EPTOff-Topic General Discussion - Page 2651
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mordek
United States12705 Posts
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
He's so hard to buy for. I mean, it's easy to get him DVDs because he loves a lot of movies and shows, but it feels lame just getting DVDs over and over. Feels really impersonal, you know? | ||
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Scip
Czech Republic11293 Posts
Good thing she gave up early, I haven't said happy birthday IRL since¨, let alone buy anyone a gift LOL | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On August 01 2014 01:53 mordek wrote: He's my God because he chose me and I chose him. There is no us vs. them in my mind. There are people who have acknowledged God and obey him and there are those that have chosen not to. We're all the same people made in His image. I need you to elaborate more on this "us vs. them" paradigm. Right, but in my mind it's still boiling down to "You now have to make this choice, and if you don't choose correctly (to follow God), then it's going to suck for you" - which I just don't agree with at all. The "us vs them" thing is what Teut was using to explain conflict in general, not just religious conflict, but religion is a very easy way to create an "us vs them" mentality. On August 01 2014 01:58 Requizen wrote: Crap I've forgotten to get a birthday present for my Dad. I should take care of that sooner rather than later. He's so hard to buy for. I mean, it's easy to get him DVDs because he loves a lot of movies and shows, but it feels lame just getting DVDs over and over. Feels really impersonal, you know? It seems our fathers share a birthday. edit: rereading, I might have just interpreted that your dad's birthday is today lol | ||
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mordek
United States12705 Posts
On August 01 2014 01:58 Requizen wrote: Crap I've forgotten to get a birthday present for my Dad. I should take care of that sooner rather than later. He's so hard to buy for. I mean, it's easy to get him DVDs because he loves a lot of movies and shows, but it feels lame just getting DVDs over and over. Feels really impersonal, you know? What's his favorite show? [QUOTE]On August 01 2014 02:01 jcarlsoniv wrote: [QUOTE]On August 01 2014 01:53 mordek wrote: He's my God because he chose me and I chose him. There is no us vs. them in my mind. There are people who have acknowledged God and obey him and there are those that have chosen not to. We're all the same people made in His image. I need you to elaborate more on this "us vs. them" paradigm.[/QUOTE] Right, but in my mind it's still boiling down to "You now have to make this choice, and if you don't choose correctly (to follow God), then it's going to suck for you" - which I just don't agree with at all. The "us vs them" thing is what Teut was using to explain conflict in general, not just religious conflict, but religion is a very easy way to create an "us vs them" mentality. There is an element of "this is how it is" I can't deny that. We make choices all the time that have consequences. Lots of them are sucky. I mean we can complain about sucky consequences, I'm with you there. I'm confused about the "now you have to choose" point. You are always making this choice. This is an active choice being made by everyone all the time. People create us vs. them. You can use "religion" as a tool just like anything else. I would argue any and all sin will boil down to me vs. others. My interests, my glory, my needs are ahead of anyone else's. Not what we were created for (glorifying God and subsequently others made in His image). | ||
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Dandel Ion
Austria17960 Posts
In essence the basis of missionary work is "I really believe in that god fella and I'm a pretty swell dude, if other people are as swell as me they'll also believe in god when they hear about it and if they aren't they won't." From there it's a microscopically small step to translate the last part into "If they don't believe in the same thing as me they're not as swell as I am" So everybody choosing your religion is clearly a smart gentleman while everyone that doesn't is an idiot. This has nothing to do with religion it's just how people work. Humans are all about the "us vs them" mentality. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
I dunno a lot of things. Star Trek, GoT, Doctor Who, Fringe, BSG, Walking Dead, basically anything I watch as well. | ||
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mordek
United States12705 Posts
On August 01 2014 02:06 Requizen wrote: I dunno a lot of things. Star Trek, GoT, Doctor Who, Fringe, BSG, Walking Dead, basically anything I watch as well. Is there any kind of show related thing you can get him? If he's a big fan of something he would appreciate something tangible about that show/movie? | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On August 01 2014 02:11 mordek wrote: Is there any kind of show related thing you can get him? If he's a big fan of something he would appreciate something tangible about that show/movie? Well I've done that previously with stuff, like he has a Tardis for his desk and some of those little POP statues of TWD characters, maybe I'll go look for something similar. | ||
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
On August 01 2014 01:40 jcarlsoniv wrote: Sure, I understand. I've just always thought it was a bit odd that it's like "Hey, I just met you, and this is crazy, but these are my god's laws, so now you have to choose whether or not you want to abandon what you believed before to follow this thing I've now introduced to you, else burn in hell." I'm not sure that fits the tune... | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
I'm confused about the "now you have to choose" point. You are always making this choice. This is an active choice being made by everyone all the time. I was going back more to the question I posed before regarding people who were previously unaware of this religion and belief set. They have now been informed of something that others believe, and because they now have the knowledge, they are "forced" to make a choice, and if they don't choose the new stuff, then it will suck for them. It's irrelevant what this isolated group believed before (or didn't believe, if that may be the case), but in the eyes of the believers, the isolated will now be judged by God if they don't choose to follow him since they now know of him, even though they wouldn't have been judged if the believers never spread the word? Even if the believers have the best of intentions (to spread happiness), they've now burdened this isolated group with their own belief system and perceived punishments/benefits. | ||
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Duvon
Sweden2360 Posts
Then I remember "wrong" things, and despair. I live by my own rules, as well as I can. I don't do perfectly, but good enough that I'd consider myself a good person (lol, who doesn't). I believe in love, hardship, acceptance, yada yada, but I also believe in the importance of.. not individualism as an -ism, but the principal sense of persons being individuals, who are more or less unique, but still unique enough that labels are close to worthless. <confusing>I'm an anti-labeler. Including labels such as what religion you believe in, what sex you are interested in, and so on. Yes, labels can be good for science, but they must be absent when we are talking about specific people, you or me, our friends and groups we find ourselves in. </confusing> | ||
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ComaDose
Canada10357 Posts
religion is like a hereditary scare tactic that threatens people into behaving well. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On August 01 2014 02:39 Duvon wrote: Sometimes I wish I had faith, and comfort from it. Then I remember "wrong" things, and despair. I live by my own rules, as well as I can. I don't do perfectly, but good enough that I'd consider myself a good person (lol, who doesn't). I believe in love, hardship, acceptance, yada yada, but I also believe in the importance of.. not individualism as an -ism, but the principal sense of persons being individuals, who are more or less unique, but still unique enough that labels are close to worthless. <confusing>I'm an anti-labeler. Including labels such as what religion you believe in, what sex you are interested in, and so on. Yes, labels can be good for science, but they must be absent when we are talking about specific people, you or me, our friends and groups we find ourselves in. </confusing> You make it sounds like everyone who believes lives a saintly life. Not at all, everyone messes up, even the Pope goes to confession. The point is to try, with the help of whatever deity you believe in, to be as good of a person as you can, and (at least in Christianity) to not worry about failing because if you're truly, completely repentful in your soul, God forgives. On August 01 2014 02:42 ComaDose wrote: it bothers me how geographical religions are like if you were born in a Muslim state and your parents took you to temple every week and made you say your prayers do you really think that you would choose the same god. religion is like a hereditary scare tactic that threatens people into behaving well. So is anything in the world. Political views, moral lines, what music you listen to, how polite you are, the way you treat women - all these are ingrained in your head as well. But, as we grow up, we change our minds on everything we know and sometimes grow into a completely different person than we were raised as. That's part of being human. | ||
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mordek
United States12705 Posts
On August 01 2014 02:29 jcarlsoniv wrote: dat formatting mord I was going back more to the question I posed before regarding people who were previously unaware of this religion and belief set. They have now been informed of something that others believe, and because they now have the knowledge, they are "forced" to make a choice, and if they don't choose the new stuff, then it will suck for them. It's irrelevant what this isolated group believed before (or didn't believe, if that may be the case), but in the eyes of the believers, the isolated will now be judged by God if they don't choose to follow him since they now know of him, even though they wouldn't have been judged if the believers never spread the word? Even if the believers have the best of intentions (to spread happiness), they've now burdened this isolated group with their own belief system and perceived punishments/benefits. Whoops, I didn't even notice I mis-copied. They're judged based on their knowledge. I would argue in these isolated groups there are those that are acknowledging this unknown god (God) and there are those choosing their own wickedness. They are still making the choice. Spreading the gospel is to convince those choosing sin/iniquity/wickedness to repent by explaining who God is and His salvation. Since I'm not God I couldn't tell you how he makes certain distinctions but we trust he judges fairly. Probably unnecessary but I'd like to say I'm very much interested in helping you understand a perspective you may not have had a lot of great exposure to. I wholeheartedly believe in what I'm telling you. These are tough questions that I've had to wrestle with and this is my best understanding at the moment. I hope it helps and I also hope you explore these things more. | ||
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Celial
2602 Posts
On August 01 2014 01:19 MoonBear wrote: Relugious discussions are banned from the General Forum because they always descend into asinine arguements and are an agony to read let alone moderate. I am somewhat ok with this discussion in OT for now. Because the community here is smaller and knows each other I think it's much less likely that the discussion can stay reasonable and respectful, and avoid ridiculous hyperbole or arguments becoming personal. After all, there is no point trying to burn bridges with people who you're going to interact with regularly especially in a small community. I dont care about this discussion, I was just confused why it was happening in the first place cuz I clearly remember reading the rule all those years ago. I was just making the observation that the rule is apparently gone OR I'm looking in all the wrong places. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On August 01 2014 03:01 mordek wrote: Whoops, I didn't even notice I mis-copied. They're judged based on their knowledge. I would argue in these isolated groups there are those that are acknowledging this unknown god (God) and there are those choosing their own wickedness. They are still making the choice. Spreading the gospel is to convince those choosing sin/iniquity/wickedness to repent by explaining who God is and His salvation. Since I'm not God I couldn't tell you how he makes certain distinctions but we trust he judges fairly. I EXPECT YOU TO KNOW THESE THINGS DAMNIT <3 Thanks for entertaining my questions. For me, belief in a deity would have to come from some sort of empirical and physical evidence - I've never been one to blindly trust in anything. But if there were indisputable proof that some sort of god/afterlife exists, then I'd be a fool and a hypocrite not to acknowledge it. | ||
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mordek
United States12705 Posts
On August 01 2014 03:07 jcarlsoniv wrote: I EXPECT YOU TO KNOW THESE THINGS DAMNIT <3 Thanks for entertaining my questions. For me, belief in a deity would have to come from some sort of empirical and physical evidence - I've never been one to blindly trust in anything. But if there were indisputable proof that some sort of god/afterlife exists, then I'd be a fool and a hypocrite not to acknowledge it. How seriously are you pursuing empirical/physical evidence and what would it take for something to be indisputable? Also I seriously appreciate how well this discussion has gone  <3 Moonbear would be proud. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On August 01 2014 03:08 mordek wrote: How seriously are you pursuing empirical/physical evidence and what would it take for something to be indisputable. I'm not pursuing it at all as I have no particular desire or need/wish to believe in something "greater". For it to be indisputable, it would have to be something that could be tested and proven. It would have to go through the same principles of science that anything that I know to be fact would have gone through. | ||
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