EPTOn June 09 2013 20:10 plogamer wrote:
I'd rather build more bunkers and/or more turrets.
I'd rather build more bunkers and/or more turrets.
Now you are loosing lots of marines and resources, wow. Your army will suffer too much!
Designated Balance Discussion Thread - Page 519
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Magbane
Finland95 Posts
Now you are loosing lots of marines and resources, wow. Your army will suffer too much! | ||
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Chaggi
Korea (South)1936 Posts
On June 09 2013 20:06 Magbane wrote: Turrets dont stop hellbats, and with booster you can even take few hits to fly over in many cases. Bunker range is not enough, scv pulling takes away income. Also, if you are gonna make so many turrets he wont get in you already have a lot of resources invested, way more than with one tank at base. 3 tanks is not that much for three base income, and at the stage of the game you already have big army. I have seen tanks at base for defend in pro games even. Look, I don't know if you actually play this game at a decently high level, or you're just theorycrafting, but if you have played any Mech (which, would technically be the best way to use this defense as Mech is incredibly inmobile and you don't want to trade constantly, ontop of the fact that it'd be less of a % of your main tank force than if you were playing Bio), but minerals are basically free past a very early point in Mech. The bottleneck, has, and always will be, gas. If it was me playing on say, Whirlwind, I'd put 2 turrets, w/ range upgrade near where they could drop me, and put one in my mineral line and maybe one along the path where a medivac could be. If the medivac even gets hellbats off to drop, it's going to be pretty far from my mineral line. If it somehow makes it to my mineral line, I have marines in a bunker to defend, which does a similar idea of what a tank does as well (except without splash that could kill more of my own SCVs) Yes, tanks at base for defense in pro games, but those are situational. We saw it today in MVP vs Innovation I believe. But those are incredibly situational times when a tank at your base is good. In the vast majority of cases, it literally doesn't matter as the bunker + turret combo is a much better, and cheaper defense for your army and you lose less from your actual main army. | ||
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Chaggi
Korea (South)1936 Posts
On June 09 2013 20:13 Magbane wrote: Now you are loosing lots of marines and resources, wow. Your army will suffer too much! You are a moron for thinking that 4 marines is worth even equal to a tank in a mid to late game army composition. If I could trade 4 marines for a tank, I'd do it every fucking time | ||
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Magbane
Finland95 Posts
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Magbane
Finland95 Posts
On June 09 2013 20:19 Chaggi wrote: You are a moron for thinking that 4 marines is worth even equal to a tank in a mid to late game army composition. If I could trade 4 marines for a tank, I'd do it every fucking time two bunkers with 4 marines at each base | ||
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Chaggi
Korea (South)1936 Posts
On June 09 2013 20:20 Magbane wrote: I dont understand how it is cheaper if you build multiple turrets, bunkers and marines in those bunkers. because they don't cost gas, and if you're going mech, gas is the limiting resource. Do you even play Terran? And you only need 1 bunker w/ 4 marines | ||
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Magbane
Finland95 Posts
1 bunker is not enough, not enough range | ||
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Chaggi
Korea (South)1936 Posts
On June 09 2013 20:24 Magbane wrote: Minerals are not exactly that expendable even for mech. 1 bunker is not enough, not enough range yes they are that expendable, and bunkers have that range if you put it behind the mineral line okay I'm done. You're just stupid. thanks for keeping me amused while on the subway home | ||
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Magbane
Finland95 Posts
On June 09 2013 20:26 Chaggi wrote: yes they are that expendable, and bunkers have that range if you put it behind the mineral line okay I'm done. You're just stupid. thanks for keeping me amused while on the subway home They actually dont have enough range to cover all workers, do you even play terran? Also hellbats can take few hits while killing workers. | ||
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Usernameffs
Sweden107 Posts
On June 09 2013 18:25 iky43210 wrote: but he doesn't. Outside of TvT he uses hellbat not even 20% of the time, and that is a too high of an percentage. Fact is hellbat does not have a role in high level TvZ and TvP atm outside of semi all-in. Maybe few months from now meta will change but so far those complaining about it needs to l2p. Are you dumb, hellbat is the best unit in the game by far for the cost. | ||
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Magbane
Finland95 Posts
On June 09 2013 20:28 Usernameffs wrote: Are you dumb, hellbat is the best unit in the game by far for the cost. marine | ||
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Usernameffs
Sweden107 Posts
Hellbat 100 minerals, marines are good but not that good. | ||
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Sissors
1395 Posts
Seriously while I am not a big fan of hellbats, saying a unit that is very slow, has horribad range and can only attack ground targets is by far the best unit for its cost is a bit weird. | ||
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samuu
Germany13 Posts
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Usernameffs
Sweden107 Posts
On June 09 2013 21:27 Sissors wrote: Battlecruiser. Seriously while I am not a big fan of hellbats, saying a unit that is very slow, has horribad range and can only attack ground targets is by far the best unit for its cost is a bit weird. Battlecruisers cost 6 times what a hellbat does, you get 4 hellbats and 2 medivacs for a battlecrusier. | ||
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On June 09 2013 21:30 samuu wrote: Medivac is the best unit. Think about it the medivac is really good, but it's applications are kind of limited and it's strength doesn't grow significantly past a certain amount. | ||
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Usernameffs
Sweden107 Posts
On June 09 2013 21:45 Big J wrote: the medivac is really good, but it's applications are kind of limited and it's strength doesn't grow significantly past a certain amount. Lol applications are limited? You cant say a unit cant be the best unit just because you cant mass it. You could never mass infestors, ghost, hellbats. All those units have been the best unit in the game by far. | ||
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Magbane
Finland95 Posts
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On June 09 2013 21:51 Usernameffs wrote: Lol applications are limited? You cant say a unit cant be the best unit just because you cant mass it. You could never mass infestors, ghost, hellbats. All those units have been the best unit in the game by far. Yup, it's applications are limited. Think about this WoL example: The Infestor was a hardcounter to many Terran units, such as the marine or the viking. It was still a softcounter to many other units like the marauder or the banshee. And against the few units that in 1v1 scenarios beat it (like ghost, BC, siege tank) it was still extremly useful. Or another example, the other way around would be the marine in HotS. It counters basically every Zerg unit hard or soft with the execption of the infestor, the baneling, the broodlord and the ultralisk. Against the infestor and the baneling it can still stand its ground with decent control, against the broodlord it only becomes inefficient when the value of the broodlords massively exceed the marines value and against the ultralisk it will still do a lot of damage before going down (and in certain terrain situations can even straight up counter it). Now think about the medivac. It can't fight on its own. It is only as good as the units you use it with - which, when you play with marines or hellbats is pretty good. In other situations, not as much. | ||
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RaFox17
Finland4581 Posts
On June 09 2013 22:03 Magbane wrote: Never could mass infestors you say? Never think before you write? Have you seen the same kind of mass infestor usage as in wings? Really stop trolling and think before you write. Not all of your thoughts are made of gold. | ||
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