EPTOrb Dismissed from Evil Geniuses Broadcasts - Page 73
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Alex is verbose, and you owe it to yourself (and the rest of us) to read the statement in its entirety. Remember, when making comments/claims to provide proper evidence, facts etc. Arguments based on incorrect assumptions, facts and straw men, will be dealt with swiftly. If in doubt, PM a mod or ask IRC. Do NOT spread misinformation, when in doubt, check your sources. In short, be smart. Alex comments on Idra: Orbs Statement: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=319038 Personal attacks against other posters in this thread will be met with a ban -- 14:20 KST | ||
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Nekovivie
United Kingdom2599 Posts
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ryndaris
263 Posts
On March 09 2012 17:19 Otolia wrote: While Mr. Garfield is taking responsibility, I'd like us to reflect a moment of people from our community who while seemingly on the good side of things this time are using methods that are no less despicable than orb's language : Kendon Williams' twitter If this horrible person is indeed the person who have sent EG sponsors letters of complain, we should put on the same spot as orb. Wow, that twitter account is just perfect in so many ways - a beautiful illustration of how internet drama works. And this guy... what a degenerate piece of trash. | ||
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legatus legionis
Netherlands559 Posts
I am way more ashamed by that than any foul languages usage. Sure he shouldn't have said it, but he's been saying it since the beta. It is only an issue because suddenly "netizens" make it into an issue. Overall this has been hugely abusive and manipulative. I'm ashamed for the internet. | ||
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Ansinjunger
United States2451 Posts
On March 09 2012 17:18 hysterial wrote: Uhh, you must know some pretty tame black guys then ^_^. I know of at least one black guy who finds the use of the word completely unacceptable. Just finding circumstances of black people "owning" or embracing the term doesn't make it okay for all those who don't. | ||
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schimmetje
Netherlands1104 Posts
(I apologize if anyone finds the term "wicker basket" offensive, which is of course the other side of the medal but really not that applicable in the case of such a historically laden term as the n-word.) In the meantime hopefully this is another small step on the path toward making our community a little more mature. And if not, at least I opened up TL to an intelligent post today, counting that one as a win. | ||
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oBlade
United States6118 Posts
On March 09 2012 17:39 Eschaton wrote: That may be because your entire family history isn't entwined with slavery at the hands of black people. Really, you should stop and think about that. That was what, eight generations ago? Nobody who witnessed that is alive now. It's even less in the minds of people than the Korean war. People are a lot more worried about what's going on in their lives today. | ||
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marttorn
Norway5211 Posts
On March 09 2012 17:37 ImmortalTofu wrote: Ok first nice image meme. But also, noone has provided incidents of him acting this way since his contract with EG, and so yes before this, it was his private stream and he wasn't representing anyone, except for MAYBE esv, as he casted their korean weekly, but afaik he wasn't payed or at least not alot. Well, it wasn't really a 'meme', just a silly joke based on a word he misspelled, but aside from that. Whether he was hired by EG or not at the time of these happenings, you can guarantee that if EG hears he has said it and has no reason to say he won't do it again, they have to investigate. In this case, he was found guilty. Therefore he is disassociated with EG and their broadcasts. | ||
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Ballistixz
United States1269 Posts
On March 09 2012 17:41 Ansinjunger wrote: I know of at least one black guy who finds the use of the word completely unacceptable. Just finding circumstances of black people "owning" or embracing the term doesn't make it okay for all those who don't. idk where u are from, but black ppl here call other black ppl nigga all the time and the meaning is the same as "dude" or "friend" or "homie". | ||
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Kfcnoob
United States296 Posts
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robhoward
79 Posts
Alex unintentionally hit on this with one of his reddit replies to posts telling others to report their disgust to EG sponsors; that this would damage eSports and make other sponsors less likely to jump on board. If you hire someone with a known history of behaviour capable of sparking this much outrage, you are putting eSports as a legitimate business model at risk. | ||
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ffdestiny
United States773 Posts
On March 09 2012 17:04 Eschaton wrote: I'm glad this happened. I see this word thrown around so much by ragers on ladder that at times I have questioned whether this community that seems in general to condone the usage of the "n-word" is one that I actually want to be a part of, whether I want to be associated with people like this. And here is the thing about its common usage that I see on BNet - it is absolutely meant in a racist way, to suggest that another player is bad because they might belong to a certain race. Call it a joke if you want, but that is just a lie to hide your racism behind. The condonement I see on BNet isn't even tacit - typically in a team game calling someone a n----- well elicit more than a few LOLs. When Orb acts that way in public - and make no mistake, when he is laddering as "Orb", he is acting as a public figure - it sends a message to the rest of the community that it is OK to do as he did. Great post Alex, and I'm glad that you stepped up to show some leadership here. Unfortunately there are many posters here who see no problem with a highly visible community member behaving as Orb did. From comments such as above ("I cannot respect your post. Expecting universal condemnation of behaviour that does not conform to your personal values strikes me as a terrible thing." - Hailplays) there are simply those in our community who think that racism is fine. To answer Hailplays, condemning racism in all its forms is not simply a belief of Alex Garfield's - it is a fundamental tenant of the global society in which we all live, and it's reasonable to expect nearly universal condemnation, excluding racists of course. It's leaning towards about 60/40 or 70/30 (against/for) the usage of the n-word, and any other word/slur/euphemism--at least in the Starcraft community. Basically the minority are either bigoted Destiny fanboys, or (by extension) Orb followers--they can't understand the point of the argument past logical fallacies, red herrings, and diversionary tactics enacted by said popular streamers/caster to either justifty, cope, self-delude, or project their white guilt unto a meaningless "context" debate. They cannot, and will not accept the denotation of a word, and the history of said racism. For them, life is black/white, and they see things only in true or false ways. | ||
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ShinobiX
Germany33 Posts
Don't get me wrong, using that kind of language is horribly stupid and there is no excuse for it. However, who the fuck is Orb? Celebrity status? Hardly. SC2 community overrating itself once again. Once he appears in People magazine or similar, call him celebrity and give his words that much weight. Right now it's a bunch of nerds hating one person and digging up old skeletons. And I bet my breakfast this morning that those exact same people behaved politically incorrect on the same level ("Fag" anyone? "Retard"? Choose your brand of choice when you were 16...) themselves once in a while. Because the internet is full of hypocrites. HTH HAND | ||
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sirkyan
211 Posts
On March 09 2012 17:39 Eschaton wrote: That may be because your entire family history isn't entwined with slavery at the hands of black people. Really, you should stop and think about that. I doubt every white person really thinks about that every single time they say nigger. I doubt every black person think about it either, wether they are called nigger or say it themselves. People really need to identify themselves as individuals and leave some shit behind. Oh well. I don't think it's necessary to call someone nigger, ever.. It's childish. But not moreso than calling someone gay, fag, idiot retarded, and so on. I suppose it's him being a pro-gamer though, and presenting yourself is very important. | ||
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Pasargadae
Korea (South)173 Posts
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quen
201 Posts
I am an EG fan, but I heavily disagree with this decision. | ||
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FadeOner
United States10 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/0cC89.gif) Use an ER and get sent to the ER. Nigga guys say it with me. Watup nigga, bitch nigga, fuck you nigga. Totally acceptable. ER oh the dreadful ER..... that will get you fired and demonized (by white people on the internet) | ||
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kAra
Germany1424 Posts
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tazzat
1 Post
I am not defending what orb said, nor do I believe you are doing the wrong thing by dismissing him, what I object to is the framing of this as rascism. Simply saying the word 'nigger' does not make you rascist, bigoted or hateful. It's a word, and if you don't want your employees using it, that is entirely up to you, but framing it in the context of rascism is intellectually dishonest. | ||
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Orracle
United States314 Posts
On March 09 2012 17:17 Rinnegan5 wrote: I think its a little bit of an overreaction. This said I also think that the Starcraft 2 community enjoys its "pitchforks" moment. Its like "hey guys we have another thing we can complain about or act crazy about". What happened now is that Mr Garfield bought into the pitchfork moment like Mr Chae did with Naniwa in the probe rush incident. I think I dont speak only for myself when I say that most ppl really enjoy these moments and grab some popcorn with it and add the occasional comment to fuel the fire. So congratulations for being another victim of our community Mr Garfield. Enjoy it! and all its drama. I agree it is a very big overraction. Again, I'll state I don't care for orb, but drama shouldn't be made around some one's future. I wasn't even aware he was casting for EG(or even with them), but it sounds like a lot of people enjoyed his casting. For him to get removed from EG, not because of lying to management, but because in a moment of anger he said some bad words is just silly. Lets look at SOTG, they encourage drinking(when there is obviously a large portion under 21), they swear, etc, yet this is good for "eSports". Now some one calls some one a nigger and suddenly people are enraged. Now I'm not opposed to what SOTG does, I just think it's hypocritical for people to put the spotlight on orb. | ||
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Leporello
United States2845 Posts
On March 09 2012 16:25 aka_star wrote: Alex hired a guy then found out he once said something stupid, now Alex fired him and stated he doesn't have to be a neo-nazi to be racist in Alex's eyes. Alex is essentially stating to the community, he will fire anyone for something they have said or done in the past at his own discretion. Even before being part of EG, so that shit you took in your diaper might come back to haunt you. So let me ask Alex, if a caster is not completely homosexual but tried a sexual act with the same gender and the community found out years later, Will they also be fired for being different? essentially what I am saying here is, how do we the community know what is acceptable to EG before we apply for a position. Can you please list your prejudiced. It's clear from the statement EG is discriminating against orb and a group of white people, EG has become the monster it wished to destroy. Why can't a neo-Nazi be a caster, player or able to join EG?... why must the community be funneled into a narrow band of mentality that EG wishes. Whats most shocking is, This however happened before joining EG, legal action should follow and you should be ashamed for imposing your beliefs on the community. I for one do not appreciated who I can or can't watch because they have a different political belief than EG's management, reminds me of CNN FOX... yawn. Complete moral relativism. The world gone mad. Yeah, what's wrong with neo-Nazis? Maybe hate and degradation are great things for society! You essentially compare being a homosexual in your post, to being a neo-nazi, based on the fact that they're both "different". Wow. Just wow. | ||
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