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8748 Posts
On October 06 2011 01:20 Cyrak wrote:
I don't play or like poker but asserting that poker only became popular because it was put on TV.. really?
Sure, lots of things changed after poker came on TV. It didn't just become more popular. We talked about it. Some people are wary of going on TV because, even if SC2 does become more popular, there may also be bad effects, like the average fan becoming less knowledgeable or the average person respecting us less.
I think you may have misplaced the word "only" and it makes a huge difference. So assuming you were trying to say that we said that poker being televised was the only necessary condition for its popularity, then I think you misunderstood us. We expressed that poker being televised played a key role for its boom. The way the presentation of the game was directed was new. Cameras were placed to detect the contents of hidden cards so the viewer had all the information. Chance to win the hand displayed as a simple percentage immediately gave the audience information that previously took specialized knowledge and practice to calculate on the fly. And the basic rules of the game were explained multiple times a broadcast.
Another key factor was poker's emergence in the online gaming world. Played physically, poker is considered too inconvenient and slow by many. Online poker made the game significantly easier to play than ever before. These two key factors fed off each other, as budding poker players wanted to watch the pros and spectators wanted to give the game a try. Of course, SC2 already has this so it was not worth mentioning. Though it's fair to concede that online poker was more convenient since its software was free and had low system requirements.
I believe you understand the similarities and differences between multiple necessary conditions and a single necessary condition. And I'm sure you understand that in complicated real world scenarios, it's often impossible to prove that any part was necessary. The imagination can usually convince us that it could have happened in an entirely different way. So identifying a necessary condition is very difficult. The best we can usually do is look at the situation and reason about which factors, when removed, would have made that specific situation fail. I think it's safe to say that poker's new style of televised content was one such factor for its boom. We didn't mean to make any more ambitious claim than that. But it very well could be that that was the only way it could have happened at that time. So it's similarly ambitious to deny that going on TV wasn't the only necessary condition. It's best to leave such claims alone as we shouldn't pretend or aspire to have such certainty.
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On October 06 2011 01:35 Cyrak wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 01:21 Risen wrote:On October 06 2011 01:20 Cyrak wrote:
This show has really jumped the shark. Listening to the bits about ESPN really reinforced what a delusional bubble these guys are living in.
I don't play or like poker but asserting that poker only became popular because it was put on TV.. really? If that's the level of expert analysis on issues that are even slightly tangential to SC2 then it might be best to steer the conversation away from anything that doesn't directly relate to tournaments.
Poker EXPLODED after it was shown on TV. What planet are you living on? (I say this as someone who lived in Las Vegas almost their whole life) This is why I hate posting on forums infested with teenagers and college dropouts. Can you not parse a sentence? This assertion implies that there weren't a myriad of factors equally important to TV that contributed to the "poker boom". The confluence of its introduction into popular culture, the televised WPT and the introduction of online poker were all arguably equally important. That's just for poker. Let's compare it to starcraft now. Despite how difficult it is to play well, poker is very easy to understand. The drama and tension surrounding poker are easy to quantify (you can see the cash on the table!). It's easy to understand which player is 'winning' and what they are playing for. It is simple yet dramatic and interesting for even casual observers due to the ease of understanding what is going on. Starcraft is complicated, difficult to assess and understand even for people who have played it their entire lives and has no pop culture appeal because it's played by a bunch of nerdy kids. Asserting that the only difference between SC2 blowing up and Poker is that one was put on TV is a hilarious oversimplification and displays a level of real-world analytical ability that I've come to expect from the simpletons of the SC2 community.
The levels of generalization here do not reflect the level of intellect that your ego portrays.
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8748 Posts
ah, i see from cyrak's posts that indeed he did write his sentence incorrectly. what a fucking idiot. i dont discuss things with such shit. go get an education and learn to place your modifiers in the correct spots or im not gonna waste time on you (treat others the way you want to be treated, etc)
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On October 06 2011 02:20 thee telescopes wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 02:06 Bulkers wrote:Now we even dont have mp3, JP McFail have sold SotG to MLG... thats all  We should request a full refund.
People are silly. JP posted on twitter "audio portion of @stateofthe game will be up tomorrow when I wake up -- to tired to edit it tonight -- VOD within 24 hours"
Give the man time, capturing video and compiling it takes time. And since it is free, we all get to wait. Or you could demand it faster, but I don't think thats a good use of your time.
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I was going to use reason, logic and wit to deal with Cyrak and his ego-centered non-sense, but Tyler's route is way more effective.
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8748 Posts
On October 06 2011 02:35 Plansix wrote:
I was going to use reason, logic and wit to deal with Cyrak and his ego-centered non-sense, but Tyler's route is way more effective.
honestly, he doesn't deserve anything more. he knew that the position he was attributing to us is untenable. if he honestly thought that we were taking that position, then he would have simply posed the question and waited for one of us to respond, or waited to see the consensus from other viewers. but instead he goes on and on about it before anyone says "yes that's exactly what they were saying and that's exactly what they meant to say". it looks like he just wanted to flex his writing and reasoning muscles. but it's funny that he had a misplaced modifier, which is a huge problem when the standard you're setting in the discussion is so rigorous and he's complaining that people arent being as rigorous as him.
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Any ETA on the Mp3 file, was hoping to listen to it while at work ^^
Thnx!
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Have yet to listen to the podcast this week, but I'm guessing a lot of this has to do with MLG Sundance Reddit post that showed up.
Personally when I saw his question on Reddit, I said I would watch it, but the hard reality is that me and most of my generation is slowly tuning out of Scheduled broadcast television. So I don't know how effective it will actually be to the current ESPN 2 viewers.
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On October 06 2011 02:44 Liquid`Tyler wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 02:35 Plansix wrote:
I was going to use reason, logic and wit to deal with Cyrak and his ego-centered non-sense, but Tyler's route is way more effective. honestly, he doesn't deserve anything more. he knew that the position he was attributing to us is untenable. if he honestly thought that we were taking that position, then he would have simply posed the question and waited for one of us to respond, or waited to see the consensus from other viewers. but instead he goes on and on about it before anyone says "yes that's exactly what they were saying and that's exactly what they meant to say". it looks like he just wanted to flex his writing and reasoning muscles. but it's funny that he had a misplaced modifier, which is a huge problem when the standard you're setting in the discussion is so rigorous and he's complaining that people arent being as rigorous as him.
Tyler gives me hope for the future of SC2 forum discussion.
EDIT: Not tongue-in-cheek.
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On October 06 2011 02:51 SenorChang wrote:
Any ETA on the Mp3 file, was hoping to listen to it while at work ^^
Thnx!
JP indicated that it would be in the next 12 hours or so. (read the thread dude)
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United Kingdom14464 Posts
+ Show Spoiler +On October 06 2011 02:30 Liquid`Tyler wrote:
ah, i see from cyrak's posts that indeed he did write his sentence incorrectly. what a fucking idiot. i dont discuss things with such shit. go get an education and learn to place your modifiers in the correct spots or im not gonna waste time on you (treat others the way you want to be treated, etc)
Tyler laying down the law as always. When do we get a new blog?
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On October 06 2011 02:58 Trezeguet wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 02:51 SenorChang wrote:
Any ETA on the Mp3 file, was hoping to listen to it while at work ^^
Thnx! JP indicated that it would be in the next 12 hours or so. (read the thread dude)
Sorry but I just look at the OP and saw nothing about it. I prefer to not read through this thread, dude!
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On October 06 2011 02:30 Liquid`Tyler wrote:
ah, i see from cyrak's posts that indeed he did write his sentence incorrectly. what a fucking idiot. i dont discuss things with such shit. go get an education and learn to place your modifiers in the correct spots or im not gonna waste time on you (treat others the way you want to be treated, etc)
hey tyler hows life?...that is all...
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On October 06 2011 03:01 SenorChang wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 02:58 Trezeguet wrote:On October 06 2011 02:51 SenorChang wrote:
Any ETA on the Mp3 file, was hoping to listen to it while at work ^^
Thnx! JP indicated that it would be in the next 12 hours or so. (read the thread dude) Sorry but I just look at the OP and saw nothing about it. I prefer to not read through this thread, dude!
Well its about half way up the page. JP said he would deal with it when he got up in the morning. When he wakes up, we do not know, because that would be creepy. Also, if he running late and needs to do work, that might delay things.
The free podcast is comming. We will be entertained soon.
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On October 06 2011 03:05 ForeverAzerG wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 02:30 Liquid`Tyler wrote:
ah, i see from cyrak's posts that indeed he did write his sentence incorrectly. what a fucking idiot. i dont discuss things with such shit. go get an education and learn to place your modifiers in the correct spots or im not gonna waste time on you (treat others the way you want to be treated, etc) hey tyler hows life?...that is all...
thats low, enjoy your ban.
JP quit killing e-sports and wake up!
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Not at least a MP3? 
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On October 06 2011 02:33 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 02:20 thee telescopes wrote:On October 06 2011 02:06 Bulkers wrote:Now we even dont have mp3, JP McFail have sold SotG to MLG... thats all We should request a full refund. People are silly. JP posted on twitter "audio portion of @stateofthe game will be up tomorrow when I wake up -- to tired to edit it tonight -- VOD within 24 hours" Give the man time, capturing video and compiling it takes time. And since it is free, we all get to wait. Or you could demand it faster, but I don't think thats a good use of your time.
All we want is the mp3 :/
+ Show Spoiler +Cue a bunch of people yelling at me for being sad that I can't get my fix of the best podcast out there
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Restream SotG for Eu, and we would not care about mp3/vod delays... so simple
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On October 06 2011 02:44 Liquid`Tyler wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 02:35 Plansix wrote:
I was going to use reason, logic and wit to deal with Cyrak and his ego-centered non-sense, but Tyler's route is way more effective. honestly, he doesn't deserve anything more. he knew that the position he was attributing to us is untenable. if he honestly thought that we were taking that position, then he would have simply posed the question and waited for one of us to respond, or waited to see the consensus from other viewers. but instead he goes on and on about it before anyone says "yes that's exactly what they were saying and that's exactly what they meant to say". it looks like he just wanted to flex his writing and reasoning muscles. but it's funny that he had a misplaced modifier, which is a huge problem when the standard you're setting in the discussion is so rigorous and he's complaining that people arent being as rigorous as him.
Yeah, but I am not a TL community vet, or a ProGamer, so I have to lean on what I can. Plus, I argue with morons for a living, my clients included. Dealing with the some of these TL folks is relaxing.
But I must say that seeing your well thought out and written response was nice. What was better and made me laugh out loud was seeing your post after you noticed that Cyrak was a moron and wasted your time. And now that I had my laugh on lunch, I am back to writing about less interesting things.
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EPT
