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group 3 is the group of death imo
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On September 22 2011 22:29 ishboh wrote:
group 3 is the group of death imo
I would not call it group of death if noone can be eliminated anyway.
I
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On September 22 2011 21:13 Kevan wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2011 20:15 Atrimex wrote:On September 22 2011 19:19 Kevan wrote:On September 22 2011 18:46 Atrimex wrote:On September 22 2011 11:29 Blasphemi wrote:On September 22 2011 09:16 Lunas wrote:On September 22 2011 07:25 Blasphemi wrote:On September 22 2011 07:06 Lunas wrote:On September 22 2011 07:02 Blasphemi wrote:On September 22 2011 06:58 Lunas wrote:
[quote]
Ignorance is bliss.
1. First of all he actually qualified beating alot of good koreans, unlike some others that just get invited because they got alot of fans
2nd. He placed 3rd at Assembly Summer 2011 beating Sen, and many others. 1st place Sennheiser Cup. 1st place Master Series Finals. 3rd place LDLC Summer Trophy all good lans with tough opposition.
At IEM he all-most knocked Puma out of the tournament was a really good serie TvZ. Showed that Stephano can compete with the best of the best
at HSC 3 he beat Huk 2-0 quite easy and Huk went l8t on to win that tournament.
He also got the highest win/lose ration EU ladder atm. Rank 1
There is a reason why his nickname is Wrecking Ball! But that's nothing compared to say Huk who won Dreamhack, Homestory and an MLG. Or Ret who won Assembly and EU Blizzcon Or Naniwa 2nd in TSL, 1st MLG. Thorzain 1st TSL, 2nd Dreamhack. and so on... No one thinks Stephano isn't good, it's just his hype extends well beyond his achievements right now. Yes it is Assemply summer is much bigger then blisscon invitational where only 8 players get invited and where is more about getting lucky with the brackets then anything els. You could also say not the best players in EU where there. Yes Huk has won Dreamhack and mlg like 4 months and allmost 1 year ago alot can happened. Stephano is on the top of his game atm and Huk lost last time to Stephano . Huk is an amasing player and he is still rank 1 on my pound4pound list on best foreign player. Im not saying Huk cant beat Stephano but its not gonna be easy I'm fairly sure there was more money for Blizzcon EU and the quality of players was higher are at least the same. No to mention Ret actually won, rather than coming third. What are you talking about all-most the same players at Blizzon was at Assemply summer + the top of EU and others "Nada, Sen" You cant even compare it Assemply together with Dreamhack and ESL is the biggest lan in Europe you preatty clueless if you think otherwise So you ignore the fact Stephano didn't actually win, he came third. Which was my original point, that winning Blizzcon EU is better than coming third at Assembly, and when you factor in Ret's own Assembly win (yes win, not third place) there's really no reason to rate Stephano above Ret right now. Kas, Happy and Goody have proven that online cups don't mean anything. Stephano needs to get himself a big LAN (or IPL/TSL level online tourny) win before I will consider him alongside top foreigners like Dimaga, Idra, White Ra, Select, Ret, Huk, Naniwa and Thorzain. Results do matter and they're much more important than how nice his play looked on his stream or how many Craft Cup's he won vs Elfi. First, Stephano only came third because he lost ZvZ gambling vs Dimaga. That was more luck then skill. I dont know why playing under horrible conditions in offline events like @ Assembly should have more value then online cups. I also don't know which offline event was won by Idra, White-Ra, Naniwa or Select that makes them top foreigners in your eyes, while Happy, Kas or Goody are not in your list (all by far better then Idra). In my eyes: Idra: MLG DC and Ro8 GSL. White Ra: HSC 2 and 2nd in DH inv and IEM. Naniwa: MLG Dallas and 2nd in HSC 2 and 3 and Blizz EU inv. Select: Blizz NA inv and 2nd MLG DC. They´re all better than Happy, Kas and Goody who don´t really have comparable results. MLG DC, MLG Dallas and Blizz Na means nothing. Every EU online cup is harder to win then these. Its also about how often you play in offline events. Happy or Kas only played @ very few big offline events, while Naniwa shows up nearly everywhere and has also not a big list of wins. Its hard to make a list of the best EU players (not counting Naniwa or Thorzain EU). There are around 30 players nearly at the same level and I wouldn't put White-Ra or Dimaga @ the top of them. They mean more than smaller online cups because a LAN tournament is the premier way to show skill. And if you don´t prove yourself on LAN tournaments you shouldn´t be considered to be better than someone who has. So, unless you win an online tournament that has like a 50 000$ prize pool and some of the best players from all over the world, like IPL 2(White Ra won btw) it won´t matter nearly as much as if you´d win a big offline event, like Assembly(that Dimaga won). @ KinQuh Goody managed to beat Nestea online when Nestea played from Korea?Ever heard of lag, delay or maybe not caring because you´re busy winning GSLs? Maybe you guys watched SotG and you´re just trolling, I´m not sure.
Goody is just goody, he's on an over universe ! You can compare him to any-one, he doesn't play the same game as us 
Btw i'm a big stephano's fan and i really think he doesn't deserve all this hipe, the guy is incredibly good, he beat puzzle, marineking, mma, revival and Alicia in bo3 but they played at 6am with massive lag from korea ! We put so much pressure on him, he seems the favorite of his group for everyone in the thread but the 3 others are group S. He has hard time vs top tosses and zergs these times and Huk can really beat him i'd give 70% for huk vs Stephano. And the corean terrans seem to be on fire nowodays ! He will certainly be 2nd or 3th of his group i guess, behind alive wich seems the best of group1.
And remember infestor has been nerfed
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On September 22 2011 22:14 Atrimex wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2011 21:13 Kevan wrote:On September 22 2011 20:15 Atrimex wrote:On September 22 2011 19:19 Kevan wrote:On September 22 2011 18:46 Atrimex wrote:On September 22 2011 11:29 Blasphemi wrote:On September 22 2011 09:16 Lunas wrote:On September 22 2011 07:25 Blasphemi wrote:On September 22 2011 07:06 Lunas wrote:On September 22 2011 07:02 Blasphemi wrote:
[quote]
But that's nothing compared to say Huk who won Dreamhack, Homestory and an MLG.
Or Ret who won Assembly and EU Blizzcon
Or Naniwa 2nd in TSL, 1st MLG.
Thorzain 1st TSL, 2nd Dreamhack.
and so on...
No one thinks Stephano isn't good, it's just his hype extends well beyond his achievements right now.
Yes it is Assemply summer is much bigger then blisscon invitational where only 8 players get invited and where is more about getting lucky with the brackets then anything els. You could also say not the best players in EU where there. Yes Huk has won Dreamhack and mlg like 4 months and allmost 1 year ago alot can happened. Stephano is on the top of his game atm and Huk lost last time to Stephano . Huk is an amasing player and he is still rank 1 on my pound4pound list on best foreign player. Im not saying Huk cant beat Stephano but its not gonna be easy I'm fairly sure there was more money for Blizzcon EU and the quality of players was higher are at least the same. No to mention Ret actually won, rather than coming third. What are you talking about all-most the same players at Blizzon was at Assemply summer + the top of EU and others "Nada, Sen" You cant even compare it Assemply together with Dreamhack and ESL is the biggest lan in Europe you preatty clueless if you think otherwise So you ignore the fact Stephano didn't actually win, he came third. Which was my original point, that winning Blizzcon EU is better than coming third at Assembly, and when you factor in Ret's own Assembly win (yes win, not third place) there's really no reason to rate Stephano above Ret right now. Kas, Happy and Goody have proven that online cups don't mean anything. Stephano needs to get himself a big LAN (or IPL/TSL level online tourny) win before I will consider him alongside top foreigners like Dimaga, Idra, White Ra, Select, Ret, Huk, Naniwa and Thorzain. Results do matter and they're much more important than how nice his play looked on his stream or how many Craft Cup's he won vs Elfi. First, Stephano only came third because he lost ZvZ gambling vs Dimaga. That was more luck then skill. I dont know why playing under horrible conditions in offline events like @ Assembly should have more value then online cups. I also don't know which offline event was won by Idra, White-Ra, Naniwa or Select that makes them top foreigners in your eyes, while Happy, Kas or Goody are not in your list (all by far better then Idra). In my eyes: Idra: MLG DC and Ro8 GSL. White Ra: HSC 2 and 2nd in DH inv and IEM. Naniwa: MLG Dallas and 2nd in HSC 2 and 3 and Blizz EU inv. Select: Blizz NA inv and 2nd MLG DC. They´re all better than Happy, Kas and Goody who don´t really have comparable results. MLG DC, MLG Dallas and Blizz Na means nothing. Every EU online cup is harder to win then these. Its also about how often you play in offline events. Happy or Kas only played @ very few big offline events, while Naniwa shows up nearly everywhere and has also not a big list of wins. Its hard to make a list of the best EU players (not counting Naniwa or Thorzain EU). There are around 30 players nearly at the same level and I wouldn't put White-Ra or Dimaga @ the top of them. They mean more than smaller online cups because a LAN tournament is the premier way to show skill. And if you don´t prove yourself on LAN tournaments you shouldn´t be considered to better than someone who has. So, unless you win an online tournament that has like a 50 000$ prize pool and some of the best players from all over the world, like IPL 2(White Ra won btw) it won´t matter nearly as much as if you´d win a big offline event, like Assembly(that Dimaga won). @ KinQuh Goody managed to beat Nestea online when Nestea played from Korea?Ever heard of lag, delay or maybe not caring because you´re busy winning GSLs? Maybe you guys watched SotG and you´re just trolling, I´m not sure. MLG DC, MLG Dallas and Blizz NA are a joke. Most of the players in the later rounds of IPL2 you will find in every EU online cup too. The quality in EU online cups is very high and I don't know if you play under horrobile conditions like at Assembly the winner is always the best player. @GoOdy vs Nestea We all love GoOdy. You know why? Because loosing to GoOdy forces always some very strange excuse by his opponent. GoOdy has one of the biggest fanbase in EU because its so funny to see him winning against people thinking that they are by far the superior players.
You don´t understand. Even if every single player in grandmaster on the KR, NA and EU servers would compete in the online cups they still wouldn´t matter as much as offline events do because the prize pool is relatively small, lag is always a factor and people do not take it as seriously.
Goody is awesome but if he would play Nestea at an MLG or GSL he would probably lose.
I agree that EU > NA but you must understand that LAN events > online cups.
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On September 22 2011 19:33 R3N wrote:yeah mana+nerchio is the 2 of the best Euros atm. Really which foreign toss (that is not living in korea  ) is better than mana atm?
Depends on the matchup:
His PvT is undoubtly the best in EU atm. PvP is a matchup, that is extremely hard to judge, because it is so unforgiving. One small mistake can cost you a match. However, Mana´s PvP is surely good enough to take games off other Top EU Protoss palyers like White-Ra, Socke or Hasuobs. It really depends on the daily form. In PvZ I see Socke stronger. Not only is he statitically way better than Mana (over 60% winrate to 50%), Socke had also some really strong results against Zerg lately.
Regarding the other topic on the last pages, I can not believe how far some people here go to make Stephano´s 3rd place at Assembly look as best as possible. Blaming his loss on the nature of ZvZ rather than giving Dimaga (the guy, that won the tourney eventually) the respect he deserves or shitting on major NA events like the Battlenet Inv. NA. This tourney featured powerhouses like Huk, Sheth, Kiwikaki, Select and (an performing) Idra. While EU as a whole is better than NA, the few absolute top players they have can compete with any top player in europe.
Stephanos 3rd place was undoubtly a very strong result as was his run in the qualifier for IPL III, but it can also not be argured, that there are some zergs and a good number of foreigners in general, who are more accomplished than him, partly due to the fact that those people play on the highest foreign level for far longer than Stephano (which is in itself proof for their skill).
I just get the feeling, that some people want to force him into the role of the best foreign zerg or even best foreign player. For them anything short of advancing to the finals would be probably a dissapointment. As far as the hype around him goes, he is still not unbeatable. For that I only need to look a few days back, when Hasuobs defeated him convincingly.
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Just two more weeks. Can't wait to see who shows up for the open bracket. Hopefully this event gets the awesome turnout it deserves. :D
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Wasn't very interested before reading but now I'm really excited!
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On September 23 2011 00:18 Kevan wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2011 22:14 Atrimex wrote:On September 22 2011 21:13 Kevan wrote:On September 22 2011 20:15 Atrimex wrote:On September 22 2011 19:19 Kevan wrote:On September 22 2011 18:46 Atrimex wrote:On September 22 2011 11:29 Blasphemi wrote:On September 22 2011 09:16 Lunas wrote:On September 22 2011 07:25 Blasphemi wrote:On September 22 2011 07:06 Lunas wrote:
[quote]
Yes it is Assemply summer is much bigger then blisscon invitational where only 8 players get invited and where is more about getting lucky with the brackets then anything els. You could also say not the best players in EU where there.
Yes Huk has won Dreamhack and mlg like 4 months and allmost 1 year ago alot can happened. Stephano is on the top of his game atm and Huk lost last time to Stephano . Huk is an amasing player and he is still rank 1 on my pound4pound list on best foreign player. Im not saying Huk cant beat Stephano but its not gonna be easy I'm fairly sure there was more money for Blizzcon EU and the quality of players was higher are at least the same. No to mention Ret actually won, rather than coming third. What are you talking about all-most the same players at Blizzon was at Assemply summer + the top of EU and others "Nada, Sen" You cant even compare it Assemply together with Dreamhack and ESL is the biggest lan in Europe you preatty clueless if you think otherwise So you ignore the fact Stephano didn't actually win, he came third. Which was my original point, that winning Blizzcon EU is better than coming third at Assembly, and when you factor in Ret's own Assembly win (yes win, not third place) there's really no reason to rate Stephano above Ret right now. Kas, Happy and Goody have proven that online cups don't mean anything. Stephano needs to get himself a big LAN (or IPL/TSL level online tourny) win before I will consider him alongside top foreigners like Dimaga, Idra, White Ra, Select, Ret, Huk, Naniwa and Thorzain. Results do matter and they're much more important than how nice his play looked on his stream or how many Craft Cup's he won vs Elfi. First, Stephano only came third because he lost ZvZ gambling vs Dimaga. That was more luck then skill. I dont know why playing under horrible conditions in offline events like @ Assembly should have more value then online cups. I also don't know which offline event was won by Idra, White-Ra, Naniwa or Select that makes them top foreigners in your eyes, while Happy, Kas or Goody are not in your list (all by far better then Idra). In my eyes: Idra: MLG DC and Ro8 GSL. White Ra: HSC 2 and 2nd in DH inv and IEM. Naniwa: MLG Dallas and 2nd in HSC 2 and 3 and Blizz EU inv. Select: Blizz NA inv and 2nd MLG DC. They´re all better than Happy, Kas and Goody who don´t really have comparable results. MLG DC, MLG Dallas and Blizz Na means nothing. Every EU online cup is harder to win then these. Its also about how often you play in offline events. Happy or Kas only played @ very few big offline events, while Naniwa shows up nearly everywhere and has also not a big list of wins. Its hard to make a list of the best EU players (not counting Naniwa or Thorzain EU). There are around 30 players nearly at the same level and I wouldn't put White-Ra or Dimaga @ the top of them. They mean more than smaller online cups because a LAN tournament is the premier way to show skill. And if you don´t prove yourself on LAN tournaments you shouldn´t be considered to better than someone who has. So, unless you win an online tournament that has like a 50 000$ prize pool and some of the best players from all over the world, like IPL 2(White Ra won btw) it won´t matter nearly as much as if you´d win a big offline event, like Assembly(that Dimaga won). @ KinQuh Goody managed to beat Nestea online when Nestea played from Korea?Ever heard of lag, delay or maybe not caring because you´re busy winning GSLs? Maybe you guys watched SotG and you´re just trolling, I´m not sure. MLG DC, MLG Dallas and Blizz NA are a joke. Most of the players in the later rounds of IPL2 you will find in every EU online cup too. The quality in EU online cups is very high and I don't know if you play under horrobile conditions like at Assembly the winner is always the best player. @GoOdy vs Nestea We all love GoOdy. You know why? Because loosing to GoOdy forces always some very strange excuse by his opponent. GoOdy has one of the biggest fanbase in EU because its so funny to see him winning against people thinking that they are by far the superior players. You don´t understand. Even if every single player in grandmaster on the KR, NA and EU servers would compete in the online cups they still wouldn´t matter as much as offline events do because the prize pool is relatively small, lag is always a factor and people do not take it as seriously. Goody is awesome but if he would play Nestea at an MLG or GSL he would probably lose. I agree that EU > NA but you must understand that LAN events > online cups.
On the other hand, in offline cups you will always have a limited number of good players. Most of the time the reason to get invited is more the team u are on then the skilllevel. Look at MLG. To be the best online needs much more skill then win an offline event.
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Every group is a group of death, isn't it? Should be epic.
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United States1050 Posts
On September 22 2011 19:28 Nadarath wrote:
Im kind of sad that i dont see in players list neither Nerchio or Mana. Would be much better if IPL try harder to invite players who did well in IPL2.
If it was refuse on players side then its ok but since i dont have such info im sad ;(
We had to make very difficult decisions and we wanted to invite one of each race from NA and EU. This isn't a slight on any players that didn't get picked, there were too many players that deserve it. A lot of heated debates in the office about it also! 
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I"m late to the format debate but I just want to say only taking 12 players from the open bracket and giving the top of each pool a bye first round might have been something to consider giving the pool players something to fight for.
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On September 23 2011 02:20 Atrimex wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2011 00:18 Kevan wrote:On September 22 2011 22:14 Atrimex wrote:On September 22 2011 21:13 Kevan wrote:On September 22 2011 20:15 Atrimex wrote:On September 22 2011 19:19 Kevan wrote:On September 22 2011 18:46 Atrimex wrote:On September 22 2011 11:29 Blasphemi wrote:On September 22 2011 09:16 Lunas wrote:On September 22 2011 07:25 Blasphemi wrote:
[quote]
I'm fairly sure there was more money for Blizzcon EU and the quality of players was higher are at least the same. No to mention Ret actually won, rather than coming third.
What are you talking about all-most the same players at Blizzon was at Assemply summer + the top of EU and others "Nada, Sen" You cant even compare it Assemply together with Dreamhack and ESL is the biggest lan in Europe you preatty clueless if you think otherwise So you ignore the fact Stephano didn't actually win, he came third. Which was my original point, that winning Blizzcon EU is better than coming third at Assembly, and when you factor in Ret's own Assembly win (yes win, not third place) there's really no reason to rate Stephano above Ret right now. Kas, Happy and Goody have proven that online cups don't mean anything. Stephano needs to get himself a big LAN (or IPL/TSL level online tourny) win before I will consider him alongside top foreigners like Dimaga, Idra, White Ra, Select, Ret, Huk, Naniwa and Thorzain. Results do matter and they're much more important than how nice his play looked on his stream or how many Craft Cup's he won vs Elfi. First, Stephano only came third because he lost ZvZ gambling vs Dimaga. That was more luck then skill. I dont know why playing under horrible conditions in offline events like @ Assembly should have more value then online cups. I also don't know which offline event was won by Idra, White-Ra, Naniwa or Select that makes them top foreigners in your eyes, while Happy, Kas or Goody are not in your list (all by far better then Idra). In my eyes: Idra: MLG DC and Ro8 GSL. White Ra: HSC 2 and 2nd in DH inv and IEM. Naniwa: MLG Dallas and 2nd in HSC 2 and 3 and Blizz EU inv. Select: Blizz NA inv and 2nd MLG DC. They´re all better than Happy, Kas and Goody who don´t really have comparable results. MLG DC, MLG Dallas and Blizz Na means nothing. Every EU online cup is harder to win then these. Its also about how often you play in offline events. Happy or Kas only played @ very few big offline events, while Naniwa shows up nearly everywhere and has also not a big list of wins. Its hard to make a list of the best EU players (not counting Naniwa or Thorzain EU). There are around 30 players nearly at the same level and I wouldn't put White-Ra or Dimaga @ the top of them. They mean more than smaller online cups because a LAN tournament is the premier way to show skill. And if you don´t prove yourself on LAN tournaments you shouldn´t be considered to better than someone who has. So, unless you win an online tournament that has like a 50 000$ prize pool and some of the best players from all over the world, like IPL 2(White Ra won btw) it won´t matter nearly as much as if you´d win a big offline event, like Assembly(that Dimaga won). @ KinQuh Goody managed to beat Nestea online when Nestea played from Korea?Ever heard of lag, delay or maybe not caring because you´re busy winning GSLs? Maybe you guys watched SotG and you´re just trolling, I´m not sure. MLG DC, MLG Dallas and Blizz NA are a joke. Most of the players in the later rounds of IPL2 you will find in every EU online cup too. The quality in EU online cups is very high and I don't know if you play under horrobile conditions like at Assembly the winner is always the best player. @GoOdy vs Nestea We all love GoOdy. You know why? Because loosing to GoOdy forces always some very strange excuse by his opponent. GoOdy has one of the biggest fanbase in EU because its so funny to see him winning against people thinking that they are by far the superior players. You don´t understand. Even if every single player in grandmaster on the KR, NA and EU servers would compete in the online cups they still wouldn´t matter as much as offline events do because the prize pool is relatively small, lag is always a factor and people do not take it as seriously. Goody is awesome but if he would play Nestea at an MLG or GSL he would probably lose. I agree that EU > NA but you must understand that LAN events > online cups. On the other hand, in offline cups you will always have a limited number of good players. Most of the time the reason to get invited is more the team u are on then the skilllevel. Look at MLG. To be the best online needs much more skill then win an offline event.
LAN events are where you gain legitimacy as a player, if you can´t see that then you don´t understand how competitive gaming works. And MLG only invite Koreans to their events and if you think their skill level isn´t high enough you´re probably even dumber than you seem to be.
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On September 23 2011 03:55 Alex.IGN wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2011 19:28 Nadarath wrote:
Im kind of sad that i dont see in players list neither Nerchio or Mana. Would be much better if IPL try harder to invite players who did well in IPL2.
If it was refuse on players side then its ok but since i dont have such info im sad ;( We had to make very difficult decisions and we wanted to invite one of each race from NA and EU. This isn't a slight on any players that didn't get picked, there were too many players that deserve it. A lot of heated debates in the office about it also!
Yeah but how do you justify inviting Ret over the 2nd place finisher in your previous IPL? I mean nothing against Ret, he's a great player and deserves an Invite, I just feel that in the umbrella of IPL, Nerchio deserves it more based on performance.
Edit: I feel like casters and players should already have visa's, rather than waiting until they need to fly somewhere to get them, but I mean that's just me I guess.
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United States530 Posts
MaNa is too young to compete at IPL 3, unfortunately. x.x
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On September 23 2011 05:14 Kevan wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2011 02:20 Atrimex wrote:On September 23 2011 00:18 Kevan wrote:On September 22 2011 22:14 Atrimex wrote:On September 22 2011 21:13 Kevan wrote:On September 22 2011 20:15 Atrimex wrote:On September 22 2011 19:19 Kevan wrote:On September 22 2011 18:46 Atrimex wrote:On September 22 2011 11:29 Blasphemi wrote:On September 22 2011 09:16 Lunas wrote:
[quote]
What are you talking about all-most the same players at Blizzon was at Assemply summer + the top of EU and others "Nada, Sen"
You cant even compare it Assemply together with Dreamhack and ESL is the biggest lan in Europe you preatty clueless if you think otherwise So you ignore the fact Stephano didn't actually win, he came third. Which was my original point, that winning Blizzcon EU is better than coming third at Assembly, and when you factor in Ret's own Assembly win (yes win, not third place) there's really no reason to rate Stephano above Ret right now. Kas, Happy and Goody have proven that online cups don't mean anything. Stephano needs to get himself a big LAN (or IPL/TSL level online tourny) win before I will consider him alongside top foreigners like Dimaga, Idra, White Ra, Select, Ret, Huk, Naniwa and Thorzain. Results do matter and they're much more important than how nice his play looked on his stream or how many Craft Cup's he won vs Elfi. First, Stephano only came third because he lost ZvZ gambling vs Dimaga. That was more luck then skill. I dont know why playing under horrible conditions in offline events like @ Assembly should have more value then online cups. I also don't know which offline event was won by Idra, White-Ra, Naniwa or Select that makes them top foreigners in your eyes, while Happy, Kas or Goody are not in your list (all by far better then Idra). In my eyes: Idra: MLG DC and Ro8 GSL. White Ra: HSC 2 and 2nd in DH inv and IEM. Naniwa: MLG Dallas and 2nd in HSC 2 and 3 and Blizz EU inv. Select: Blizz NA inv and 2nd MLG DC. They´re all better than Happy, Kas and Goody who don´t really have comparable results. MLG DC, MLG Dallas and Blizz Na means nothing. Every EU online cup is harder to win then these. Its also about how often you play in offline events. Happy or Kas only played @ very few big offline events, while Naniwa shows up nearly everywhere and has also not a big list of wins. Its hard to make a list of the best EU players (not counting Naniwa or Thorzain EU). There are around 30 players nearly at the same level and I wouldn't put White-Ra or Dimaga @ the top of them. They mean more than smaller online cups because a LAN tournament is the premier way to show skill. And if you don´t prove yourself on LAN tournaments you shouldn´t be considered to better than someone who has. So, unless you win an online tournament that has like a 50 000$ prize pool and some of the best players from all over the world, like IPL 2(White Ra won btw) it won´t matter nearly as much as if you´d win a big offline event, like Assembly(that Dimaga won). @ KinQuh Goody managed to beat Nestea online when Nestea played from Korea?Ever heard of lag, delay or maybe not caring because you´re busy winning GSLs? Maybe you guys watched SotG and you´re just trolling, I´m not sure. MLG DC, MLG Dallas and Blizz NA are a joke. Most of the players in the later rounds of IPL2 you will find in every EU online cup too. The quality in EU online cups is very high and I don't know if you play under horrobile conditions like at Assembly the winner is always the best player. @GoOdy vs Nestea We all love GoOdy. You know why? Because loosing to GoOdy forces always some very strange excuse by his opponent. GoOdy has one of the biggest fanbase in EU because its so funny to see him winning against people thinking that they are by far the superior players. You don´t understand. Even if every single player in grandmaster on the KR, NA and EU servers would compete in the online cups they still wouldn´t matter as much as offline events do because the prize pool is relatively small, lag is always a factor and people do not take it as seriously. Goody is awesome but if he would play Nestea at an MLG or GSL he would probably lose. I agree that EU > NA but you must understand that LAN events > online cups. On the other hand, in offline cups you will always have a limited number of good players. Most of the time the reason to get invited is more the team u are on then the skilllevel. Look at MLG. To be the best online needs much more skill then win an offline event. LAN events are where you gain legitimacy as a player, if you can´t see that then you don´t understand how competitive gaming works. And MLG only invite Koreans to their events and if you think their skill level isn´t high enough you´re probably even dumber than you seem to be.
You are right. MLG is much more worse. Because MLG pool spots are inherited. Its inbreed. However, if you think you can see the best games and skilled players @ offline events like MLG "you´re probably even dumber than you seem to be."
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On September 23 2011 05:18 genius_man16 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2011 03:55 Alex.IGN wrote:On September 22 2011 19:28 Nadarath wrote:
Im kind of sad that i dont see in players list neither Nerchio or Mana. Would be much better if IPL try harder to invite players who did well in IPL2.
If it was refuse on players side then its ok but since i dont have such info im sad ;( We had to make very difficult decisions and we wanted to invite one of each race from NA and EU. This isn't a slight on any players that didn't get picked, there were too many players that deserve it. A lot of heated debates in the office about it also! Yeah but how do you justify inviting Ret over the 2nd place finisher in your previous IPL? I mean nothing against Ret, he's a great player and deserves an Invite, I just feel that in the umbrella of IPL, Nerchio deserves it more based on performance. Edit: I feel like casters and players should already have visa's, rather than waiting until they need to fly somewhere to get them, but I mean that's just me I guess.
I agree with you I got no idea how they would invite Ret over Nerchio. Ret didnt do very well in IPL season 2 Nerchio took 3rd.
It really smells like there decision was more based on popularity then actually skills. How cna new players actually evolve if they do well wont even get an invite to lans. Maybe thats why Nerchio didnt attend any qualifiers becuase he was pissed?
I would actually like a respond from Josh about why Ret over nerchio?
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I agree that players make names for themselves at big LAN events but you also have to recognize that the level of competition has risen dramatically since events like MLG DC and Dallas. The winners of those events are not necessarily still the best players. Stephano has looked very impressive for a fair amount of time now and I certainly think he is a better player then for example Ret or Idra.
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On September 23 2011 06:51 Lunas wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2011 05:18 genius_man16 wrote:On September 23 2011 03:55 Alex.IGN wrote:On September 22 2011 19:28 Nadarath wrote:
Im kind of sad that i dont see in players list neither Nerchio or Mana. Would be much better if IPL try harder to invite players who did well in IPL2.
If it was refuse on players side then its ok but since i dont have such info im sad ;( We had to make very difficult decisions and we wanted to invite one of each race from NA and EU. This isn't a slight on any players that didn't get picked, there were too many players that deserve it. A lot of heated debates in the office about it also! Yeah but how do you justify inviting Ret over the 2nd place finisher in your previous IPL? I mean nothing against Ret, he's a great player and deserves an Invite, I just feel that in the umbrella of IPL, Nerchio deserves it more based on performance. Edit: I feel like casters and players should already have visa's, rather than waiting until they need to fly somewhere to get them, but I mean that's just me I guess. I agree with you I got no idea how they would invite Ret over Nerchio. Ret didnt do very well in IPL season 2 Nerchio took 3rd. It really smells like there decision was more based on popularity then actually skills. How cna new players actually evolve if they do well wont even get an invite to lans. Maybe thats why Nerchio didnt attend any qualifiers becuase he was pissed? I would actually like a respond from Josh about why Ret over nerchio?
If the invites were based purely on skill it would be all Koreans. Also it's a matter of opinion whether Nerchio is actually better than Ret or not, especially since the only LAN they were both at Ret won. It's not like they're inviting Destiny over him or something so what's the big deal?
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On September 23 2011 07:05 Olinim wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2011 06:51 Lunas wrote:On September 23 2011 05:18 genius_man16 wrote:On September 23 2011 03:55 Alex.IGN wrote:On September 22 2011 19:28 Nadarath wrote:
Im kind of sad that i dont see in players list neither Nerchio or Mana. Would be much better if IPL try harder to invite players who did well in IPL2.
If it was refuse on players side then its ok but since i dont have such info im sad ;( We had to make very difficult decisions and we wanted to invite one of each race from NA and EU. This isn't a slight on any players that didn't get picked, there were too many players that deserve it. A lot of heated debates in the office about it also! Yeah but how do you justify inviting Ret over the 2nd place finisher in your previous IPL? I mean nothing against Ret, he's a great player and deserves an Invite, I just feel that in the umbrella of IPL, Nerchio deserves it more based on performance. Edit: I feel like casters and players should already have visa's, rather than waiting until they need to fly somewhere to get them, but I mean that's just me I guess. I agree with you I got no idea how they would invite Ret over Nerchio. Ret didnt do very well in IPL season 2 Nerchio took 3rd. It really smells like there decision was more based on popularity then actually skills. How cna new players actually evolve if they do well wont even get an invite to lans. Maybe thats why Nerchio didnt attend any qualifiers becuase he was pissed? I would actually like a respond from Josh about why Ret over nerchio? If the invites were based purely on skill it would be all Koreans. Also it's a matter of opinion whether Nerchio is actually better than Ret or not, especially since the only LAN they were both at Ret won. It's not like they're inviting Destiny over him or something so what's the big deal?
IMO it doesn't really have to do with "skill" so much as performance UNDER THE IPL UMBRELLA.
Yeah Ret won the LAN they were both at but it wasn't IPL. In the IPL they were both in Nerchio performed FAR better. He took 2nd for cryin out loud. My beef is that Nerchio performed better than Ret in IPL, so he deserves an invite FROM IPL more than Ret.
If this were NASL or something then I can see inviting Ret over Nerchio, but not IPL.
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United States530 Posts
I personally was very impressed by Ret's performance here: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2011_European_Battle.net_Invitational defeating Naniwa 2-1, ThorZaIN 2-0, and Naniwa again 2-0 in the grand finals. No one person at IGN eSports decided to invite Ret over Nerchio, just the evidence at the time and Ret's consistently good showing at live events seemed like a player we could not refuse.
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EPT
