EPTFixing the Map Situation: Bring in Old BW Maps - Page 3
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meep
United States1699 Posts
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ArvickHero
10387 Posts
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Rinrun
Canada3509 Posts
On July 29 2011 13:25 JiYan wrote: id like to see heartbreak ridge :D I too would like to see this map. Crystallis... PFs. o.o | ||
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Crushgroove
United States793 Posts
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a9arnn
United States1537 Posts
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ravenKRaz
United States580 Posts
 i lol'd at crystallis | ||
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UniversalMind
United States326 Posts
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Kimaker
United States2131 Posts
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sheaRZerg
United States613 Posts
That was one of my favorite ladder maps ever...I feel like there are some issues with unit sizes in sc2 that would make it hard to balance with the small pathways though the middle. | ||
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MacroNcheesE
United States508 Posts
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andeh
United States904 Posts
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dukem
Norway189 Posts
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Sterling
United States182 Posts
I hate the new ladder maps. At least the two light colored ones which are basically impossible to play normal/macro games on with a reasonably timed 3rd base. | ||
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Maghetti
United States2429 Posts
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Silfurstar
Switzerland263 Posts
Hilarious thread, thanks for making my day ! :D | ||
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CrazyF1r3f0x
United States2120 Posts
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imbecile
563 Posts
Each player has 21 games, overall it's 84 games. With the above mentioned price distribution the price pool needed would be $1365, and a plyer who wins all his games and gets the bets game bonus can get $310. Or is you got a lot of money, make everything x10 and you are still well below the $5000 blizzard restriction. The one best suited to pull this off is TL, because they can even opt to use those maps in TL opens or TSLs, and also have the community and website staff to hold such a tournament. | ||
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Bibbit
Canada5377 Posts
 I'm thinking of paying for lessons from Hot_Bid. Anybody have any experience with him? | ||
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Baarn
United States2702 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad83/FFC-Ifrit/DesertOutpost-5.jpg) | ||
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nitdkim
1264 Posts
On July 29 2011 13:18 Bibbit wrote: With season 3 having just hit, there have been a lot of complaints about the maps. As a responsible citizen of TeamLiquid, I felt it was my duty to look for solutions to this problem. And where better to look that at a game, similar in many respects, that has had over a decade of play to shape the maps into something truly wonderful. With that in mind, I have found 5 BW maps that I feel would be the most appropriate ports to SC2. #1: Crazy Critters The Map: + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images/thumb/7/75/CrazyCritters.jpg/400px-CrazyCritters.jpg) Notable Features: + Show Spoiler + - Neutral Critters everywhere. - 6 player map - Most expansions are islands, except other mains. - Fairly small. Why it would be good in sc2: + Show Spoiler + - It is very hard to place buildings. Most units, if not all, that many people consider imbalanced come out of buildings. Less buildings = less imbaimba - Some complain that sc2 is “too easy” compared to BW. Having to clear out Critters could raise the skill ceiling and widen the gap between pros and Joes. - Many zerg players are often very sad about how hard it is to scout and pressure when there’s a wall. Not only do the critters make walling very difficult, the choke is quite large and it takes a lot of buildings to block. - Would encourage exciting air play because there are no air critters and air units mysteriously don’t collide anyway. Air play would also help secure the island bases. Possible Issues: + Show Spoiler + - Can’t place rocks because they would interfere with the Critters. - Sc2 critters are considerably easier to kill than BW Critters. - Hellion might be too powerful at clearing Critters. - WC3 players and their sick creep clearing skills might have an unfair advantage. Conversely, they might become too focused on killing the Critters, thinking it will make their units stronger. #2: Crystallis The Map: + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images/thumb/2/2c/Crystallis.jpg/600px-Crystallis.jpg) Notable Features: + Show Spoiler + - Many mineral patches all over the map, but without many minerals per patch. - No easily reached gas, you have to clear yourself a path there. - You can’t get access to your opponent without clearing enough patches. - The map is very small (64x64) Why it would be good in SC2: + Show Spoiler + - Most units that people claim to be imbalanced are gas heavy, like Colossus, Banshees, and Infestors. By making gas just about impossible to get, it is much harder to get these units. This may make the game more balanced. - People often complain about being cheesed. If you cant get gas or reach your opponent for 15 minutes, it will be much harder to cheese them. - Many current sc2 maps are criticized for making it hard to take bases. This map, however, is essentially one giant base. You can make a Command Center, Nexus, or Hatchery basically anywhere you want. - Depending on how many paths are cleared out, there can be many opportunities for counter-attacking and general aggression. Possible Issues: + Show Spoiler + - There’s not much room to place destructible rocks. I suppose some floating rocks could be put up to inhibit air movement. - Could potentially be Terran favoured for the following reasons: 1) Command Centers fly so you don’t have to keep making new ones. 2) Marines don’t cost gas and I hear they’re pretty good. 3) Mules provide an advantage in path-carving. 4) After some gas is reached, you can drop SCVs or mules to clear out a small hole in the minerals. Then you could drop a tank in there and freely siege whatever the hell you want to. #3: Demon’s Forest The Map:+ Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/maps/169_Demon's%20Forest.jpg) Notable Features: + Show Spoiler + - Covered in trees. - Trees block sight and inhibit movement. - Backdoor expo with cliff over it. Why it would be good in Sc2: + Show Spoiler + - Some people have complained about Watch Towers possibly giving too much map awareness. The forest is essentially the opposite of a Watch Tower. - Mules have historically been called imbalanced on occasion. The forest might force Terran to spend more energy on scans than he might otherwise want to. - On current Sc2 maps, it can sometimes be hard to hold expansions. The backdoor expansion combined with the increased risk of applying early pressure through the forest might make the expansion more safe. Possible Issues: + Show Spoiler + - Colossus don’t care about the trees because they’re so tall and have telescopes. - Baneling mines might be too powerful. - Can’t put Watch Towers because it would defeat the whole purpose of the map. - Getting surrounds is very hard. You have to surround an area of the map randomly and hope their army is there. #4: Peaks of Baekdu The Map: + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/maps/6_Sin%20Peaks%20of%20Baekdu.jpg) Actually I’m just joking, this map would be terrible in Sc2. I hope nobody ever does this one. #5: Showdown The Map: + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images/thumb/2/27/Showdown.jpg/199px-Showdown.jpg) Notable Features: + Show Spoiler + - Obscenely long rush distances. - Second gas base is very very far. - Cliffs over all the expansions. Also the main. Why it would be good in Sc2: + Show Spoiler + - The walking distance from main to main is roughly two days. This allows for longer, more macro-based games. - Since your second base will likely be gasless, zerg is encouraged to get more queens. This will help with the seemingly impossible task of creep spread. - Although the long distances make direct attacks difficult, the cliffs encourage harassment and ensure the game is action packed. - The many tight chokes, often overlooked by cliffs, provides a nice defender’s advantage. - There are many locations on the map that look like they desperately want destructible rocks. Possible Issues: + Show Spoiler + - So big that Watch Towers might not be that useful. - Planetary Fortresses might be too strong, especially on the gas bases in the middle. - Possible Zerg imbalance for the following reasons: 1) Zerg units are really fast and are therefore the least affected by the size of the map. 2) There is really only one lane that you have to spread creep on. If you’re really gosu you can spread around both sides in the center but is isn’t necessary. 3) Infestors are (obviously) the scariest unit that could be dropped on a cliff. There are a bunch more maps out there that could be moved over to Sc2 but I feel this will be sufficient for the time being. I have sent a copy of this over to Blizzard and am hoping to get a few of these put onto the ladder. At least two would be great, replacing Shakuras and Xel Naga Caverns. + Show Spoiler [Wtf?] + Ok basically I just wanted to show that not even BW was perfectly set with regards to maps. This was especially true in its earlier days (like we’re in for Sc2 right now) when Showdown was totally a legitimate pro map. Demon’s Forest was a real pro map as well, in 2008 no less. Though to be fair it only lasted 8 games. In short: Shitty maps happen. + Show Spoiler [Sources] + Images taken from TLPD or Liquipedia. Some of the “Notable Features” were taken from Liquipedia as well. <3 the Liquipedia people. well these maps are blizzard maps... they're pretty equal in quality as Searing Crater imo. | ||
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