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As emotionally invested as people are on this topic, TL rules still apply. That includes flaming and ad hominem attacks. |
On August 31 2012 11:16 lazyitachi wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 11:10 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 31 2012 11:00 lazyitachi wrote:On August 31 2012 10:56 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 31 2012 10:26 lazyitachi wrote:
LOL.. This is why I love coming to Teamliquid. to see the continuous train wreck of the "intellectual" forumers.
Threads like these are great for upping them post counts.
In case, some of you did not realise, Destiny basically has pix of himself in a ROOT shirt and pics of himself in his GF's room thus indicating that his intention to cheat on her. This plus the chat logs is quite damning on his character.
Shady person indeed. Well, but seems to appeal to certain people in this "community".
Everyone can do as they please.. Not like it is anyone's business but just bear in mind, you can be judged based on those actions. And yes, the world is not fair, people are treated unequally, deal with it.
You want it to be the same, regulate it. Oh no... w don't want no KESPA... So many children living in a fantasy utopia. You do know that the world does not exactly cater to your every ideals and desires right? You're confusing posts made by many different people and lumping them all in together to fit your 'argument'. And just no, people who have a different world view from you aren't 'children' or 'living in a fantasy utopia' You can make points without being so condescending. Nope.. please try again.. The point at the bottom is for people who wants equal treatment and punishment to what they deem unfair treatment to their hero. It's not because they differ from my "world view". Oh so just by thinking there exists a clear demarcation between private and public actions, I'm apparently whining about 'unfair treatment of my hero'. This despite me not even being a particularly big Destiny fan. Please try again. Nope.. You can try again. I don't care whether its private or public action. Maybe you should argue on what I actually said. It's a repercussion to his action - people did what they did acting upon facts made public - regardless of whether actions originated from a public or private realm. There are severity of consequences and punishment meted can be disproportionate to the action. it is unfortunate but that is how it is. If you want such things to be consistent, there will be regulations like it or not otherwise everyone exercise their own judgement, Comprende? No?
No comprende. That made no sense
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On August 31 2012 11:14 bakarin wrote:
I just realized that NA players can be so bad at the game and stir up this kind of drama while EU and KR players work their asses off to be good at the game and not humiliate themselves with drama.
Ignorant. There are bad players everywhere just as there are good players. There is drama coming from all sides, as well. Naniwa is full of drama. Stephano has his drama. MMA and SlayerS JUST had their drama.
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On August 31 2012 11:19 Prophanity wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 11:14 bakarin wrote:
I just realized that NA players can be so bad at the game and stir up this kind of drama while EU and KR players work their asses off to be good at the game and not humiliate themselves with drama. Ignorant. There are bad players everywhere just as there are good players. There is drama coming from all sides, as well. Naniwa is full of drama. Stephano has his drama. MMA and SlayerS JUST had their drama.
Oh right I stand corrected some EU and KR have dramas, but they don't humiliate themselves this low and they are actually good players.
User was warned for this post
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On August 31 2012 08:52 Radin wrote:Um, this girl made a post explaining how she hacked Destiny's twitter and posted a picture of his dick because she felt betrayed by something he did with his friends in private. She brought the public into this, not Fayth or Destiny. If she didn't want scrutiny, she should have handled the situation in a more private manner with Destiny himself. The ridicule she is getting is self-inflicted and has nothing to do with Fayth.
Okay, so I'm looking at her message on reddit:
http://www.reddit.com/r/Destiny/comments/yt1a8/to_spare_erin_heres_whats_going_on/
and I don't see her mentioning Fayth at all. Did she come out and publicly ridicule him? As far as I understand the situation, the public humiliation is between her and Destiny. If she hasn't done anything to Fayth, then he shouldn't come on TL and insult her. He has the right to not apologize. If he decides not to, then he should just try to keep silent on public forums. Maybe only breaking silence to clear up misinformation, but even this can be a little bit sketchy.
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Northern Ireland27464 Posts
On August 31 2012 11:16 lazyitachi wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 11:10 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 31 2012 11:00 lazyitachi wrote:On August 31 2012 10:56 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 31 2012 10:26 lazyitachi wrote:
LOL.. This is why I love coming to Teamliquid. to see the continuous train wreck of the "intellectual" forumers.
Threads like these are great for upping them post counts.
In case, some of you did not realise, Destiny basically has pix of himself in a ROOT shirt and pics of himself in his GF's room thus indicating that his intention to cheat on her. This plus the chat logs is quite damning on his character.
Shady person indeed. Well, but seems to appeal to certain people in this "community".
Everyone can do as they please.. Not like it is anyone's business but just bear in mind, you can be judged based on those actions. And yes, the world is not fair, people are treated unequally, deal with it.
You want it to be the same, regulate it. Oh no... w don't want no KESPA... So many children living in a fantasy utopia. You do know that the world does not exactly cater to your every ideals and desires right? You're confusing posts made by many different people and lumping them all in together to fit your 'argument'. And just no, people who have a different world view from you aren't 'children' or 'living in a fantasy utopia' You can make points without being so condescending. Nope.. please try again.. The point at the bottom is for people who wants equal treatment and punishment to what they deem unfair treatment to their hero. It's not because they differ from my "world view". Oh so just by thinking there exists a clear demarcation between private and public actions, I'm apparently whining about 'unfair treatment of my hero'. This despite me not even being a particularly big Destiny fan. Please try again. Nope.. You can try again. I don't care whether its private or public action. Maybe you should argue on what I actually said. It's a repercussion to his action - people did what they did acting upon facts made public - regardless of whether actions originated from a public or private realm. There are severity of consequences and punishment meted can be disproportionate to the action. it is unfortunate but that is how it is. If you want such things to be consistent, there will be regulations like it or not otherwise everyone exercise their own judgement, Comprende? No?
Ok well, agree to disagree. It's just the world works etc etc, doesn't mean you can't critique the status quo without being some sort of utopian idealist. I don't see why we have any right to uphold whatever moral standards we may have when it comes to anybody who is in the public eye. If they go against the law, yes, otherwise the correct censure is a withdrawal of sales or what have you. In this case, don't watch the guy's stream, if you're that offended contact his team management, if they do nothing, contact the sponsors. Instead we had a reddit subforum running their own little righteous campaign, and I don't blame the sponsors for subsequently getting rid of Destiny.
What is in the 'public interest' has been watered down so much that people think they're now entitled to pass judgement on who people fuck, who they talk to and what they do in their own time. It's fucking pathetic and it's a blight upon modern society, people need to go about living their own lives instead of living vicariously through gossiping about others.
We seem to have very quickly gone from a media culture that often insulated and protected the rich and powerful, to one that now extends its coverage to irrelevant salacious gossip.
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On August 31 2012 11:18 NiteshadeSC2 wrote:
Here's how I see it.
Sure. Pro-gamers live in a world of the internet. A world where their personal lives often blend with their professional lives. It is very hard to have a life where there is a "line" that seperates the personal and professional life when your income comes from tournaments and netcsting.
That being said: I firmly believe that this is a bad move on ROOT's part. Destiny is an excellent player, and brings a lot of attention to this team for whatever reason or another. His netcasts are hilarious. His talent is incredible. Is he being released because of his professional 'work"?
Nope.
Instead Root is throwing him under the bus because of a personal matter. Instead of backing him up, and promoting his gameplay and his help in providing exposure to the team: they stick a knife in his back, call him a friend and kick him to the curb when their paycheque is threatened.
Imagine if madonna was ditched by the record label everytime bad media got out? She wouldn't have had a career past the mid 90's. Sometimes some controversial exposure is good exposure.
Destiny is vulgar and loud, but HONEST. ROOT gaming certainly isn't.
They lost a fan, and I will continue to follow Destiny instead.
ROOT has been dreadfully honest on this issue: ultimately, prior friendship isn't enough to tolerate jackassery of this magnitude and consistency. they've been back together since may, what exactly has destiny done in that time period that makes him an invaluable resource to have on their team?
also, you don't know if ROOT argued for him or not; given his history with catz and fayth, I feel safe in assuming they did, whereas your assumptions are much poorer and more numerous in this post.
also, let's be fucking real here for a moment mmkay, destiny is a decent player at best. ROOT has much more to gain from looking like a real team in the months to come and attracting powerhouse EU and KA players than letting destiny keep his jester cap on and dance around.
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Seems like lots of people don't seem to understand how sponsorship works.
Destiny was on a team. That team had sponsors. Therefore Destiny was a representative of those sponsors. That is pretty much the entire point of it. It is honestly as simple as that. If the sponsors are not happy with how the people representing them act then they can just not sponsor anymore. Therefore you CANNOT just act however the hell you want unless the sponsor is happy for you to do so. When you accept sponsorship you are ALSO accepting the responsibility of being a good representative for your sponsor. Similarly when you sign up for a team you are accepting the same responsibility but for said team.
More to the point: hiding it away, which is something that Destiny fans seem to be literally constantly advocating, is probably the worst thing you can do because hiding scandals is a one-way ticket to permanently poisoning e-sports. If the community does not show it is self-policing then there is no way in hell most sponsors are going to risk getting caught up in some sort of hidden controversy which could blow up in their face.
You might not like all of that, Destiny sure as hell doesn't like that based on these constant controversies, but thats the way the world works. Don't like it? I'm sorry but tough; you just have to put up with it. The world isn't always nice or fair. And its not going to magically change just because you stamp your feet and yell loudly enough about being able to say what you want, when you want to.
And its not a witch-hunt to call someone out on something they've actually done. I mean come on...seriously... >_>
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On August 31 2012 11:21 bakarin wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 11:19 Prophanity wrote:On August 31 2012 11:14 bakarin wrote:
I just realized that NA players can be so bad at the game and stir up this kind of drama while EU and KR players work their asses off to be good at the game and not humiliate themselves with drama. Ignorant. There are bad players everywhere just as there are good players. There is drama coming from all sides, as well. Naniwa is full of drama. Stephano has his drama. MMA and SlayerS JUST had their drama. Oh right I stand corrected some EU and KR have dramas, but they don't humiliate themselves this low and they are actually good players.
lol you're really asking for it, huh?
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On August 31 2012 11:22 KillingVector wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 08:52 Radin wrote:Um, this girl made a post explaining how she hacked Destiny's twitter and posted a picture of his dick because she felt betrayed by something he did with his friends in private. She brought the public into this, not Fayth or Destiny. If she didn't want scrutiny, she should have handled the situation in a more private manner with Destiny himself. The ridicule she is getting is self-inflicted and has nothing to do with Fayth. If she hasn't done anything to Fayth, then he shouldn't come on TL and insult her. He has the right to not apologize. If he decides not to, then he should just try to keep silent on public forums. Maybe only breaking silence to clear up misinformation, but even this can be a little bit sketchy.
She caused him to lose his teammate. She leaked his private conversation, which caused him to be suspended for a month. She indirectly hurt his reputation, but hurt it nonetheless.
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On August 31 2012 11:26 pieisamazing wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 11:21 bakarin wrote:On August 31 2012 11:19 Prophanity wrote:On August 31 2012 11:14 bakarin wrote:
I just realized that NA players can be so bad at the game and stir up this kind of drama while EU and KR players work their asses off to be good at the game and not humiliate themselves with drama. Ignorant. There are bad players everywhere just as there are good players. There is drama coming from all sides, as well. Naniwa is full of drama. Stephano has his drama. MMA and SlayerS JUST had their drama. Oh right I stand corrected some EU and KR have dramas, but they don't humiliate themselves this low and they are actually good players. lol you're really asking for it, huh?
Why, am I wrong?
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Northern Ireland27464 Posts
On August 31 2012 11:26 Lightspeaker wrote:
Seems like lots of people don't seem to understand how sponsorship works.
Destiny was on a team. That team had sponsors. Therefore Destiny was a representative of those sponsors. That is pretty much the entire point of it. It is honestly as simple as that. If the sponsors are not happy with how the people representing them act then they can just not sponsor anymore. Therefore you CANNOT just act however the hell you want unless the sponsor is happy for you to do so. When you accept sponsorship you are ALSO accepting the responsibility of being a good representative for your sponsor. Similarly when you sign up for a team you are accepting the same responsibility but for said team.
More to the point: hiding it away, which is something that Destiny fans seem to be literally constantly advocating, is probably the worst thing you can do because hiding scandals is a one-way ticket to permanently poisoning e-sports. If the community does not show it is self-policing then there is no way in hell most sponsors are going to risk getting caught up in some sort of hidden controversy which could blow up in their face.
You might not like all of that, Destiny sure as hell doesn't like that based on these constant controversies, but thats the way the world works. Don't like it? I'm sorry but tough; you just have to put up with it. The world isn't always nice or fair. And its not going to magically change just because you stamp your feet and yell loudly enough about being able to say what you want, when you want to.
And its not a witch-hunt to call someone out on something they've actually done. I mean come on...seriously... >_>
Ok, that's evidently true considering that's pretty much what got Destiny the chop, people complaining that they were so 'offended' right?
Let the advocates of proportionality have their say without making us out to be idealistic children. Maybe people will stop being idiotic and spend more time doing vaguely productive things with their time than complain about a streamer they don't like.
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On August 31 2012 11:26 Edahspmal wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 11:22 KillingVector wrote:On August 31 2012 08:52 Radin wrote:Um, this girl made a post explaining how she hacked Destiny's twitter and posted a picture of his dick because she felt betrayed by something he did with his friends in private. She brought the public into this, not Fayth or Destiny. If she didn't want scrutiny, she should have handled the situation in a more private manner with Destiny himself. The ridicule she is getting is self-inflicted and has nothing to do with Fayth. If she hasn't done anything to Fayth, then he shouldn't come on TL and insult her. He has the right to not apologize. If he decides not to, then he should just try to keep silent on public forums. Maybe only breaking silence to clear up misinformation, but even this can be a little bit sketchy. She caused him to lose his teammate. She leaked his private conversation, which caused him to be suspended for a month. She indirectly hurt his reputation, but hurt it nonetheless.
Causing him to lose a teammate (I'm not quite sure its fair to credit her as the sole cause, but let's forget that) isn't reason for him to publicly insult her. Its a decision made by his team. Sure, it hurts, and he can curse her in private as much as he wants. However, it is not appropriate for him to publicly humiliate her.
His suspension, again, is a team decision. It is also the fact that he is involved with the incident that makes it so much more inappropriate for him to publicly humiliate her. A copy of a chat log is damning, but doesn't amount to her insulting him.
And I think the idea that she leaked the conversation are accusations he made in this forum (maybe put forward as wild guesses by people before him, but he's certainly a witness to this whole thing and carries more relevance) without any opportunity for her rebuttal. That is a completely different taboo.
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On August 31 2012 11:41 KillingVector wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 11:26 Edahspmal wrote:On August 31 2012 11:22 KillingVector wrote:On August 31 2012 08:52 Radin wrote:Um, this girl made a post explaining how she hacked Destiny's twitter and posted a picture of his dick because she felt betrayed by something he did with his friends in private. She brought the public into this, not Fayth or Destiny. If she didn't want scrutiny, she should have handled the situation in a more private manner with Destiny himself. The ridicule she is getting is self-inflicted and has nothing to do with Fayth. If she hasn't done anything to Fayth, then he shouldn't come on TL and insult her. He has the right to not apologize. If he decides not to, then he should just try to keep silent on public forums. Maybe only breaking silence to clear up misinformation, but even this can be a little bit sketchy. She caused him to lose his teammate. She leaked his private conversation, which caused him to be suspended for a month. She indirectly hurt his reputation, but hurt it nonetheless. Causing him to lose a teammate (I'm not quite sure its fair to credit her as the sole cause, but let's forget that) isn't reason for him to publicly insult her. Its a decision made by his team. Sure, it hurts, and he can curse her in private as much as he wants. However, it is not appropriate for him to publicly humiliate her. His suspension, again, is a team decision. It is also the fact that he is involved with the incident that makes it so much more inappropriate for him to publicly humiliate her. A copy of a chat log is damning, but doesn't amount to her insulting him. And I think the idea that she leaked the conversation are accusations he made in this forum (maybe put forward as wild guesses by people before him, but he's certainly a witness to this whole thing and carries more relevance) without any opportunity for her rebuttal. That is a completely different taboo.
If you don't like something Fayth said here, am I correct in assuming you disagree with bluetea's own decision to drag this private incident onto the internet and use a personal army recruited from reddit to turn this into a spectacle?
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Why the hell is it that each time there is a thread like this, most of the pages are filled with in-community fighting among Teamliquid members....Why so much hatred people? Can't we all just get along..... -_-
Pretty sure this post will be quoted and some people will try to prove me wrong even though this is a peace post...
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On August 31 2012 11:46 dynwar7 wrote:
Why the hell is it that each time there is a thread like this, most of the pages are filled with in-community fighting among Teamliquid members....Why so much hatred people? Can't we all just get along..... -_-
Pretty sure this post will be quoted and some people will try to prove me wrong even though this is a peace post...
haha yeah i know it's always like this. Like every "drama-queen-get-attention thread" it's like this. Everyone is so hostile and angry lots and lots of aggro. And so often the discussion when the pages goes from 50+ never ends. Like people just keep on finding the subjects to discuss.
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On August 31 2012 11:46 dynwar7 wrote:
Why the hell is it that each time there is a thread like this, most of the pages are filled with in-community fighting among Teamliquid members....Why so much hatred people? Can't we all just get along..... -_-
Pretty sure this post will be quoted and some people will try to prove me wrong even though this is a peace post...
Obviously due to a difference in opinion.
I don't find destiny wrong in his actions, the honest truth is a good percentage of the male population do this regularly.
I do find BlueTea's vengeful actions over the top. Sneaking up on destiny and instead of confronting him and settling this privately, she took it public. Just feel's childish. She knew the risk of exposure when she sent the pictures to destiny. If she's attracted to people like destiny, then she should know the kind of guys she's bringing herself closer to.
Secondly, the sponsors actions on destiny are not unwarranted. That's just how sponsorship happens - a reaction to public norm.
Thirdly, I don't find fayth's idea of publically defending himself/destiny on the public forums professional. It's never a good image for the team. If I were in his shoes, I would also be hot-headed but being defensive like that does no one (not even himself and definitely not his sponsors) any good. While he suffered collateral damage, destiny is the one who copped the biggest bucketload, and he's managed to stay well away from all this. Props to TT1 to staying out.
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I really don't understand the kind of person who would run to a sponsor over something like this. If there's one thing that's Hurting eSports(TM), it's sending those emails.
I actually don't even know where those people come from. Are they misguided TLers who genuinely think they're helping keep the scene honest? Are they reddit kids who just hate the players that much? Are they super-sensetive nosy grandmas browsing twitter through two-inch spectaclesr?
I just don't get it...
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On August 31 2012 11:55 Belisarius wrote:
I really don't understand the kind of person who would run to a sponsor over something like this. If there's one thing that's Hurting eSports(TM), it's sending those emails.
I actually don't even know where those people come from. Are they misguided TLers who genuinely think they're helping keep the scene honest? Are they reddit kids who just hate the players that much? Are they super-sensetive nosy grandmas browsing twitter through two-inch spectaclesr? I really don't get it...
As long the money is there, people will always sponsor. Don't worry about the future of eSports.
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I'm not worried about that, I'm worried about all these little cockroaches apparently hiding among us...
User was warned for this post
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On August 31 2012 12:01 Belisarius wrote:
I'm not worried about that, I'm worried about all these little cockroaches apparently hiding among us...
They aren't hiding.. they've always been there. You will never be able to separate childish acts and opinion from games when games, especially this popular, are involved.
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EPT
