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Before you post, read the title of this thread slowly and out loud. |
On February 24 2011 12:06 jaearess wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 12:01 gibbons_ wrote:
Before you hit the post button, just take a quick read through your post and ask yourself, "Is this something a Kingston, Sennheiser, Sony Ericsson, Intel, etc. customer service representative would say to a customer?" Yeah, you're right. I'd much rather have a giant corporate bureaucracy giving "official" answers after sitting on hold for three hours or waiting two weeks for an email. I'd much rather get a whitewashed, politically correct answer from a faceless person in a call center than a direct, honest answer from a well-known member of the community.
That's not really my point though.
I appreciate the honesty of their answers; just throwing it out there that it couldn't hurt to be more professional with the content of the answer.
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cheesemaster's guide to successful TL Posting:
Step 1: Create account on TL.
Step 2: Spend every post complaining about something in or around the NASL.
Step 3: ??
The logistics of a 50 person tournament, that is spread out for quite a while simply does not work with this many players from around the world. You're not asking them to drop what they're doing and come for a weekend, you're suggesting they do it for countless weeks or months on end. They're casting a few series a night and there are a whole, whole lot of series to go through.
What you want is what everybody wants. People want to see Europeans, Koreans, and Americans, etc.. to be able to play this game as a job. But until there are more sponsors, more money, and all of the things that go with it, you can't expect 50 people to stop what they're doing in life for a small shot. Your heart is in the right place, but you're not thinking about the logistics of it all and are merely plugging your ears while complaining it's not perfect.
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On February 24 2011 12:01 jaearess wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 11:50 cheesemaster wrote:
Wont it be really easy to just look them up on sc2ranks and figure it out, someone is bound to do that and ruin the results NASL is working directly with Blizzard to create a system so this won't be possible--anonymous dummy accounts or something similar. Do you really think they wouldn't have thought of that? Or that no one previous to you has thought of that, at least?
Nono i knew about the dummy accounts, but someone could still look up the dummy accounts on sc2ranks or something like that i know they wont be playing on their real accounts obvs.
I guess if the display name was different from the actual account name that would be fine , and im sure blizzard could accomadate something like that.
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Australia8532 Posts
On February 24 2011 12:06 jaearess wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 12:01 gibbons_ wrote:
Before you hit the post button, just take a quick read through your post and ask yourself, "Is this something a Kingston, Sennheiser, Sony Ericsson, Intel, etc. customer service representative would say to a customer?" Yeah, you're right. I'd much rather have a giant corporate bureaucracy giving "official" answers after sitting on hold for three hours or waiting two weeks for an email. I'd much rather get a whitewashed, politically correct answer from a faceless person in a call center than a direct, honest answer from a well-known member of the community.
If you think that was the point of his post you need to re-read it. Everything he said is 100% accurate and true. iNcontrol has an awesome personality; it is incredibly direct and hilariously sarcastic - but when it comes to business and personal there needs to be a separation.. We all love iNcontrol for who he is and what he has done; but alienating membesr of your potential target audience can never be the right approach; the biggest problem is that these communications come over a written forum where tone and intent cannot be accurately interpreted - this makes for a great deal of misunderstanding.. it isn't hard to turn light-hearted sarcasm into direct malicious insults over an internet forum..
It's got nothing to do with bureaucracy, politics or a faceless identity.. it has to do with professionalism in an attempt to legitimise esports as a serious enterprise. The more professional things are taken from the top; the more likely it is to trickle down to gamers and the audience..
Just my 2 cents 
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will a low quality stream be provided for those that have slow internet connections similar to the GSL free stream?
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On February 24 2011 12:09 I_Love_Bacon wrote:
cheesemaster's guide to successful TL Posting:
Step 1: Create account on TL.
Step 2: Spend every post complaining about something in or around the NASL.
Step 3: ??
The logistics of a 50 person tournament, that is spread out for quite a while simply does not work with this many players from around the world. You're not asking them to drop what they're doing and come for a weekend, you're suggesting they do it for countless weeks or months on end. They're casting a few series a night and there are a whole, whole lot of series to go through.
What you want is what everybody wants. People want to see Europeans, Koreans, and Americans, etc.. to be able to play this game as a job. But until there are more sponsors, more money, and all of the things that go with it, you can't expect 50 people to stop what they're doing in life for a small shot. Your heart is in the right place, but you're not thinking about the logistics of it all and are merely plugging your ears while complaining it's not perfect.
Lol totally agree with you as i stated in a previous post ( i know there is to many of mine to actualy read all that crap lol) i would love to see it the way you and i have described countless times. I mean people do it for korea i dont see why they couldnt do it in LA where the logistics seem far more realistic. What i do understand is the money is not there for them to do this yet =(
ah well im extremely happy with the gsl and i cant really say too much until i see the NASL its just not what i imagined it was going to be, when i first heard about it after the showmatch i was truly excited but as details came out i just seemed to get more and more dissapointed and my dissapointment ended up being let out on this account cheesemaster I really thought it was going to be the GSL of north america maybe over time it will be.
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
Can I ask, where is this "incontrol is so bad" shit coming from? I told a guy santa doesn't exist... sorry that part of me will always be there. I did not yell at him or call him names wtf?
If people are citing SOTG or my stream as some sort of "official NASL announcement" I feel bad for that perspective. I am absolutely aware of my personality and my responsibilities. I have gotten as far as I have because of how I treat both. At some point some of you are going to have to come to the hard truth that I indeed am not some raving lunatic monster with no thought. If I overstep my bounds I apologize and it's over. Usually I am just having a good time. That won't change with NASL sorry.
People are real quick to try and paint me as some upstart that is so abrasive I turn people away.. sorry guys that just simply isn't the case. I've been around longer than 99% of you and I've done well the entire time. Join me in making this thing great or sit by the sidelines and call me a jerk... it's your prerogative. I didn't get where I am today acting like a call center so I won't start now.
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On February 24 2011 10:22 Plexa wrote:
Being 'live' adds virtually nothing to the event in all honesty, if the games are good you'll still feel the rush of a live game.
I completely disagree.
It's like the Super Bowl, who would watch that after it's already done with?
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On February 24 2011 12:28 Creep wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 10:22 Plexa wrote:
Being 'live' adds virtually nothing to the event in all honesty, if the games are good you'll still feel the rush of a live game. I completely disagree. It's like the Super Bowl, who would watch that after it's already done with?
If no one had seen it or knew the results, I'd say most people.
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On February 24 2011 12:26 iNcontroL wrote:
Can I ask, where is this "incontrol is so bad" shit coming from? I told a guy santa doesn't exist... sorry that part of me will always be there. I did not yell at him or call him names wtf?
If people are citing SOTG or my stream as some sort of "official NASL announcement" I feel bad for that perspective. I am absolutely aware of my personality and my responsibilities. I have gotten as far as I have because of how I treat both. At some point some of you are going to have to come to the hard truth that I indeed am not some raving lunatic monster with no thought. If I overstep my bounds I apologize and it's over. Usually I am just having a good time. That won't change with NASL sorry.
People are real quick to try and paint me as some upstart that is so abrasive I turn people away.. sorry guys that just simply isn't the case. I've been around longer than 99% of you and I've done well the entire time. Join me in making this thing great or sit by the sidelines and call me a jerk... it's your prerogative. I didn't get where I am today acting like a call center so I won't start now.
I agree, iNcontrol is actually doing what most have only talked about. If you don't like him thats fine, but at least support him for what he is doing. I'm pretty sure he is putting a TON of work into making this NASL happen. So rather than trying so hard to find something wrong with the NASL, only to find something wrong with someone personally, lets just show support for NASL and try to give them GOOD feedback on what is missing or needs improvement.
So should we expect the opening song for the NASL gonna be "Whip My Hair"?
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On February 24 2011 12:26 iNcontroL wrote:
Can I ask, where is this "incontrol is so bad" shit coming from? I told a guy santa doesn't exist... sorry that part of me will always be there. I did not yell at him or call him names wtf?
If people are citing SOTG or my stream as some sort of "official NASL announcement" I feel bad for that perspective. I am absolutely aware of my personality and my responsibilities. I have gotten as far as I have because of how I treat both. At some point some of you are going to have to come to the hard truth that I indeed am not some raving lunatic monster with no thought. If I overstep my bounds I apologize and it's over. Usually I am just having a good time. That won't change with NASL sorry.
People are real quick to try and paint me as some upstart that is so abrasive I turn people away.. sorry guys that just simply isn't the case. I've been around longer than 99% of you and I've done well the entire time. Join me in making this thing great or sit by the sidelines and call me a jerk... it's your prerogative. I didn't get where I am today acting like a call center so I won't start now.
With 100% certainty I can say that you Sir have done a ton of good for the community and the game as a whole. The people posting here should be presenting you with an award not a pile of shit. Your a good caster, Entertaining Streaming, and all around knowledgeable guy about Starcraft, and Esports We would be pretty lost and way behind without people like you and your initiative to get things done. So let me put it this way. NASL is only a good thing. Let the 1st season run it's course look back on it and fix anything that needs fixing cause hind sight is 20/20 and right now everyone is only speculating things that don't exist yet.
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Incontrol you are posting like TB except with "we can make this great" tied in there. I think it is best to just not reply in these situations.
Great casters are not made by defending themselves, but by doing a dam good job. There's no reason to counter troll, as it wont reach a wide audience, and wont really change people's views.
Once things get rolling, and NASL proves itself, as I am SURE it will, there will be very little complaining. As a caster, you have no downsides, are funny, and know the game extremely well.
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
wellllllllllllll I was more curious not really trying to defend. Hence me saying "I will keep doing this" I dunno. But you are right it is better if I don't interact with the trolls too much.
That said I am a accessible person so it's kinda a fine line I walk lol
Anyways CHEERIO MATES
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On February 24 2011 12:26 iNcontroL wrote:
Can I ask, where is this "incontrol is so bad" shit coming from? I told a guy santa doesn't exist... sorry that part of me will always be there. I did not yell at him or call him names wtf?
If people are citing SOTG or my stream as some sort of "official NASL announcement" I feel bad for that perspective. I am absolutely aware of my personality and my responsibilities. I have gotten as far as I have because of how I treat both. At some point some of you are going to have to come to the hard truth that I indeed am not some raving lunatic monster with no thought. If I overstep my bounds I apologize and it's over. Usually I am just having a good time. That won't change with NASL sorry.
People are real quick to try and paint me as some upstart that is so abrasive I turn people away.. sorry guys that just simply isn't the case. I've been around longer than 99% of you and I've done well the entire time. Join me in making this thing great or sit by the sidelines and call me a jerk... it's your prerogative. I didn't get where I am today acting like a call center so I won't start now.
Dude i think your hilarious im a huge fan of your stream have watched numerous coaching sessions and even thought of purchasing one for myself as i am a fellow brotoss. I do have some concerns about the NASL that i have voiced numerous time on this thread. I think you will do a great job casting the NASL not such a huge fan of gretorp though it will be nice to see what kind of guest casters you can bring up as well :D As long as it is you casting with the guest casters. I wasnt very impressed with your casting in the showmatch but like you said on SOTG you were distracted with the syncing issues alot of the time, your true character didnt shine through 
anyways best of luck hope you guys figure everything out before the big day
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On February 24 2011 12:54 iNcontroL wrote:
wellllllllllllll I was more curious not really trying to defend. Hence me saying "I will keep doing this" I dunno. But you are right it is better if I don't interact with the trolls too much.
That said I am a accessible person so it's kinda a fine line I walk lol
Anyways CHEERIO MATES
You would be way better off not interacting with this thread period. Don't even look at it. The negativity alone will stress you out, I kinda sense it already is. Knowing how much heart you are putting into this you must be taking alot of it personally.
Just do your thing man, no matter what anyone says I can gaurantee you everyone here will be checking this out when it's here. You obviously have everyones attention, now capitilize on it. Focus on making this great and stop trying to interact with everyone cause you will never win.
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On February 24 2011 12:26 iNcontroL wrote:
Can I ask, where is this "incontrol is so bad" shit coming from? I told a guy santa doesn't exist... sorry that part of me will always be there. I did not yell at him or call him names wtf?
If people are citing SOTG or my stream as some sort of "official NASL announcement" I feel bad for that perspective. I am absolutely aware of my personality and my responsibilities. I have gotten as far as I have because of how I treat both. At some point some of you are going to have to come to the hard truth that I indeed am not some raving lunatic monster with no thought. If I overstep my bounds I apologize and it's over. Usually I am just having a good time. That won't change with NASL sorry.
People are real quick to try and paint me as some upstart that is so abrasive I turn people away.. sorry guys that just simply isn't the case. I've been around longer than 99% of you and I've done well the entire time. Join me in making this thing great or sit by the sidelines and call me a jerk... it's your prerogative. I didn't get where I am today acting like a call center so I won't start now.
I didn't mean to offend you; I was trying offer sincere advice to make NASL as great as it's going to be. You aren't a jerk - you are passionate about your venture and defend it as any entrepreneur would. I applaud that. The only point of my post was to illuminate the fact that you are speaking to customers, and to suggest that an attitude beyond 'love me or hate me' might be a big positive to the future of NASL.
To be fair, you don't speak to sponsors the way you speak to community members, right? My question is why?
I'm really not trying to troll here. I should hope that trolls don't put as much effort into thought-provoking conversations as I have tried to do so today 
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Yeah I agree iNc, don't read us. Or at least, not regular. Someone else can pass on the good ideas as appropriate.
Re the whole "live" thing. SC2 isn't the Superbowl, there are a lot of good tech reasons for having it not live, including cheating, inherent unreliability of the underlying technology (bnet etc) and so on. In addition the NASL people have made it clear they want to "package" the games and add value through some cool post-production and so on. How the games should be presented as a product (livecasted vs postproduced and glitzified) is a moot point; they've chosen the "extra glossy" option, let's see how it turns out.
I understand why people feel "if it's not live it's not the same", I admit deep down I feel that too. But that's at least partly becase I'm used to meatspace sporting events, where everything is different (can't cheat in skating by viewing a stream etc).
Basically, let them try it their way, see what the end product is like, is what I'm thinking.
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Vancouver14381 Posts
On February 24 2011 12:26 iNcontroL wrote:
Can I ask, where is this "incontrol is so bad" shit coming from? I told a guy santa doesn't exist... sorry that part of me will always be there. I did not yell at him or call him names wtf?
If people are citing SOTG or my stream as some sort of "official NASL announcement" I feel bad for that perspective. I am absolutely aware of my personality and my responsibilities. I have gotten as far as I have because of how I treat both. At some point some of you are going to have to come to the hard truth that I indeed am not some raving lunatic monster with no thought. If I overstep my bounds I apologize and it's over. Usually I am just having a good time. That won't change with NASL sorry.
People are real quick to try and paint me as some upstart that is so abrasive I turn people away.. sorry guys that just simply isn't the case. I've been around longer than 99% of you and I've done well the entire time. Join me in making this thing great or sit by the sidelines and call me a jerk... it's your prerogative. I didn't get where I am today acting like a call center so I won't start now.
I think that it's great of you to reply to the people who don't agree with how you do things. But really, sometimes I just think you need to quote HuK and say "Basically people need to stop talking so much shit." This feels a bit like the Kelly situation where people are going overboard when they should be giving constrictive feedback and logical reasoning for their arguments.
I don't think I've seen an answer to my question about tiebreakers yet, so I'll just assume that answer won't be available until the league actually starts.
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On February 24 2011 12:33 oursblanc wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 12:28 Creep wrote:On February 24 2011 10:22 Plexa wrote:
Being 'live' adds virtually nothing to the event in all honesty, if the games are good you'll still feel the rush of a live game. I completely disagree. It's like the Super Bowl, who would watch that after it's already done with? If no one had seen it or knew the results, I'd say most people.
Disagree 100%, maybe it's different in New Zealand, I'd guess less than 33%. I watch it every year, but wouldn't watch it whatsoever if it was recorded, I'd just go to ESPN and watch the highlights instead.
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On February 24 2011 13:42 FabledIntegral wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 12:33 oursblanc wrote:On February 24 2011 12:28 Creep wrote:On February 24 2011 10:22 Plexa wrote:
Being 'live' adds virtually nothing to the event in all honesty, if the games are good you'll still feel the rush of a live game. I completely disagree. It's like the Super Bowl, who would watch that after it's already done with? If no one had seen it or knew the results, I'd say most people. Disagree 100%, maybe it's different in New Zealand, I'd guess less than 33%. I watch it every year, but wouldn't watch it whatsoever if it was recorded, I'd just go to ESPN and watch the highlights instead.
Well, there wouldn't be any highlights until after it was aired, so...
Everyone in the audience is seeing it together for the first time regardless of it being live or not.
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EPT
