The very fact that we're making such a big deal out of this (while being reasonable and not flaming, which should tell you we aren't just being internet-angry-people) should tell you that this is important.
The fact that nobody has said 1 word about the fact that TSL games are not cast live, and there is over 100 pages of people talking about NASL games being cast essentially the same way is confusing to me.
Care to explain this?
Because the TSL is not claiming to be a North American equivalent of the GSL, it is just a simple tournament being run by one website. In addition, I'm fairly sure the actual TSL itself will be cast live, but even if it isn't, its not on the same scale, and the same expectation does not exist. We also won't be paying for the TSL games.
Every TSL event in the past has been cast off replays. The point is that, you're arguing that the "not live" cheapens the affect. However, we have documented proof (in the fact that TSL 1 and TSL 2 were HUGELY successful being cast ENTIRELY off replays, aka NOT live) that an event that is cast "not live" is just as exciting as an event that is cast "live" ...
The fact that TSL was free and NASL is not (you can watch NASL free stream so your argument is kind of a moot point because if you're watching NASL live you don't need to pay... if you're watching the VODS, you need to pay, but if you're watching the VOD its already by definition not live) relevant to anything.
Honestly, your argument isn't coherent. First you're saying "not live" cheapens the experience. Then I counter with some evidence that shows that "not live" events have just the same amount of interest / excitement. You then say "but that was free and this isn't"... well actually, it is. So, what are you arguing about?
Hmm i never knew that the TSL wasnt broadcast live, its the only tournament i havent watched to much but im pretty sure most people thought it was cast live, when i hear of a huge tournament i automatically assume that it is cast live. Most large sc2 tournament are that is just one example of one that isnt, but it also isnt going to be a league i think most people will hold NASL to similair standards of the gsl at least in regards to being broadcast live. A vast majority of the people in this thread have at least a mild problem with the NASL not being brodcast live, you keep brushing it off like its nothing no matter what you say though everyones mind works the same in this regard, it is just not as interesting when it is not broadcast live.
Im not saying it wont be succesful because of this but i do think it will be less succesful. Also i think far less people will be willing to pay for a HQ live stream that isnt live. I dont pay for the GSL premium service to watch the VOD's i like watching my events live I pay for the HQ stream so i dont have to watch my live event in rubbish quality.
How would people assume it was live when in the stream it clearly showed people opening replays, lol.
Yea sorry i meant people who hadnt seen it would assume it was live, like i said i havent really watched a TSL only the TSL opens wich i know are live. So I would assume if the lesser tournament were live the big one would be too but maybe thats just me.
Thats kind of lame they dont do it live, i would be a bit dissapointed finding that out because i was planning on watching the upcoming one of course, oh well at least i know now
The very fact that we're making such a big deal out of this (while being reasonable and not flaming, which should tell you we aren't just being internet-angry-people) should tell you that this is important.
The fact that nobody has said 1 word about the fact that TSL games are not cast live, and there is over 100 pages of people talking about NASL games being cast essentially the same way is confusing to me.
Care to explain this?
Because the TSL is not claiming to be a North American equivalent of the GSL, it is just a simple tournament being run by one website. In addition, I'm fairly sure the actual TSL itself will be cast live, but even if it isn't, its not on the same scale, and the same expectation does not exist. We also won't be paying for the TSL games.
Every TSL event in the past has been cast off replays. The point is that, you're arguing that the "not live" cheapens the affect. However, we have documented proof (in the fact that TSL 1 and TSL 2 were HUGELY successful being cast ENTIRELY off replays, aka NOT live) that an event that is cast "not live" is just as exciting as an event that is cast "live" ...
The fact that TSL was free and NASL is not (you can watch NASL free stream so your argument is kind of a moot point because if you're watching NASL live you don't need to pay... if you're watching the VODS, you need to pay, but if you're watching the VOD its already by definition not live) relevant to anything.
Honestly, your argument isn't coherent. First you're saying "not live" cheapens the experience. Then I counter with some evidence that shows that "not live" events have just the same amount of interest / excitement. You then say "but that was free and this isn't"... well actually, it is. So, what are you arguing about?
Hmm i never knew that the TSL wasnt broadcast live, its the only tournament i havent watched to much but im pretty sure most people thought it was cast live, when i hear of a huge tournament i automatically assume that it is cast live. Most large sc2 tournament are that is just one example of one that isnt, but it also isnt going to be a league i think most people will hold NASL to similair standards of the gsl at least in regards to being broadcast live. A vast majority of the people in this thread have at least a mild problem with the NASL not being brodcast live, you keep brushing it off like its nothing no matter what you say though everyones mind works the same in this regard, it is just not as interesting when it is not broadcast live.
Im not saying it wont be succesful because of this but i do think it will be less succesful. Also i think far less people will be willing to pay for a HQ live stream that isnt live. I dont pay for the GSL premium service to watch the VOD's i like watching my events live I pay for the HQ stream so i dont have to watch my live event in rubbish quality.
How would people assume it was live when in the stream it clearly showed people opening replays, lol.
Yea sorry i meant people who hadnt seen it would assume it was live, like i said i havent really watched a TSL only the TSL opens wich i know are live. So I would assume if the lesser tournament were live the big one would be too but maybe thats just me.
Thats kind of lame they dont do it live, i would be a bit dissapointed finding that out because i was planning on watching the upcoming one of course, oh well at least i know now
It's to prevent the players from cheating by watching the broadcasted stream. Although I have a solution!
Make it mandatory for all players to stream themselves with a webcam playing the game!!! No problemmmm yo.
The very fact that we're making such a big deal out of this (while being reasonable and not flaming, which should tell you we aren't just being internet-angry-people) should tell you that this is important.
The fact that nobody has said 1 word about the fact that TSL games are not cast live, and there is over 100 pages of people talking about NASL games being cast essentially the same way is confusing to me.
Care to explain this?
Because the TSL is not claiming to be a North American equivalent of the GSL, it is just a simple tournament being run by one website. In addition, I'm fairly sure the actual TSL itself will be cast live, but even if it isn't, its not on the same scale, and the same expectation does not exist. We also won't be paying for the TSL games.
Every TSL event in the past has been cast off replays. The point is that, you're arguing that the "not live" cheapens the affect. However, we have documented proof (in the fact that TSL 1 and TSL 2 were HUGELY successful being cast ENTIRELY off replays, aka NOT live) that an event that is cast "not live" is just as exciting as an event that is cast "live" ...
The fact that TSL was free and NASL is not (you can watch NASL free stream so your argument is kind of a moot point because if you're watching NASL live you don't need to pay... if you're watching the VODS, you need to pay, but if you're watching the VOD its already by definition not live) relevant to anything.
Honestly, your argument isn't coherent. First you're saying "not live" cheapens the experience. Then I counter with some evidence that shows that "not live" events have just the same amount of interest / excitement. You then say "but that was free and this isn't"... well actually, it is. So, what are you arguing about?
Hmm i never knew that the TSL wasnt broadcast live, its the only tournament i havent watched to much but im pretty sure most people thought it was cast live, when i hear of a huge tournament i automatically assume that it is cast live. Most large sc2 tournament are that is just one example of one that isnt, but it also isnt going to be a league i think most people will hold NASL to similair standards of the gsl at least in regards to being broadcast live. A vast majority of the people in this thread have at least a mild problem with the NASL not being brodcast live, you keep brushing it off like its nothing no matter what you say though everyones mind works the same in this regard, it is just not as interesting when it is not broadcast live.
Im not saying it wont be succesful because of this but i do think it will be less succesful. Also i think far less people will be willing to pay for a HQ live stream that isnt live. I dont pay for the GSL premium service to watch the VOD's i like watching my events live I pay for the HQ stream so i dont have to watch my live event in rubbish quality.
How would people assume it was live when in the stream it clearly showed people opening replays, lol.
Yea sorry i meant people who hadnt seen it would assume it was live, like i said i havent really watched a TSL only the TSL opens wich i know are live. So I would assume if the lesser tournament were live the big one would be too but maybe thats just me.
Thats kind of lame they dont do it live, i would be a bit dissapointed finding that out because i was planning on watching the upcoming one of course, oh well at least i know now
Any tournament cast online and live is jeopardising the integrity of their tournament. Any tournament wishing to be big or successful with a significant online component simply has to be done this way. Being 'live' adds virtually nothing to the event in all honesty, if the games are good you'll still feel the rush of a live game.
The very fact that we're making such a big deal out of this (while being reasonable and not flaming, which should tell you we aren't just being internet-angry-people) should tell you that this is important.
The fact that nobody has said 1 word about the fact that TSL games are not cast live, and there is over 100 pages of people talking about NASL games being cast essentially the same way is confusing to me.
Care to explain this?
Because the TSL is not claiming to be a North American equivalent of the GSL, it is just a simple tournament being run by one website. In addition, I'm fairly sure the actual TSL itself will be cast live, but even if it isn't, its not on the same scale, and the same expectation does not exist. We also won't be paying for the TSL games.
Every TSL event in the past has been cast off replays. The point is that, you're arguing that the "not live" cheapens the affect. However, we have documented proof (in the fact that TSL 1 and TSL 2 were HUGELY successful being cast ENTIRELY off replays, aka NOT live) that an event that is cast "not live" is just as exciting as an event that is cast "live" ...
The fact that TSL was free and NASL is not (you can watch NASL free stream so your argument is kind of a moot point because if you're watching NASL live you don't need to pay... if you're watching the VODS, you need to pay, but if you're watching the VOD its already by definition not live) relevant to anything.
Honestly, your argument isn't coherent. First you're saying "not live" cheapens the experience. Then I counter with some evidence that shows that "not live" events have just the same amount of interest / excitement. You then say "but that was free and this isn't"... well actually, it is. So, what are you arguing about?
Hmm i never knew that the TSL wasnt broadcast live, its the only tournament i havent watched to much but im pretty sure most people thought it was cast live, when i hear of a huge tournament i automatically assume that it is cast live. Most large sc2 tournament are that is just one example of one that isnt, but it also isnt going to be a league i think most people will hold NASL to similair standards of the gsl at least in regards to being broadcast live. A vast majority of the people in this thread have at least a mild problem with the NASL not being brodcast live, you keep brushing it off like its nothing no matter what you say though everyones mind works the same in this regard, it is just not as interesting when it is not broadcast live.
Im not saying it wont be succesful because of this but i do think it will be less succesful. Also i think far less people will be willing to pay for a HQ live stream that isnt live. I dont pay for the GSL premium service to watch the VOD's i like watching my events live I pay for the HQ stream so i dont have to watch my live event in rubbish quality.
How would people assume it was live when in the stream it clearly showed people opening replays, lol.
Yea sorry i meant people who hadnt seen it would assume it was live, like i said i havent really watched a TSL only the TSL opens wich i know are live. So I would assume if the lesser tournament were live the big one would be too but maybe thats just me.
Thats kind of lame they dont do it live, i would be a bit dissapointed finding that out because i was planning on watching the upcoming one of course, oh well at least i know now
It's to prevent the players from cheating by watching the broadcasted stream. Although I have a solution!
Make it mandatory for all players to stream themselves with a webcam playing the game!!! No problemmmm yo.
Or delay the stream by 10 minutes :D im pretty sure they do this with other tournaments. wouldnt be that hard to do i dont think
The very fact that we're making such a big deal out of this (while being reasonable and not flaming, which should tell you we aren't just being internet-angry-people) should tell you that this is important.
The fact that nobody has said 1 word about the fact that TSL games are not cast live, and there is over 100 pages of people talking about NASL games being cast essentially the same way is confusing to me.
Care to explain this?
Because the TSL is not claiming to be a North American equivalent of the GSL, it is just a simple tournament being run by one website. In addition, I'm fairly sure the actual TSL itself will be cast live, but even if it isn't, its not on the same scale, and the same expectation does not exist. We also won't be paying for the TSL games.
Every TSL event in the past has been cast off replays. The point is that, you're arguing that the "not live" cheapens the affect. However, we have documented proof (in the fact that TSL 1 and TSL 2 were HUGELY successful being cast ENTIRELY off replays, aka NOT live) that an event that is cast "not live" is just as exciting as an event that is cast "live" ...
The fact that TSL was free and NASL is not (you can watch NASL free stream so your argument is kind of a moot point because if you're watching NASL live you don't need to pay... if you're watching the VODS, you need to pay, but if you're watching the VOD its already by definition not live) relevant to anything.
Honestly, your argument isn't coherent. First you're saying "not live" cheapens the experience. Then I counter with some evidence that shows that "not live" events have just the same amount of interest / excitement. You then say "but that was free and this isn't"... well actually, it is. So, what are you arguing about?
Hmm i never knew that the TSL wasnt broadcast live, its the only tournament i havent watched to much but im pretty sure most people thought it was cast live, when i hear of a huge tournament i automatically assume that it is cast live. Most large sc2 tournament are that is just one example of one that isnt, but it also isnt going to be a league i think most people will hold NASL to similair standards of the gsl at least in regards to being broadcast live. A vast majority of the people in this thread have at least a mild problem with the NASL not being brodcast live, you keep brushing it off like its nothing no matter what you say though everyones mind works the same in this regard, it is just not as interesting when it is not broadcast live.
Im not saying it wont be succesful because of this but i do think it will be less succesful. Also i think far less people will be willing to pay for a HQ live stream that isnt live. I dont pay for the GSL premium service to watch the VOD's i like watching my events live I pay for the HQ stream so i dont have to watch my live event in rubbish quality.
How would people assume it was live when in the stream it clearly showed people opening replays, lol.
Yea sorry i meant people who hadnt seen it would assume it was live, like i said i havent really watched a TSL only the TSL opens wich i know are live. So I would assume if the lesser tournament were live the big one would be too but maybe thats just me.
Thats kind of lame they dont do it live, i would be a bit dissapointed finding that out because i was planning on watching the upcoming one of course, oh well at least i know now
Any tournament cast online and live is jeopardising the integrity of their tournament. Any tournament wishing to be big or successful with a significant online component simply has to be done this way. Being 'live' adds virtually nothing to the event in all honesty, if the games are good you'll still feel the rush of a live game.
Wouldnt delaying the stream by 10 minutes completly negate this? Like I said above im sure it wouldnt be that hard to do. Honestly i have no problem with it for a tournament like TSL. I just think a league like NASL should try to be Live if at all possible and delay the stream by 10 minutes or so
Wouldnt delaying the stream by 10 minutes completly negate this? Like I said above im sure it wouldnt be that hard to do. Honestly i have no problem with it for a tournament like TSL. I just think a league like NASL should try to be Live if at all possible and delay the stream by 10 minutes or so
What would happened when there's lag, disconnection or even worse, bnet 2.0 acting funny and take 1-2 hours to be able to play again? Casting games from replays is the best to ensure everything went smoothly.
The very fact that we're making such a big deal out of this (while being reasonable and not flaming, which should tell you we aren't just being internet-angry-people) should tell you that this is important.
The fact that nobody has said 1 word about the fact that TSL games are not cast live, and there is over 100 pages of people talking about NASL games being cast essentially the same way is confusing to me.
Care to explain this?
Because the TSL is not claiming to be a North American equivalent of the GSL, it is just a simple tournament being run by one website. In addition, I'm fairly sure the actual TSL itself will be cast live, but even if it isn't, its not on the same scale, and the same expectation does not exist. We also won't be paying for the TSL games.
Every TSL event in the past has been cast off replays. The point is that, you're arguing that the "not live" cheapens the affect. However, we have documented proof (in the fact that TSL 1 and TSL 2 were HUGELY successful being cast ENTIRELY off replays, aka NOT live) that an event that is cast "not live" is just as exciting as an event that is cast "live" ...
The fact that TSL was free and NASL is not (you can watch NASL free stream so your argument is kind of a moot point because if you're watching NASL live you don't need to pay... if you're watching the VODS, you need to pay, but if you're watching the VOD its already by definition not live) relevant to anything.
Honestly, your argument isn't coherent. First you're saying "not live" cheapens the experience. Then I counter with some evidence that shows that "not live" events have just the same amount of interest / excitement. You then say "but that was free and this isn't"... well actually, it is. So, what are you arguing about?
Hmm i never knew that the TSL wasnt broadcast live, its the only tournament i havent watched to much but im pretty sure most people thought it was cast live, when i hear of a huge tournament i automatically assume that it is cast live. Most large sc2 tournament are that is just one example of one that isnt, but it also isnt going to be a league i think most people will hold NASL to similair standards of the gsl at least in regards to being broadcast live. A vast majority of the people in this thread have at least a mild problem with the NASL not being brodcast live, you keep brushing it off like its nothing no matter what you say though everyones mind works the same in this regard, it is just not as interesting when it is not broadcast live.
Im not saying it wont be succesful because of this but i do think it will be less succesful. Also i think far less people will be willing to pay for a HQ live stream that isnt live. I dont pay for the GSL premium service to watch the VOD's i like watching my events live I pay for the HQ stream so i dont have to watch my live event in rubbish quality.
How would people assume it was live when in the stream it clearly showed people opening replays, lol.
Yea sorry i meant people who hadnt seen it would assume it was live, like i said i havent really watched a TSL only the TSL opens wich i know are live. So I would assume if the lesser tournament were live the big one would be too but maybe thats just me.
Thats kind of lame they dont do it live, i would be a bit dissapointed finding that out because i was planning on watching the upcoming one of course, oh well at least i know now
Any tournament cast online and live is jeopardising the integrity of their tournament. Any tournament wishing to be big or successful with a significant online component simply has to be done this way. Being 'live' adds virtually nothing to the event in all honesty, if the games are good you'll still feel the rush of a live game.
I agree with your post with the exception of the bold, and I'd say a lot of the community would agree with me, as evident by responses in this topic. I remember being marginally disappointed for the TSL2 as well upon realizing it wasn't live. I stated I agree with the rest of your post however, and understand that the integrity of a tournament trumps the added benefit of having it live, I just simply disagree you can say it adds nothing.
The entire mindset of "it's happening NOW" is absolutely huge for me. I remember as a kid, certain hockey games were delayed by 3 hours on television for whatever reason. I would instead watch another game, and eagerly wait and watch the score updates scroll through the list of other teams playing at the bottom, seeing if there would be a change in score. I would never actually watch the game 3 hours later, I had no urge to see a game where the score had already been decided. It simply took away from the thrill. There's a reason I, as well as a lot of other people, will follow LR threads as games are happening instead of waiting for the VODs to come out.
The very fact that we're making such a big deal out of this (while being reasonable and not flaming, which should tell you we aren't just being internet-angry-people) should tell you that this is important.
The fact that nobody has said 1 word about the fact that TSL games are not cast live, and there is over 100 pages of people talking about NASL games being cast essentially the same way is confusing to me.
Care to explain this?
Because the TSL is not claiming to be a North American equivalent of the GSL, it is just a simple tournament being run by one website. In addition, I'm fairly sure the actual TSL itself will be cast live, but even if it isn't, its not on the same scale, and the same expectation does not exist. We also won't be paying for the TSL games.
Every TSL event in the past has been cast off replays. The point is that, you're arguing that the "not live" cheapens the affect. However, we have documented proof (in the fact that TSL 1 and TSL 2 were HUGELY successful being cast ENTIRELY off replays, aka NOT live) that an event that is cast "not live" is just as exciting as an event that is cast "live" ...
The fact that TSL was free and NASL is not (you can watch NASL free stream so your argument is kind of a moot point because if you're watching NASL live you don't need to pay... if you're watching the VODS, you need to pay, but if you're watching the VOD its already by definition not live) relevant to anything.
Honestly, your argument isn't coherent. First you're saying "not live" cheapens the experience. Then I counter with some evidence that shows that "not live" events have just the same amount of interest / excitement. You then say "but that was free and this isn't"... well actually, it is. So, what are you arguing about?
Hmm i never knew that the TSL wasnt broadcast live, its the only tournament i havent watched to much but im pretty sure most people thought it was cast live, when i hear of a huge tournament i automatically assume that it is cast live. Most large sc2 tournament are that is just one example of one that isnt, but it also isnt going to be a league i think most people will hold NASL to similair standards of the gsl at least in regards to being broadcast live. A vast majority of the people in this thread have at least a mild problem with the NASL not being brodcast live, you keep brushing it off like its nothing no matter what you say though everyones mind works the same in this regard, it is just not as interesting when it is not broadcast live.
Im not saying it wont be succesful because of this but i do think it will be less succesful. Also i think far less people will be willing to pay for a HQ live stream that isnt live. I dont pay for the GSL premium service to watch the VOD's i like watching my events live I pay for the HQ stream so i dont have to watch my live event in rubbish quality.
How would people assume it was live when in the stream it clearly showed people opening replays, lol.
Yea sorry i meant people who hadnt seen it would assume it was live, like i said i havent really watched a TSL only the TSL opens wich i know are live. So I would assume if the lesser tournament were live the big one would be too but maybe thats just me.
Thats kind of lame they dont do it live, i would be a bit dissapointed finding that out because i was planning on watching the upcoming one of course, oh well at least i know now
Any tournament cast online and live is jeopardising the integrity of their tournament. Any tournament wishing to be big or successful with a significant online component simply has to be done this way. Being 'live' adds virtually nothing to the event in all honesty, if the games are good you'll still feel the rush of a live game.
Wouldnt delaying the stream by 10 minutes completly negate this? Like I said above im sure it wouldnt be that hard to do. Honestly i have no problem with it for a tournament like TSL. I just think a league like NASL should try to be Live if at all possible and delay the stream by 10 minutes or so
No, because it could still give way to things like hidden expansions, proxy tech, etc. Even some casters talk about strategy they expect each player to use in the series, etc. At the very minimum, it would need to be a half hour.
Wouldnt delaying the stream by 10 minutes completly negate this? Like I said above im sure it wouldnt be that hard to do. Honestly i have no problem with it for a tournament like TSL. I just think a league like NASL should try to be Live if at all possible and delay the stream by 10 minutes or so
What would happened when there's lag, disconnection or even worse, bnet 2.0 acting funny and take 1-2 hours to be able to play again? Casting games from replays is the best to ensure everything went smoothly.
You deal with it, like the GSL does. The chances of this happening are often minimal. Also, even with replays, they usually will broadcast the disconnect game first, then say "oh no, DC!" and then broadcast the regame.
You have stated that recording the games and broadcasting them later will allow you to accommodate European players by allowing them to play at normal hours. I really appreciate this and feel that making sure the player's playing conditions are optimal is crucial in providing a high quality product.
Question: Will you be making it possible for two non North American players that meet in the group stage to play their games on their server? (EU/LA/SEA/KR) This will require you to setup more dummy accounts as well as accounts for the casters, but with Blizzard's support this should not be an issue.
The very fact that we're making such a big deal out of this (while being reasonable and not flaming, which should tell you we aren't just being internet-angry-people) should tell you that this is important.
The fact that nobody has said 1 word about the fact that TSL games are not cast live, and there is over 100 pages of people talking about NASL games being cast essentially the same way is confusing to me.
Care to explain this?
Because the TSL is not claiming to be a North American equivalent of the GSL, it is just a simple tournament being run by one website. In addition, I'm fairly sure the actual TSL itself will be cast live, but even if it isn't, its not on the same scale, and the same expectation does not exist. We also won't be paying for the TSL games.
Every TSL event in the past has been cast off replays. The point is that, you're arguing that the "not live" cheapens the affect. However, we have documented proof (in the fact that TSL 1 and TSL 2 were HUGELY successful being cast ENTIRELY off replays, aka NOT live) that an event that is cast "not live" is just as exciting as an event that is cast "live" ...
The fact that TSL was free and NASL is not (you can watch NASL free stream so your argument is kind of a moot point because if you're watching NASL live you don't need to pay... if you're watching the VODS, you need to pay, but if you're watching the VOD its already by definition not live) relevant to anything.
Honestly, your argument isn't coherent. First you're saying "not live" cheapens the experience. Then I counter with some evidence that shows that "not live" events have just the same amount of interest / excitement. You then say "but that was free and this isn't"... well actually, it is. So, what are you arguing about?
Hmm i never knew that the TSL wasnt broadcast live, its the only tournament i havent watched to much but im pretty sure most people thought it was cast live, when i hear of a huge tournament i automatically assume that it is cast live. Most large sc2 tournament are that is just one example of one that isnt, but it also isnt going to be a league i think most people will hold NASL to similair standards of the gsl at least in regards to being broadcast live. A vast majority of the people in this thread have at least a mild problem with the NASL not being brodcast live, you keep brushing it off like its nothing no matter what you say though everyones mind works the same in this regard, it is just not as interesting when it is not broadcast live.
Im not saying it wont be succesful because of this but i do think it will be less succesful. Also i think far less people will be willing to pay for a HQ live stream that isnt live. I dont pay for the GSL premium service to watch the VOD's i like watching my events live I pay for the HQ stream so i dont have to watch my live event in rubbish quality.
How would people assume it was live when in the stream it clearly showed people opening replays, lol.
Yea sorry i meant people who hadnt seen it would assume it was live, like i said i havent really watched a TSL only the TSL opens wich i know are live. So I would assume if the lesser tournament were live the big one would be too but maybe thats just me.
Thats kind of lame they dont do it live, i would be a bit dissapointed finding that out because i was planning on watching the upcoming one of course, oh well at least i know now
Any tournament cast online and live is jeopardising the integrity of their tournament. Any tournament wishing to be big or successful with a significant online component simply has to be done this way. Being 'live' adds virtually nothing to the event in all honesty, if the games are good you'll still feel the rush of a live game.
Wouldnt delaying the stream by 10 minutes completly negate this? Like I said above im sure it wouldnt be that hard to do. Honestly i have no problem with it for a tournament like TSL. I just think a league like NASL should try to be Live if at all possible and delay the stream by 10 minutes or so
And in the event of a disconnect? Or lag? etc. There are further implications beyond creating a fair gaming environment.
Do you want to face drama and cheating acquisations on a daily basis, TL flodded with posts about proof that ____ cheated against _____ as he clearly was watching the stream
Or
Will you accept that the game might be 1 day old but 100% free of any drama?
There is no third choice, unless you still believe people are all good and great and would never do such a thing
I love live events but its a sacrifice im willing to take, and so should everyone considering what this is about. Esport+streaming just has thatproblem, especially when its a RTS game. Had this been about Street Fighter 4 it wouldnt have been a issue obviously by design.
so here is my question, its nothing about u would think of first but for me it plays a really huge part of a tournament.
im talking about music.
proleague and winnersleague are basically where it all comes from and u are aiming in the same direction so why not take the standards right. so for every season they have like 5-6 songs for intro, pregame, aftergame etc. Mostly american punk/rock/metal/emo stuff because it fits the best to hype and get into the right mood. atleast for me it fits perfectly.
so if u listen to something like that:
BOOM korean air osl2
or:
its ofc GSL 1.
i just identify the league through this....when u talking in 2014 about this 'one' song and u will get the memories from nasl 1.
gsl may overextend this in using basically every day a different one, thats not how it should be. so its a huge part for me, and i might not be the only one who thinks like that.
Will this be a part of nasl or do u consider anything like that?
Live broadcasts is pretty important, at least in the future. I don't like watching sporting events recorded so if this is for North Americans and you want to compete with prime time TV, then you should do it live.
Now, I know that the broadcasting teams for sports have a lot more experience with live TV in order to make everything smooth, but I think you should work towards this.
That being said, I also watch the GSL every day on VODs since I can't get up at 4AM, so maybe it's not too bad. Their VODs are higher quality than their HQ live stream as well, though, which sort of makes up for not being live.
On February 24 2011 03:03 motioncity wrote: i am extremely disappointed that this will not be live. that is part of the greatness of the GSL knowing that it is live and the x-factor that we can see live new strategies that have never been seen before. also the showmatch was great and all but it was very easy to tell that is was pre-recorded and if it had been any other two players in the world i probably would have not watched as the production value was not that great. i would much rather seen the loading screen with two players than know that im watching a replay. and i was planning on paying for the premium stream but knowing that it will not be live there is no way that i will pay to watch a stream of replays. kthxbye
edit: no high level quality of production will be worth the fact of it not being live.
TSL Open's = not live TSL1-2 = Not live (not sure about 3 but, probably!)
With stream cheating and us wanting to do production for the shows and cut the idle shit between matches you should know everything live SAVE FOR the actual broadcast = great
Also santa doesn't exist.
i appreciate you responding to my post and what you guys are doing for e-sports here. i do watch TSL and dont like that the casters usually end up waiting for replays but i thought since you guys are having seasons i figured you were more trying to emulate GSL. not saying your trying to copy GSL which i know is not your goal, but if is this is a league and not just several tournaments put together i think that being live does add something to NASL. obviously you guys think that not being live will add more to production value which probably will happen as you get more practice, i just wanted to get my opinion in. also i understand that he GSL has everyone there in the studio playing but they also deal with disconnects and problems associated with being live. to me GSL is the gold standard and love nearly everything about it except staying up until 6am watching but to me it is worth it because we dont have anything else like it as an option. i know i dont speak for everyone but to be a paying customer live is almost neccessary. also MLG is well run i think and they have many viewers and deal with the "liveness" of playing, casting, and streaming. i know this is your guys' "baby" and are going to do it your way
As long as the results of the games aren't spoiled, then this system will work out just fine. I think one of the largest "fines" should be if a player spoils his result.
I really wish Blizz could figure out a way to hide the NASL accounts from Bnet so there would be no way for anyone to look at the results that way.
You just know some nerd will get his jollies off spoiling the results.
Looking forward to this and wishing you all the success.
Lastly, I don't have any problem with the format and the 5 players per team limit. You could see in GSL where having two members of oGs in the same group affected the outcome of the MC/Hyperdub match.
The very fact that we're making such a big deal out of this (while being reasonable and not flaming, which should tell you we aren't just being internet-angry-people) should tell you that this is important.
The fact that nobody has said 1 word about the fact that TSL games are not cast live, and there is over 100 pages of people talking about NASL games being cast essentially the same way is confusing to me.
Care to explain this?
Because the TSL is not claiming to be a North American equivalent of the GSL, it is just a simple tournament being run by one website. In addition, I'm fairly sure the actual TSL itself will be cast live, but even if it isn't, its not on the same scale, and the same expectation does not exist. We also won't be paying for the TSL games.
Every TSL event in the past has been cast off replays. The point is that, you're arguing that the "not live" cheapens the affect. However, we have documented proof (in the fact that TSL 1 and TSL 2 were HUGELY successful being cast ENTIRELY off replays, aka NOT live) that an event that is cast "not live" is just as exciting as an event that is cast "live" ...
The fact that TSL was free and NASL is not (you can watch NASL free stream so your argument is kind of a moot point because if you're watching NASL live you don't need to pay... if you're watching the VODS, you need to pay, but if you're watching the VOD its already by definition not live) relevant to anything.
Honestly, your argument isn't coherent. First you're saying "not live" cheapens the experience. Then I counter with some evidence that shows that "not live" events have just the same amount of interest / excitement. You then say "but that was free and this isn't"... well actually, it is. So, what are you arguing about?
Hmm i never knew that the TSL wasnt broadcast live, its the only tournament i havent watched to much but im pretty sure most people thought it was cast live, when i hear of a huge tournament i automatically assume that it is cast live. Most large sc2 tournament are that is just one example of one that isnt, but it also isnt going to be a league i think most people will hold NASL to similair standards of the gsl at least in regards to being broadcast live. A vast majority of the people in this thread have at least a mild problem with the NASL not being brodcast live, you keep brushing it off like its nothing no matter what you say though everyones mind works the same in this regard, it is just not as interesting when it is not broadcast live.
Im not saying it wont be succesful because of this but i do think it will be less succesful. Also i think far less people will be willing to pay for a HQ live stream that isnt live. I dont pay for the GSL premium service to watch the VOD's i like watching my events live I pay for the HQ stream so i dont have to watch my live event in rubbish quality.
How would people assume it was live when in the stream it clearly showed people opening replays, lol.
Yea sorry i meant people who hadnt seen it would assume it was live, like i said i havent really watched a TSL only the TSL opens wich i know are live. So I would assume if the lesser tournament were live the big one would be too but maybe thats just me.
Thats kind of lame they dont do it live, i would be a bit dissapointed finding that out because i was planning on watching the upcoming one of course, oh well at least i know now
Any tournament cast online and live is jeopardising the integrity of their tournament. Any tournament wishing to be big or successful with a significant online component simply has to be done this way. Being 'live' adds virtually nothing to the event in all honesty, if the games are good you'll still feel the rush of a live game.
Wouldnt delaying the stream by 10 minutes completly negate this? Like I said above im sure it wouldnt be that hard to do. Honestly i have no problem with it for a tournament like TSL. I just think a league like NASL should try to be Live if at all possible and delay the stream by 10 minutes or so
And in the event of a disconnect? Or lag? etc. There are further implications beyond creating a fair gaming environment.
Like said above deal with it the way GSL does, it rarely happens and when it does there has never been more than a 10 minute delay wich really isnt a big deal for the added benifit of watching something live. The stream could be delayed by up to half an hour its not really a big deal thats still live enough for me. Honestly i just wish it was all live broadcast in a studio where you could actually see the players its 10x more exciting that way. and there is no chance of cheating either the whole online tournament causes alot of problems,
I compeletly understand the way its done for the TSL that doesnt bother me in the slightest, but for the NASL its a league and having most of it online takes out alot of the fun. People say that it doesnt work in the states for people drop everything and travel to LA for this league, but i guarantee you all the best players would. ALot of players have travelled to korea in attempt to qualify and made it work over there. Not many have qualified but thats besides the point. I dont want to watch players who have a job on the side and dont view the game as a proffesion i want to watch progamers duke it out to see who is the best in the world. Attending a league in LA would be much easier and more realistic for most players then travelling to korea and trying to qualify without any guarantee of being in the tournament i dont think it would be nearly as big of a problem as people make it out to be. I just think that the money isnt there for them to do it this way yet.
On February 24 2011 11:04 Pudge_172 wrote: As long as the results of the games aren't spoiled, then this system will work out just fine. I think one of the largest "fines" should be if a player spoils his result.
I really wish Blizz could figure out a way to hide the NASL accounts from Bnet so there would be no way for anyone to look at the results that way.
You just know some nerd will get his jollies off spoiling the results.
Looking forward to this and wishing you all the success.
Lastly, I don't have any problem with the format and the 5 players per team limit. You could see in GSL where having two members of oGs in the same group affected the outcome of the MC/Hyperdub match.
Wont it be really easy to just look them up on sc2ranks and figure it out, someone is bound to do that and ruin the results
On February 24 2011 11:04 Pudge_172 wrote: As long as the results of the games aren't spoiled, then this system will work out just fine. I think one of the largest "fines" should be if a player spoils his result.
I really wish Blizz could figure out a way to hide the NASL accounts from Bnet so there would be no way for anyone to look at the results that way.
You just know some nerd will get his jollies off spoiling the results.
Looking forward to this and wishing you all the success.
Lastly, I don't have any problem with the format and the 5 players per team limit. You could see in GSL where having two members of oGs in the same group affected the outcome of the MC/Hyperdub match.
Wont it be really easy to just look them up on sc2ranks and figure it out, someone is bound to do that and ruin the results
While I and the community appreciate what you are doing to the nth degree, I feel like something should be said for you to consider. This is my first post on TeamLiquid - I left the shadows of lurking to offer this advice.
You are now operating a business. Whether you like it or not, this is no longer just gaming. This may be your career from here on out. You are well respected community members, but you are no longer just well known SC players making posts about the game.
In both posts by iNcontroL and Xeris, you two seem to be taking the criticism of NASL very personally. Your responses are defensive and sometimes rude. You are now speaking to your CUSTOMERS. People who will be buying your high quality streams and clicking on the advertisements during the free streams.
Saying things to us like "Santa doesn't exist" and telling us that our arguments are incoherent and, to paraphrase, 'stupid', is very unprofessional.
Before you reply to anyone commenting or questioning NASL, please understand that you are the only professional representatives of your business venture. There are real corporations backing this with real money on the line. Before you hit the post button, just take a quick read through your post and ask yourself, "Is this something a Kingston, Sennheiser, Sony Ericsson, Intel, etc. customer service representative would say to a customer?"
You guys haven't directly insulted me at all. I'm just trying to offer some friendly advice from someone who knows a modest amount of the business world.
Thanks for all your effort and keep it up! I look forward to buying your HQ stream
On February 24 2011 11:50 cheesemaster wrote: Wont it be really easy to just look them up on sc2ranks and figure it out, someone is bound to do that and ruin the results
NASL is working directly with Blizzard to create a system so this won't be possible--anonymous dummy accounts or something similar. Do you really think they wouldn't have thought of that? Or that no one previous to you has thought of that, at least?
On February 24 2011 12:01 gibbons_ wrote: Before you hit the post button, just take a quick read through your post and ask yourself, "Is this something a Kingston, Sennheiser, Sony Ericsson, Intel, etc. customer service representative would say to a customer?"
Yeah, you're right. I'd much rather have a giant corporate bureaucracy giving "official" answers after sitting on hold for three hours or waiting two weeks for an email. I'd much rather get a whitewashed, politically correct answer from a faceless person in a call center than a direct, honest answer from a well-known member of the community.
EPT
