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No Kespa Players in Upcoming GSL - Page 76

Forum Index > SC2 General
1864 CommentsPost a Reply
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GTR
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
51639 Posts
August 24 2012 07:12 GMT
#1501
On August 24 2012 16:09 nokz88 wrote:
Players should have the right to choose whether they will participate or not. That's the bottom line and everything else is secondary.

You think players have too grueling of a schedule?
Fuck what you think. Ask them whether they can handle it.
Respect their decision whether they accept or decline.
But one thing that should never ever happen is taking away freedom from the players.


Heh, reminds me of Welsh/Scotland/Northern Ireland Football Association's trying to bar their players into playing for Team GB in the Olympics, but legally, they couldn't do anything though.

Should apply to here, in this case, as well.
Commentator
JustPassingBy
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
10776 Posts
August 24 2012 07:12 GMT
#1502
On August 24 2012 16:09 nokz88 wrote:
Players should have the right to choose whether they will participate or not. That's the bottom line and everything else is secondary.

You think players have too grueling of a schedule?
Fuck what you think. Ask them whether they can handle it.
Respect their decision whether they accept or decline.
But one thing that should never ever happen is taking away freedom from the players.


Add in the fact that not every player has the opportunity to play Proleague, OSL, WCS, WCG.
Denying them the opportunity to make a possible breakout performance by qualifying for the GSL is just petty.
Taku
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Canada2036 Posts
August 24 2012 07:14 GMT
#1503
On August 24 2012 15:50 hunts wrote:
"About the future plan for joining GSL, KeSPA told “We don’t join GSL Season 5 because there has not been enough discussion prior to the event. If we discuss several issues prior to the event enough and if it could make some synergy with Proleague, we will join the future GSL.”

Yeah fuck kespa. I say now is a good time to throw the shit storm that the SC2 community is known for. Email/tweet/mail/call etc.. all the KESPA companies that are international, tell them you will boycot them until the end of time for being associated with kespa, have the koreans go apeshit, everyone go apeshit on KESPA and all the organizations that support it.

Sigh reddit is leaking again. Once again, how can you boycott someone whom you already give zero dollars to?
When SC2 came for BW, I cried. Now LoL/Dota2 comes for SC2, and I laugh. \o/
Fenrax
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States5018 Posts
August 24 2012 07:14 GMT
#1504
On August 24 2012 16:05 MCXD wrote:
Welp, KeSPA sucks. The sooner they become a non-factor the better.

EDIT: Infact, can't we just ignore them? Just pretend they don't exist and continue on just as things were 3 months ago. If they don't want to participate in the GSL or any foreign leagues, then they simply don't deserve the attention *shrug*. They're just a side attraction that should not have any impact anywhere else.



Typical SC2 player talking bad about an organization he doesn't even know...


If you knew them you knew that ignoring isn't an option. And talk much worse!
ArvickHero
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
10387 Posts
August 24 2012 07:15 GMT
#1505
On August 24 2012 15:56 hunts wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2012 15:53 Dodgin wrote:
So I guess that confirms Kespa won't be in the GSL at all this year unless season 5 was a typo.

On August 24 2012 15:50 hunts wrote:
"About the future plan for joining GSL, KeSPA told “We don’t join GSL Season 5 because there has not been enough discussion prior to the event. If we discuss several issues prior to the event enough and if it could make some synergy with Proleague, we will join the future GSL.”

Yeah fuck kespa. I say now is a good time to throw the shit storm that the SC2 community is known for. Email/tweet/mail/call etc.. all the KESPA companies that are international, tell them you will boycot them until the end of time for being associated with kespa, have the koreans go apeshit, everyone go apeshit on KESPA and all the organizations that support it.


careful, danger~~~

try not to start a witch hunt


I hate the whole witch hunt thing that TL and especially reddit seems to have gotten fond of lately, but I think this is the one time it's needed. Make every KESPA companies life a living hell, make them lose business until they go bankrupt or disolve and make SC2 a better place by going away.

uhhh yea good luck with that, you're gonna need it if you want to try to sway these Korean mega-conglomerate companies lol
Writerptrk
Gosi
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
Sweden9072 Posts
August 24 2012 07:17 GMT
#1506
On August 24 2012 13:35 Xiphos wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2012 13:23 LighT. wrote:
On August 24 2012 13:15 jpak wrote:
On August 24 2012 13:06 LighT. wrote:
let's look at the sponsors for the Kespa Korean teams which makes up the federation that makes the final call:
CJ Entus
SKT1 Telecom
KT Rolster
Woojin
STX
Samsung Khan
Air Force Ace
Team 8.

Of this list; few things stand out.
Air Force Ace first of all, is a team that is to be discounted in future events as they're impeding any future recruits bringing a halt to their esport history.

So now..7 teams.
Of the 7 teams, Team 8 does NOT have a sponsor, and run purely by kespa

So now, we're looking at 6 teams.

CJ Entus, KT, SKT1 Telecom, are phone companies (much like Verizon in US, Telus in Canada), in which their focus in business is national across Korea rather than intentional. It would be illogical for them because expanding overseas would mean little to their entire aspect of sponsoring the team which is to advertise the brand name of their phone companies.
This ALSO hapepns to be where the giants of BW players stand: aka bisu, fantasy, flash, Leta, effort. They have quite the stronghold.

Woongjin just happens to be a bank firm. Like the telecom companies. Do they care about intentional recognition? No. because there's little beneficialness out of it. Their best interest is to let the product and their firm known in Korea, and could care less about the US.

STX Korea - Trading Company for creating Ships, trade and banking.
Samsung - Electronic Manufacturing Company.

These are 2 teams which are intentionally based. Aka. They WANT sponsorship and and their name value raised.
Most likely these teams want to venture more intentionally to make their product known and Samsung has especially let its voice heard in its eagerness for intentional relations having hosted League of Legends tournaments. If anyone's pushing the movement of Kespa towards the intentional,sponsor wise, it's these two teams.

As you can see, the final weight is rather large with an overwhelming amount of companies that only should care about national interest outnumbering those sponsors who would push for intentional interest. It's the interest of such why they're reluctant.

...

We've heard the coaches interviews with Coach Lee, January etc. and their views. We've heard interviews from Kespa players on their perspective as well. Of course, as gamers and people with passion of the game, they want to go outside of Korea, and grow the e-sports scene, play in GSL, play in MLG, Dreamhack, IPL etc. The coaches and the players are the last people to blame. Sadly, the politics doesn't work that way. under obligated contracts players have to do what they're told.

Kespa won't adjust that easy. They will eventually play in the GSL. That will happen, perhaps not this season, maybe not the next but in a few.
Why??
1) Fan pressure + uproar + to appease
2) In the interest of business (GomTV does have a korean audience after all)

The big announcement they have planned?
Most likely some national tournament to gain further exposure nationally within Korea because that's the sponsor's interest.

I almost wonder what the conversations are like amongst the representatives of each sponsor at meetings heh.

TL:DR; The coaches and players may have the passion and desire to play the game and expand esports; but the goal of Kespa is not of esports, I feel but nationally advertising their product which would not create an increase in stock, advertising overseas. Aka, they don't care about esports.


Just my two cents.


CJ is not a telecom company. CJ is an entertainment company and actually is the company that owns OGN.

Other than that, I think the best way to get Kespa to bend is through Team 8. If you offer up a major company willing to sponsor that team in return for certain conditions, then Kespa will consider.


The thing is...Kespa will never really care about e-sports at heart. Thats what people are failing to realize. That's why they're hated in Korea, and everywhere on this forums.
Teams like KT an SKT will pursue national expansion, Samsung and STX would likely pursue international expansion. Rifts will likely create and the organization is in for a mess. I can ultimately see a powerful company like Samsung disbanding from the organziation and running its own thing, as they are starting to in all honesty, but Kespa wont budge.
It's really not about Kespa wanting to create e-sports or killing it. It's about greed, money and interest and in their minds, its not intentional for a lot of teams.

And yes, my mistake on CJ, however, they are still seeking national attention than intentional and I think that's the key argument.


Well Blizzard don't actually care about 'esport' neither.

All they want to do is satisfy their consumers to like their product. If they truly believe in the spirit of the competition, they would
1. stop patching their goddamn multiplayer segment and
2. let the players figure out the game because while my pals played starcraft 2 for the sake of competition, a lot of them argued wins because of unit being nerfed or buffed and not at all blaming for their skills, and
3. it gives incentive for the players to put their entire devotion to make breakthrough builds and strategies knowing that those won't get shafted because of the aforementioned patches.

Imagine Bisu beating sAviOr 3-0 in that MSL only for Blizzard to patch the game to nerf DTs right afterward? How would Bisu feel and how would everyone on MBCGame that helped to devise the build feel afterwards?

The funniest thing about this is that if Blizzard would be the same back then as now when it comes to patching there wouldn't be any "Bisu build" because Protoss would be buffed/Zerg nerfed before that game even happened because P was out on some deep shit.
[13:40] <Qbek> gosi i dreanmt about you
achan1058
Profile Joined February 2012
1091 Posts
August 24 2012 07:27 GMT
#1507
On August 24 2012 16:14 Taku wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2012 15:50 hunts wrote:
"About the future plan for joining GSL, KeSPA told “We don’t join GSL Season 5 because there has not been enough discussion prior to the event. If we discuss several issues prior to the event enough and if it could make some synergy with Proleague, we will join the future GSL.”

Yeah fuck kespa. I say now is a good time to throw the shit storm that the SC2 community is known for. Email/tweet/mail/call etc.. all the KESPA companies that are international, tell them you will boycot them until the end of time for being associated with kespa, have the koreans go apeshit, everyone go apeshit on KESPA and all the organizations that support it.

Sigh reddit is leaking again. Once again, how can you boycott someone whom you already give zero dollars to?
You can boycott Samsung.
desarrisc
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
Canada226 Posts
August 24 2012 07:28 GMT
#1508
I think Blizzard actually holds a lot more power compared to the BW because of NO LAN. Bliz can actually make KESPA play nice with Gom or face their tournaments being blacklisted.

Anyways aside from business bull that's going on, I feel for kespa players and hopefully they can play at GSL (assuming this problem gets patched up somehow) and the spectators can enjoy games by the bests of the bests.
"Your opponent's doing anything out of the ordinary? Just go f**king kill him." -Day [9]
Weirdkid
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Singapore2431 Posts
August 24 2012 07:30 GMT
#1509
On August 24 2012 16:27 achan1058 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2012 16:14 Taku wrote:
On August 24 2012 15:50 hunts wrote:
"About the future plan for joining GSL, KeSPA told “We don’t join GSL Season 5 because there has not been enough discussion prior to the event. If we discuss several issues prior to the event enough and if it could make some synergy with Proleague, we will join the future GSL.”

Yeah fuck kespa. I say now is a good time to throw the shit storm that the SC2 community is known for. Email/tweet/mail/call etc.. all the KESPA companies that are international, tell them you will boycot them until the end of time for being associated with kespa, have the koreans go apeshit, everyone go apeshit on KESPA and all the organizations that support it.

Sigh reddit is leaking again. Once again, how can you boycott someone whom you already give zero dollars to?
You can boycott Samsung.


B..b..but Samsung phones are pretty good
"Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest you be like him yourself." - Proverbs 26:4
achan1058
Profile Joined February 2012
1091 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-24 07:39:01
August 24 2012 07:30 GMT
#1510
On August 24 2012 16:30 Weirdkid wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2012 16:27 achan1058 wrote:
On August 24 2012 16:14 Taku wrote:
On August 24 2012 15:50 hunts wrote:
"About the future plan for joining GSL, KeSPA told “We don’t join GSL Season 5 because there has not been enough discussion prior to the event. If we discuss several issues prior to the event enough and if it could make some synergy with Proleague, we will join the future GSL.”

Yeah fuck kespa. I say now is a good time to throw the shit storm that the SC2 community is known for. Email/tweet/mail/call etc.. all the KESPA companies that are international, tell them you will boycot them until the end of time for being associated with kespa, have the koreans go apeshit, everyone go apeshit on KESPA and all the organizations that support it.

Sigh reddit is leaking again. Once again, how can you boycott someone whom you already give zero dollars to?
You can boycott Samsung.


B..b..but Samsung phones are pretty good

I won't disagree, as I have one myself. Some problems with the usb plug though. The metal in the middle gets moved to the side after a year or so of use, which makes it pings like crazy thinking that it is being charged, and hence drain battery like crazy. Got it fixed myself by forcefully pushing the pin back.
Twinkle Toes
Profile Joined May 2012
United States3605 Posts
August 24 2012 07:33 GMT
#1511
Kespa seem selfish on this.
Gom tried to bend to them but I think they know they have the power know.
Let's see who has more influence on the korean sc2 scene.
Bisu - INnoVation - Dark - Rogue - Stats
Fionn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States23455 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-24 07:36:41
August 24 2012 07:36 GMT
#1512
GSL 4: September - Late October
GSL 5: November - December 2nd (IPL5)
Blizzard Cup: December

GSL S1 2013 should begin the second week of January.

So we'll see if KeSPA changes their mind by the start of 2013. Until then, guess we'll just have to hope a GSL player and KeSPA player draw each other at MLG.
Writerhttps://twitter.com/FionnOnFire
SynapseSC
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States86 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-24 07:59:45
August 24 2012 07:42 GMT
#1513
At some point, the players are going to have to be pissed when they realize the governing body is telling them "No, you can't go win any of that $100,000 IPL prize pool, no you can't win money at this MLG, no you can't go to IEM or Dreamhack and win more money, no you can't go to Homestory Cup and win money, and no you can't go participate in Code S and win a ton more money." Until then I doubt KeSPA changes unless Blizzard makes them or it hits their bottom line.

Their excuse is ridiculous, of course. Federation players have GSL, GSTL, OSL, WCS, WCG, and still hit all the international events even. They don't seem to have a problem avoiding shutting every single player out of an event because of conflicts.

None of this is surprising, but the players will eventually realize that they have more leverage than before because there's actual competition this time.
TheAmazombie
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States3714 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-24 08:00:01
August 24 2012 07:43 GMT
#1514
I can accept that the players are busy, but the issue is that these oh so busy players STILL wanted to try to play in the GSL and fully understand their schedule. This is still KeSPa controlling everything. I also don't care much for their attempt to make it sounds like it is GOMs fault.

I agree that sooner or later some of these big names from KeSPa are going to leave if KeSPa keeps then on such a tight leash for too long.
We think too much and feel too little. More than machinery, we need humanity. More than cleverness, we need kindness and gentleness. Without these qualities, life will be violent and all will be lost. -Charlie Chaplin
MisterTea
Profile Joined September 2010
United Kingdom1047 Posts
August 24 2012 07:46 GMT
#1515
-----------
KeSPA players will be presented at SC2 Proleague, OSL, WCG Korean representative qualifiers, WCS and MLG online matches, MLG final invitational. Their regular week schedule will be 4 days for Proleague, 2 days for OSL, 2days for MLG cross matches.

Therefore, KeSPA decided not to join GSL Season 4 because of their busy schedule.
------

Sounds like a bullshit excuse tbh
Why do they not let the player choose which event they want to participate in
Weirdkid
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Singapore2431 Posts
August 24 2012 07:47 GMT
#1516
Haha kinda not related but related in some way, the picture that thisisgame uses for this incident is pretty cool looking.

[image loading]
"Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest you be like him yourself." - Proverbs 26:4
oBlade
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States6296 Posts
August 24 2012 07:50 GMT
#1517
On August 24 2012 15:56 hunts wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2012 15:53 Dodgin wrote:
So I guess that confirms Kespa won't be in the GSL at all this year unless season 5 was a typo.

On August 24 2012 15:50 hunts wrote:
"About the future plan for joining GSL, KeSPA told “We don’t join GSL Season 5 because there has not been enough discussion prior to the event. If we discuss several issues prior to the event enough and if it could make some synergy with Proleague, we will join the future GSL.”

Yeah fuck kespa. I say now is a good time to throw the shit storm that the SC2 community is known for. Email/tweet/mail/call etc.. all the KESPA companies that are international, tell them you will boycot them until the end of time for being associated with kespa, have the koreans go apeshit, everyone go apeshit on KESPA and all the organizations that support it.


careful, danger~~~

try not to start a witch hunt


I hate the whole witch hunt thing that TL and especially reddit seems to have gotten fond of lately, but I think this is the one time it's needed. Make every KESPA companies life a living hell, make them lose business until they go bankrupt or disolve and make SC2 a better place by going away.

What the fuck would be better about the loss of 8 professional Starcraft teams?
"I read it. You know how to read, you ignorant fuck?" - Andy Dufresne
achan1058
Profile Joined February 2012
1091 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-24 07:57:57
August 24 2012 07:53 GMT
#1518
On August 24 2012 16:50 oBlade wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2012 15:56 hunts wrote:
On August 24 2012 15:53 Dodgin wrote:
So I guess that confirms Kespa won't be in the GSL at all this year unless season 5 was a typo.

On August 24 2012 15:50 hunts wrote:
"About the future plan for joining GSL, KeSPA told “We don’t join GSL Season 5 because there has not been enough discussion prior to the event. If we discuss several issues prior to the event enough and if it could make some synergy with Proleague, we will join the future GSL.”

Yeah fuck kespa. I say now is a good time to throw the shit storm that the SC2 community is known for. Email/tweet/mail/call etc.. all the KESPA companies that are international, tell them you will boycot them until the end of time for being associated with kespa, have the koreans go apeshit, everyone go apeshit on KESPA and all the organizations that support it.


careful, danger~~~

try not to start a witch hunt


I hate the whole witch hunt thing that TL and especially reddit seems to have gotten fond of lately, but I think this is the one time it's needed. Make every KESPA companies life a living hell, make them lose business until they go bankrupt or disolve and make SC2 a better place by going away.

What the fuck would be better about the loss of 8 professional Starcraft teams?

Personally, I think it's at the point where it's open war already. Teams will be lost no matter what. It's just who's teams.

Edit: I am still waiting to see what the federation will do, since this doesn't not bode well for them.
bo1b
Profile Blog Joined August 2012
Australia12814 Posts
August 24 2012 07:58 GMT
#1519
I wonder what the reason will be in 2013.
rysecake
Profile Joined October 2010
United States2632 Posts
August 24 2012 07:59 GMT
#1520
On August 24 2012 16:05 MCXD wrote:
Welp, KeSPA sucks. The sooner they become a non-factor the better.

EDIT: Infact, can't we just ignore them? Just pretend they don't exist and continue on just as things were 3 months ago. If they don't want to participate in the GSL or any foreign leagues, then they simply don't deserve the attention *shrug*. They're just a side attraction that should not have any impact anywhere else.


As much as I hate kespa, we cannot ignore them. They hold an enormous talent pool at their disposal.
The Notorious Winkles
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