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Issue with NASL First Seed vs Open Winner - Page 13

Forum Index > SC2 General
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sixfour
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
England11062 Posts
June 26 2011 18:55 GMT
#241
i don't get the issue. there's no real obvious weak spots, and you're going to have to beat multiple superelite players at some point if you want to win the $50k. sure, it sucks if you run into someone who's slightly better than everyone else in the first round, but that's a fault with having an ultra-crapshooty final format rather than who you've actually been drawn against
p: stats, horang2, free, jangbi z: soulkey, zero, shine, hydra t: leta, hiya, sea
PuercoPop
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Peru277 Posts
June 26 2011 19:43 GMT
#242
This is part of the 'growing pains' of NASL.

The first seasons are part of a transitory state. Remember the Top8 of the OpenTournament get into Season2 so with each iteration the better players will be in the main season and top seed will probably give an easier opponent. It is a good system for steady state. With each iteration it corrects its own flaws.

I only watch the GSL but ocasionally tune to the NASL and always has some good games each day.
The Proof of the Pudding is in the eating!
thepuppyassassin
Profile Joined April 2011
900 Posts
July 06 2011 21:17 GMT
#243
Geez another Korean in the grand finals. I didn't know that GSL changed venues.

So including the other Koreans in the top 8 of the open bracket, I'm counting about 14 Koreans who are definitely getting an invite to the next season. I'm also thinking more Koreans will get in via qualfiers.

Now i'm not sure how the qualifier works.. but if we simply go by the same stats as the open bracket (lets say another 5 get in). That's 19 Koreans in the next season out of 50 players in the group stages.

Correct me if I'm wrong.. but isn't this what the tournament admins NOT want? )something about it being a North American tournament and all that jazz).
SafeAsCheese
Profile Joined June 2011
United States4924 Posts
July 06 2011 21:19 GMT
#244
On July 07 2011 06:17 thepuppyassassin wrote:
Geez another Korean in the grand finals. I didn't know that GSL changed venues.

So including the other Koreans in the top 8 of the open bracket, I'm counting about 14 Koreans who are definitely getting an invite to the next season. I'm also thinking more Koreans will get in via qualfiers.

Now i'm not sure how the qualifier works.. but if we simply go by the same stats as the open bracket (lets say another 5 get in). That's 19 Koreans in the next season out of 50 players in the group stages.

Correct me if I'm wrong.. but isn't this what the tournament admins NOT want? )something about it being a North American tournament and all that jazz).

NA means the games are played on the NA servers, that's it

Anyone willing to play on our servers can participate.
laharl23
Profile Joined February 2011
United States582 Posts
July 06 2011 21:26 GMT
#245
On July 07 2011 06:19 SafeAsCheese wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2011 06:17 thepuppyassassin wrote:
Geez another Korean in the grand finals. I didn't know that GSL changed venues.

So including the other Koreans in the top 8 of the open bracket, I'm counting about 14 Koreans who are definitely getting an invite to the next season. I'm also thinking more Koreans will get in via qualfiers.

Now i'm not sure how the qualifier works.. but if we simply go by the same stats as the open bracket (lets say another 5 get in). That's 19 Koreans in the next season out of 50 players in the group stages.

Correct me if I'm wrong.. but isn't this what the tournament admins NOT want? )something about it being a North American tournament and all that jazz).

NA means the games are played on the NA servers, that's it

Anyone willing to play on our servers can participate.


The point hes trying to make is, its a north american league and eventually the league is going to be dominated by mostly koreans.

It would be like the gsl being dominated by over 50% north americans, do you think thats something the gsl would want?
DoomsVille
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada4885 Posts
July 06 2011 21:28 GMT
#246
On July 07 2011 06:17 thepuppyassassin wrote:
Geez another Korean in the grand finals. I didn't know that GSL changed venues.

So including the other Koreans in the top 8 of the open bracket, I'm counting about 14 Koreans who are definitely getting an invite to the next season. I'm also thinking more Koreans will get in via qualfiers.

Now i'm not sure how the qualifier works.. but if we simply go by the same stats as the open bracket (lets say another 5 get in). That's 19 Koreans in the next season out of 50 players in the group stages.

Correct me if I'm wrong.. but isn't this what the tournament admins NOT want? )something about it being a North American tournament and all that jazz).

Your numbers are a bit off. In the main bracket of NASL1 there are 9 koreans (1 of which is select... so 8.5 koreans? lol). In the open tournament, 5 koreans qualified for NASL2 (2 of which also got into the main bracket of NASL1). So that makes a total of 11 koreans + select.

There are only 4 spots available from the NASL2 qualifier (they are only have 45 people next season I believe). The qualifier has already been played and all 4 were korean. That makes a total of 15 koreans + select. And I believe ensnare qualified for season 2 (ranked 33) but wasn't high enough to make the playoffs. So there should be a total of 16 + Select next season.

About what the admins want... I think they just want the best players and to put on the best tournament. I don't think they really care if there are a ton of koreans.
Smurphy
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States374 Posts
July 06 2011 21:29 GMT
#247
On July 07 2011 06:26 laharl23 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2011 06:19 SafeAsCheese wrote:
On July 07 2011 06:17 thepuppyassassin wrote:
Geez another Korean in the grand finals. I didn't know that GSL changed venues.

So including the other Koreans in the top 8 of the open bracket, I'm counting about 14 Koreans who are definitely getting an invite to the next season. I'm also thinking more Koreans will get in via qualfiers.

Now i'm not sure how the qualifier works.. but if we simply go by the same stats as the open bracket (lets say another 5 get in). That's 19 Koreans in the next season out of 50 players in the group stages.

Correct me if I'm wrong.. but isn't this what the tournament admins NOT want? )something about it being a North American tournament and all that jazz).

NA means the games are played on the NA servers, that's it

Anyone willing to play on our servers can participate.


The point hes trying to make is, its a north american league and eventually the league is going to be dominated by mostly koreans.

It would be like the gsl being dominated by over 50% north americans, do you think thats something the gsl would want?


Your analogy doesn't work too well. The "NA" in NASL stands for North America. The "G" in GSL stands for "Global". Since the "G" in GSL stands for "Global" AND because America is a wealthy consumer nations that's great for advertisers and generating revenue... yes, I do think the GSL wants their league to be dominated by North Americans.
Imres
Profile Joined March 2011
515 Posts
July 09 2011 16:54 GMT
#248
NASL staff should try to explain to ret that his 1st seed wasn't bad... seriously...
Bobster
Profile Joined January 2011
Germany3075 Posts
July 09 2011 16:59 GMT
#249
The bottom 4 seeds including the Open winner should be pooled, and the first 4 seeds should be able to choose their Ro16 opponents from that pool.

There, all problems solved.
Imres
Profile Joined March 2011
515 Posts
July 09 2011 17:00 GMT
#250
On July 10 2011 01:59 Bobster wrote:
The bottom 4 seeds including the Open winner should be pooled, and the first 4 seeds should be able to choose their Ro16 opponents from that pool.

There, all problems solved.


Yeah but according to Xeris it wasn't a problem... People proposed a good amount of viable solution, and they still fucked up.
Zeon0
Profile Joined September 2010
Austria2995 Posts
July 09 2011 17:04 GMT
#251
20 KR, 20 EU, 10 NA (+/- 1 for SEn) seems fair, NA is a lot weaker than KR and EU, so i dont have a problem with fewer NAs. But i can understand, that in the NASL should be a reasonable number of NA players
Hater of MKP since GSL Open Season 2 | Fanboy of: NesTea Stephano IdrA DIMAGA MorroW ret DongRaeGu Snute SaSe Mvp ThorZaIN DeMusliM
acrimoneyius
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States983 Posts
July 09 2011 17:06 GMT
#252
Ret gets rewarded by facing arguably the strongest player in the tournament
Olinim
Profile Joined March 2011
4044 Posts
July 09 2011 17:08 GMT
#253
On July 10 2011 02:06 acrimoneyius wrote:
Ret gets rewarded by facing arguably the strongest player in the tournament

Not as unlucky as having to face MC like boxer xD
Irrelevant
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States2364 Posts
July 09 2011 17:08 GMT
#254
Why does everyone care so much about race and nationality isn't the goal of esports to watch the best of the best playing?
Soma.bokforlag
Profile Joined February 2011
Sweden448 Posts
July 09 2011 17:11 GMT
#255
On July 07 2011 06:26 laharl23 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2011 06:19 SafeAsCheese wrote:
On July 07 2011 06:17 thepuppyassassin wrote:
Geez another Korean in the grand finals. I didn't know that GSL changed venues.

So including the other Koreans in the top 8 of the open bracket, I'm counting about 14 Koreans who are definitely getting an invite to the next season. I'm also thinking more Koreans will get in via qualfiers.

Now i'm not sure how the qualifier works.. but if we simply go by the same stats as the open bracket (lets say another 5 get in). That's 19 Koreans in the next season out of 50 players in the group stages.

Correct me if I'm wrong.. but isn't this what the tournament admins NOT want? )something about it being a North American tournament and all that jazz).

NA means the games are played on the NA servers, that's it

Anyone willing to play on our servers can participate.


The point hes trying to make is, its a north american league and eventually the league is going to be dominated by mostly koreans.

It would be like the gsl being dominated by over 50% north americans, do you think thats something the gsl would want?


ideally people want to watch the best players possible.. premier league, serie a and la liga isnt exactly dominated by english, italian and spanish players
acrimoneyius
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States983 Posts
July 09 2011 17:12 GMT
#256
On July 10 2011 02:08 Olinim wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 10 2011 02:06 acrimoneyius wrote:
Ret gets rewarded by facing arguably the strongest player in the tournament

Not as unlucky as having to face MC like boxer xD


What's funny is boxer had an advantage in game 2 and botched it with his decision to attack MC's third instead of clashing armies. Boxer is pretty strong, but small things hold him back.
MaxField
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States2386 Posts
July 09 2011 17:13 GMT
#257
On July 10 2011 02:08 Irrelevant wrote:
Why does everyone care so much about race and nationality isn't the goal of esports to watch the best of the best playing?

Yes it is, but even in huge tournaments like March Madness, Top teams ranked #1 are put against the Weakest of the Top teams. That way they get rewarded for playing better than the other teams during the regular season. Sorting into the bracket makes or breaks certain teams.

This is why people were upset about the way NASL did it. They believed that Ret was playing a harder opponent becuase the Open Bracket Winner was likely better than many of the other people who qualified, and I agree with this.
"Zerg, so bad it loses to hydras" IdrA.
Irrelevant
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States2364 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-09 17:15:21
July 09 2011 17:14 GMT
#258
On July 10 2011 02:13 MaxField wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 10 2011 02:08 Irrelevant wrote:
Why does everyone care so much about race and nationality isn't the goal of esports to watch the best of the best playing?

Yes it is, but even in huge tournaments like March Madness, Top teams ranked #1 are put against the Weakest of the Top teams. That way they get rewarded for playing better than the other teams during the regular season. Sorting into the bracket makes or breaks certain teams.

This is why people were upset about the way NASL did it. They believed that Ret was playing a harder opponent becuase the Open Bracket Winner was likely better than many of the other people who qualified, and I agree with this.


I don't disagree with that.

However half the pages in this thread are full with "koreans shouldn't be allowed in a NORTH AMERICAN league, or only a very small amount!" Yet no one says anything about Euro players...
LimeNade
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States2125 Posts
July 09 2011 17:16 GMT
#259
orrrrrrrrrrrr NA players can learn to not suck so much and if they wanna be a "pro" gamer then get better. Use the koreans dominating your own turf as motivation to get better cause I as a spectator and player want to see the best play in a tournament for 100,000 dollar prize pool and if ever given the chance i wanna play against the best.
JD, need I say more? :D
FeeL_ThE_RusH
Profile Joined February 2010
Ireland227 Posts
July 09 2011 17:17 GMT
#260
You could have the top 8 seeds choose their opponents from the bottom 8 in descending order. Have to agree that there's an obvious problem with the way it panned out this season. It'll probably take a few seasons for the level of players in/outside the league to even out so that the open bracket player might possibly be the 16th seed skillwise.
#starcraft.ie on Quakenet, Irish SC2ers assemble
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