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IPL5 to host Code S Ro8 to the Grand Finals - Page 33

Forum Index > SC2 General
818 CommentsPost a Reply
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iNcontroL *
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
USA29055 Posts
August 12 2012 20:30 GMT
#641
1. Stephano
2. Naniwa
3. Major
4. Thorzain
5. Sase

I'd say if Ret was in form and not mind fucked atm he'd be #5 other notables would be Mana, nerchio and idra.

Can't wait though.. should be awesome. I hope they do the coach thing for the team as well
Troxle
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
United States486 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-12 20:45:39
August 12 2012 20:33 GMT
#642
I can see team Taeja takin' it over the foreigners, but I guess here is to foreign hope!

On August 13 2012 05:30 iNcontroL wrote:
1. Stephano
2. Naniwa
3. Major
4. Thorzain
5. Sase

I'd say if Ret was in form and not mind fucked atm he'd be #5 other notables would be Mana, nerchio and idra.

Can't wait though.. should be awesome. I hope they do the coach thing for the team as well


1. Stephano
2. NaNiwa
3. Nerchio
4. MaNa
5. Kas

Notables: Scarlett, Ret, SaSe, ThorZaIN, BlinG, Beastyqt

Would be my guess or is that the official list Mr. iNcontroL?

Korean List be:

1. Taeja
2. Nestea
3. MC
4. Genius
5. Mvp

Possibly? Notables bein' Squirtle, MarineKing, Dongraegu, Puzzle, PartinG, Seed, Polt, PuMa, HerO, aLive
If you're homophobic, you're probably ugly, so don't worry about a gay guy coming onto you. - jarrydesque
chris5180
Profile Joined July 2012
198 Posts
August 12 2012 20:36 GMT
#643
i want to go to this :/
markrevival
Profile Joined January 2012
United States222 Posts
August 12 2012 20:37 GMT
#644
I think the discussion about MajOr is interesting because I would be pretty comfortable betting money that he would out-perform every foreign terran but Thorzain in at least 2 out of 3 tournaments. The problem is he never attends any tournaments because he, until now, had no sponsor and no team for the last several months. Since this tournament is still some time away, we will get to see how MajOr does at WCS Americas and then WCS world(if he qualifies) and then we can have a better say. But for now, my 5 foreigners would be:

1. Stephano(Z) France
2. NaNiwa(P) Sweden
3. Thorzain(T) Sweden
4. VortiX(Z) Spain
5. MajOr(T) Mexico

as far as Ret - I would have voted ret ahead of VortiX as a second zerg until the last few months wear VortiX has been on tear and Ret has been pretty bad. everyone was cringing at his matches yesterday vs IM in SF
Shiori
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
3815 Posts
August 12 2012 20:38 GMT
#645
On August 13 2012 05:30 iNcontroL wrote:
1. Stephano
2. Naniwa
3. Major
4. Thorzain
5. Sase

I'd say if Ret was in form and not mind fucked atm he'd be #5 other notables would be Mana, nerchio and idra.

Can't wait though.. should be awesome. I hope they do the coach thing for the team as well

It is extremely vindicating to know that you share my rough opinions on the top foreigners .

Yay!
RaelSan
Profile Joined February 2012
Belgium223 Posts
August 12 2012 20:40 GMT
#646
On August 13 2012 04:18 jmbthirteen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2012 04:10 Shiori wrote:
On August 13 2012 04:00 RaelSan wrote:
On August 13 2012 03:47 Shiori wrote:
On August 13 2012 03:46 RaelSan wrote:
On August 13 2012 03:20 Shiori wrote:
On August 13 2012 03:16 Xoronius wrote:
On August 13 2012 03:13 Shiori wrote:
On August 13 2012 03:09 Xoronius wrote:
On August 13 2012 02:54 Whitewing wrote:
[quote]

I think Ret is better than Scarlett. Probably should have Major up there in place of Nerchio though, Nerchio is good but I don't think he's top 5. Major is a prick but he's good.


Nerchio is better than both, Ret and Major. He recently won HSC, beating MC and destroying Yonghwa. Major is ofc. an option, but guys like Vortix, SortOf, MaNa or Socke should be considered as well.

Major is easily better than any of the other players in your post, including Nerchio.


Like I said, Nerchio won HSC, beating a top korean. What has major done, to be considered on par with him? Or MaNa, who recently won a DH?

It doesn't matter. If you watch their play, it's obvious who the better player is. Major wasn't even at HSC. Nerchio's games against MC were pretty bizarre and nonstandard, in addition. It's hard to say he has Stephano level ZvP on the basis of those games. Mana got 3-0d no contest out of TSL by a decent but unexceptional Korean Terran...

Major is consistent and plays a solid style that seems to be competitive against top Koreans.


Or you can just say that in your opinion Major is better than Nerchio, because it may be true ( even if I don't think so ) but it really isn't " obvious " as you said, and that is a fact.

No, it really is obvious. I feel like a lot of the Nerchio/Mana/Vortix love is a Euro thing, so I can't relate. I honestly don't find any of them particularly amazing. Major is the only one I've seen play and develop a solid style born out of living in Korea (aside from Naniwa, Stephano, Sase etc).



Even if you're confident that you are right, it's still your opinion, it also took me time to accept that

Again, I don't really think skill is a matter of opinion, but that's for another thread.

skill isn't a matter of opinion. perceived skill is a matter of opinion.



I was going to write that, then I told to myself this discussion is nonsense, but still happy that you spoke my mind ( with the same exact words) !
I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it
Champloo
Profile Joined August 2011
Germany1850 Posts
August 12 2012 20:41 GMT
#647
Why would anyone put Sase or Major in the top 5? What have they done compared to Nerchio, Stephano, Mana, Thorzain (all won a major tournament recently) or Naniwa (top 8 in the last 2 GSLs)?

But knowing IPL, Quantic Illusion will be one of them for sure, LOL
gedatsu
Profile Joined December 2011
1286 Posts
August 12 2012 20:45 GMT
#648
On August 13 2012 05:30 iNcontroL wrote:
1. Stephano
2. Naniwa
3. Major
4. Thorzain
5. Sase

I'd say if Ret was in form and not mind fucked atm he'd be #5 other notables would be Mana, nerchio and idra.

Can't wait though.. should be awesome. I hope they do the coach thing for the team as well

I know you're biased and all and that's ok, but really? Idra is... not on my list right now.
FabledIntegral
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States9232 Posts
August 12 2012 20:45 GMT
#649
On August 13 2012 05:41 Champloo wrote:
Why would anyone put Sase or Major in the top 5? What have they done compared to Nerchio, Stephano, Mana, Thorzain (all won a major tournament recently) or Naniwa (top 8 in the last 2 GSLs)?

But knowing IPL, Quantic Illusion will be one of them for sure, LOL


Have you seem Major play? He's been in Korea and not attending foreign tournaments, so he couldn't have accomplished anything. But there are also tons of Koreans that don't travel either, are you going to say they're nothing notable either? The reason SaSe and Major aren't accomplishing as much is because they aren't traveling as much (notably Major).

I'd probably put Major over Mana.
StarVe
Profile Joined June 2011
Germany13591 Posts
August 12 2012 20:48 GMT
#650
On August 13 2012 05:45 FabledIntegral wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2012 05:41 Champloo wrote:
Why would anyone put Sase or Major in the top 5? What have they done compared to Nerchio, Stephano, Mana, Thorzain (all won a major tournament recently) or Naniwa (top 8 in the last 2 GSLs)?

But knowing IPL, Quantic Illusion will be one of them for sure, LOL


Have you seem Major play? He's been in Korea and not attending foreign tournaments, so he couldn't have accomplished anything. But there are also tons of Koreans that don't travel either, are you going to say they're nothing notable either? The reason SaSe and Major aren't accomplishing as much is because they aren't traveling as much (notably Major).

I'd probably put Major over Mana.

SaSe is at like every major tournament.
iNcontroL *
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
USA29055 Posts
August 12 2012 20:49 GMT
#651
On August 13 2012 05:45 gedatsu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2012 05:30 iNcontroL wrote:
1. Stephano
2. Naniwa
3. Major
4. Thorzain
5. Sase

I'd say if Ret was in form and not mind fucked atm he'd be #5 other notables would be Mana, nerchio and idra.

Can't wait though.. should be awesome. I hope they do the coach thing for the team as well

I know you're biased and all and that's ok, but really? Idra is... not on my list right now.


Still one of the best ZvT's and has a good ZvZ. Obvious weakness in ZvP. He has more experience in big matches than almost anyone you can mention and he has more accomplishments than almost anyone you can mention. IdrA hating is all the rage right now (get the pun?) but he is still one of the best. Yup, even in 2012 where the numbers have fallen off dramatically. He still competes with the absolute best.
mememolly
Profile Joined December 2011
4765 Posts
August 12 2012 20:50 GMT
#652
On August 13 2012 05:45 FabledIntegral wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2012 05:41 Champloo wrote:
Why would anyone put Sase or Major in the top 5? What have they done compared to Nerchio, Stephano, Mana, Thorzain (all won a major tournament recently) or Naniwa (top 8 in the last 2 GSLs)?

But knowing IPL, Quantic Illusion will be one of them for sure, LOL


Have you seem Major play? He's been in Korea and not attending foreign tournaments, so he couldn't have accomplished anything. But there are also tons of Koreans that don't travel either, are you going to say they're nothing notable either? The reason SaSe and Major aren't accomplishing as much is because they aren't traveling as much (notably Major).

I'd probably put Major over Mana.


for all Major's korean time he hasn't done anything, he seems to just be living off his korean training hype atm
Champloo
Profile Joined August 2011
Germany1850 Posts
August 12 2012 20:51 GMT
#653
On August 13 2012 05:45 FabledIntegral wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2012 05:41 Champloo wrote:
Why would anyone put Sase or Major in the top 5? What have they done compared to Nerchio, Stephano, Mana, Thorzain (all won a major tournament recently) or Naniwa (top 8 in the last 2 GSLs)?

But knowing IPL, Quantic Illusion will be one of them for sure, LOL


Have you seem Major play? He's been in Korea and not attending foreign tournaments, so he couldn't have accomplished anything. But there are also tons of Koreans that don't travel either, are you going to say they're nothing notable either? The reason SaSe and Major aren't accomplishing as much is because they aren't traveling as much (notably Major).

I'd probably put Major over Mana.


I've seen Major a lot lately and he's definetly top 3 foreign terran atm, but for a tournament like this you really shouldn't pick him over people who won a major tournament within the last 3 months. There's just no evidence that he's better than these 5 (Mana, Nerchio, Stephano, Thorzain, Naniwa).

And Sase travels A LOT to tournaments. He just isn't good enough.
Shiori
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
3815 Posts
August 12 2012 20:52 GMT
#654
On August 13 2012 05:49 iNcontroL wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2012 05:45 gedatsu wrote:
On August 13 2012 05:30 iNcontroL wrote:
1. Stephano
2. Naniwa
3. Major
4. Thorzain
5. Sase

I'd say if Ret was in form and not mind fucked atm he'd be #5 other notables would be Mana, nerchio and idra.

Can't wait though.. should be awesome. I hope they do the coach thing for the team as well

I know you're biased and all and that's ok, but really? Idra is... not on my list right now.


Still one of the best ZvT's and has a good ZvZ. Obvious weakness in ZvP. He has more experience in big matches than almost anyone you can mention and he has more accomplishments than almost anyone you can mention. IdrA hating is all the rage right now (get the pun?) but he is still one of the best. Yup, even in 2012 where the numbers have fallen off dramatically. He still competes with the absolute best.

I think if you could find a way to distill the Idra that shows up on his best days, bottle it, and inject him with it every time he plays, then he would 100% be a candidate for this tournament. It's weird. Sometimes he plays SO WELL but other times he just sort of rolls over and dies. And yeah, ZvP.

I'm sure he'll come back eventually though. He works hard and is talented.
rhs408
Profile Joined January 2011
United States904 Posts
August 12 2012 20:53 GMT
#655
On August 12 2012 09:00 Glurkenspurk wrote:
Well let's just hope they let GOM do all the production.

This was my first thought also.
FabledIntegral
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States9232 Posts
August 12 2012 20:53 GMT
#656
On August 13 2012 05:51 Champloo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2012 05:45 FabledIntegral wrote:
On August 13 2012 05:41 Champloo wrote:
Why would anyone put Sase or Major in the top 5? What have they done compared to Nerchio, Stephano, Mana, Thorzain (all won a major tournament recently) or Naniwa (top 8 in the last 2 GSLs)?

But knowing IPL, Quantic Illusion will be one of them for sure, LOL


Have you seem Major play? He's been in Korea and not attending foreign tournaments, so he couldn't have accomplished anything. But there are also tons of Koreans that don't travel either, are you going to say they're nothing notable either? The reason SaSe and Major aren't accomplishing as much is because they aren't traveling as much (notably Major).

I'd probably put Major over Mana.


I've seen Major a lot lately and he's definetly top 3 foreign terran atm, but for a tournament like this you really shouldn't pick him over people who won a major tournament within the last 3 months. There's just no evidence that he's better than these 5 (Mana, Nerchio, Stephano, Thorzain, Naniwa).

And Sase travels A LOT to tournaments. He just isn't good enough.


Hmm... maybe SaSe does travel to more tournaments than I thought in retrospect (especially seeing the last few posts saying so, I'm prob wrong^^), but in terms of skill who's a better Terran than Thorzain maybe?

Although I can agree with your argument that if you're going to have a tournament like this maybe you should pick people rather who have had a major tournament win, and thus I could understand Mana over Major.
mememolly
Profile Joined December 2011
4765 Posts
August 12 2012 20:54 GMT
#657
On August 13 2012 05:49 iNcontroL wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2012 05:45 gedatsu wrote:
On August 13 2012 05:30 iNcontroL wrote:
1. Stephano
2. Naniwa
3. Major
4. Thorzain
5. Sase

I'd say if Ret was in form and not mind fucked atm he'd be #5 other notables would be Mana, nerchio and idra.

Can't wait though.. should be awesome. I hope they do the coach thing for the team as well

I know you're biased and all and that's ok, but really? Idra is... not on my list right now.


Still one of the best ZvT's and has a good ZvZ. Obvious weakness in ZvP. He has more experience in big matches than almost anyone you can mention and he has more accomplishments than almost anyone you can mention. IdrA hating is all the rage right now (get the pun?) but he is still one of the best. Yup, even in 2012 where the numbers have fallen off dramatically. He still competes with the absolute best.


why would you have someone on a team whose big game "experience" has proven time and time again that he'll leave games before they are lost or even games that he has basically won, his mindset is god awful for a team
FabledIntegral
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States9232 Posts
August 12 2012 20:54 GMT
#658
On August 13 2012 05:49 iNcontroL wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2012 05:45 gedatsu wrote:
On August 13 2012 05:30 iNcontroL wrote:
1. Stephano
2. Naniwa
3. Major
4. Thorzain
5. Sase

I'd say if Ret was in form and not mind fucked atm he'd be #5 other notables would be Mana, nerchio and idra.

Can't wait though.. should be awesome. I hope they do the coach thing for the team as well

I know you're biased and all and that's ok, but really? Idra is... not on my list right now.


Still one of the best ZvT's and has a good ZvZ. Obvious weakness in ZvP. He has more experience in big matches than almost anyone you can mention and he has more accomplishments than almost anyone you can mention. IdrA hating is all the rage right now (get the pun?) but he is still one of the best. Yup, even in 2012 where the numbers have fallen off dramatically. He still competes with the absolute best.


Sure, he's a top gamer, but you'd put him in the top 8 of all foreigners? I think that's definitely stretching it.
Xoronius
Profile Joined July 2011
Germany6362 Posts
August 12 2012 20:56 GMT
#659
To the guys, who are saying, major would outperform all other foreign terrans, if he would be at tournaments or he could´nt achieve anything, because he does not attend tournaments: He did try to qualify for MLG Spring Arena, but lost to SeleCT and Rain and he tried to qualify for IEM, but lost to Minigun. So it is not the case, that he would´nt try to go there.
StarVe
Profile Joined June 2011
Germany13591 Posts
August 12 2012 20:58 GMT
#660
On August 13 2012 05:53 FabledIntegral wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2012 05:51 Champloo wrote:
On August 13 2012 05:45 FabledIntegral wrote:
On August 13 2012 05:41 Champloo wrote:
Why would anyone put Sase or Major in the top 5? What have they done compared to Nerchio, Stephano, Mana, Thorzain (all won a major tournament recently) or Naniwa (top 8 in the last 2 GSLs)?

But knowing IPL, Quantic Illusion will be one of them for sure, LOL


Have you seem Major play? He's been in Korea and not attending foreign tournaments, so he couldn't have accomplished anything. But there are also tons of Koreans that don't travel either, are you going to say they're nothing notable either? The reason SaSe and Major aren't accomplishing as much is because they aren't traveling as much (notably Major).

I'd probably put Major over Mana.


I've seen Major a lot lately and he's definetly top 3 foreign terran atm, but for a tournament like this you really shouldn't pick him over people who won a major tournament within the last 3 months. There's just no evidence that he's better than these 5 (Mana, Nerchio, Stephano, Thorzain, Naniwa).

And Sase travels A LOT to tournaments. He just isn't good enough.


Hmm... maybe SaSe does travel to more tournaments than I thought in retrospect (especially seeing the last few posts saying so, I'm prob wrong^^), but in terms of skill who's a better Terran than Thorzain maybe?

Although I can agree with your argument that if you're going to have a tournament like this maybe you should pick people rather who have had a major tournament win, and thus I could understand Mana over Major.


Foreigner Terrans are generally worse than foreigner Zergs and Protosses so why would you want to put more than one of them in a five man lineup anyway? Pick Thorzain if you want to, but then leave it at that.
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