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Is it okay to say extreme stuff over game? - Page 16

Forum Index > SC2 General
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FryktSkyene
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1327 Posts
September 25 2011 21:23 GMT
#301
The title fits perfect.


Keep it classy spades.

Snitches get stiches
kofman
Profile Joined August 2011
Andorra698 Posts
September 25 2011 21:31 GMT
#302
On September 26 2011 06:19 SafeAsCheese wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 26 2011 06:16 kofman wrote:
I have a question: is manner muling BM? Koreans in the GSL do it basically every game, from what I see, but when I tried doing it today, the guy got really pissed off at me and raged. I didn't mean to be an asshole, I just wanted to say "I won, you lost, please leave the game" in a polite fashion, without saying it outright. Whenever I get manner muled, I don't feel offended and just accept it as my opponent telling me to leave the game already and GG out, but is it actually an insult? Cause I don't wanna be BM, I just wanna let people know the game is over.


You know how IdrA types "get out" to people?

That's what manner mules mean. Terran just doesn't have to type it xD


I know that, but I think its less rude than "get out". It's like giving someone a dirty look rather than going up to them and punching them in the face.
DreamChaser
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
1649 Posts
September 25 2011 21:34 GMT
#303
On September 26 2011 06:31 kofman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 26 2011 06:19 SafeAsCheese wrote:
On September 26 2011 06:16 kofman wrote:
I have a question: is manner muling BM? Koreans in the GSL do it basically every game, from what I see, but when I tried doing it today, the guy got really pissed off at me and raged. I didn't mean to be an asshole, I just wanted to say "I won, you lost, please leave the game" in a polite fashion, without saying it outright. Whenever I get manner muled, I don't feel offended and just accept it as my opponent telling me to leave the game already and GG out, but is it actually an insult? Cause I don't wanna be BM, I just wanna let people know the game is over.


You know how IdrA types "get out" to people?

That's what manner mules mean. Terran just doesn't have to type it xD


I know that, but I think its less rude than "get out". It's like giving someone a dirty look rather than going up to them and punching them in the face.


Manner muling is basically an offensive GG which is BM also
Plays against every MU with nexus first.
MisterTea
Profile Joined September 2010
United Kingdom1047 Posts
September 25 2011 21:38 GMT
#304
if you start with the rascist shit after losing a game, as a pro/semi pro player you should get heavily punished for it by your team/sponsor.
being mad is no excuse for being a rascist, saying sorry doesn't make up for it
Al Bundy
Profile Joined April 2010
7257 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-25 21:49:32
September 25 2011 21:46 GMT
#305
On September 26 2011 06:34 DreamChaser wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 26 2011 06:31 kofman wrote:
On September 26 2011 06:19 SafeAsCheese wrote:
On September 26 2011 06:16 kofman wrote:
I have a question: is manner muling BM? Koreans in the GSL do it basically every game, from what I see, but when I tried doing it today, the guy got really pissed off at me and raged. I didn't mean to be an asshole, I just wanted to say "I won, you lost, please leave the game" in a polite fashion, without saying it outright. Whenever I get manner muled, I don't feel offended and just accept it as my opponent telling me to leave the game already and GG out, but is it actually an insult? Cause I don't wanna be BM, I just wanna let people know the game is over.


You know how IdrA types "get out" to people?

That's what manner mules mean. Terran just doesn't have to type it xD


I know that, but I think its less rude than "get out". It's like giving someone a dirty look rather than going up to them and punching them in the face.


Manner muling is basically an offensive GG which is BM also

Manner mules are like neural parasited CCs, it's part of the game. It's more like a taunt, which is different from actual BM. The same goes for using /dance to make your units dance, and post-game cermonies. Also please note that taunt moves are present in a lot of games besides Sc2; fighting games and mmorpgs come to mind. It's entirely different from actual insults and other similar BM behaviors.

It's very important to distinguish the "BM" from the "taunts". For example MC doing a throat slicing move to Idra is a taunt, Idra flipping MC off is BM. This is applicable in other games too; in TF2 if I perform a taunt with my Medigun after a kill (especially when I kill spies): it's a taunt, hence the name. But if I say "learn to play you nigger free to play noob", then it's actual BM.
o choro é livre
iloveAthene
Profile Joined June 2011
186 Posts
September 25 2011 21:46 GMT
#306
On September 26 2011 06:38 MisterTea wrote:
if you start with the rascist shit after losing a game, as a pro/semi pro player you should get heavily punished for it by your team/sponsor.
being mad is no excuse for being a rascist, saying sorry doesn't make up for it


Exactly!
Especially when the racial slur is paired with a physical threat.
Bonkerz
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States831 Posts
September 25 2011 21:50 GMT
#307
BM is good for the scene nobody cares about saying stuff like/ get out/ manner mules, but there are lines you should't cross.
High masters terran streaming in 720p 60 FPS with commentary and analysis after every game twitch.tv/bonkerz1
taintmachine
Profile Joined May 2010
United States431 Posts
September 25 2011 21:54 GMT
#308
On September 26 2011 05:34 cydial wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 26 2011 05:29 taintmachine wrote:
On September 26 2011 04:53 mbr2321 wrote:
On September 25 2011 18:03 Spades wrote:
On September 25 2011 17:53 iloveAthene wrote:
2 white guys calling each other the N word is not anywhere near the same league as what Spades said. Has Destiny taught us nothing? It's the thoughts behind the words and not the words themselves. And in Spades' case the thoughts seem pretty obvious.

Besides, this was a tourney where Spades was representing RGN, not a ladder game

How can you interpret the thoughts behind a single line of text? Tell me what i can do for you to make you happy? I've apologized publicly, I've apologized to HwangSin on a skype call, everything is fine in the world, but you apparently think I'm the modern day Starcraft 2 Hitler. I apologize to anyone who was offended, I said this in a chat channel with about 30 people in it. I didn't say this on stream, i didnt post this all over the internet, my intentions were never to insult anyone outside HwangSin, which was clearly a lapse in composure, and I apologized. HwangSin and I, have both apologized to eachother for our argument on a skype call, and we have moved on with no hard feelings. I have no issue with HwangSin, or the asian community whatsoever, and again I apologize if you were offended.


There's very little you can do to make me happy. I don't care that you apologized, I don't care that GoSu has accepted your apology. To me none of that matters. You called HwangSin a gook, and that has, in my mind, irrevocably and eternally made you unworthy of my fandom. The differences between you and IdrA are simple: IdrA does not spit racial slurs at people, and IdrA is flat-out better than you, so he can back up his trash-talk.

Until you start pumping out better results than IdrA, or until you become nicer than Sheth, you will be the villain at every tournament at which you compete to me, and nothing more. I wish you nothing but the worst luck in StarCraft.


people do much worse than call others racial slurs in this world. maybe western society has convinced you otherwise. that is sad.


What you just said makes no sense at all. He never said a racial slur is the worst thing you can say to anybody, but he is right in that Spades is talking about of shit that he can't back up. What's worse is that hes getting racial about it, probably because he's just an insecure douche.




what i said makes sense if you look at how worked up he is over a few words that have no real impact on either player or the games they played. i think it's ok to disapprove of what spades said. getting all preachy on a forum about something like this just seems weird unless you really think this kind of topic merits the time it takes to pour so much anger and thought into your posts.
RavenLoud
Profile Joined March 2011
Canada1100 Posts
September 25 2011 22:23 GMT
#309
On September 26 2011 06:46 AlBundy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 26 2011 06:34 DreamChaser wrote:
On September 26 2011 06:31 kofman wrote:
On September 26 2011 06:19 SafeAsCheese wrote:
On September 26 2011 06:16 kofman wrote:
I have a question: is manner muling BM? Koreans in the GSL do it basically every game, from what I see, but when I tried doing it today, the guy got really pissed off at me and raged. I didn't mean to be an asshole, I just wanted to say "I won, you lost, please leave the game" in a polite fashion, without saying it outright. Whenever I get manner muled, I don't feel offended and just accept it as my opponent telling me to leave the game already and GG out, but is it actually an insult? Cause I don't wanna be BM, I just wanna let people know the game is over.


You know how IdrA types "get out" to people?

That's what manner mules mean. Terran just doesn't have to type it xD


I know that, but I think its less rude than "get out". It's like giving someone a dirty look rather than going up to them and punching them in the face.


Manner muling is basically an offensive GG which is BM also

Manner mules are like neural parasited CCs, it's part of the game. It's more like a taunt, which is different from actual BM. The same goes for using /dance to make your units dance, and post-game cermonies. Also please note that taunt moves are present in a lot of games besides Sc2; fighting games and mmorpgs come to mind. It's entirely different from actual insults and other similar BM behaviors.

It's very important to distinguish the "BM" from the "taunts". For example MC doing a throat slicing move to Idra is a taunt, Idra flipping MC off is BM. This is applicable in other games too; in TF2 if I perform a taunt with my Medigun after a kill (especially when I kill spies): it's a taunt, hence the name. But if I say "learn to play you nigger free to play noob", then it's actual BM.

IMO "Taunt" and "BM" aren't really a mutually exclusive. If you get teabagged in Halo, you know the guy's intentions isn't really to taunt you to kill him as much as it is to tell you how much you suck. Manner mules and dancing are part of the game, but they are used to convey messages that if translated in words, would not be nearly as tolerated for the sake of "taunt".

A player that constantly drop manner mule will lose respect from me. A certain amount of it is fun and good for the scene, but there is a limit between arrogance and confidence that's easy to cross.
ROOTFayth
Profile Joined January 2004
Canada3351 Posts
September 25 2011 23:40 GMT
#310
On September 26 2011 05:24 DiuLaSing wrote:
i mean spades...i doubt any pro respect him...maphacker since bw=\

testie also maphacked in broodwar and then he got a lot of respect in broodwar..
Falcor
Profile Joined February 2010
Canada894 Posts
September 25 2011 23:42 GMT
#311
On September 26 2011 08:40 ReignFayth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 26 2011 05:24 DiuLaSing wrote:
i mean spades...i doubt any pro respect him...maphacker since bw=\

testie also maphacked in broodwar and then he got a lot of respect in broodwar..


being the best random player doesnt hurt..
ckunkel1
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States181 Posts
September 25 2011 23:43 GMT
#312
No it absolutely not okay to say that stuff and it sounds like he is sorry. If e-sports is going to get big the professionals are going to have to become more professional. That is all there is to it. Many of the pro players are on the right track and that is great! However it only takes one person to ruin the image of a whole team/ community.
alwaid
Profile Joined October 2010
United States96 Posts
September 25 2011 23:48 GMT
#313
This thread has gotten out of control. I think that we can all agree that racial slurs and words like "faggot" and "retard" are very offensive and should not be ignored without some sort of consequence to professional players in a public forum.

Pro players should act classy and shouldn't be complete racist, homophobic and all around intolerant tools. In general, people agree that you can't say those words in the real world, and just saying "durr it's the internet" doesn't really change anything when the forum is so public and linked to actual, important events.

tldr; pro gaming is not 4chan.
Incursus
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States415 Posts
September 25 2011 23:49 GMT
#314
I understand that there was likely some serious BM going on there. And quite frankly with how HwangSin was speaking I am never going to support him as a player ever. That kind of behavior is childish and has no place in E-Sports.

Having said that, none of that is an excuse for Spades' behavior, which was many orders of magnitude worse. Sorry does not make up for that kind of language and the fact that he is saying things like that should be of serious concern to Reign as a team.

Both players are wrong here and I have lost a considerable amount of respect for both of them to be honest. Even if you're the best in the world you don't get to behave like that, acting like that is simply not something that should be rewarded.
Don't be surprised when a crack in the ice...appears under your feet.
NrG.NeverExpo
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada2114 Posts
September 25 2011 23:52 GMT
#315
On September 26 2011 08:40 ReignFayth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 26 2011 05:24 DiuLaSing wrote:
i mean spades...i doubt any pro respect him...maphacker since bw=\

testie also maphacked in broodwar and then he got a lot of respect in broodwar..

ugh comparing those 2 isn't really fair...Testie had a lot of haters too.
TwitteR: @NeverExpo follow me, i'll follow back :)
Torte de Lini
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany38463 Posts
September 26 2011 00:01 GMT
#316
On September 26 2011 08:40 ReignFayth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 26 2011 05:24 DiuLaSing wrote:
i mean spades...i doubt any pro respect him...maphacker since bw=\

testie also maphacked in broodwar and then he got a lot of respect in broodwar..


Not even close to the same O-o
https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
Bill Murray
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States9292 Posts
September 26 2011 00:09 GMT
#317
that was a mild slur
i thought this was going to be bad
University of Kentucky Basketball #1
hongo
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
207 Posts
September 26 2011 00:12 GMT
#318
Yeah i don't think that's a big deal. I'm going to slap you? Not much of a threat imo
SolveN
Profile Joined September 2010
Canada43 Posts
September 26 2011 00:14 GMT
#319
Competitive professional sports comes to mind when thinking about players and trash talk. For instance, hockey players/coaches are constantly yelling at each other and saying the most derogatory things that they can to each other in an effort to gain a psychological edge over their opponent. Society at large puts up with it, they certainly don't take enough offence to it that it jeopardizes the sport. In high level competition of any kind, you get exceptionally competitive people and I think tempers flaring is only natural.

Also, more directly to this issue, Spades was angry at the player, not the race. Racism is a problem to me when someone is targeted specifically because they fit a profile, but in this case, a 'racial slur' was used the other way around. I can't believe anyone would want to classify Spades as a problematic racist over this. Spades already said he was sorry, I don't see a point in prolonging the drama with a thread such as this, its probably hurting e-sports (albeit still completely insignificantly) more than Spades ever did.
Bill Murray
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States9292 Posts
September 26 2011 00:16 GMT
#320
reminds me of that south park episode "high school musical"

i'm going to slap the shit out of you
i'm feeling slap happy
slappin and slappin and slappin you
University of Kentucky Basketball #1
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