EPTCharge still does not hit - Page 6
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freetgy
1720 Posts
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Cartel
Canada255 Posts
On March 23 2011 18:07 willeesmalls wrote: what color are protoss tears? Charge is fine. If you don't think it's worth 200/200, don't get it. Your loss. edit: marauders have to stim. It takes like 17 marauder shots to kill a zealot given equal upgrades. Throw in the fact that marauders overkill, it's worth it for charge just to force stims. You are jokes. How about let's make stim just display the animation but not actually work. You dont like it? Dont upgrade it. Your loss. Now do you see how odd you sound? | ||
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MepHiii
Poland191 Posts
On March 23 2011 17:45 ceciljacobs wrote: boo hoo your 0 micro-mineral only-tank as fuck-dps machines can't be sitting on an army at all times I like you. | ||
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Redmark
Canada2129 Posts
On March 23 2011 17:50 ooni wrote: Ha? What are you on about? So charge is supposed to have an infinte range? Suppose an allied mothership recalled the marauder will the zealot charge at it like Speedbreaker until it is cancelled? Here is a diagram for everyone ![[image loading]](http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/5407/hitu.png) This is still the post that makes the most sense to me (despite the image quality). Are people saying that charging zealots should be immune to slow? That makes some sense. Other than that I have no idea what people want. | ||
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papaz
Sweden4149 Posts
On March 23 2011 20:55 Jerax wrote: As I see it, this charge buff would let the zealot get 1 hit while getting kited by stimmed marauders, Before, zealots would just run up to where the marauder originally was and end the charge, while the marauder was already a short distance away, having taken zero damage. My guess is this will be patched to work correctly soon. No it won't and if it would the impact is so huge I dont understand how there can't be already 100 threads on TL screaming WOW HUGE PROTOSS BUFF. You need to consider the following before discussing this: 1. Charge has a certain distance (lets for discussion say the distance is 5, idk what the real number is) 2. Attack should only go off if your are in melee distance Now here is an example: - Zealot get into charge distance and start charging - Same time mauruader stim and run opposite direction - Zealot has charged distance = 5 but not caught up to the mauruader (melee distance) due to maurader speed with stim What do you expect to happen here in order to hit the maurader without breaking rule 1) or 2) ? You want blizz to just "hell with charge distance, just keep charging until you are in melee range", or "throw the psi blades on the maurader to hit him". But just consider how big that buff is. GUARANTEE HIT. Let me say that again: GUARANTEE HIT. A-Move would have a whole new meaning when people are QQing about races and in this case protoss. "Toss only has to A-move chargelots without even thinking" would have a whole new meaning because this time it would actually be true because of the GUARANTEE HIT. No risk, no thinking. Just A-move. I excpect Suspense to do a new song about Toss then with the title "I A-move my chargelots". | ||
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freetgy
1720 Posts
Protoss has the worst Micropotential. A fleeing M&M can't be caught with FF cause they can outrun Sentry FF Range and dance around it to make you waste energy. People thought this small buff in return would give us the time to survive in such battles until HTs are ready to storm, since this is not the case, endless kiting is still possible. Zealots might have high dps on paper but their effective dps is way below standard, when your opponent micros properly. You on the other hand have no potential to micro, flanking with zealots (still possible obviously) Zealots are too slow, to get in the small charge range. | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
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papaz
Sweden4149 Posts
On March 23 2011 21:18 freetgy wrote: your talking like it is any different from today, Zealots always get A-Moved like Zerglings are to (flanking might be a thing but there is no Zealot Micro potential; except in PvP) Yeah, but at least you are taking a risk when a-moving them when they have charge. You risk of wasting the charge. With the change some were expecting the risk is completely eliminated. | ||
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ondik
Czech Republic2908 Posts
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Bactrian
Australia176 Posts
Currently: If a zealot reaches the unit after charging it will hit. What (some of) you want: If a zealot starts charge, it will always get a hit. What this would actually mean: If I fungal charging zealots, they would still hit. Magically. Just like people want zealots that don't get in range of marauders also magically hit. If you target a specific unit, but other units are in the way, the targeted unit still gets hit. Again, magically. Because in the case of the marauder it is never in attacking range of the zealot, just like all the other examples I gave. That's how dumb the idea of "guaranteed hits" is. Now say giving charging units some kind of snare immunity, that's a better idea. Of course the patch has only been out for 1-2 days, so maybe people should wait and see what the current change is like before jumping around crying "zealot dead in pvt"? | ||
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papaz
Sweden4149 Posts
On March 23 2011 21:20 zarepath wrote: Um, when your Marauder a-moves, that is also a "GUARANTEED HIT." Because it's ranged. So quit tossing that phrase around as if it's an obviously imbalanced concept, when every single freaking unit in the Terran arsenal does "GUARANTEED HITS". The entire POINT of the Charge upgrade is to get a guaranteed hit. Whatever the point is with charge, is a completely different discussion actually. I'm just saying that if that is what blizz ends up doing with charge I expect more threads about that change rather than seeing "why is blizz removing the losses from my bnet profile". | ||
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freetgy
1720 Posts
On March 23 2011 21:23 Bactrian wrote: What this would actually mean: If I fungal charging zealots, they would still hit. Magically. Just like people want zealots that don't get in range of marauders also magically hit. If you target a specific unit, but other units are in the way, the targeted unit still gets hit. Again, magically. Because in the case of the marauder it is never in attacking range of the zealot, just like all the other examples I gave. That's how dumb the idea of "guaranteed hits" is. Now say giving charging units some kind of snare immunity, that's a better idea. Of course the patch has only been out for 1-2 days, so maybe people should wait and see what the current change is like before jumping around crying "zealot dead in pvt"? how is that an argument, obviously fungal would cancel charge... charge lots should be immune or less affected by Shells, right now charge makes no difference in a kiting M&M&M ball. so what was the point to getting charge to begin with? | ||
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papaz
Sweden4149 Posts
On March 23 2011 21:21 ondik wrote: so what is the change then? You won't see the zealot making a stab into thin air anymore. | ||
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branflakes14
2082 Posts
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ParasitJonte
Sweden1768 Posts
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Bactrian
Australia176 Posts
On March 23 2011 21:24 freetgy wrote: how is that an argument, obviously fungal would cancel charge... So what is different about a charging zealot not being in range of because of fungal, and a charging zealot not being in a range because of concussive? What I am saying is if you want to arbitrarily give zealots hits even when never being in range (i.e., as in the case of stimmed marauders) thats going to produce some really stupid situations where zealots can hit units they never reach in other situations (i.e., when fungaled, when the target is surrounded by other units). | ||
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The KY
United Kingdom6252 Posts
On March 23 2011 21:27 ParasitJonte wrote: Just give us zealot speed and remove concussive shell. Jesus, it's so simple :/ Zealot speed; yes please. Remove conc shell; oh dear god no thank you. | ||
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Piski
Finland3461 Posts
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Double Letters
United States58 Posts
On March 23 2011 21:23 Bactrian wrote: So let's look at this the other way. Currently: If a zealot reaches the unit after charging it will hit. What (some of) you want: If a zealot starts charge, it will always get a hit. What this would actually mean: If I fungal charging zealots, they would still hit. Magically. Just like people want zealots that don't get in range of marauders also magically hit. If you target a specific unit, but other units are in the way, the targeted unit still gets hit. Again, magically. Because in the case of the marauder it is never in attacking range of the zealot, just like all the other examples I gave. That's how dumb the idea of "guaranteed hits" is. Now say giving charging units some kind of snare immunity, that's a better idea. Of course the patch has only been out for 1-2 days, so maybe people should wait and see what the current change is like before jumping around crying "zealot dead in pvt"? This is definitely a strawman argument, absolutely nobody here thinks charge should nullify fungal. Nor mothership recalls, or whatever other ridiculous scenario you can think of. This is specifically about marauders with concussive shell, stop trying to add other things in. | ||
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sleepingdog
Austria6145 Posts
On March 23 2011 20:40 Mercury- wrote: So I guess when all the P players say that mech is fine vs P it really means mech needs huge buffs? Well...yes...kinda. It indeed does mean that mech-play is nowhere near as efficient as bio play and usually not hard to deal with, if you and your opponent are of the same skill. | ||
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