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On September 22 2012 10:07 Robotix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2012 07:58 Fencar wrote:
Warpins, Colossus, Blink, completely screw with the low mobility of Mech. Blinkstalker all-in's also kill Mech builds and are one of the hardest things to fight even when opening Bio.
Charge, Immortals, and Colossus are also some of the toughest things for Tanks to fight against. Mines die to Colossus+Observer, and then there are only a few layers of mines for the Chargelots to fight. Tanks are really good against Colossi. Not only do they do bonus damage to Armored and outrange Colossi, they also do full damage to anything directly beneath the Colossi (and splash to everything nearby, including other Colossi).
Collosus vs tanks is actually a somewhat interesting matchup desingwise. Its true that in direct comeback with FF tanks should do well vs collosus. However collosus/blink stalker combination (esp. with recall) has really strong mobility and could provide a lot of trouble against mech. It's just sad that we (apparently) will not see this matchup play out due to the incompencies of Blizzard.
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Yes, because EMP belonged to the Science Vessel instead of the Ghost. Byebye Immortals.
EDIT: Actually, come to think of it, Colossi would be more of a threat without Vikings. Hmmm...
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10387 Posts
On September 22 2012 10:34 Crawdad wrote:
Yes, because EMP belonged to the Science Vessel instead of the Ghost. Byebye Immortals.
EDIT: Actually, come to think of it, Colossi would be more of a threat without Vikings. Hmmm...
EMP w/ bigger radius and taking out 100% of shields/energy. imba!!!
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Collossus is just too good, if you removed it then yes, original mech is viable at most
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remove immortals. Start from there.
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United States97276 Posts
On September 21 2012 07:59 Tppz! wrote:
The big problem of mech in HotS are 2 things:
a) anti air
b) immortal
both would be solved by a goliath. a) because of his anti air attack (obviously) and b) because of his fast attack. so yes it would in my opinion.
This post pretty much sums it up. Battle hellions seem to hold up against the zealots pretty well which was a major problem. Immortals are still pretty annoying but HoTS has definitely started in the right direction. Part of me wishes I could have gotten into the Beta while the warhound was there so I could have a little fun with that xD but I lost when I was meching today  I know I'm not a real high level player to go by (only diamond in WoL >.< so bad!) but mech at least seems more reasonable than it was before. The goliath would be a perfect support unit
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I think it would do MUCH better than the current mech composition.
First off tanks are straight up stronger (theyll do their full damage to cols) and 2 supply. Secondly, because you can open with spider mines it makes P all-ins/builds that doesn't involve the robo that much riskier. Thirdly, many dont realise but vultures shoot faster than a hellion while dealing 20 damage to light units (10 to armoured). Also adding the goliaths means anti air is covered well.
Map control will be fought over proxy pylon/warp ins vs vulture/spider mines. P will require observers every time or get punished. Id think immortals would fall to vultures really fast.
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On September 23 2012 08:23 YyapSsap wrote:
I think it would do MUCH better than the current mech composition.
First off tanks are straight up stronger (theyll do their full damage to cols) and 2 supply. Secondly, because you can open with spider mines it makes P all-ins/builds that doesn't involve the robo that much riskier. Thirdly, many dont realise but vultures shoot faster than a hellion while dealing 20 damage to light units (10 to armoured). Also adding the goliaths means anti air is covered well.
Map control will be fought over proxy pylon/warp ins vs vulture/spider mines. P will require observers every time or get punished. Id think immortals would fall to vultures really fast.
On September 23 2012 08:23 YyapSsap wrote:
Map control will be fought over proxy pylon/warp ins vs vulture/spider mines. P will require observers every time or get punished. Id think immortals would fall to vultures really fast.
On September 23 2012 08:23 YyapSsap wrote:
Id think immortals would fall to vultures really fast.
Spit out my drink.
BW vultures have(according to Liquipedia) 80 hp, no armor and 5 range. In BW concussive damage did 25% damage versus big target, not 50%.
I find the notion of vultures killing immortals hilarious. "Really fast". The best part is that I´m sure you´re serious.
When did you last play BW mech, if at all? Watching other players do it doesn´t count.
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Just make a map. Implement the bw tec and try it out. Give terran vultures, mines change the tank supply give goliath remove helion and keep toss as they are... perhaps some high master or gm could test that?
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I honestly don't think Mech tvp in Hots is that weak right now. I mean yeah it still isn't perfect, but Morrow is playing lots of mech against protoss right now and he actually seems to make it work pretty well. I think a buff for widow mines to 1 supply might be what is needed. I would at least like blizz to let the pros test it just a little bit more( like i said, from what i've seen from morrow he is doing ok with mech), before they do some drastic changes, like add a goliath like unit. And spider mines just wouldn't work against blink stalkers or collossi. Plus changing tanks to be much stronger would completely screw zerg.
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On September 23 2012 18:04 Mataza wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2012 08:23 YyapSsap wrote:
I think it would do MUCH better than the current mech composition.
First off tanks are straight up stronger (theyll do their full damage to cols) and 2 supply. Secondly, because you can open with spider mines it makes P all-ins/builds that doesn't involve the robo that much riskier. Thirdly, many dont realise but vultures shoot faster than a hellion while dealing 20 damage to light units (10 to armoured). Also adding the goliaths means anti air is covered well.
Map control will be fought over proxy pylon/warp ins vs vulture/spider mines. P will require observers every time or get punished. Id think immortals would fall to vultures really fast. Show nested quote +On September 23 2012 08:23 YyapSsap wrote:
Map control will be fought over proxy pylon/warp ins vs vulture/spider mines. P will require observers every time or get punished. Id think immortals would fall to vultures really fast. Show nested quote +On September 23 2012 08:23 YyapSsap wrote:
Id think immortals would fall to vultures really fast. Spit out my drink. BW vultures have(according to Liquipedia) 80 hp, no armor and 5 range. In BW concussive damage did 25% damage versus big target, not 50%. I find the notion of vultures killing immortals hilarious. "Really fast". The best part is that I´m sure you´re serious. When did you last play BW mech, if at all? Watching other players do it doesn´t count.
looks like you aren't reading this thread
shields in BW take full damage from all attacks. so vultures will be doing damage to immortal shields about the same speed as a marauder, costs only 75, and doesn't take full damage from immortal shots in return
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On September 23 2012 23:11 Zanno wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2012 18:04 Mataza wrote:On September 23 2012 08:23 YyapSsap wrote:
I think it would do MUCH better than the current mech composition.
First off tanks are straight up stronger (theyll do their full damage to cols) and 2 supply. Secondly, because you can open with spider mines it makes P all-ins/builds that doesn't involve the robo that much riskier. Thirdly, many dont realise but vultures shoot faster than a hellion while dealing 20 damage to light units (10 to armoured). Also adding the goliaths means anti air is covered well.
Map control will be fought over proxy pylon/warp ins vs vulture/spider mines. P will require observers every time or get punished. Id think immortals would fall to vultures really fast. On September 23 2012 08:23 YyapSsap wrote:
Map control will be fought over proxy pylon/warp ins vs vulture/spider mines. P will require observers every time or get punished. Id think immortals would fall to vultures really fast. On September 23 2012 08:23 YyapSsap wrote:
Id think immortals would fall to vultures really fast. Spit out my drink. BW vultures have(according to Liquipedia) 80 hp, no armor and 5 range. In BW concussive damage did 25% damage versus big target, not 50%. I find the notion of vultures killing immortals hilarious. "Really fast". The best part is that I´m sure you´re serious. When did you last play BW mech, if at all? Watching other players do it doesn´t count. looks like you aren't reading this thread shields in BW take full damage from all attacks. so vultures will be doing damage to immortal shields about the same speed as a marauder, costs only 75, and doesn't take full damage from immortal shots in return
Vultures don´t attack as fast as maruaders. They attack a bit slower than unstimmed marauders with less range. So quite a bit slower.
If that was enough, Hellions would work in WoL.
Hellions have 10 more HP, do 8-11 damage (so full shield damage and double the vulture after shields go down)and do splash.
That down doesn´t make them kill immortals.
They would evaporate as fast if not faster than Hellions and once Immortals reach your tanks, it´s over regardless. Range 7, 3 shots per Tank.
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EPT
