• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 13:05
CET 19:05
KST 03:05
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners11Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros10[ASL20] Finals Preview: Arrival13TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting12[ASL20] Ro4 Preview: Descent11
Community News
StarCraft, SC2, HotS, WC3, Returning to Blizzcon!45$5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship7[BSL21] RO32 Group Stage4Weekly Cups (Oct 26-Nov 2): Liquid, Clem, Solar win; LAN in Philly2Weekly Cups (Oct 20-26): MaxPax, Clem, Creator win10
StarCraft 2
General
SC: Evo Complete - Ranked Ladder OPEN ALPHA Mech is the composition that needs teleportation t TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners StarCraft, SC2, HotS, WC3, Returning to Blizzcon! RotterdaM "Serral is the GOAT, and it's not close"
Tourneys
Constellation Cup - Main Event - Stellar Fest Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond)
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 499 Chilling Adaptation Mutation # 498 Wheel of Misfortune|Cradle of Death Mutation # 497 Battle Haredened Mutation # 496 Endless Infection
Brood War
General
FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ [ASL20] Ask the mapmakers — Drop your questions BW General Discussion Where's CardinalAllin/Jukado the mapmaker?
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL20] Grand Finals [BSL21] RO32 Group A - Saturday 21:00 CET [BSL21] RO32 Group B - Sunday 21:00 CET
Strategy
PvZ map balance Current Meta How to stay on top of macro? Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Should offensive tower rushing be viable in RTS games? Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Canadian Politics Mega-thread US Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! Korean Music Discussion Series you have seen recently...
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NBA General Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Learning my new SC2 hotkey…
Hildegard
Coffee x Performance in Espo…
TrAiDoS
Saturation point
Uldridge
DnB/metal remix FFO Mick Go…
ImbaTosS
Reality "theory" prov…
perfectspheres
Our Last Hope in th…
KrillinFromwales
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1491 users

Racial Distribution in Patch 1.0 - Diamond Ladder - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 21 22 23 Next All
NonY
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
8751 Posts
September 01 2010 22:59 GMT
#21
On September 02 2010 07:53 Vexx wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 02 2010 07:50 Liquid`Tyler wrote:
On September 02 2010 07:46 cup of joe wrote:
it means absolutely nothing because the sample size is tiny at the right end of the graph

There is no sample size. This is a graph of the entire population.


Not quite. He means that there are so few players at the highest point levels that you can't use that information reliably.

Use it reliably for what? He says it's not possible to answer a question using this data without indicating what the question is...?

There is nothing wrong with the data and the right end of the graph does not rely on a sample.
"Fucking up is part of it. If you can't fail, you have to always win. And I don't think you can always win." Elliott Smith ---------- Yet no sudden rage darkened his face, and his eyes were calm as they studied her. Then he smiled. 'Witness.'
EliteAzn
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States661 Posts
September 01 2010 22:59 GMT
#22
Looking at the data, anything past 1400, the data sample is too small (5z/22t/10p for 1401-1500 and it gets smaller from there).

However, it is pretty convincing that Terran seems to be dominating at very high level of play. Terran needs a nerf? That's what patches 1.1 and on are for.
(╯`Д´)╯︵ ┻━┻ High Five! _o /\ o_
NonY
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
8751 Posts
September 01 2010 23:01 GMT
#23
On September 02 2010 07:59 EliteAzn wrote:
Looking at the data, anything past 1400, the data sample is too small (5z/22t/10p for 1401-1500 and it gets smaller from there).

Too small for what?
"Fucking up is part of it. If you can't fail, you have to always win. And I don't think you can always win." Elliott Smith ---------- Yet no sudden rage darkened his face, and his eyes were calm as they studied her. Then he smiled. 'Witness.'
Backpack
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States1776 Posts
September 01 2010 23:01 GMT
#24
Popularity does not equal strength.

The fact that people have this *idea* that terran might be OP and that zerg might suck will make them play terran more. You see terran all the time at high levels simply because there are more terran than zerg. The more people cry "terran OP," the more people will switch over to it.

The top players are there because they are the best players. Not because of their race. The reason there are so many terrans at the top is because there are so many terrans overall.
"You people need to just generally care a lot less about everything." -Zatic
Dionyseus
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
United States2068 Posts
September 01 2010 23:01 GMT
#25
On September 02 2010 07:52 Sentenal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 02 2010 07:46 cup of joe wrote:
it means absolutely nothing because the sample size is tiny at the right end of the graph

I disagree that it means absolutely nothing. Because regardless of numbers, the right end of the graph represents the "top players", and it shows that amoung them, Terran is dominate.

However, it would be nice to see the sample size there to put it into context.


There's currently 65k players in the diamond league, only 27k diamond players are at least 600 points.
source: http://www.sc2ranks.com/stats/league/all/1/all
9/5/10 P acct: NA D 10,683 651pts 69w56L http://sc2ranks.com/char/us/290365/LetoAtreides T acct: NA D 16,137 553pts 70w67L http://sc2ranks.com/char/us/1560008/Khrone Z: NA G 16,058 465pts 28w26L http://www.sc2ranks.com/us/1997354/Omnius
Darksoldierr
Profile Joined May 2010
Hungary2012 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-01 23:03:08
September 01 2010 23:02 GMT
#26
So on lower level, with Protoss, its easier to win ( proxy 2 gate, 4gate all in), but on top tier, protoss looks balanced, and zerg underpreforming compared to terran

Thats pretty much sums up every thread full of whines, that was made the last 4 weeks.
What do humans know of our pain? We have sung songs of lament since before your ancestors crawled on their bellies from the sea.
DonKey_
Profile Joined May 2010
Liechtenstein1356 Posts
September 01 2010 23:03 GMT
#27
this graph means jack shit when it doesn't even indicate how many people are within each grouping.

ex. what if only 10 people were in the 1500 range
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
Moa
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States790 Posts
September 01 2010 23:03 GMT
#28
That is a bit disturbing.

Looking at the 600-1100 range all I can think of is 4 gate. It would be nice to see the number of people in each group between 1200 and 1500 if there are very few people it could be said that racial imbalance is only affecting the highest levels of play severely. If there is a decent number of people between that range then it could suggest that the reason there are fewer terran players between 600 and 1100 is because most of the diamond worthy terran players are in the higher ranges.

It would be interesting to see what is up with the random players, it follows a strange curve.
^O^
Zombee
Profile Joined April 2010
Germany69 Posts
September 01 2010 23:03 GMT
#29
I got a Theory a little off topic:

I am a Daimond ranom player, the higher I get, the less I spawn as Terran, the more as Zerg.

Is blizzard using us to compansate the lack of race distribution? :O

---Na, just kidding, but out of 20 games today I spawned friggin 17 times Zerg xD.
GreatFall
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States1061 Posts
September 01 2010 23:05 GMT
#30
Nice graph, shows clearly that Zerg dwindle at the very top. I don't understand why so many people responding to this thread can't read a simple graph.
Inventor of the 'Burning Tide' technique to quickly getting Outmatched Crusher achivement :D
EliteAzn
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States661 Posts
September 01 2010 23:07 GMT
#31
On September 02 2010 08:01 Liquid`Tyler wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 02 2010 07:59 EliteAzn wrote:
Looking at the data, anything past 1400, the data sample is too small (5z/22t/10p for 1401-1500 and it gets smaller from there).

Too small for what?


Too small to make a very solid point that Terran is OP and Blizzard screwed up big time. For example (this is an extreme case), I can say Zerg is Extremely OP at the Extremely high Bronze level (There is 1 zerg/player who has 2001+ points in Bronze (lol)).

Yes, it's a trend and we can all see that the # of zerg players is decreasing as points increase. Same said with Terran but the opposite (increasing)
(╯`Д´)╯︵ ┻━┻ High Five! _o /\ o_
Art_of_Kill
Profile Joined September 2003
Zaire1232 Posts
September 01 2010 23:07 GMT
#32
isnt it obvious?
1200-1500 terran gets higher and higher in number, which shows that the race if used right is too strong
TLT07 ===> *winner* <===TLT08
Doomrok
Profile Joined April 2010
United States38 Posts
September 01 2010 23:08 GMT
#33
Terran is perfectly balanced, I mean, look at my Terran vs Zerg win rate! http://www.danrok.com/stats/

rr:r
http://www.danrok.com/stats/profile/1/ - Win/Loss Breakdown by Race and Map
KillerPlague
Profile Joined June 2010
United States1386 Posts
September 01 2010 23:08 GMT
#34
i'm not too sure what to make of this graph. it appears protoss is the most common race and evenly distributed. also it appears terran players have an easier time reaching the top of the ladder than are other races although maybe just maybe it's because there are more of them?
Side 1: Why no dominant players with 90% win ratio Side 2: Nerf Side 1
Chairman Ray
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States11903 Posts
September 01 2010 23:09 GMT
#35
Zerg is consistently the lowest, which may be a result of less Zerg players, but right between mid and high ELO, there is a shift between Protoss being the top and Terran being the top. This may be a clear indication that Terran's strength increases much more rapidly as the player's skill increases compared to Protoss.
Art_of_Kill
Profile Joined September 2003
Zaire1232 Posts
September 01 2010 23:10 GMT
#36
On September 02 2010 08:07 EliteAzn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 02 2010 08:01 Liquid`Tyler wrote:
On September 02 2010 07:59 EliteAzn wrote:
Looking at the data, anything past 1400, the data sample is too small (5z/22t/10p for 1401-1500 and it gets smaller from there).

Too small for what?


Too small to make a very solid point that Terran is OP and Blizzard screwed up big time. For example (this is an extreme case), I can say Zerg is Extremely OP at the Extremely high Bronze level (There is 1 zerg/player who has 2001+ points in Bronze (lol)).

Yes, it's a trend and we can all see that the # of zerg players is decreasing as points increase. Same said with Terran but the opposite (increasing)

how can it be too small? it are the best player lol
if it would be bigger then there would be way to many not good player inclueded
look at broodwar u have flash jeadong and nobody more at the top
TLT07 ===> *winner* <===TLT08
eth3n
Profile Joined August 2010
718 Posts
September 01 2010 23:10 GMT
#37
At the same time, doesn't this mean the terran imbalance is only really determinative at the 1000+ diamond level (although it may be easier for terrans to compete in general, it seems that its not unbeatable until it reaches this level)
Idra Potter: I don't use avada kedavra because i have self-respect.
Cade
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada1420 Posts
September 01 2010 23:10 GMT
#38
On September 02 2010 07:55 Liquid`Tyler wrote:
As far as I know, sc2ranks is pretty damn comprehensive of Diamond, especially high Diamond (where it seems some people have a problem with the "sample size"). Yeah, the number of people in the 1500+ group is small but that doesn't mean that there is a problem with the sample size. These numbers aren't extrapolated from a small population of the 1500+ Diamond group. These numbers directly represent that group.



This post states perfectly the idea that everyone seems to be missing when complaining about sample size. I hope people read it and attempt to understand it.
HeyitsClay
Profile Joined April 2008
Canada336 Posts
September 01 2010 23:11 GMT
#39
On September 02 2010 08:01 Liquid`Tyler wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 02 2010 07:59 EliteAzn wrote:
Looking at the data, anything past 1400, the data sample is too small (5z/22t/10p for 1401-1500 and it gets smaller from there).

Too small for what?


LOL these posts are too funny,

there is an obvious trend im sure having 1000 extra people in the 1400++ range wouldn't all off a sudden give zerg an upward spike
dacthehork
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States2000 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-01 23:15:00
September 01 2010 23:12 GMT
#40
Honestly, I hope people don't read too much into these numbers. There can be a lot of factors, and seeing it as a function of time would be important, not just a snapshot.

Everyone is still (as far as I can tell) still evolving strategies, it might be that zerg is harder to master. It is very interesting though, almost reminds me of SC1 with protoss being popular in the D/C range.
Warturtle - DOTA 2 is KING
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 21 22 23 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Wardi Open
12:00
#60
WardiTV2024
IndyStarCraft 234
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
IndyStarCraft 234
UpATreeSC 71
StarCraft: Brood War
Rain 3575
Horang2 1490
Shuttle 810
firebathero 164
scan(afreeca) 46
Mong 32
sSak 28
Rock 27
Aegong 21
JulyZerg 14
[ Show more ]
ivOry 7
SilentControl 6
Dota 2
Gorgc5432
qojqva3452
420jenkins303
BananaSlamJamma168
XcaliburYe140
Counter-Strike
byalli507
fl0m497
Other Games
FrodaN954
ceh9623
Beastyqt615
KnowMe292
Lowko260
Sick259
Hui .195
Liquid`VortiX148
Mew2King102
ArmadaUGS83
QueenE44
Trikslyr44
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• kabyraGe 48
• Reevou 2
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• intothetv
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• Michael_bg 10
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV145
League of Legends
• Nemesis3748
• TFBlade985
• imaqtpie41
Other Games
• Shiphtur310
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
4h 55m
WardiTV Korean Royale
17h 55m
OSC
22h 55m
Replay Cast
1d 4h
Replay Cast
1d 14h
Kung Fu Cup
1d 17h
Classic vs Solar
herO vs Cure
Reynor vs GuMiho
ByuN vs ShoWTimE
Tenacious Turtle Tussle
2 days
The PondCast
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
Solar vs Zoun
MaxPax vs Bunny
Kung Fu Cup
2 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Korean Royale
2 days
PiGosaur Monday
3 days
RSL Revival
3 days
Classic vs Creator
Cure vs TriGGeR
Kung Fu Cup
3 days
CranKy Ducklings
4 days
RSL Revival
4 days
herO vs Gerald
ByuN vs SHIN
Kung Fu Cup
4 days
BSL 21
5 days
Tarson vs Julia
Doodle vs OldBoy
eOnzErG vs WolFix
StRyKeR vs Aeternum
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
Reynor vs sOs
Maru vs Ryung
Kung Fu Cup
5 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
5 days
BSL 21
6 days
JDConan vs Semih
Dragon vs Dienmax
Tech vs NewOcean
TerrOr vs Artosis
Wardi Open
6 days
Monday Night Weeklies
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-11-07
Stellar Fest: Constellation Cup
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
SOOP Univ League 2025
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual

Upcoming

SLON Tour Season 2
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXVIII
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
RSL Revival: Season 3
META Madness #9
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.