• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 18:44
CEST 00:44
KST 07:44
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall9HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, Rogue, Classic, GuMiho0TL Team Map Contest #5: Presented by Monster Energy6
Community News
Flash Announces Hiatus From ASL51Weekly Cups (June 23-29): Reynor in world title form?12FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event16Esports World Cup 2025 - Final Player Roster16Weekly Cups (June 16-22): Clem strikes back1
StarCraft 2
General
Statistics for vetoed/disliked maps The SCII GOAT: A statistical Evaluation The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings How does the number of casters affect your enjoyment of esports? Esports World Cup 2025 - Final Player Roster
Tourneys
Korean Starcraft League Week 77 Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series [GSL 2025] Code S: Season 2 - Semi Finals & Finals $5,100+ SEL Season 2 Championship (SC: Evo)
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 480 Moths to the Flame Mutation # 479 Worn Out Welcome Mutation # 478 Instant Karma Mutation # 477 Slow and Steady
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Flash Announces Hiatus From ASL Player “Jedi” cheat on CSL Unit and Spell Similarities Help: rep cant save
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL20] Grand Finals - Sunday 20:00 CET Small VOD Thread 2.0 [BSL20] GosuLeague RO16 - Tue & Wed 20:00+CET
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers I am doing this better than progamers do.
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile What do you want from future RTS games? Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Trading/Investing Thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Games Industry And ATVI
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2025 Football Thread NBA General Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Blogs
Culture Clash in Video Games…
TrAiDoS
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
Blog #2
tankgirl
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 611 users

Why SC2 should not be getting more BW-y - Page 3

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 11 12 13 Next All
The Void
Profile Joined May 2010
Germany428 Posts
October 26 2011 01:56 GMT
#41
no problem with copy things from bw if they worked great.

it's not about a different game, it's just about make a fucking good eSport-Titel.
it is hard to be an atheist and deal with day9 (╯°□°)╯︵┻━┻ also i stole this too ♞...o_O..oh..and his buddies ♚♛♜♝♟http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=295038 don't trust the suits...
Zerksys
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States569 Posts
October 26 2011 01:58 GMT
#42
Honestly the only reason I don't play BW is because of the smaller community and the lack of tournaments. If the starcraft community would switch back to brood war I would in a heartbeat.

That being said I agree with you to an extent. Sc2 should not be 100 percent like brood war. Have you seen the post about the sc2 pro mod April fools joke? Look it up if you have not because there are some very good points that are made in the posts. Namely, that recreating brood war is not what we should seek to do with sc2. In this you are correct, but I have to severely critique you here for your lack of insight beyond this point.

You seem to be annoyed at the fact that people are trying to make sc2 more like brood war and you believe that these people are all trying to bring back some sort of lost nostalgia by bringing back the brood war user interface (12 unit selection, shitty pathing, one building selection, etc...) and by bringing back the units (lurker, deflier, corsair, etc...)

In reality it is you that is completely missing the point and you show this by IMO what is a completely anti BW post dressed up to not appear so bad. What people are trying to recreate by mentioning BW is the magic of the game that seems to have been lost upon sc2. Many of you are going to say that you feel just as much magic when watching an sc2 game as watching a brood war game. Let me tell you this: If you've been an active participant in both scenes (active participant meaning you were as active in bw as you are now in sc2), then I challenge one person here to tell me that sc2 has the same magic that BW has. What's wrong with wanting this back?

To answer your question of why more people play sc2 than played BW I have this to say. I'm of the opinion that the reason that sc2 is more popular is because of a combination of 3 factors: easy unit control, the battle.net ladder, and critical mass.

1. Easy unit control - no explaination necessary. Easier unit control makes the game easier to play. Making a less steep learning curve. This is one of the things that Sc2 got right over BW.

2. Battle.net ladder - Always winning 50 percent of the time is nice because it makes you feel that you're really good at something. If I logged onto Iccup and played right now I'd loose 90 percent of my games. People don't like to loose all the time.

3. Critical mass: Sc2 has enough fans now that the whole "friends tell other friends" concept is now in place.

Don't get me wrong. I love this game, but something about it just doesn't feel right. I can't put my finger on it, but I think it has something to do with the fact that armies just don't feel big any more. When I play with a maxed 200/200 army I feel like I'm playing with a warcraft III TFT 100/100 army. Sc2 got a lot of things right that BW didn't - I agree with this 100 percent. But there are certain elements that BW got right that shouldn't have been taken out of the game.
What's that probe doing there? It's a scout. You mean one of those flying planes? No....
Zamkis
Profile Joined July 2009
Canada114 Posts
October 26 2011 01:59 GMT
#43
Why you would want the sequel to one of the greatest game of all time NOT have most of its best features is beyond me. BW was amazing, and trying to keep what made it so good should be a priority. The questions were right on spot. Bring back the Starcraft in Starcraft 2.
Destruction is a work of an afternoon, Creation is a work of a lifetime.
The Void
Profile Joined May 2010
Germany428 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-26 02:08:18
October 26 2011 01:59 GMT
#44
try it this way:

if you have a great race-game with great physics...
would you ruin the physics in his successor just to have a different game?

no problem with copying things from bw if they were great.
there is no need to invent a totally new game. if you want new units no problem but they must work at some point in time. i like that they are testing but they shouldnt lose the track.


for exsample the cliff mechanics are still a bit broken in sc2. if they would change it in the way it was in bw this would actually ADD more tactical deepness. this is a case where they made something different for no reason and its bad... so..
it is hard to be an atheist and deal with day9 (╯°□°)╯︵┻━┻ also i stole this too ♞...o_O..oh..and his buddies ♚♛♜♝♟http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=295038 don't trust the suits...
BrosephBrostar
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States445 Posts
October 26 2011 02:01 GMT
#45
On October 26 2011 09:56 opisska wrote:
But here comes my question: what is the point of recreating something, even if it was good? BW is still a perfectly working piece of software, with servers to play on and a large playerbase. What is the point of having another game very similar to it, when we already do have BW?


Because BW has basically been thrown under a bus and a lot of BW fans feel the only possibility of seeing more BW is by having SC2 become BW++.


On October 26 2011 09:56 opisska wrote:
The general success of SC2 is given by the fact, that it is simpler to play on a reasonable (whatever that means for you) level than BW. Thanks to this fact, more non-koreans can really enjoy playing it and more non-koreans can enjoy watching other non-koreans play it. (Wait, OP, are you really that simple-minded? No, I am not, but I think that it is unnecessary to explain this statement with political correct words. Everyone gets the point, right?). It leads to SC2 lacking some aspects of BW but also filling some that BW never had - namely a vivid, lively western ESPORTS scene.


Being easier might make it more popular as a game, but that has little bearing on how popular it is as a spectator event. There are tons of fat and unathletic people who watch regular sports. You're basically arguing for the WNBA, and we all know no one watches women's basketball. I'd also like to point out that the western SC2 scene only really took off after tournaments started inviting Korean players.
red4ce
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States7313 Posts
October 26 2011 02:02 GMT
#46
On October 26 2011 10:05 neSix wrote:
I think you're missing the point of those arguments: It's not the game itself we wish to copy, but rather it's the characteristics that made the game so great that we hope to see more of in SC2.

I don't think the (legitimate) goal for anyone is to mimic Brood War. Instead, I think it's to use a game that we loved a benchmark for comparison. It's not that we want the game to be identical, but rather we would like the sequel to make use of aspects that we found exciting, such as space control, drawn-out, spaced-out large battles, the ability to turn an advantage into a victory outright as opposed to just expanding, etc.


Pretty much this. SC2 fans always talk about how SC2 isn't Brood War, yet every time we see a game with BW characteristics (lots of back and forth small engagements, multipronged harass, sick marine splits, insane multitasking) the games get 98% recommended votes. Whether you like to admit it or not, you DO want SC2 to be more BW-esque, just not BW 2.0.
DarkRise
Profile Joined November 2010
1644 Posts
October 26 2011 02:03 GMT
#47
I always thought that sc2 is a different game NOT BW. I'm annoyed for those people who keep saying BW is better and more skilled whilst playing sc2 themselves. BW is past and it will remain there just like other classic games. It thanks to these games that games evolve to what is it now and not to mimic or copy the originals.
lololol
Profile Joined February 2006
5198 Posts
October 26 2011 02:03 GMT
#48
On October 26 2011 10:54 Redmark wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 26 2011 10:39 lololol wrote:
On October 26 2011 10:38 Probulous wrote:
On October 26 2011 10:33 lololol wrote:
So because BW exists, SC2 should be as different as possible? What kind of an argument is that?

Since BW was great and balanced, I guess SC2 should be terrible and imbalanced, right?
Since if you tried to make it great and balanced it would be "BWy" and we can't have that, right?


Nice hyperbole you have there.

How is that even close to what people are saying. According to your logic, we either have a BW remake or a game that has no resemblance to BW at all. All the OP is saying is that this game is different. It didn't have to be but it is. There is no point trying to make things the same as BW because the game is not BW. Yes some things have been incorporated but not everything. There is a middle ground here.


The hyperbole is not from my side, nobody wants SC2 to be a rerelease of BW.

That in itself is hyperbole. There is a minority of people who explicitly say that they want this, and a larger group who always clamor for lurkers, reavers, scourge, old high ground, tank AI etc.


People want these, because there are better than what we have right now, they don't want an exact copy of BW, because they already bought one years ago, they just want the stuff that is better.
You know, they want a game that is improved and better, not one that is different, if they want one that is different, they can buy a million other cheap bad rts games, which believe me are all very different from BW.
I'll call Nada.
Fighter
Profile Joined August 2010
Korea (South)1531 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-26 02:11:36
October 26 2011 02:08 GMT
#49
On October 26 2011 10:05 neSix wrote:
I think you're missing the point of those arguments: It's not the game itself we wish to copy, but rather it's the characteristics that made the game so great that we hope to see more of in SC2.

I don't think the (legitimate) goal for anyone is to mimic Brood War. Instead, I think it's to use a game that we loved a benchmark for comparison. It's not that we want the game to be identical, but rather we would like the sequel to make use of aspects that we found exciting, such as space control, drawn-out, spaced-out large battles, the ability to turn an advantage into a victory outright as opposed to just expanding, etc.


Yep, this guy's pretty much spot on.

There's certain things that make BW not only fun to play, but a lot of fun to watch as a spectator sport. Just off the top of my head, here's some things that make BW so much fun to watch:

Dropships and Shuttles trying to evade scourge

I mean, HOW much fun is this whole scenario?? The scourge just BARELY catching up, the commentators freaking out, WILL IT GET AWAY?? WILL IT GET KILLED?? So much fun. There's nothing quite like that in sc2. If a drop gets spotted early it's usually more of an issue of whether or not the player can respond correctly, which is interesting, and entertaining, but not edge of my chair exciting the way scourge chases are. This isn't always the case, but come on, scourge chases happened all the time in BW, and they were awesome.

Reaver drops and workers trying to run away
This is the same kinda thing. It takes good reaction speed to move your workers fast enough, which is technically impressive, but then watching the scarab chase the workers, wondering how many kills it can get... it just builds so much tension and it's SO exciting. And once again, there's nothing quite like it in sc2.

Hold position lurkers
The zerg player burrows his lurkers in an interesting spot. The terran doesn't suspect. A mass of marines move out. They're getting closer to the lurkers. The terran has no idea but the crowd is freaking out. Is he going to move forward? Will the zerg player wait until JUST the right moment? This is actually something sc2 kind of DID mimic, what with burrowed banelings. Is it is as good? Maybe. Maybe even better.

I think you get my point. I'm not saying sc2 needs scourge and reavers, but what it does need are units that create interesting and entertaining scenarios like what I've described. Sc2 is probably going to be fun to play no matter what, but the difference between how fun it is to watch a player micro roaches, and how fun it is to watch a player micro a shuttle with a reaver, is something that makes a HUGE difference to the spectators.

It's not the specific units from BW that I want to see moved to SC2, it's the design philosophy. Part of what made BW so good was that it had units that could do amazing things when micro'd, and engagements rewarded intelligent use of geography and tactics (i.e. no deathballs).

Edit: I don't want to come off as someone who's knocking SC2, because SC2 does A LOT of things right. I mean, I went to MLG Columbus, I love the game and it's only getting better and better. I just want to point out what could be added to make it the best it CAN be.
For Aiur???
The Void
Profile Joined May 2010
Germany428 Posts
October 26 2011 02:09 GMT
#50
On October 26 2011 11:03 lololol wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 26 2011 10:54 Redmark wrote:
On October 26 2011 10:39 lololol wrote:
On October 26 2011 10:38 Probulous wrote:
On October 26 2011 10:33 lololol wrote:
So because BW exists, SC2 should be as different as possible? What kind of an argument is that?

Since BW was great and balanced, I guess SC2 should be terrible and imbalanced, right?
Since if you tried to make it great and balanced it would be "BWy" and we can't have that, right?


Nice hyperbole you have there.

How is that even close to what people are saying. According to your logic, we either have a BW remake or a game that has no resemblance to BW at all. All the OP is saying is that this game is different. It didn't have to be but it is. There is no point trying to make things the same as BW because the game is not BW. Yes some things have been incorporated but not everything. There is a middle ground here.


The hyperbole is not from my side, nobody wants SC2 to be a rerelease of BW.

That in itself is hyperbole. There is a minority of people who explicitly say that they want this, and a larger group who always clamor for lurkers, reavers, scourge, old high ground, tank AI etc.


People want these, because there are better than what we have right now, they don't want an exact copy of BW, because they already bought one years ago, they just want the stuff that is better.
You know, they want a game that is improved and better, not one that is different, if they want one that is different, they can buy a million other cheap bad rts games, which believe me are all very different from BW.

nailed it!
thx
it is hard to be an atheist and deal with day9 (╯°□°)╯︵┻━┻ also i stole this too ♞...o_O..oh..and his buddies ♚♛♜♝♟http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=295038 don't trust the suits...
Angra
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States2652 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-26 02:10:50
October 26 2011 02:10 GMT
#51
On October 26 2011 10:39 R0YAL wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 26 2011 10:29 Angra wrote:
On October 26 2011 10:05 neSix wrote:
I think you're missing the point of those arguments: It's not the game itself we wish to copy, but rather it's the characteristics that made the game so great that we hope to see more of in SC2.

I don't think the (legitimate) goal for anyone is to mimic Brood War. Instead, I think it's to use a game that we loved a benchmark for comparison. It's not that we want the game to be identical, but rather we would like the sequel to make use of aspects that we found exciting, such as space control, drawn-out, spaced-out large battles, the ability to turn an advantage into a victory outright as opposed to just expanding, etc.



Exactly.



A little bit off topic, but personally I think the one absolute biggest difference that makes SC2 feel so different (and not as likable to many people) from BW isn't in the units at all, but rather, the fact that unit hitboxes/sizes are SO TINY compared to BW. This makes a 200/200 army able to slip through choke points, walk up ramps, and die to aoe attacks in a matter of seconds. It was completely different in BW and it DEFINITELY was what allowed such powerful spells to exist, and allowed map control to be a much bigger deal, because large armies took much longer to travel around the map no matter what race.

The sad thing is this will never happen because Blizzard will never change the way their game works. They will only ever change numbers, and it makes me sad.

Size has no influence with this. In BW the units take a path and takes into consideration all of the other units in its way, so the unit would take the fastest path as if the other units were a part of terrain. This caused units to naturally spread out more because they had to find a path around the other units. In SC2 they take the fastest path regardless of where other units are, and even push units out of the way. Since all of the units are going straight to a location, they bunch up.


Most ramps in BW could only fit 1 unit at a time though, too. Other units physically couldn't get by if a unit was on hold position at the time. It takes about 3-4 units to do the same thing in most SC2 ramps.

Anyway regardless of how it worked, it had a really huge impact on how the game worked, and it's a big reason why SC2 feels and plays so differently.
Fuhrmaaj
Profile Joined January 2011
167 Posts
October 26 2011 02:12 GMT
#52
For me, I welcomed WoL and the simplification of repetitive tasks. I'm thinking specifically about automining, multiple building selection, and infinite size control groups which was not possible in BW. The unit pathing is definitely much better in WoL and there aren't discussion about "stupid units," regarding the unit's AI (like dragoons and scarabs in BW). All of those changes, I like.

Other than that, I'd rather be playing BW to be perfectly honest.The control in BW allows for many micro techniques and the distinction between micro players and macro players was very large. For example, you could control mutas in such a way that they constantly darting in and attacked then left without slowing down. This was crucial when sniping marines because you would significantly reduce the amount of damage you sustained. There was also no delay for firing animations (for the most part, I'm looking at you Valkyrie), so if you had one more range than your opponent then you wouldn't need to suffer any damage while using scoot and shoot micro.

Map control and long-term planning was rewarded much better in BW as well. You could place spider mines around the map and later siege up near those positions and be largely protected from Protoss gateway units. This defined your pushing paths and it was very difficult for Terran when all of their mine fields were cleaned up with Dragoons and an observer because it drastically limited your map control and awareness and slowed your pushes. Terran mech could form a siege line literally from one end of the map to the other and it would take an entire Protoss army focuses on one point to break the siege line. I miss these types of planning dynamics.

I think that if some of the game engine were made to be more similar to BW, that we could again see more interesting harass dynamics. I'm less interested in which units are used, but they play a significant factor in the game dynamic. If the new units are considered more similar to BW, I don't really care. It's a new game, there are new units and if we as a community like the new units then we'll adopt the game. If we don't like the new units and Blizzard doesn't want to accommodate us then we can continue to play WoL; wait for Legacy of the Void; or put together a mod which raises the skill ceiling on the game. I've seen many custom maps which tweak certain features of the game and it's not out of the question.

My two cents.
Random player
Alpino
Profile Joined June 2011
Brazil4390 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-26 02:16:43
October 26 2011 02:15 GMT
#53
I just want space control and less "ball on ball" action. And what the post above me says :D .
20/11/2015 - never forget EE's Ember
The Void
Profile Joined May 2010
Germany428 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-26 02:17:26
October 26 2011 02:16 GMT
#54
On October 26 2011 11:15 Alpino wrote:
I just want space control and less "ball on ball" action.

/signed

many little tricky moves instead of 1a + some spells.
it is hard to be an atheist and deal with day9 (╯°□°)╯︵┻━┻ also i stole this too ♞...o_O..oh..and his buddies ♚♛♜♝♟http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=295038 don't trust the suits...
RavenLoud
Profile Joined March 2011
Canada1100 Posts
October 26 2011 02:18 GMT
#55
People often refers to BW because it is the basic template that SC2 was designed from. When they share so many units, so many mechanics, so many spells and so many of the same game concepts, comparisons are inevitable.

For example, people will always bring up carrier micro in BW when lamenting its SC2 counterpart.

However I do not think the majority of fans want SC2 to be BW in HD (Play SC2BW mod for that )
MMello
Profile Joined October 2010
279 Posts
October 26 2011 02:18 GMT
#56
I support this thread.
٩(̾●̮̮̃̾•̃̾)۶ __̴ı̴̴̡̡̡ ̡͌l̡̡̡ ̡͌l̡*̡̡ ̴̡ı̴̴̡ ̡̡͡|̲̲̲͡͡͡ ̲▫̲͡ ̲̲̲͡͡π̲̲͡͡ ̲̲͡▫̲̲͡͡ ̲|̡̡̡ ̡ ̴̡ı̴̡̡ ̡͌l̡̡̡̡.__ <- FXO Gaming house
0neder
Profile Joined July 2009
United States3733 Posts
October 26 2011 02:20 GMT
#57
Fair point, but there are certain timeless principles that BW was based on that SC2 hasn't developed yet.
Loes
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada115 Posts
October 26 2011 02:21 GMT
#58
" Isn't BW the best "version of BW" we could ever hope for? "

Thats a really good point.
canikizu
Profile Joined September 2010
4860 Posts
October 26 2011 02:24 GMT
#59
Every time I heard "Back in BW, we..." I remember my grandpa, my dad "When I was young, I..." Yeah I know your 60s, 70s was great, was the bomb, whatever. Things were so much balanced back then, and my generation sucks
/sarcasm

I like SC2 for what it is right now. I don't want to another BW that I've watched for last decade.
Gamegene
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States8308 Posts
October 26 2011 02:25 GMT
#60
On October 26 2011 10:17 R0YAL wrote:

I disagree entirely. The army balls in sc2 are not even close to as spectator friendly as the pathing in bw was. It looked much better, it was more clear, and it felt almost infinitely more epic. I actually can't conceive someone thinking that a blob on one screen is more appealing than masses upon masses of units stretched out over the map.

That's just a bad side effect of good pathfinding. Honestly, it's up to you to 1a2a3a4a and not Blizzard to artificially create spread.
Throw on your favorite jacket and you're good to roll. Stroll through the trees and let your miseries go.
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 11 12 13 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 4h 16m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 264
ProTech78
Livibee 51
StarCraft: Brood War
Dewaltoss 93
ZZZero.O 46
MaD[AoV]22
NaDa 19
Jaeyun 19
HiyA 18
Shine 9
Dota 2
capcasts141
NeuroSwarm75
League of Legends
JimRising 601
Counter-Strike
taco 839
flusha468
Other Games
summit1g8273
tarik_tv2439
Grubby2359
FrodaN1787
fl0m724
Pyrionflax182
mouzStarbuck160
ViBE154
PPMD32
Organizations
Other Games
BasetradeTV35
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• davetesta80
• RyuSc2 77
• IndyKCrew
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• intothetv
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 20
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota21482
League of Legends
• Doublelift4345
• Jankos2366
Other Games
• Scarra1449
• imaqtpie861
Upcoming Events
Korean StarCraft League
4h 16m
CranKy Ducklings
11h 16m
RSL Revival
11h 16m
ByuN vs Cham
herO vs Reynor
FEL
17h 16m
RSL Revival
1d 11h
Clem vs Classic
SHIN vs Cure
FEL
1d 13h
BSL: ProLeague
1d 19h
Dewalt vs Bonyth
Replay Cast
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
The PondCast
4 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-06-28
HSC XXVII
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
Acropolis #3
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
Championship of Russia 2025
RSL Revival: Season 1
Murky Cup #2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025

Upcoming

2025 ACS Season 2: Qualifier
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
2025 ACS Season 2
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
SEL Season 2 Championship
FEL Cracov 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.