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Elky might play SC2 - Page 5

Forum Index > SC2 General
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Natt
Profile Joined August 2010
France253 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-10-10 11:28:06
October 10 2010 11:27 GMT
#81
He recently play an exhib match in Paris, where he clearly stated (after his win) that he would not be part of the SC2 pro-scene. Though, he admit to be eager to play SC2 more, for fun, cos it's so good ya know It's on youtube (french interview).

That's too bad i know
Borked
Profile Joined October 2010
221 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-10-10 11:32:09
October 10 2010 11:27 GMT
#82
On October 10 2010 18:22 some_pro wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 10 2010 13:50 Borked wrote:
On October 10 2010 13:43 loving it wrote:
Can someone explain why alot of former progamers turn to poker?


cause you forfeit your education (for most progamers) so you don't have any special field. you either work your life from rock bottom or you go in a risky business like gambling.

and as a professional RTS player, you have counters, early-mid-late games, cheese, hidden tech, "mindgames", etc. strategies those can be applied to poker.


Poker is not gambling


I know what Poker is thanks.

When I was using the word gambling I was just simply trying to categorize it. I didn't know someone would use that word in bold and would get all correcting...

I don't want to derail the thread to a "Poker, is it gambling?" discussion but to an average person, if there is money in it, if luck is in it, if it's played with cards, if it's also played in casinos like many other places, it's gambling.

Anyway, ElkY is the man.
Thou shall not crave thy neighbor.
Kokujin
Profile Joined July 2010
United States456 Posts
October 10 2010 11:28 GMT
#83
On October 10 2010 20:11 Fruscainte wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 10 2010 20:05 Dantelew wrote:
On October 10 2010 18:22 some_pro wrote:
On October 10 2010 13:50 Borked wrote:
On October 10 2010 13:43 loving it wrote:
Can someone explain why alot of former progamers turn to poker?


cause you forfeit your education (for most progamers) so you don't have any special field. you either work your life from rock bottom or you go in a risky business like gambling.

and as a professional RTS player, you have counters, early-mid-late games, cheese, hidden tech, "mindgames", etc. strategies those can be applied to poker.


Poker is not gambling


Don't kid yourself, even the best pros and theorists admit that you're crazy if you can believe that poker is not gambling.


For random people, yes, it's at the very basis, gambling.

At pro level, I dont think you realize how much skill goes into it. Gambling implies that it's all luck that goes into it; further implying that randoms should always be winning tournaments and not the same people over and over. I may not be a pro, but I think I can safely say that Poker is more about reading your opponents emotions and facial expressions, figuring out potential chance of flops, managing money, than it is getting good hands and hoping to win.

I'm learning some basic poker math right now, that gives me probability. Let's say I got a Queen and a King of diamonds, and on the flop there is Jack of diamonds. I am learning to accurately figure out what my chances are, taking into the account of X for my opponents hands, for me getting a flush or a straight (or any mix of the two) on the next two cards. It may be something fun that I'm learning, it may be something at least at the very minimum that pros do. Poker is not gambling. Slots are gambling.


lol, this post is very wrong and made me chuckle. even at the 'pro level', poker is widely accepted as a form of gambling. 'reading opponents faces' is certainly an aspect of the game but realistically affects <5% of decisions.
tyr
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
France1686 Posts
October 10 2010 11:29 GMT
#84
While I would love to see a fellow frenchman and such a legendary BW player come back, he never said in that interview nor anywhere else that he was interested in playing competitively again.
More like the opposite. He has a contract with pokerstars and is making a lot of money. If he quit starcraft in the first place it was to be able to focus on poker more.
"I'm always reminded of how manly Jaedong is every time I see him." -Bisu
Yenticha
Profile Joined July 2010
257 Posts
October 10 2010 11:41 GMT
#85
On October 10 2010 20:27 Natt wrote:
He recently play an exhib match in Paris, where he clearly stated (after his win) that he would not be part of the SC2 pro-scene. Though, he admit to be eager to play SC2 more, for fun, cos it's so good ya know It's on youtube (french interview).

That's too bad i know


wait...what?? Where/when did that showmatch happen? Is there a newsletter about this kind of events in Paris ? :D
Natt
Profile Joined August 2010
France253 Posts
October 10 2010 11:47 GMT
#86
On October 10 2010 20:41 wantPopRocks wrote:
wait...what?? Where/when did that showmatch happen? Is there a newsletter about this kind of events in Paris ? :D


lol, it was for the "Salon du Jeuxvidéo" if i remember correctly, it was live commented by Pomf&Thud, 2 famous french caster.

Well, you can subscribe to the millenium, aaalive, esportfrance RSS to be aware
Dantelew
Profile Joined September 2010
Canada63 Posts
October 10 2010 12:09 GMT
#87
On October 10 2010 20:11 Fruscainte wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 10 2010 20:05 Dantelew wrote:
On October 10 2010 18:22 some_pro wrote:
On October 10 2010 13:50 Borked wrote:
On October 10 2010 13:43 loving it wrote:
Can someone explain why alot of former progamers turn to poker?


cause you forfeit your education (for most progamers) so you don't have any special field. you either work your life from rock bottom or you go in a risky business like gambling.

and as a professional RTS player, you have counters, early-mid-late games, cheese, hidden tech, "mindgames", etc. strategies those can be applied to poker.


Poker is not gambling


Don't kid yourself, even the best pros and theorists admit that you're crazy if you can believe that poker is not gambling.


For random people, yes, it's at the very basis, gambling.

At pro level, I dont think you realize how much skill goes into it. Gambling implies that it's all luck that goes into it; further implying that randoms should always be winning tournaments and not the same people over and over. I may not be a pro, but I think I can safely say that Poker is more about reading your opponents emotions and facial expressions, figuring out potential chance of flops, managing money, than it is getting good hands and hoping to win.

I'm learning some basic poker math right now, that gives me probability. Let's say I got a Queen and a King of diamonds, and on the flop there is Jack of diamonds. I am learning to accurately figure out what my chances are, taking into the account of X for my opponents hands, for me getting a flush or a straight (or any mix of the two) on the next two cards. It may be something fun that I'm learning, it may be something at least at the very minimum that pros do. Poker is not gambling. Slots are gambling.


I know odds, i know equities, expected value, hand ranges, pot odds, etc. etc. etc.
I know how to play winning poker and yes I know how much dedication, skill, and discipline goes into it.
That being said, yes you obviously can win in the long run, I know this. It doesnt change the fact that its gambling, but as I said, there are two types of gambling, Postive and negative expected value. Pit games, such as blackjack, have a long term negative expected value, therefore unbeatable. Poker if you play properlty has a positive expected value, therefore if you consistantly make the correct decisions, you can win.

If you were to ask Phil Ivey, Doyle Brunson, hell, even ElkY, you would probably here them say that poker is still gambling.

Ill give you a tip though, you say Poker is about reading your opponents emotions and facial expressions? Don't even bother. The only thing you need is discipline, and bankroll management. Poker comes down to making the right decisions the majority of the time, not some "tell" you think you picked up.

Anyways thats the last im going to say about it because this thread isn't about that.
Fruscainte
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
4596 Posts
October 10 2010 12:41 GMT
#88
I seem to be misinformed and all that jazz then

I love getting my ass kicked by smarter people on here. Perhaps I have a different definition of gambling (where I perceive gambling all luck and just hoping for the best) and I consider anything else a form of skill; in shape or another.

But that's neither here nor there.

Congrats Elky, best of luck to you!
bubblegumbo
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Taiwan1296 Posts
October 10 2010 12:47 GMT
#89
Elky has nothing to lose if he plays SC2 competitively, unlike other progamers, thinking about the prize money wouldn't faze him at all. Hell I wish I was in his position.
It'll be like the old days except he can live in a nice place (if he wants to) in Korea while training.
"I honestly think that whoever invented toilet paper is a genius. For man to survive, they need toilet paper!"- Nal_rA
alpha9
Profile Joined September 2010
14 Posts
October 10 2010 14:10 GMT
#90
ElkY is one of the best in what he likes to do, and he's paid for this. It's everyone's dream.
I would like to see him trading on financial markets
StarStruck
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
25339 Posts
October 10 2010 14:22 GMT
#91
With his endorsement with Poker Stars I don't see how he'll be able to find the time to practice to really get far in major tournaments. You cannot have the best of both worlds. Poker is very time consuming to stay on top of your game and the same can be said about Starcraft.

He's a great guy; I wish him well.
Kage
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
India788 Posts
October 10 2010 14:29 GMT
#92
This is so cool thank you for posting it. Can't wait for the SC1 greats to come! 6 million dollars wow.
TheMick
Profile Joined April 2010
Great Britain164 Posts
October 10 2010 14:34 GMT
#93
TillerMaN did exactly same as Elky just not as successful.
http://eu.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/265104/1/HyperioN/ My SC2 profile!
Touch
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada475 Posts
October 10 2010 14:42 GMT
#94
6 Million dollars...I think he can shell out a little for a Korean copy of SC2
Sieg
hypercube
Profile Joined April 2010
Hungary2735 Posts
October 10 2010 15:12 GMT
#95
On October 10 2010 20:27 Borked wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 10 2010 18:22 some_pro wrote:
On October 10 2010 13:50 Borked wrote:
On October 10 2010 13:43 loving it wrote:
Can someone explain why alot of former progamers turn to poker?


cause you forfeit your education (for most progamers) so you don't have any special field. you either work your life from rock bottom or you go in a risky business like gambling.

and as a professional RTS player, you have counters, early-mid-late games, cheese, hidden tech, "mindgames", etc. strategies those can be applied to poker.


Poker is not gambling


I know what Poker is thanks.

When I was using the word gambling I was just simply trying to categorize it. I didn't know someone would use that word in bold and would get all correcting...

I don't want to derail the thread to a "Poker, is it gambling?" discussion but to an average person, if there is money in it, if luck is in it, if it's played with cards, if it's also played in casinos like many other places, it's gambling.

Anyway, ElkY is the man.


No, you don't and the fact that you think you do actually stops you from learning. It is a very common mistake and not just about poker.

In any case someone made the point that poker is as risky as gambling. You can't defend that statement by saying that average person think it's gambling. There's no connection between the two.
"Sending people in rockets to other planets is a waste of money better spent on sending rockets into people on this planet."
Azide
Profile Joined March 2010
Canada566 Posts
October 10 2010 20:34 GMT
#96
I played against him in Beta lol
Azide and SuperNinja - Best Double Protoss 2v2 Team!
professorben
Profile Joined May 2010
United States15 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-10-10 21:06:31
October 10 2010 21:01 GMT
#97
There are a ton of silly and many outright wrong assumptions about poker in this thread.

I used to think that people criticizing the poker-RTS connection were being overly critical, but people have gone way too far in trying to draw connections between the 2. There are a lot more people who have failed in the other realm than have succeeded. At this point, it's seems appropriate to say that there is a light amount of correlation in success between the two, but that anyone who tells you that there is causation is being ridiculous.

Cheerio
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
Ukraine3178 Posts
October 10 2010 21:12 GMT
#98
I played against him today. On europe, a 2v2.
templar rage
Profile Joined September 2010
United States2509 Posts
October 10 2010 21:13 GMT
#99
Poker is a form of gambling, and you're kidding yourself thinking any differently. The definition of gambling is "betting on an uncertain outcome", which is exactly what poker is. The fact that you can win long-term (or not for blackjack, craps, etc) is completely irrelevant to the definition. I think that's where the most common misconception is. The term "gambling" generally has a negative connotation due to being associated to games like roulette, blackjack, and other games that have a negative expectation. Because of that, people want to put poker in a different basket because it (can) have positive expectation, but that's wrong.
Tonyoh
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
France218 Posts
October 10 2010 21:37 GMT
#100
I love Elky, he is such a great and friendly gamer, all his life is mainly about game.

Now he plays for fun (because being among the top is kinda too hard, and he is already making enough money with poker)

I think he is overrated, not nearly enough from the SlayerS_Boxer level but he still has a really decent level =) Hope to see him at the french tournaments =)
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Liquid-Jinro/174837579208018?ref=ts
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