Terran tech lab/reactor positioning - Page 4

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lololol

5198 Posts

July 01 2010 21:58 GMT

#61

On July 01 2010 12:12 DM20 wrote:

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Unless every building becomes a square there will be maps with spawns that are less than optimal.

WTF are you talking about? Every building is a square.

Lemure

189 Posts

July 01 2010 22:10 GMT

#62

On July 02 2010 05:20 chax wrote:
I think learning where to place things is part of the game. I like the one side. I also like just pressing the hot key and not having to click where I want to place it like in BW

It can still be the same, an example would be holding down a button like shift to allow you to choose where the addon will be placed. Without holding shift the addon will build in the current default position.

monitor

United States2404 Posts

July 02 2010 01:50 GMT

#63

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Scrap station has a HUUUGE choke in front of the base that takes 3 supply depots to block.. yet no one complains about that.. at least in this thread!

Do you know what this thread is about? Maybe go back and read.

I hadn't though of Zerg Larva being positionally imbalanced! I think the larva should move as close as they can to the rally point, but still be next to the hatchery. This way, correctly rallied drones wouldn't take 0.5 seconds longer to get mining.

Only problem is with this, is you may want your drones to spawn on the top so they are closer to your minerals and your attacking units to spawn on the bottom so they can reinforce your units defending a push sooner (also, so spawning combat units don't interfere with drones mining), how do you balance that? Zerg larva are lose-lose positionally speaking.

I mean, once you make a unit form that larva, it will move towards its own rally point.

Swede

New Zealand853 Posts

July 02 2010 05:47 GMT

#64

On July 01 2010 22:34 STS17 wrote:
The problem with this is that if you “fix” the inconvenience this creates for Terran then you have to “fix” the Zerg larva spawn issue as well, which is significantly more complex. You can’t do one without the other because it isn’t “fair.”

As far as the problem for Terran, if you need to spawn in a certain location for your build to work then you need a new build. Sure some spawning locations are easier than others but I have never been in a game where I lost because my wall wasn’t completed fast enough, just speed up the production of your second supply depot or use a damn SCV and marine while you wait for the minerals.

Anyone who says “but STS17, if you think you can just throw down the second supply like nothing then you don’t understand how RTSs and economy works” should know that I play Terran and do this every day when I spawn at a less than ideal location. Also, if your build “needs” to save those extra couple seconds to get the tech lab out quicker than you are probably cheesing or going allin which isn’t going to get you very far. If it is to complete your wall off faster to prevent something like a 6 pool or early gateway pressure I can assure you (from experience) that using the second supply depot can and will complete your wall in time.

Yes, it is annoying when you build a rax/fax wall and can’t get your add on but that wall is only temporary and can be done with supply depot/bunker instead of the factory if you really need that add on quickly.

I don't think this is the biggest problem with having the add-on spawn on the right. A recent post was made demonstrating some good ways of walling off your natural on Blistering Sands in order to fast expand safely. On one side of the map the wall in worked beautifully, but on the other side certain things had to be repositioned to complete the wall-in, but it was not as strong. And I don't just mean a little bit weaker. It was significant enough that in certain situations it could break your wall-in when in the same situation on the other side it wouldn't have.

This is a problem because there is nothing the player can do to create an equally strong wall-in in certain positions on a map. Bases should be equal opportunity to eliminate as many non-skill related variables as possible.

As well as that, I don't see there being any real problems created by making this change. If you can fix an imbalance (positional or otherwise) without creating other problems then you should do it. There is literally no reason not to.

The larvae problem is interesting... But I think whatever differences it does make to the balance of a game are negligible at best. It would be interesting to see some research on though. The problem with the add-on thing is that it is only negligible in some situations, whereas in others (rare as they may be) it can be the difference between winning and losing a confrontation or even the game.

Lennon

United Kingdom2275 Posts

July 02 2010 08:22 GMT

#65

It doesn't bother me so much.

Actually, the only time when it bothers me is when I'm trying to wall off my ramp and mess up and I can't move the add-on