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Discussing the controversy and stating your opinions in a constructive way is fine, but there will be bans for any player/organization bashing without anything to substantiate it. |
On January 18 2012 15:25 Raambo11 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 15:23 CuSToM wrote:On January 18 2012 15:20 Bagration wrote:
Heart too? TSL seems to be on the verge of collapse. They are bleeding players too fast. This might drop them from the top tier of Korean teams. At this point they can barely fill a GSTL roster. Just like how TSL was on the verge of collapsing after Rain, Tester and Fruitdealer left. Just like how TSL was on the verge of collapsing after SangHo, Clide and JYP left. hmm... To be fair Alive is probably the best player yet to leave TSL, this will be a bad blow. Also I remembered that TSL was paying its players a salary back when FD was on the team so edited my earlier post, however its possible even probable that when the two most popular TSL players left their sponsorship support started to go down the drain.
Nope.
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On January 18 2012 15:29 VirgilSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 15:25 Raambo11 wrote:On January 18 2012 15:23 CuSToM wrote:On January 18 2012 15:20 Bagration wrote:
Heart too? TSL seems to be on the verge of collapse. They are bleeding players too fast. This might drop them from the top tier of Korean teams. At this point they can barely fill a GSTL roster. Just like how TSL was on the verge of collapsing after Rain, Tester and Fruitdealer left. Just like how TSL was on the verge of collapsing after SangHo, Clide and JYP left. hmm... To be fair Alive is probably the best player yet to leave TSL, this will be a bad blow. Also I remembered that TSL was paying its players a salary back when FD was on the team so edited my earlier post, however its possible even probable that when the two most popular TSL players left their sponsorship support started to go down the drain. Nope.
I was actually about to do that.LOL
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On January 18 2012 15:20 Phobbers wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 15:09 Arceus wrote:
I can see aLive going 0-4 this afternoon and soon disappearing without a trace. Thats what is happening with FD/Tester/Rain/Jyp/SangHo and Puma (forever Code B) to a lesser extent (Clide is another case)
I mean, thats what you get for leaving for cash and relaxing practice.
TSL is not doomed by any means To be fair, FD faded away far before leaving TSL. Also, Puma has indeed been Code B for quite some time, but he actually has only attempted the Code A qualifiers once if I recall, and I wouldn't say he is disappearing without a trace considering he ranks in at #5 of most prize money won in 2011 and that money has come from recent events.
Agreed, PuMa also came REALLY close to getting into Code A this season.
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On January 18 2012 15:29 VirgilSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 15:25 Raambo11 wrote:On January 18 2012 15:23 CuSToM wrote:On January 18 2012 15:20 Bagration wrote:
Heart too? TSL seems to be on the verge of collapse. They are bleeding players too fast. This might drop them from the top tier of Korean teams. At this point they can barely fill a GSTL roster. Just like how TSL was on the verge of collapsing after Rain, Tester and Fruitdealer left. Just like how TSL was on the verge of collapsing after SangHo, Clide and JYP left. hmm... To be fair Alive is probably the best player yet to leave TSL, this will be a bad blow. Also I remembered that TSL was paying its players a salary back when FD was on the team so edited my earlier post, however its possible even probable that when the two most popular TSL players left their sponsorship support started to go down the drain. Nope.
Exactly. Sponsors sign contracts when they enter sponsorships saying we will support you for X amount of time, or based on X amount of results. Unless there was a specific clause about this players, which is very doubtful, they wouldn't just drop their sponsorship... lol
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Is this guy gonna cry everytime one of his star players gets offered a better position?
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On January 18 2012 15:25 Raambo11 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 15:23 CuSToM wrote:On January 18 2012 15:20 Bagration wrote:
Heart too? TSL seems to be on the verge of collapse. They are bleeding players too fast. This might drop them from the top tier of Korean teams. At this point they can barely fill a GSTL roster. Just like how TSL was on the verge of collapsing after Rain, Tester and Fruitdealer left. Just like how TSL was on the verge of collapsing after SangHo, Clide and JYP left. hmm... To be fair Alive is probably the best player yet to leave TSL, this will be a bad blow. Also I remembered that TSL was paying its players a salary back when FD was on the team so edited my earlier post, however its possible even probable that when the two most popular TSL players left their sponsorship support started to go down the drain.
he isnt the best but he was vice captain when sangho was still on the team and captain after sangho left. He is basicly the pillar of the team in term of skill and motivation. Similar to MC leaving oGs, this is something unacceptable in korean culture.
Not even counting the fact that TSL has signed contract with every of their players after the tester FD incident. I believe legal issue is appropriate in this case. Unless fnatic come up with some good excuses soon, they gona have to pay for alive out of this. Blaming the middle man is the LAMEST excuse EVER in the business world, it shows that you are not in control of your own business and blindly trust a middle man to handle your money... WTF?
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United States23455 Posts
On January 18 2012 15:31 magnaflow wrote:
Is this guy gonna cry everytime one of his star players gets offered a better position?
He let Fnatic train in his house with his team. He tried to partner with Fnatic. Apparently the translator from Fnatic talked Alive into leaving TSL. Alive has a contract.
Anyone would be pissed if this happened. If the story is true, then Fnatic did pretty much the dirtiest thing you could ever do in e-sports. Do you think someone like FXOBoss would be okay with allowing another foreign team to practice with his team and then suddenly leave with Gumiho or Leenock in their back pocket?
Come on now.
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On January 18 2012 14:45 kineSiS- wrote:
Is there an actual contract that TSL has with Alive?
i'm sure coach Lee made sure all of his players were on contracts after the Puma incident
On January 18 2012 15:33 Fionn wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 15:31 magnaflow wrote:
Is this guy gonna cry everytime one of his star players gets offered a better position? He let Fnatic train in his house with his team. He tried to partner with Fnatic. Apparently the translator from Fnatic talked Alive into leaving TSL. Alive has a contract. Anyone would be pissed if this happened. If the story is true, then Fnatic did pretty much the dirtiest thing you could ever do in e-sports. Do you think someone like FXOBoss would be okay with allowing another foreign team to practice with his team and then suddenly leave with Gumiho or Leenock in their back pocket? Come on now.
very good point ^
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idk, I'll wait out a few hours before I make any haste decisiond. but if whats revealed to be true so far. Fnatic has lost one fan.
I really like mama bear though and have spoken to alive a few times, sad this had to happen.
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On January 18 2012 15:33 Fionn wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 15:31 magnaflow wrote:
Is this guy gonna cry everytime one of his star players gets offered a better position? He let Fnatic train in his house with his team. He tried to partner with Fnatic. Apparently the translator from Fnatic talked Alive into leaving TSL. Alive has a contract. Anyone would be pissed if this happened. If the story is true, then Fnatic did pretty much the dirtiest thing you could ever do in e-sports. Do you think someone like FXOBoss would be okay with allowing another foreign team to practice with his team and then suddenly leave with Gumiho or Leenock in their back pocket? Come on now.
No room in my house for another foreign team 
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If what's said is true, then Fnatic should just buy aLive's contract. This kind of smells like another weird merging of the Stephano coL-Mill situation and the EG PuMa scandal. What a way to start the year off.
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Can't wait for how Fnatic have to deal with this after they acquired Moon.
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clearing the facts from the drama posts from all the information I've collected so far about this issue:
1) Coach Lee is the owner/manager/coach of TSL. He is the ultimate authority in the team. It is impossible for a coach-management dispute unless he suffers from split personality syndrome -_-
2) The terms of the contract between aLive and TSL are known by nobody besides those 2. So stop the gossip about who's right and who's wrong. We can all wait for fnatic's statement regarding this issue to clarify on this matter, as well as an official statement from Coach Lee, if he makes one. Being furious and saying I'm taking you to court is one thing and then calmy recollecting your thoughts and giving a statement of the events that transpired is another thing.
3) There was NO fnatic player staying or training in the TSL house besides Rain. ToD is the only other fnatic player in Korea and he stays at the GOM house. The whole allegation that "we let them stay here and they poach our player" is unfounded in my opinion, as Rain was a ex-TSL player and regards Lee very highly and Coach Lee considers Rain almost like a son from what I've heard. There was no training going on in TSL house for fnatic players besides Rain. Talks of a partnership transpired by the whole "only signing was left and then they backed out and took aLive with them so the whole partnership was only a backdrop to poach aLive" seems highly exaggerated. There needs to be clarity on this issue as well.
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what kind of contract must this be that forbids you to talk to other teams?
i could meet with other companies for a job interview.. thats my business and i am free to do so...
i am very confused about the legal actions. and if my boss would say hes taking legal actions id be out of the office the moment i hear it. thats no healthy way to work/practice.
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On January 18 2012 15:37 hyperknight wrote:
3) There was NO fnatic player staying or training in the TSL house besides Rain. ToD is the only other fnatic player in Korea and he stays at the GOM house. The whole allegation that "we let them stay here and they poach our player" is unfounded in my opinion, as Rain was a ex-TSL player and regards Lee very highly and Coach Lee considers Rain almost like a son from what I've heard. There was no training going on in TSL house for fnatic players besides Rain. Talks of a partnership transpired by the whole "only signing was left and then they backed out and took aLive with them so the whole partnership was only a backdrop to poach aLive" seems highly exaggerated. There needs to be clarity on this issue as well.
ToD stayed in the Fnatic house for a short while (less than a week as it was more of a trial thing iirc but he was definately there for a period of time).
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On January 18 2012 15:33 Fionn wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 15:31 magnaflow wrote:
Is this guy gonna cry everytime one of his star players gets offered a better position? He let Fnatic train in his house with his team. He tried to partner with Fnatic. Apparently the translator from Fnatic talked Alive into leaving TSL. Alive has a contract. Anyone would be pissed if this happened. If the story is true, then Fnatic did pretty much the dirtiest thing you could ever do in e-sports. Do you think someone like FXOBoss would be okay with allowing another foreign team to practice with his team and then suddenly leave with Gumiho or Leenock in their back pocket? Come on now.
I'm going to wait on my judgement until there is facts that Alive was under contract. Poaching players is disrespectful, not only to the other team but the community. Having a black mark per say to your teams name, is going to make Fnatic a no-name Foreigner team. What Korean team would want to even think about partnering with a team who has a black mark about poaching?
But like I said, at this stage there isn't any facts that Alive was coerced to leave, and there isn't any facts that Alive was under a contract. Until they are released I'll -try- not have a judgement into this, but if they did.. ohh boy, this is going to become hell for Fnatic to clean up.
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On January 18 2012 15:37 hyperknight wrote:
clearing the facts from the drama posts from all the information I've collected so far about this issue:
1) Coach Lee is the owner/manager/coach of TSL. He is the ultimate authority in the team. It is impossible for a coach-management dispute unless he suffers from split personality syndrome -_-
2) The terms of the contract between aLive and TSL are known by nobody besides those 2. So stop the gossip about who's right and who's wrong. We can all wait for fnatic's statement regarding this issue to clarify on this matter, as well as an official statement from Coach Lee, if he makes one. Being furious and saying I'm taking you to court is one thing and then calmy recollecting your thoughts and giving a statement of the events that transpired is another thing.
3) There was NO fnatic player staying or training in the TSL house besides Rain. ToD is the only other fnatic player in Korea and he stays at the GOM house. The whole allegation that "we let them stay here and they poach our player" is unfounded in my opinion, as Rain was a ex-TSL player and regards Lee very highly and Coach Lee considers Rain almost like a son from what I've heard. There was no training going on in TSL house for fnatic players besides Rain. Talks of a partnership transpired by the whole "only signing was left and then they backed out and took aLive with them so the whole partnership was only a backdrop to poach aLive" seems highly exaggerated. There needs to be clarity on this issue as well.
ToD was in the TSL house for a period of time training.
EDIT: Typo
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On January 18 2012 15:39 MonkSEA wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 15:33 Fionn wrote:On January 18 2012 15:31 magnaflow wrote:
Is this guy gonna cry everytime one of his star players gets offered a better position? He let Fnatic train in his house with his team. He tried to partner with Fnatic. Apparently the translator from Fnatic talked Alive into leaving TSL. Alive has a contract. Anyone would be pissed if this happened. If the story is true, then Fnatic did pretty much the dirtiest thing you could ever do in e-sports. Do you think someone like FXOBoss would be okay with allowing another foreign team to practice with his team and then suddenly leave with Gumiho or Leenock in their back pocket? Come on now. I'm going to wait on my judgement until there is facts that Alive was under contract. Poaching players is disrespectful, not only to the other team but the community. Having a black mark per say to your teams name, is going to make Fnatic a no-name Foreigner team. What Korean team would want to even think about partnering with a team who has a black mark about poaching? But like I said, at this stage there isn't any facts that Alive was coerced to leave, and there isn't any facts that Alive was under a contract. Until they are released I'll -try- not have a judgement into this, but if they did.. ohh boy, this is going to become hell for Fnatic to clean up.
aLive was under contract. It's 100% fact.
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On January 18 2012 15:38 Shuffleus wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 15:37 hyperknight wrote:
3) There was NO fnatic player staying or training in the TSL house besides Rain. ToD is the only other fnatic player in Korea and he stays at the GOM house. The whole allegation that "we let them stay here and they poach our player" is unfounded in my opinion, as Rain was a ex-TSL player and regards Lee very highly and Coach Lee considers Rain almost like a son from what I've heard. There was no training going on in TSL house for fnatic players besides Rain. Talks of a partnership transpired by the whole "only signing was left and then they backed out and took aLive with them so the whole partnership was only a backdrop to poach aLive" seems highly exaggerated. There needs to be clarity on this issue as well.
ToD stayed in the Fnatic house for a short while(less than a week as it was more of a trial thing iirc but he was definately there for a period of time).
There is no fnatic house. I dont know what you're talking about. Tod stays at the GOM house with desrow and the other chaps from what I've colelcted so far.
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EPT
