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Drama in MoW house. - Page 14

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Stop derailing with living cost talk

On September 13 2012 07:51 MinistryOfWin wrote:
Press Release:

http://www.ministryofwin.com/news/press-release-september-13th-2012

Stay tuned for the article on ESFIWORLD.com.

- Wednesday, Sep 12 10:51pm GMT (GMT+00:00)

On September 13 2012 08:02 MinistryOfWin wrote:
http://esfiworld.com/news/ministry-win-respond-fuzers-claims

- Wednesday, Sep 12 11:02pm GMT (GMT+00:00)
hypercube
Profile Joined April 2010
Hungary2735 Posts
September 12 2012 19:45 GMT
#261
On September 13 2012 04:43 Jager wrote:
None of it would hold up in court, so can everyone please stop getting wound up over it


I doubt it would get thrown out without trial though. So it's still a massive headache if "Boss" decided to sue.
"Sending people in rockets to other planets is a waste of money better spent on sending rockets into people on this planet."
torm3ntin
Profile Joined October 2009
Brazil2534 Posts
September 12 2012 19:46 GMT
#262
On September 13 2012 04:44 pallad wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2012 04:41 Xcobidoo wrote:
Wait so if Ret has signed, then he can't go to any liquidhouse etc.? Ouch :/


Fuzer make mistake in post , dont knowing that or...

You can go to another house.., YOU CANT OPEN OWN house and coach people there. This is in conbtract , not that you cant go to another house.



You keep focusing on that and forget about the part where he owes money back to fuzer.
Grubby and Ret fan, but a TERRAN player :D
TheDougler
Profile Joined April 2010
Canada8324 Posts
September 12 2012 19:46 GMT
#263
Oh good, my pitchfork was getting rusty anyway.
I root for Euro Zergs, NA Protoss* and Korean Terrans. (Any North American who has beat a Korean Pro as Protoss counts as NA Toss)
Haspe
Profile Joined December 2011
Finland35 Posts
September 12 2012 19:46 GMT
#264
I think its stupid to speculate the case until MoW releases their statement. All we have is Fuzers one, and i personally beliveve him and support him 100% in this thing, this is so wrong in many ways. Ministry of Win, you guys better have a great explanation for this.
"Form is temporary, Class is permanent" - MMA
S_SienZ
Profile Joined September 2011
1878 Posts
September 12 2012 19:46 GMT
#265
On September 13 2012 04:44 Zorkmid wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2012 04:41 Diamond wrote:
On September 13 2012 04:34 Zorkmid wrote:
Also, there's nothing standard about a non-competition clause with a timeline exceeding the length of the contract. Assuming a player lived in the house for a year, a non-competition clause cannot extend beyond that year. It's something put it to prevent people from breaking contracts and going to a competitor DURING their contract, not after it.


I think this whole situation sucks but just wanted to point out that you obviously know nothing about non-compete clauses, MANY do exist after the length of the contract, it's a pretty regular thing.


Show me one.

Can't show you an exact one, but an example would be in the software development industry. When you leave a firm there's usually a clause preventing you from competing with them for about 1-2 years. 10 years seems a bit disproportionate imo esp for eSports.
Terminal
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom2109 Posts
September 12 2012 19:47 GMT
#266
I also gotta say, forcing players to stream and taking a cut from their stream revenue is pretty fucking disgusting. Sounds like slavery to me.
Swords
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
6038 Posts
September 12 2012 19:47 GMT
#267
On the plus side...

Mana's house will have less competition now.
Torrathyr
Profile Joined June 2012
Canada95 Posts
September 12 2012 19:47 GMT
#268
On September 13 2012 04:44 Destiny wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2012 04:20 Mackus wrote:
On September 13 2012 04:15 Destiny wrote:
The Boss guy looks like kind of a dick here, but honestly, a contract is a contract.

When I was first contacted by MoW, my very first action was to request a contract and read through all of the fine terms.

As for the "not allowed to stay at another house in 10 years," that's not true, you're just not allowed to start your own team house in 10 years. It's kind of strange, maybe, for the e-sports world, but that's a pretty standard non-competition clause from the business world. It's meant to protect businesses from revealing practices to an employee and then having that employee run off to start their own business to compete using everything they learned from that previous business. Not saying it's right or wrong in this circumstance, just giving some background.

Yeah, there are some other clauses. Financial compensation they want, minimum number of stream hours, etc...etc...But to complain about all of these after the fact..? I can't understand why anyone would move to a house and not read the contract first, seems kind of strange.


You're missing the important part where he's paid a months rent without signing a contract and has been asked to leave.

This is going to sound incredibly dickish, and it definitely doesn't excuse MoW from acting dickish, but there's nothing to keep them from keeping the money.

You never, ever, ever, ever, ever give someone money without signing a contract first or at least asking for a receipt.

This. I'm not going to buy anything, especially with a price tag of 600 euros, without asking for a receipt.
Talent < Skill < Practice < Dedication
torm3ntin
Profile Joined October 2009
Brazil2534 Posts
September 12 2012 19:47 GMT
#269
On September 13 2012 04:46 Haspe wrote:
I think its stupid to speculate the case until MoW releases their statement. All we have is Fuzers one, and i personally beliveve him and support him 100% in this thing, this is so wrong in many ways. Ministry of Win, you guys better have a great explanation for this.


Why you put so much weight in MoW statement?

Destiny already confirmed some stuff. Other 2/3 players said the same.

It's not like they can change everything upside down.
Grubby and Ret fan, but a TERRAN player :D
GhettoSheep
Profile Joined August 2008
United States150 Posts
September 12 2012 19:48 GMT
#270
Non-complete conditions in contracts that forbid you from taking similar employment, like establishing your own gaming house, are almost never enforced in court. It's bs and they can't enforce it. At least that's how it would work in the US.
bonifaceviii
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada2890 Posts
September 12 2012 19:48 GMT
#271
On September 13 2012 04:44 Swords wrote:
On top of this, 10 years is an insanely long time even for a business contract designed to prevent instant future competitors. Yeah, these kinds of clauses are often included, but ten years is an extremely long time. Theoretically we'll be years into Legacy of the Void by then and who knows how esports or SC2 as an esport will even be thriving. 3 years might be a reasonable request, 10 years in the world of esports is saying you'd better hope this grows bigger or as big as BW if you ever want to start a pro-house or coach in one after coming here.

These kind of clauses are in there more to scare people than to create any sort of legal obligation. If Fuzer set up a gaming house a couple of years after staying in MoW they'd have a really hard time trying to go after him for it (ie it wouldn't be worth their while to do so).
Stay a while and listen || http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=354018
Solarist
Profile Joined September 2011
291 Posts
September 12 2012 19:49 GMT
#272
On September 13 2012 04:46 S_SienZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2012 04:44 Zorkmid wrote:
On September 13 2012 04:41 Diamond wrote:
On September 13 2012 04:34 Zorkmid wrote:
Also, there's nothing standard about a non-competition clause with a timeline exceeding the length of the contract. Assuming a player lived in the house for a year, a non-competition clause cannot extend beyond that year. It's something put it to prevent people from breaking contracts and going to a competitor DURING their contract, not after it.


I think this whole situation sucks but just wanted to point out that you obviously know nothing about non-compete clauses, MANY do exist after the length of the contract, it's a pretty regular thing.


Show me one.

Can't show you an exact one, but an example would be in the software development industry. When you leave a firm there's usually a clause preventing you from competing with them for about 1-2 years. 10 years seems a bit disproportionate imo esp for eSports.


This is true. We have a programmer in my firm who had in his contract that he coudent work for a customer ( he's a consultant) for 2 years i belive it was.
Arceus
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Vietnam8333 Posts
September 12 2012 19:49 GMT
#273
that ten years part is pretty douchy. Maybe he misreads a decimal point there xD
Cinquedea
Profile Joined July 2012
Canada144 Posts
September 12 2012 19:49 GMT
#274
Sounds like the average competitive gaming house. Lol. Although this does seem to be a bit more of a problem then the usual. Good job bringing this out, couldn't of been easy.
Too strange to live, too rare to die.
Balgrog
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States1221 Posts
September 12 2012 19:49 GMT
#275
Bummer to hear it is going this way, I really had high hopes for MoW, and still do, hope they can get there act together.
The only way to attack structure is with chaos.
StarStruck
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
25339 Posts
September 12 2012 19:49 GMT
#276
On September 13 2012 04:44 Zorkmid wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2012 04:41 Diamond wrote:
On September 13 2012 04:34 Zorkmid wrote:
Also, there's nothing standard about a non-competition clause with a timeline exceeding the length of the contract. Assuming a player lived in the house for a year, a non-competition clause cannot extend beyond that year. It's something put it to prevent people from breaking contracts and going to a competitor DURING their contract, not after it.


I think this whole situation sucks but just wanted to point out that you obviously know nothing about non-compete clauses, MANY do exist after the length of the contract, it's a pretty regular thing.


Show me one.


It's applied to every business. Everything I can think of.

If they let you go or you decide to resign. It's normal to have a non-compete clause in order to protect the business, but ten years is kind of ridiculous.

Usually it's six months to a year.
WerderBremen
Profile Joined September 2011
Germany1070 Posts
September 12 2012 19:50 GMT
#277
So sorry for you Fuzer, you are the best. Only userstream I tune in every single time I see it!
ggl in the future
"Thats the moment you send the kids outta the room - when you get contained by MarineKing." Tasteless
pallad
Profile Joined September 2010
Poland1958 Posts
September 12 2012 19:50 GMT
#278
On September 13 2012 04:47 torm3ntin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2012 04:46 Haspe wrote:
I think its stupid to speculate the case until MoW releases their statement. All we have is Fuzers one, and i personally beliveve him and support him 100% in this thing, this is so wrong in many ways. Ministry of Win, you guys better have a great explanation for this.


Why you put so much weight in MoW statement?

Destiny already confirmed some stuff. Other 2/3 players said the same.

It's not like they can change everything upside down.


What Destiny confirmed.. ? that Fuzer is wrong.. ? And there is nothing abouth " you cant go to other house" , but there is " you cant make own house and coach people"

What else he confirmed? I miss something ?
SC 2 -LingsLover- EU -- Jaedong , NesTea , Nerchio , DRG , Moon , Oz , Tarson , Scarlett -- Dota 2 Pallad EU- NaVi - LGD
necrimanci
Profile Joined March 2011
70 Posts
September 12 2012 19:50 GMT
#279
standard poland

User was warned for this post
bonifaceviii
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada2890 Posts
September 12 2012 19:50 GMT
#280
If you thought Korean gaming houses were sweatshops...
Stay a while and listen || http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=354018
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