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On December 19 2012 07:57 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2012 07:54 BeyondCtrL wrote:On December 19 2012 07:44 Zelniq wrote:
It may sound outrageous, especially for those who haven't been able to play the beta... I know I'd feel the same way before I'd gotten a chance to try out the change from Instant Fungal to Missile. But after I tried it, I was surprised how much of a nerf it was. Before you'd always land perfect fungals on groups of units, now many times you'll miss units completely vs moving units, and fast ones are very tough to fungal.
Also, remember that ofc the further the target is, the harder it is to Fungal it. And the more time they have to run away.
This is actually a bigger deal than you'd think.
Giving the missile a move speed effectively reduces the max range that you can actually hit anything. Many times the times you want to use Fungal the most is vs units that are retreating, and before today's patch, Fungaling stalkers that were just running away (not even Blinking) was effectively as if you shot an Instant Fungal of like range 6 (6's just a guess), because they'd have to had been within 6 range of your Infestor at the time you tried to Fungal. Because by the time the projectile got to where you targeted at the max range of 8, they'd be well out of range of course.
Faster retreating units like stimmed bio/hellions/phoenixes/mutas would be even more extreme, meaning that they'd have to be even closer to your infestors to be Fungaled or they'd be out of range. This is not even factoring in how with a missile, they can move in other directions or dodge and make it even harder. And then there's Blink.
I'd wait to try it out before overreacting, these changes might be reasonable.
BTW, for an extreme example: Imagine if Fungal had the same missile speed but a max range of 20. You'd never actually be able to Fungal anything moving from a distance of 20, the enemy would easily just dodge away long beforehand. This is just to illustrate that a max range of a moving missile is so different from instant missiles/spells that it should not be compared.
But it IS constantly compared with other things that are instant range, shocking/enraging nerds everywhere when they just see that "range 10" number in the patch notes. It would be a rational post if not for the fact that the iteration was not even tested substantially. It takes a while to develop good skills to aim spells like that. How long did Zergs have to get used to the new Fungal? We saw in WoL that as time went people got progressively better at using units and skill despite the fact that they did not change. Even when Fungal and Infestor oriented play was beginning it was no where near as good as it is today. I don't see how such a powerful spell, considering its function, was not given more time so as to probe what its actual potential could be. Maybe it was hard to completely deny any hope for retreat for your opponent with the new Fungal, but that was the raging topic in WoL to begin with. It should not be an easy task to completely deny all retreat. Now it's easier to deny that. When we are talking about engaging the Zerg army, now it becomes, potentially, even harder than it ever was in WoL. To be fair to zergs, I was able to dodge fungles with phoenixes that were at a dead stop. I saw the infestor waddling up and moved them away. I think the zerg got two of the 8 had with the fungle. I think the only way he could have hit was if I wasn't looking at the screen.
Good, maybe we will see less of the infestor. You aren't seriously saying you think it is a well designed unit that we should see a lot?
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Just because you cant make 50 infestors in every single matchup on every single map anymore doesnt mean they are somehow "useless". Zerg just stopped making them because they saw a nerf. Just because infestors filled the support role and not the core of your army doesnt make them useless. They were beginning to fit exactly where they should. Throwing in a couple infestors to SUPPORT your army, to root they enemy when they are running away. But these fucking patch zergs think infestors are useless cause they can no longer win every single game by making nothing but infestors.
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On December 19 2012 07:54 Zelniq wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2012 07:48 iEchoic wrote:On December 19 2012 07:44 Zelniq wrote:
BTW, for an extreme example: Imagine if Fungal had the same missile speed but a max range of 20. You'd never actually be able to Fungal anything moving from a distance of 20, the enemy would easily just dodge away long beforehand. This is just to illustrate that a max range of a moving missile is so different from instant missiles/spells that it should not be compared.
But it IS constantly compared with other things that are instant range, shocking/enraging nerds everywhere when they just see that "range 10" number in the patch notes. This isn't a good analogy because the new fungal travels the 10 range faster than it used to travel the 8 range. If they didn't increase the speed as well, this wouldn't be an issue. Imagine in your example that the fungal traveled 20 range faster than it currently travels 10. That's the proper analogy, and yeah, that would be broken. a fair point I guess, tho I don't see how that would be broken. You'd still never hit anything even with the new speed if the distance was 20 and they were watching. but I'ma edit that part out as it's unnecessary anyway I think.
You'd be surprised how bad siege tanks and swarm hosts are in dodging fungals.
But all kidding aside, at 20 range even if you would have vision on the fungal, you got something like 1.3 blizard secs time to dodge, which is like 1 normal second. Remove a reasonable human reaction time, server lag, etc, and I would say you have 0.5 seconds. That means for most units that are near the center they simply cannot dodge it, even at 20 range.
Also now with the current fungal it is for the vast majority of the units not possible to dodge them by reacting to fungals, at best some of the units at the edge get away. However what you do have is that you also got lag and reaction time on the fungaler's side, so it is hard to predict where the enemy units are going to be when the fungal hits. And that is what is making it difficult to hit them alot more than player reactions (only some very fast units can realistically dodge them, such as phoenix and speedling).
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On December 19 2012 07:49 Mysticesper wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2012 07:48 iEchoic wrote:On December 19 2012 07:44 Zelniq wrote:
BTW, for an extreme example: Imagine if Fungal had the same missile speed but a max range of 20. You'd never actually be able to Fungal anything moving from a distance of 20, the enemy would easily just dodge away long beforehand. This is just to illustrate that a max range of a moving missile is so different from instant missiles/spells that it should not be compared.
But it IS constantly compared with other things that are instant range, shocking/enraging nerds everywhere when they just see that "range 10" number in the patch notes. This isn't a good analogy because the new fungal travels the 10 range faster than it used to travel the 8 range. If they didn't increase the speed as well, this wouldn't be an issue. The analogy is still applicable. The further the projectile flies, the more time you have to dodge it. It's just less time than before.
I definitely have to agree with Echoic here. A range increase is NEVER a nerf, but it can help balance things out because you're right, it's not much of a buff. But if they're increasing the range and speed, especially increasing the range to more than we've seen before, it'll probably make infestors too powerful again.
I'm fine with that and trust blizzard to continue tweaking it until they get it right. This is all part of the calibration process.
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United States7166 Posts
On December 19 2012 07:54 BeyondCtrL wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2012 07:44 Zelniq wrote:
It may sound outrageous, especially for those who haven't been able to play the beta... I know I'd feel the same way before I'd gotten a chance to try out the change from Instant Fungal to Missile. But after I tried it, I was surprised how much of a nerf it was. Before you'd always land perfect fungals on groups of units, now many times you'll miss units completely vs moving units, and fast ones are very tough to fungal.
Also, remember that ofc the further the target is, the harder it is to Fungal it. And the more time they have to run away.
This is actually a bigger deal than you'd think.
Giving the missile a move speed effectively reduces the max range that you can actually hit anything. Many times the times you want to use Fungal the most is vs units that are retreating, and before today's patch, Fungaling stalkers that were just running away (not even Blinking) was effectively as if you shot an Instant Fungal of like range 6 (6's just a guess), because they'd have to had been within 6 range of your Infestor at the time you tried to Fungal. Because by the time the projectile got to where you targeted at the max range of 8, they'd be well out of range of course.
Faster retreating units like stimmed bio/hellions/phoenixes/mutas would be even more extreme, meaning that they'd have to be even closer to your infestors to be Fungaled or they'd be out of range. This is not even factoring in how with a missile, they can move in other directions or dodge and make it even harder. And then there's Blink.
I'd wait to try it out before overreacting, these changes might be reasonable.
BTW, for an extreme example: Imagine if Fungal had the same missile speed but a max range of 20. You'd never actually be able to Fungal anything moving from a distance of 20, the enemy would easily just dodge away long beforehand. This is just to illustrate that a max range of a moving missile is so different from instant missiles/spells that it should not be compared.
But it IS constantly compared with other things that are instant range, shocking/enraging nerds everywhere when they just see that "range 10" number in the patch notes. It would be a rational post if not for the fact that the iteration was not even tested substantially. It takes a while to develop good skills to aim spells like that. How long did Zergs have to get used to the new Fungal? We saw in WoL that as time went people got progressively better at using units and skill despite the fact that they did not change. Even when Fungal and Infestor oriented play was beginning it was no where near as good as it is today. I don't see how such a powerful spell, considering its function, was not given more time so as to probe what its actual potential could be. Maybe it was hard to completely deny any hope for retreat for your opponent with the new Fungal, but that was the raging topic in WoL to begin with. It should not be an easy task to completely deny all retreat. Now it's easier to deny that. When we are talking about engaging the Zerg army, now it becomes, potentially, even harder than it ever was in WoL.
If you read my post/understand it, you should realize the new Hots fungal is still worse than the current WoL range 8 Instant Fungal. Skill or not, there is also luck and then also the problem of retreating units as I described earlier. It's no question that the new fungal is weaker. The benefit of having a little extra range vs units that arent moving is nothing compared to the nerf of not being able to fungal anything that moves as effectively as PERFECT instant fungals provided.
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On December 19 2012 07:59 Zelniq wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2012 07:54 BeyondCtrL wrote:On December 19 2012 07:44 Zelniq wrote:
It may sound outrageous, especially for those who haven't been able to play the beta... I know I'd feel the same way before I'd gotten a chance to try out the change from Instant Fungal to Missile. But after I tried it, I was surprised how much of a nerf it was. Before you'd always land perfect fungals on groups of units, now many times you'll miss units completely vs moving units, and fast ones are very tough to fungal.
Also, remember that ofc the further the target is, the harder it is to Fungal it. And the more time they have to run away.
This is actually a bigger deal than you'd think.
Giving the missile a move speed effectively reduces the max range that you can actually hit anything. Many times the times you want to use Fungal the most is vs units that are retreating, and before today's patch, Fungaling stalkers that were just running away (not even Blinking) was effectively as if you shot an Instant Fungal of like range 6 (6's just a guess), because they'd have to had been within 6 range of your Infestor at the time you tried to Fungal. Because by the time the projectile got to where you targeted at the max range of 8, they'd be well out of range of course.
Faster retreating units like stimmed bio/hellions/phoenixes/mutas would be even more extreme, meaning that they'd have to be even closer to your infestors to be Fungaled or they'd be out of range. This is not even factoring in how with a missile, they can move in other directions or dodge and make it even harder. And then there's Blink.
I'd wait to try it out before overreacting, these changes might be reasonable.
BTW, for an extreme example: Imagine if Fungal had the same missile speed but a max range of 20. You'd never actually be able to Fungal anything moving from a distance of 20, the enemy would easily just dodge away long beforehand. This is just to illustrate that a max range of a moving missile is so different from instant missiles/spells that it should not be compared.
But it IS constantly compared with other things that are instant range, shocking/enraging nerds everywhere when they just see that "range 10" number in the patch notes. It would be a rational post if not for the fact that the iteration was not even tested substantially. It takes a while to develop good skills to aim spells like that. How long did Zergs have to get used to the new Fungal? We saw in WoL that as time went people got progressively better at using units and skill despite the fact that they did not change. Even when Fungal and Infestor oriented play was beginning it was no where near as good as it is today. I don't see how such a powerful spell, considering its function, was not given more time so as to probe what its actual potential could be. Maybe it was hard to completely deny any hope for retreat for your opponent with the new Fungal, but that was the raging topic in WoL to begin with. It should not be an easy task to completely deny all retreat. Now it's easier to deny that. When we are talking about engaging the Zerg army, now it becomes, potentially, even harder than it ever was in WoL. If you read my post/understand it, you should realize the new Hots fungal is still worse than the current WoL range 8 Instant Fungal. Skill or not, there is also luck and then also the problem of retreating units as I described earlier. It's no question that the new fungal is weaker. The benefit of having a little extra range vs units that arent moving is nothing compared to the nerf of not being able to fungal anything that moves as effectively as PERFECT instant fungals provided.
And the 'problem' against retreating units can also be described as the advantage against attacking units.
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We'll see how this plays out, but I just think that infestors should be a support caster, eg make a handful to fight big slow deathballs, allow banelings to hit, get off a neural, make sneak attacks. I'm just afraid that rebuffing will make them a spammable option again, which imho is not a good idea, as it doesn't produce fun games, neither for playing nor for spectating. If Zerg is too weak without a spammable infestor, buff some other units, not the infestor. We shall see - and test - how this plays out, maybe it is not as bad as it seems.
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10 range lol. Don't even have anything clever to say.
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On December 19 2012 07:52 HollowLord wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2012 07:51 crbox wrote:
Huh I don't get it why did they like buffed the hell out of fungal lol. Not really following the Hots scene but isn't it a general consensus that Fungal is overpowered? No, it's not. Fungal is pretty much useless in Hots now. Edit: I mean pre this patch, don't jump at that shit
i will still stomp on this. Do you know what the word useless means? fungal was not a weapon vs everything anymore and that was fine. Now its just insane.
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On December 19 2012 07:54 Zelniq wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2012 07:48 iEchoic wrote:On December 19 2012 07:44 Zelniq wrote:
BTW, for an extreme example: Imagine if Fungal had the same missile speed but a max range of 20. You'd never actually be able to Fungal anything moving from a distance of 20, the enemy would easily just dodge away long beforehand. This is just to illustrate that a max range of a moving missile is so different from instant missiles/spells that it should not be compared.
But it IS constantly compared with other things that are instant range, shocking/enraging nerds everywhere when they just see that "range 10" number in the patch notes. This isn't a good analogy because the new fungal travels the 10 range faster than it used to travel the 8 range. If they didn't increase the speed as well, this wouldn't be an issue. Imagine in your example that the fungal traveled 20 range faster than it currently travels 10. That's the proper analogy, and yeah, that would be broken. a fair point I guess, tho I don't see how that would be broken. You'd still never hit anything even with the new speed if the distance was 20 and they were watching. but I'ma edit that part out as it's unnecessary anyway I think.
As a note about watching for the fungal and dodging, the new 15-speed projectile travels 10 distance in 2/3rds of a second (note: that's a game-time second on faster, which means it's actually like 1/2 second or something in real life).
It's not physically possible to react to the projectile and move units out of the radius in time. Even if you reacted in 1/4th of a second (as in - see the projectile, click them away, wait for server lag and then them to move), which is borderline impossible, you'd still get hit.
Projectiles will sometimes miss due to units already moving or units moving in response to seeing an infestor move, but you're not going to be watching projectiles and dodging them. This has less to do with awareness, and has more to do with weakness of projectiles on already-moving targets.
You may have already intended this, just pointing out that people aren't going to be doing sick fungal dodging to counter this.
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On December 19 2012 07:59 kollin wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2012 07:57 Plansix wrote:On December 19 2012 07:54 BeyondCtrL wrote:On December 19 2012 07:44 Zelniq wrote:
It may sound outrageous, especially for those who haven't been able to play the beta... I know I'd feel the same way before I'd gotten a chance to try out the change from Instant Fungal to Missile. But after I tried it, I was surprised how much of a nerf it was. Before you'd always land perfect fungals on groups of units, now many times you'll miss units completely vs moving units, and fast ones are very tough to fungal.
Also, remember that ofc the further the target is, the harder it is to Fungal it. And the more time they have to run away.
This is actually a bigger deal than you'd think.
Giving the missile a move speed effectively reduces the max range that you can actually hit anything. Many times the times you want to use Fungal the most is vs units that are retreating, and before today's patch, Fungaling stalkers that were just running away (not even Blinking) was effectively as if you shot an Instant Fungal of like range 6 (6's just a guess), because they'd have to had been within 6 range of your Infestor at the time you tried to Fungal. Because by the time the projectile got to where you targeted at the max range of 8, they'd be well out of range of course.
Faster retreating units like stimmed bio/hellions/phoenixes/mutas would be even more extreme, meaning that they'd have to be even closer to your infestors to be Fungaled or they'd be out of range. This is not even factoring in how with a missile, they can move in other directions or dodge and make it even harder. And then there's Blink.
I'd wait to try it out before overreacting, these changes might be reasonable.
BTW, for an extreme example: Imagine if Fungal had the same missile speed but a max range of 20. You'd never actually be able to Fungal anything moving from a distance of 20, the enemy would easily just dodge away long beforehand. This is just to illustrate that a max range of a moving missile is so different from instant missiles/spells that it should not be compared.
But it IS constantly compared with other things that are instant range, shocking/enraging nerds everywhere when they just see that "range 10" number in the patch notes. It would be a rational post if not for the fact that the iteration was not even tested substantially. It takes a while to develop good skills to aim spells like that. How long did Zergs have to get used to the new Fungal? We saw in WoL that as time went people got progressively better at using units and skill despite the fact that they did not change. Even when Fungal and Infestor oriented play was beginning it was no where near as good as it is today. I don't see how such a powerful spell, considering its function, was not given more time so as to probe what its actual potential could be. Maybe it was hard to completely deny any hope for retreat for your opponent with the new Fungal, but that was the raging topic in WoL to begin with. It should not be an easy task to completely deny all retreat. Now it's easier to deny that. When we are talking about engaging the Zerg army, now it becomes, potentially, even harder than it ever was in WoL. To be fair to zergs, I was able to dodge fungles with phoenixes that were at a dead stop. I saw the infestor waddling up and moved them away. I think the zerg got two of the 8 had with the fungle. I think the only way he could have hit was if I wasn't looking at the screen. Good, maybe we will see less of the infestor. You aren't seriously saying you think it is a well designed unit that we should see a lot?
I am ok with four infestors or so, doing stuff, protecting bases from harassment. Really, I want fungle to be lobbed like it came from a catapult, because it would look awesome. But this is not about want I want.
I don't think any unit should be nerfed to the point where it is useless. BW had units with stuns and there is room for them in SC2 too. Not a ton of them, but room for a few.
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Fungal sounds crazy, but if the speed is slower, then maybe its alright.
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On December 19 2012 07:57 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2012 07:54 BeyondCtrL wrote:On December 19 2012 07:44 Zelniq wrote:
It may sound outrageous, especially for those who haven't been able to play the beta... I know I'd feel the same way before I'd gotten a chance to try out the change from Instant Fungal to Missile. But after I tried it, I was surprised how much of a nerf it was. Before you'd always land perfect fungals on groups of units, now many times you'll miss units completely vs moving units, and fast ones are very tough to fungal.
Also, remember that ofc the further the target is, the harder it is to Fungal it. And the more time they have to run away.
This is actually a bigger deal than you'd think.
Giving the missile a move speed effectively reduces the max range that you can actually hit anything. Many times the times you want to use Fungal the most is vs units that are retreating, and before today's patch, Fungaling stalkers that were just running away (not even Blinking) was effectively as if you shot an Instant Fungal of like range 6 (6's just a guess), because they'd have to had been within 6 range of your Infestor at the time you tried to Fungal. Because by the time the projectile got to where you targeted at the max range of 8, they'd be well out of range of course.
Faster retreating units like stimmed bio/hellions/phoenixes/mutas would be even more extreme, meaning that they'd have to be even closer to your infestors to be Fungaled or they'd be out of range. This is not even factoring in how with a missile, they can move in other directions or dodge and make it even harder. And then there's Blink.
I'd wait to try it out before overreacting, these changes might be reasonable.
BTW, for an extreme example: Imagine if Fungal had the same missile speed but a max range of 20. You'd never actually be able to Fungal anything moving from a distance of 20, the enemy would easily just dodge away long beforehand. This is just to illustrate that a max range of a moving missile is so different from instant missiles/spells that it should not be compared.
But it IS constantly compared with other things that are instant range, shocking/enraging nerds everywhere when they just see that "range 10" number in the patch notes. It would be a rational post if not for the fact that the iteration was not even tested substantially. It takes a while to develop good skills to aim spells like that. How long did Zergs have to get used to the new Fungal? We saw in WoL that as time went people got progressively better at using units and skill despite the fact that they did not change. Even when Fungal and Infestor oriented play was beginning it was no where near as good as it is today. I don't see how such a powerful spell, considering its function, was not given more time so as to probe what its actual potential could be. Maybe it was hard to completely deny any hope for retreat for your opponent with the new Fungal, but that was the raging topic in WoL to begin with. It should not be an easy task to completely deny all retreat. Now it's easier to deny that. When we are talking about engaging the Zerg army, now it becomes, potentially, even harder than it ever was in WoL. To be fair to zergs, I was able to dodge fungles with phoenixes that were at a dead stop. I saw the infestor waddling up and moved them away. I think the zerg got two of the 8 had with the fungle. I think the only way he could have hit the majority of them was if I wasn't looking at the screen.
That's what I mean. The spell went from a no skill guaranteed hit to a skill based judgement call. Just because you moved your Pheonixes out of the way does not mean we have to assume the Zerg did his best at attempting to Fungal them. He probably just pressed "F" and clicked on your Pheonixes without even thinking.
Wouldn't it take more skill for the spell user to accept the fact that you can see his units and that his intent is painfully obvious? Woe unto us if Zergs were to use creativity once in a while when approaching an engagement.
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On December 19 2012 08:02 SpecKROELLchen wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2012 07:52 HollowLord wrote:On December 19 2012 07:51 crbox wrote:
Huh I don't get it why did they like buffed the hell out of fungal lol. Not really following the Hots scene but isn't it a general consensus that Fungal is overpowered? No, it's not. Fungal is pretty much useless in Hots now. Edit: I mean pre this patch, don't jump at that shit i will still stomp on this. Do you know what the word useless means? fungal was not a weapon vs everything anymore and that was fine. Now its just insane.
Fungal was useless. The end. Whether you think it should be useless or not doesn't change the fact that it was useless.
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On December 19 2012 07:58 InVerno wrote:
10 is the center of the aoe, but fungal can hit at 12 too because of 2 aoe radius.
So basically it's a siege tank without siege mode, with the 2x of the splash damage, 1psi less, moves cloacked and faster and every unit hitted slowly dies due to chain fungal. Eh ah, got a very strong anti air too.
At the cost of a bit gas more than a tank. Seems legit.
If 10 is the center of the AoE, doesn't that make it 11 range? I assume that with 2 radius it would hit from 9 to 11 range.
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So, according to David Kim, some time ago blizz intended these changes:
+ Show Spoiler +Terran 1. Redesign Thor ability/Raven seeker missile 2. Push early game Reaper a bit more 3. Hellbats better against melee units, not necessarily better vs. Ranged. 4. We'd really like to see more Medivac usage like we saw in Wings for a time in the past. Currently thinking on a cooldown based speed booster ability. 5. Buff Bio in the late game - with the addition of new units in HotS, we feel Bio in the late game is a bit weak. 6. Buff mech in general - we'd like to maybe test combining the vehicle and air upgrades at the armory. Zerg 1. Hydralisk movement speed upgrade to Lair 2. Mutalisk buff to speed and/or acceleration 3. Ultralisk changed to be good vs. all ground 4. Nerf Infestor quite heavily5. Make it easier to unburrow and reposition Swarm Hosts Protoss 1. Redesign Voidray - we're currently thinking of having the player choose when to activate the charge. 2. Oracle - pulsar beam would now overlap too much with the new Voidray, so we'd like to change the Oracle to be more of a worker harasser. 3. Buff DTs not necessarily for the DT rush case, but to have DTs more often in the late game. 4. Nerf Vortex - we don't like how all or nothing this ability is in Wings, and with new unit adds, we feel we can remove or phase out this ability. 5. Tempest doesn't counter all late tech Zerg. We currently don't like how Zerg can't go Tier 3 units if Tempests are in play. 6. Make Voidray + Phoenix + Oracle combo a viable strat overall. These are our current thoughts for each of the races. And please remember none of these changes are final. Our hope is to move into the more fine tuning stages if this major patch turns out well. source: http://eu.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/5966979955
And now they buff fungal. Niece one.
Terran changes make a lot of sense. Widow mine might be a bit weak vs toss now, maybe?
Blink change is just a bandaid fix on MSC. It was an amazing unit at the start of the beta - back when it moved slow as hell and had the ability to energize. Now it's this dumb tweener, that isn't good for much else then detection and high ground spotting for blink allins. I wish they reverted it back to early concept stage, along with recall.
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On December 19 2012 06:22 neoghaleon55 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2012 06:18 Archas wrote:
Were Infestors really so neutered by the previous Fungal Growth change that Blizzard needed to boost the range and missile speed this much?
Serious question, by the way. Actually yes. If you've been playing on ladder, you would know that Terran lately have been making nothing but MMM, tankless. That is because zerg had no AOE to stop it. The short range of fungal coupled with the slow projectile speed, made it very difficult to punish mass bio play. If you cast fungal, it would usually only hit perimeter units, not the center clump of the unit, effectively half the AOE would be wasted.
No AoE? What about dat baneling? I hear they are pretty good against mmm
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i think blizzard is just trying to force terran users to build that useless fusion core building... Maybe is BC's were something like the broodlord(you know, worth building and cost efficient).
Zergs have now also flooded the hots ladder and its now 50% zergs or more, should have just left fungal where it was and make changes to other zerg units...
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On December 19 2012 08:03 Prog455 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2012 07:58 InVerno wrote:
10 is the center of the aoe, but fungal can hit at 12 too because of 2 aoe radius.
So basically it's a siege tank without siege mode, with the 2x of the splash damage, 1psi less, moves cloacked and faster and every unit hitted slowly dies due to chain fungal. Eh ah, got a very strong anti air too.
At the cost of a bit gas more than a tank. Seems legit. If 10 is the center of the AoE, doesn't that make it 11 range? I assume that with 2 radius it would hit from 9 to 11 range.
yeah.
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You know, before this buff fungal was unusable on Beta because 8 range + projectile + Beta latency
Honestly, I was completely sure they'd remove the projectile part completely, but they didnt, and that's interesting, because it somehow show us that they do not want at all to take the Wol approach, they are trying new things, and I dont see how it could be a bad thing about fungals
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EPT
