
And that's where the leadership was supposed to come in. A good team manger and coach can provide the team with inspiration, focus, and direction. It's a difficult job to to do, and one that requires the right kind of personality -a cross between a businessman, a teacher, and a camp counselor. Good leadership is the key to fostering a healthy team atmosphere and promoting good values for SC2 players.
This is where Jessica and Slayers completely dropped the ball. Even in the instances where she was right, it feels to me like Jessica made everything worse by reacting poorly to the situation. She expected her players, including MMA and Crank, to act responsibly and like adults in every situation, and didn't seem to consider that fact that these players are still kids in many ways, and will make mistakes. And when they did make mistakes, instead of using it as an to guide and teach them, she reacted nastily towards them. The coach of a team needs to be loved and respected by their players in order to do their job well -the second your players begin to resent your leadership, it's all over. Even when you're 100% right, they'll rebel against you.
That's why I think Jessica is primarily at fault here. As a team manager, it was her job to foster the kind of environment where values like dedication and trust and brotherhood flourished. She completely failed at that job. If Slayers had possessed a healthy team atmosphere, the majority of the problems that led to it's destruction would have never happened.
Definitely agree. Just listen to the way the Star_Tale players talk about their manager. And that's far from an isolated case. There are countless examples of players thanking their coaches and managers in interviews.
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United States23455 Posts
On October 23 2012 07:45 tMomiji wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2012 07:44 Dionyseus wrote:
I'm siding with Boxer, Jessica, and Cella. Then you seem to be in the minority, it looks like...
In Korea, it seems like the heavy majority think MMA/Crank are spoiled brats, should be shunned, etc. In foreign community, the majority lies with the players.
MMA needs to just join EG and fly to America before someone throws a rock through his window.
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On October 23 2012 07:45 tMomiji wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2012 07:44 Dionyseus wrote:
I'm siding with Boxer, Jessica, and Cella. Then you seem to be in the minority, it looks like...
How about the people who are not siding with anyone yet until concrete evidences are presented? Those are the minority of minorities it seems. 
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On October 23 2012 07:45 tMomiji wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2012 07:44 Dionyseus wrote:
I'm siding with Boxer, Jessica, and Cella. Then you seem to be in the minority, it looks like...
Only outside of Korea apparently, which happens to be the demographic which doesn't matter lol.
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Canada16217 Posts
On October 23 2012 07:47 Fionn wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2012 07:45 tMomiji wrote:On October 23 2012 07:44 Dionyseus wrote:
I'm siding with Boxer, Jessica, and Cella. Then you seem to be in the minority, it looks like... In Korea, it seems like the heavy majority think MMA/Crank are spoiled brats, should be shunned, etc. In foreign community, the majority lies with the players. MMA needs to just join EG and fly to America before someone throws a rock through his window.
That's because it's Boxer they are siding with.
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On October 23 2012 07:47 Fionn wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2012 07:45 tMomiji wrote:On October 23 2012 07:44 Dionyseus wrote:
I'm siding with Boxer, Jessica, and Cella. Then you seem to be in the minority, it looks like... In Korea, it seems like the heavy majority think MMA/Crank are spoiled brats, should be shunned, etc. In foreign community, the majority lies with the players. MMA needs to just join EG and fly to America before someone throws a rock through his window.
This, and especially bolded part. 
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On October 23 2012 07:47 Fionn wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2012 07:45 tMomiji wrote:On October 23 2012 07:44 Dionyseus wrote:
I'm siding with Boxer, Jessica, and Cella. Then you seem to be in the minority, it looks like... In Korea, it seems like the heavy majority think MMA/Crank are spoiled brats, should be shunned, etc. In foreign community, the majority lies with the players.
Can I side with neither, or better yet, I'll just side with whatever Nestea says.
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On October 23 2012 07:49 CuteZergling wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2012 07:47 Fionn wrote:On October 23 2012 07:45 tMomiji wrote:On October 23 2012 07:44 Dionyseus wrote:
I'm siding with Boxer, Jessica, and Cella. Then you seem to be in the minority, it looks like... In Korea, it seems like the heavy majority think MMA/Crank are spoiled brats, should be shunned, etc. In foreign community, the majority lies with the players. Can I side with neither, or better yet, I'll just side with whatever Nestea says.
Nestea and MVP really should weigh in on this... And Tasteless and Artosis :p
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On October 23 2012 07:44 Series7 wrote:
It's clear from reading the accounts that Crank and MMA were not entirely innocent in this, actually did quite a few things deserving of some kind of sanction.
However, I don't think that the kinds of things that they did should have been unexpected. These guys aren't experienced and responsible adults, they're pretty young, and they're going to make mistakes and be immature and irresponsible about things.
And that's where the leadership was supposed to come in. A good team manger and coach can provide the team with inspiration, focus, and direction. It's a difficult job to to do, and one that requires the right kind of personality -a cross between a businessman, a teacher, and a camp counselor. Good leadership is the key to fostering a healthy team atmosphere and promoting good values for SC2 players.
This is where Jessica and Slayers completely dropped the ball. Even in the instances where she was right, it feels to me like Jessica made everything worse by reacting poorly to the situation. She expected her players, including MMA and Crank, to act responsibly and like adults in every situation, and didn't seem to consider that fact that these players are still kids in many ways, and will make mistakes. And when they did make mistakes, instead of using it as an to guide and teach them, she reacted nastily towards them. The coach of a team needs to be loved and respected by their players in order to do their job well -the second your players begin to resent your leadership, it's all over. Even when you're 100% right, they'll rebel against you.
That's why I think Jessica is primarily at fault here. As a team manager, it was her job to foster the kind of environment where values like dedication and trust and brotherhood flourished. She completely failed at that job. If Slayers had possessed a healthy team atmosphere, the majority of the problems that led to it's destruction would have never happened.
Again, this!! Yes the players did things wrong, but it was obvious that they were afraid of any backlash from Jessica and thus did not act in the most responsible ways. A bad environment only breeds more negativity. Ultimately, Jessica is the one who is most at fault here. Not to say the others involved were innocent, because they weren't and anyone who thinks they are must be blind, but in the end Jessica was the one ultimately responsible for the team and...well, we've all seen what's happened.
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My friend wants credits for the translations of Cella's tweets she provided. Her id is phn419
Thanks phn419 :D
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On October 23 2012 07:47 sc2superfan101 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2012 07:42 glzElectromaster wrote:On October 23 2012 07:38 sc2superfan101 wrote:On October 23 2012 07:35 Subversive wrote:On October 23 2012 07:33 grs wrote:On October 23 2012 07:32 sc2superfan101 wrote:On October 23 2012 07:28 BRaegO wrote:On October 23 2012 07:24 sc2superfan101 wrote:On October 23 2012 07:23 BRaegO wrote:On October 23 2012 07:14 sc2superfan101 wrote:
[quote]
only Korean law is relevant, because we are discussing Korean law. I am not entirely aware of the specific laws in this case, but am pretty sure, since no one from the area is calling for her to be arrested or trying to pursue this legally, that she is not doing anything illegal.
pretty simple, dude...
And you are sure no one is pursuing this legally? haha You complain about people saying things without proof; do you realize how much of a hypocrite you are being right now? You don't even know the law in Korea(i'm not claiming to either). At least we are basing what we know on something. You say "almost positive" to "pretty sure" cause she hasn't been arrested yet. That has to be one of the most idiotic things I've read in this thread. Quit flaming. Pretty simple, dude. I literally just posted the relevant information about the law... and I didn't flame you once, whereas you just called me idiotic... "people like you, who jump to conclusions based on nothing, are the problem. not Jessica, not MMA. You and all your ilk. have a nice day" That's not flaming? haha Hopefully you've learned that's categorizing too, by now. You posted what you thought was right before actually knowing and posting the relevant info. Do you see my point? You are stating shit before even knowing what you are talking about. ..... I said I was categorizing when I made that statement. and no, that isn't flaming, but if it hurt your feelings, I am sorry. I am the only person so far that has sourced a thing he said in this thread, so why the fuck are you jumping down my throat? hundreds of posts on here with unsupported and FALSE assertions, and you jump on the one guy who said somehting true, and then sourced it when challenged? makes a lot of sense... If you really want to know, why people jump on you: It is because you sound very aggressive and know-it-all. No idea if you mean it that way, but that's how it sounds. He knows. He just can't bear to retract that stupid line about knowing nothing about Korean law but being certain he was right. And this in a reply telling someone they were wrong. He knows. I was right... so if I was certain about being right, and I was right.... how is that wrong? No one is disputing the fact that you were right, son. It's just that saying that you have no source nor knowledge about Korean Law to back it up while claiming to be certain and at the same time calling out someone else's claim as bogus while they based it on German law seems a bit...irrational. Good thing you were right though. when making a claim on Korean law, German law would be irrelevant, would it not? and if no one is talking about the illegality of a thing, including those who were involved, wouldn't it be a good guess to say that the thing isn't illegal?
German law wouldn't be completely irreverent. Most first world country laws are pretty similar.
I do agree it's a good guess. But if you want to sound credible, wording could help.
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I usually enjoy following esports drama from a distance but I just couldn't be less interested in this whole situation. Not sure why. The news that has affected me the most is that Coca is going to play LoL. As for the rest.....meh.
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All this made me want is to play football with SlayerS.
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-_- i actually have no idea because i love cella boxer and mma...
but the XCKD today was quite illustrative of all this drama
+ Show Spoiler +
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On October 23 2012 07:48 Jisunsu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2012 07:45 tMomiji wrote:On October 23 2012 07:44 Dionyseus wrote:
I'm siding with Boxer, Jessica, and Cella. Then you seem to be in the minority, it looks like... How about the people who are not siding with anyone yet until concrete evidences are presented? Those are the minority of minorities it seems.
Ahahaha, you caught me there~ You are indeed correct.
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On October 23 2012 07:50 geokilla wrote:My friend wants credits for the translations of Cella's tweets she provided. Her id is phn419 Thanks phn419 :D
Thank you phn419~
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United States23455 Posts
On October 23 2012 07:47 Subversive wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2012 07:44 Series7 wrote:
It's clear from reading the accounts that Crank and MMA were not entirely innocent in this, actually did quite a few things deserving of some kind of sanction.
However, I don't think that the kinds of things that they did should have been unexpected. These guys aren't experienced and responsible adults, they're pretty young, and they're going to make mistakes and be immature and irresponsible about things.
And that's where the leadership was supposed to come in. A good team manger and coach can provide the team with inspiration, focus, and direction. It's a difficult job to to do, and one that requires the right kind of personality -a cross between a businessman, a teacher, and a camp counselor. Good leadership is the key to fostering a healthy team atmosphere and promoting good values for SC2 players.
This is where Jessica and Slayers completely dropped the ball. Even in the instances where she was right, it feels to me like Jessica made everything worse by reacting poorly to the situation. She expected her players, including MMA and Crank, to act responsibly and like adults in every situation, and didn't seem to consider that fact that these players are still kids in many ways, and will make mistakes. And when they did make mistakes, instead of using it as an to guide and teach them, she reacted nastily towards them. The coach of a team needs to be loved and respected by their players in order to do their job well -the second your players begin to resent your leadership, it's all over. Even when you're 100% right, they'll rebel against you.
That's why I think Jessica is primarily at fault here. As a team manager, it was her job to foster the kind of environment where values like dedication and trust and brotherhood flourished. She completely failed at that job. If Slayers had possessed a healthy team atmosphere, the majority of the problems that led to it's destruction would have never happened. Definitely agree. Just listen to the way the Star_Tale players talk about their manager. And that's far from an isolated case. There are countless examples of players thanking their coaches and managers in interviews.
TSL went through the same stuff Slayers did. Lost players. Had the SC2Con side with FruitDealer/Tester and make TSL look like some evil corporation. Instead of let's say Polt, Hyun and Symbol turning on the coaching staff, and Coach Lee blaming everyone for not practicing with them, they just became a tighter family unit and survived. They now are in the GSTL semifinals, have three players in Code S, and a coach and at least a team member always show up to another TSL member's GSL game.
TSL and Slayers have a lot of parallels. Coach Lee might have done a lot of shady stuff like Jessica did, but the difference is he never gave up on the team and his players believed in his plan. From the Slayers situation, the players gave up on Jessica.
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On October 23 2012 07:50 geokilla wrote:My friend wants credits for the translations of Cella's tweets she provided. Her id is phn419 Thanks phn419 :D
I haven't been following SC2 lately so geokilla updated me on this news. Cella was tweeting a novel xD
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On October 23 2012 07:50 geokilla wrote:My friend wants credits for the translations of Cella's tweets she provided. Her id is phn419 Thanks phn419 :D
Aw, no altruism?
Thanks.
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On October 23 2012 07:50 geokilla wrote:My friend wants credits for the translations of Cella's tweets she provided. Her id is phn419 Thanks phn419 :D
I bestow unto her 3000 esports credits.
...alas, not worth much in these days of crisis.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/law_of_drama.png)
