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On September 02 2010 05:35 Buddhist wrote:
holy shit @ carriers
twice the dps of fully charged void rays against armored targets, and they do that much damage vs. any target, AND they can kite every ground unit in the game, and they do 60% more dps with 3 weapon upgrades.
At 3 weapon ups, it's 128 dps for carrier vs. about 52 dps for charged VR on armored target.
Like, wow.
I need to start making some viable into-carriers builds.
That's absolutely not what you should be pulling from this. SC2 is not a tower defense game where you can win by picking the right units at the right time.
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On September 02 2010 05:35 Buddhist wrote:
holy shit @ carriers
twice the dps of fully charged void rays against armored targets, and they do that much damage vs. any target, AND they can kite every ground unit in the game, and they do 60% more dps with 3 weapon upgrades.
At 3 weapon ups, it's 128 dps for carrier vs. about 52 dps for charged VR on armored target.
Like, wow.
I need to start making some viable into-carriers builds.
Assuming
1. that the enemy units have no armor (which guts Carriers but does practically nothing for VRs)
2. that Carriers actually attack once per second *per interceptor*. This seems very, very odd. I checked http://starcraft.wikia.com/wiki/Interceptor and it claims the Interceptor shoots twice per 3 seconds (and not twice per second). Can anyone clear this up?
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On September 02 2010 05:50 Jarmam wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2010 05:35 Buddhist wrote:
holy shit @ carriers
twice the dps of fully charged void rays against armored targets, and they do that much damage vs. any target, AND they can kite every ground unit in the game, and they do 60% more dps with 3 weapon upgrades.
At 3 weapon ups, it's 128 dps for carrier vs. about 52 dps for charged VR on armored target.
Like, wow.
I need to start making some viable into-carriers builds. Assuming 1. that the enemy units have no armor (which guts Carriers but does practically nothing for VRs) 2. that Carriers actually attack once per second *per interceptor*. This seems very, very odd. I checked http://starcraft.wikia.com/wiki/Interceptor and it claims the Interceptor shoots twice per 3 seconds (and not twice per second). Can anyone clear this up?
This data was took by the ingame help >.<
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Starcraft isn't a DPS game. There's way too many different factors like splash damage, unit speed, range, mineral/gas ratios, etc, etc. I guess you could learn some stuff with the DPS but in general, not as useful as it could be in games like WoW or something.
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On September 02 2010 05:31 ZaaaaaM wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2010 05:22 Grummler wrote:
Theorycraft of its finest. Do you think its a good idea to ignore: hitpoints, movement speed, fire rate, fire range, unit size, unit tech, unit abilities, flying/not flying, shoots air/ doesnt shoot air and synergies?
Edit: Just in case: Yes, he did ignore fire rate. I know what dps means, but its not the same if a unit deals 1000dmg each 1000 seconds or 1 dmg each second. Think about it. Pff, don't try to be the smartguy- we know we know, don't have to "think about it" either lol
So, you have read my last sentence. Awesome. Or maybe you read the rest too, but dont want to discuss about it, cause trolling is so much easier.
On September 02 2010 05:53 neobowman wrote:
Starcraft isn't a DPS game. There's way too many different factors like splash damage, unit speed, range, mineral/gas ratios, etc, etc. I guess you could learn some stuff with the DPS but in general, not as useful as it could be in games like WoW or something.
This.
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On September 02 2010 05:45 Fraidnot wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2010 05:35 Buddhist wrote:
holy shit @ carriers
twice the dps of fully charged void rays against armored targets, and they do that much damage vs. any target, AND they can kite every ground unit in the game, and they do 60% more dps with 3 weapon upgrades.
At 3 weapon ups, it's 128 dps for carrier vs. about 52 dps for charged VR on armored target.
Like, wow.
I need to start making some viable into-carriers builds. That's absolutely not what you should be pulling from this. SC2 is not a tower defense game where you can win by picking the right units at the right time.
The roles of carrier and void ray overlap pretty heavily, and carriers are worth more per cost.
That's pretty simple.
Obviously void rays are infinitely more powerful for harassment, but in an army situation, carriers are clearly superior.
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oh my god. spreadsheets in WOW and now they are in SC2 ! ha...
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Hyrule19221 Posts
Kind of interesting. How'd you account for upgrade costs (specifically Stim and Siege Mode)?
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Saying that "this isn't WoW" is a silly argument. No one blindly relied on spread sheets for DPS in WoW for PvP either, for obvious reasons.
It didn't matter what your sustained dps was if you were just going to get kited all day.
It's still good information to have, however.
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On September 02 2010 06:00 tofucake wrote:
Kind of interesting. How'd you account for upgrade costs (specifically Stim and Siege Mode)?
That would mean to create much more data depending on how many units you have, do you really want that much data? :O
Maybe I´ll do it.
Also it will need to involve movespeed, range etc.
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On September 02 2010 05:57 berzerger wrote:
oh my god. spreadsheets in WOW and now they are in SC2 ! ha...
Perfect SC2 raid group:
1 Ultralisk tank
2 Medivac healers
10 Zerglings (or as many that can surround the enemy  )
12 stimmed Marines
But joking aside, this is really interesting data. I don't know if it'll effect anyone's decisions on their unit compositions, but it's still nice to know. Nice work Pepe :D
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For protoss, shields is definitely a compensation.
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carrier is incorrect, interceptor cooldown is 3, also spine crawler is incorrect as cooldown is .8608, might be more errors me thinks
what is the point of 3 attack calculation?
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This has been done a few times before but its always worthwhile to look at again or from another perspective. The biggest issue has been coming up with a good valuation of gas. There are 2.4 times as many minerals as gas at a base, and you mine minerals at about 2.8 times the rate of gas. I think gas should be valued higher than your top valuation of 1.5.
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Nice work here, some stats are interesting. Would be cool to add hp analysis to this as well.
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Carriers work like this:
Carriers fire Interceptors every 0.5 seconds and Interceptors make an attack every 3 seconds. The Interceptor deals 2 attacks each dealing 5 damage and there can be a maximum of 8 Interceptors. This results to the following:
To fire all 8 Interceptors: 4 seconds.
Attack CD of all 8 Interceptors on their "fire round": 3.5 seconds. (+0.5 second launch time)
The first attack made by the Interceptors in a newly engaged battle, therefore, is 80 (total damage) / 4 (4 is larger than 3.5) = 20.
The following attacks made by the Interceptors after they have been fired (assumes none are killed): 80 / 3 (no need for the additional +0.5 second launch time): 26.6777777r.
Carriers do more damage if they're kept alive than the moment they engage. Alternatively, you can attack some of your own units to launch the Interceptors and then engage, much like the Void Ray can charge it's Prismatic Beam on allied units.
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On September 02 2010 05:32 figq wrote:Lings, rines, zlots own the place. But I guess if they were weaker, then a lot of game variety would be lost. As of now it is usually a valid opposition for one side to stay tier 1, while the opponent goes higher tech, and they can compete shoulder-to-shoulder, which is fun. - Armor plays a big role. Unupgraded lings have 0 dps vs armor upgraded Planetary Fortress (the game counts the damage as 0.5 in those cases though, but that's 1/10th of what's in the table). - In late game there's one more factor - per food. - 1 gas really costs around 3 minerals, because the mining rate from a saturated base is around 250:800 per minute. ( source)
nothing ever has 0 dps. dmg is minimized at 1.
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On September 02 2010 06:29 danl9rm wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2010 05:32 figq wrote:Lings, rines, zlots own the place. But I guess if they were weaker, then a lot of game variety would be lost. As of now it is usually a valid opposition for one side to stay tier 1, while the opponent goes higher tech, and they can compete shoulder-to-shoulder, which is fun. - Armor plays a big role. Unupgraded lings have 0 dps vs armor upgraded Planetary Fortress (the game counts the damage as 0.5 in those cases though, but that's 1/10th of what's in the table). - In late game there's one more factor - per food. - 1 gas really costs around 3 minerals, because the mining rate from a saturated base is around 250:800 per minute. ( source) nothing ever has 0 dps. dmg is minimized at 1. Damage is minimized at 1/2.
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On September 02 2010 05:32 figq wrote:- 1 gas really costs around 3 minerals, because the mining rate from a saturated base is around 250:800 per minute. ( source)
Nah, it doesnt... buildings cost far more minerals than gas.
It would just be more than 2 if you are producing mass archons or anything like that.
If you are massing Zealots it would get below 1 and if you are producing mass reapers it would maybe go up to 2.
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Seems you are missing infested marines
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EPT
