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Waxangel
United States33388 Posts
![[image loading]](/staff/Waxangel/EPT/summer2020/dhmastersbanner750.jpg) DreamHack SC2 Masters WinterSchedule Europe: September 29 - October 17 North America: October 5-17 Latin America: September 29 - October 3 China: October 6-10 Taiwan / Hong Kong / Macau / Japan: September 29 - October 3 Oceania & Rest of Asia: September 29 - October 3 Players North America Latin America China Taiwan, Hong Kong, Macau, and Japan Oceania / Asia Official Streams (Check TL.net for community streams)  ESL StarCraft II - Main Stream ESL StarCraft II - B Stream | ||
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Waxangel
United States33388 Posts
Let's all share what temperature it is where you're at. A balmy 20°C here in New York  | ||
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stilt
France2749 Posts
The third game of denver vs ptitdrogo was amazing tho ! | ||
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Kreuger
Sweden728 Posts
 Enjoyed the games today, to bad Sortof couldnt take a win though | ||
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Durnuu
13320 Posts
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stilt
France2749 Posts
On October 02 2021 03:36 Durnuu wrote: Marinelord and Stephano battling to see who is the best totally 100% retired player Dunno if there is a "mlord has retired" meme on reddit but for now mlord is still playing full time while steph has a full time job now. The french terran is even training a lot with Serral. | ||
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darklycid
3510 Posts
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Kreuger
Sweden728 Posts
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AzAlexZ
Australia3303 Posts
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AzAlexZ
Australia3303 Posts
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Kreuger
Sweden728 Posts
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Crocolisk Dundee
870 Posts
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Kreuger
Sweden728 Posts
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royalroadweed
United States8301 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
I think thats why you see KR Terran opening with Tanks more often (Maru Cure Byun), because they got smashed with Roach timing from Rogue and Dark too many times in their career already. | ||
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Luolis
Finland7104 Posts
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Oukka
Finland1683 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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Pandain
United States12989 Posts
1. Who will win China? 2. Neeb likely to be knocked out if he loses vs Nina, possibly knocked out if he only wins 2-1. In addition, we have: 1. Serral going for 14-0 2. Astrea and Scarlett vs each other for first place 3. Marinelord-Clem in rematch fighting each other for first. 4. Maxpax Lambo fighting different opponents for second place. 5. Disk-Asuna fighting each other for 2nd place. And most groups still being open for who makes it 3-4th | ||
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AzAlexZ
Australia3303 Posts
On October 10 2021 05:29 Luolis wrote: Still dont understand why Purelegacy is allowed to play. wdym? | ||
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Luolis
Finland7104 Posts
He was banned from WCS couple years ago for hacking. Dunno why the same ban isn't enforced now. | ||
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Elentos
55550 Posts
He was banned from WCS for being a maphacker not that long ago. | ||
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Luolis
Finland7104 Posts
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hjpalpha
Germany339 Posts
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Pandain
United States12989 Posts
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AzAlexZ
Australia3303 Posts
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Pandain
United States12989 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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dysenterymd
1237 Posts
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Pandain
United States12989 Posts
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darklycid
3510 Posts
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ZombieGrub
United States704 Posts
On October 10 2021 18:43 Luolis wrote: Also Vindicta too, i don't know why he is allowed to play either. huh? | ||
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royalroadweed
United States8301 Posts
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darklycid
3510 Posts
On October 11 2021 01:38 royalroadweed wrote: Showtime's supply plummeted after that fungal growth + parasitic bomb. Maybe he didn't have to take that fight. He was up in bases. Think they were equal at that time, but yeah best way of winning would probably have been the tempest turtle but noone ever wants to see that. | ||
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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darklycid
3510 Posts
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AzAlexZ
Australia3303 Posts
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Captain Peabody
United States3110 Posts
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Swisslink
2953 Posts
On October 11 2021 02:25 AzAlexZ wrote: OMEGA THROW by Skillous No idea why he fought there. reynor did as well as he could, no doubt, but there was no reason for Skillous to not just expand everywhere instead of suiciding an entire army. | ||
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AzAlexZ
Australia3303 Posts
On October 11 2021 02:27 Swisslink wrote: No idea why he fought there. reynor did as well as he could, no doubt, but there was no reason for Skillous to not just expand everywhere instead of suiciding an entire army. I know right? Literally the worst thing he could do, and he does it to lose. | ||
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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darklycid
3510 Posts
On October 11 2021 02:31 tigera6 wrote: Its called being an arrogant boy, he thought he could A-Move Skytoss into the forest of Spores and auto-win. Horrible take. | ||
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Pandain
United States12989 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
Yeah? Still as not horrible as that throw. | ||
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Captain Peabody
United States3110 Posts
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AzAlexZ
Australia3303 Posts
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Captain Peabody
United States3110 Posts
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tantalus
69 Posts
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hjpalpha
Germany339 Posts
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koalabro
59 Posts
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dysenterymd
1237 Posts
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Elentos
55550 Posts
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ilax300
15 Posts
On October 11 2021 03:40 koalabro wrote: Funny that they said Stephano is untrained. AFAIK, he has never practiced. Ever. And still won. I think he just isn't up to date with the meta. yeah because the meta has shifted so much lately lel | ||
Poopi
France12883 Posts
On October 11 2021 03:40 koalabro wrote: Funny that they said Stephano is untrained. AFAIK, he has never practiced. Ever. And still won. I think he just isn't up to date with the meta. He has practiced in the past, obviously? The whole slacker thing was for memes and giggles, he even pretended to be studying medicine. Since he is now working full time for Ogaming, he does not practice much indeed, which kinda explains those poor results. MarineLord is on fire though | ||
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feardragon
United States972 Posts
On October 11 2021 03:17 hjpalpha wrote: How i hate all that TalkCraft ... they are >1h behind schedule and still do a long TalkCraft segment ... This was because there's a rule dreamhack has about the final day of groups. Every match in each group has to start at the same time so if main stream match finished early, the options are break or talkcraft. | ||
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Luolis
Finland7104 Posts
I was told that he was a maphacker before. | ||
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ZombieGrub
United States704 Posts
It's a very big accusation, one that deserves just the bare minimum of research done before throwing it around. /: | ||
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Luolis
Finland7104 Posts
On October 12 2021 21:28 ZombieGrub wrote: It's a very big accusation, one that deserves just the bare minimum of research done before throwing it around. /: Sure. I had no reason to doubt it, since it came from a trustworthy person and people like Pengwin have accused him of it before as well . If i'm wrong, then that's my bad. | ||
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Harris1st
Germany6929 Posts
And what a lovely bracket we have in EU <3 | ||
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dbRic1203
Germany2655 Posts
On October 12 2021 23:17 Harris1st wrote: And what a lovely bracket we have in EU <3 We didn t get the losers Breaket full of Protoss, that Mana promised us, though.. | ||
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buzz_bender
445 Posts
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yoshi245
United States2969 Posts
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swarminfestor
Malaysia2449 Posts
On October 12 2021 23:55 buzz_bender wrote: Elazer trying to copy Rogue's roach ravager style against Clem, but Rogue's roach ravager play is sooo much better than Elazer's... Yeah, he also find the weak spot on Clem's base to nydus Lurkers just like Rogue or Dark did before after roach 1-to-1 timing failed. Kudos to him taking one single map from Clem. | ||
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buzz_bender
445 Posts
On October 13 2021 00:06 swarminfestor wrote: Yeah, he also find the weak spot on Clem's base to nydus Lurkers just like Rogue or Dark did before after roach 1-to-1 timing failed. Kudos to him taking one single map from Clem. Yups, but you can see that it took him sometime before he transitioned to that. It just seems to me that Rogue/Dark is so much more decisive with this style compared to Elazer. It's understandable, since it's prob not played much in EU. | ||
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allmotor1
153 Posts
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mierin
United States4943 Posts
Though honestly I could do without the "(in my opinion) the GOAT" every Serral cast out of Catz, lol. | ||
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darklycid
3510 Posts
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Kreuger
Sweden728 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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Kreuger
Sweden728 Posts
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Pandain
United States12989 Posts
two our of the top 4 not making season finals | ||
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geokilla
Canada8240 Posts
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Kreuger
Sweden728 Posts
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dysenterymd
1237 Posts
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Poopi
France12883 Posts
French terrans so strong atm | ||
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stilt
France2749 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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geokilla
Canada8240 Posts
On October 13 2021 04:40 tigera6 wrote: Its actually normal for Reynor form to dip for a short period, although he hasn do well since DH Summer Global is a bit strange to see. The problem is his Ling only play style in the mid game to early late game. It just doesn't work. It looks like Terran players have started to figure it out and how to counter it. Of course I'm salty because I lost $140. The odds were like 1.08 lol. | ||
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AzAlexZ
Australia3303 Posts
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Pandain
United States12989 Posts
On October 13 2021 07:49 AzAlexZ wrote: If Clem beats Serral then there's a chance that Showtime makes it to the finals beating only Terrans Which is a pretty good sign if his 3-0 over HM is anything to judge by. Also, funnily enough, Showtime/ML might be a harder match for Clem than Reynor (or even Serral???). If ML somehow makes it to the finals he would have beaten S-class EU players from each matchup, which would be insanely impressive. | ||
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buzz_bender
445 Posts
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swarminfestor
Malaysia2449 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
On October 13 2021 13:26 swarminfestor wrote: Is this second time Reynor will miss Global Final in a year? More like 2 times in a ROW, but I hope thats not happening. | ||
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Archerylady
277 Posts
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Luolis
Finland7104 Posts
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Vision_
861 Posts
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Oukka
Finland1683 Posts
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Harris1st
Germany6929 Posts
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Harris1st
Germany6929 Posts
On October 13 2021 01:24 mierin wrote: Nathanias has really improved his British accent! Though honestly I could do without the "(in my opinion) the GOAT" every Serral cast out of Catz, lol. Yeah it really is a bit much. Though I enjoyed the Goat vs Lamb joke :D | ||
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koalabro
59 Posts
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geokilla
Canada8240 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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ETisME
12391 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
On October 14 2021 01:49 ETisME wrote: Denver the MVP gifting us both Denver Elazer AND this gem. A true God | ||
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dysenterymd
1237 Posts
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darklycid
3510 Posts
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Nakajin
Canada8989 Posts
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Harris1st
Germany6929 Posts
On October 14 2021 01:14 koalabro wrote: This may be a stupid question from me, but I didn't see Liquibets for this. Am I missing something? Normal ESL games don't have Liquibets AFAIK it's reserved for the "bigger" games | ||
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swarminfestor
Malaysia2449 Posts
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TheCheapSkate
Slovenia316 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
And damnnn, MaxPax playing an amazing PvZ game, I thought that was Trap-like at his best performance. | ||
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Swisslink
2953 Posts
On October 15 2021 01:44 tigera6 wrote: Yep, Lambo played like he has no idea that Denver was going for early pressure every game, and lost because he couldnt handle those well enough. And damnnn, MaxPax playing an amazing PvZ game, I thought that was Trap-like at his best performance. That Void Ray split was... not ideal to say the least though. | ||
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darklycid
3510 Posts
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Kreuger
Sweden728 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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Kreuger
Sweden728 Posts
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Husyelt
United States832 Posts
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JackieKnox
1 Post
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MarianoSC2
Slovakia1855 Posts
On October 15 2021 04:02 Kreuger wrote: Love this style from Uthermal, dropmech It pissed me off. Finally he did something to surprise Reynor and catch him off guard only to completely throw away his lead by not transitioning into normal play once Reynor started countering it | ||
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buzz_bender
445 Posts
On October 15 2021 16:39 MarianoSC2 wrote: It pissed me off. Finally he did something to surprise Reynor and catch him off guard only to completely throw away his lead by not transitioning into normal play once Reynor started countering it Yeah, I agree. I thought that uThermal had a substantial lead after his first two drops, and if he focus fired on the Hive he could have got it. Once that's done, he should just revert back to usual mech play, and converge his army for a slow push forward. If he did that, I think he would have won. I do love the innovation though! I hope someone will be able to make it work in the future. | ||
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fLyiNgDroNe
Belgium4009 Posts
And either of the Showtime, MarineLord, Denver and Maxpax will take the other 2 slots? Fascinating | ||
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buzz_bender
445 Posts
On October 15 2021 20:17 fLyiNgDroNe wrote: so, do i see it correctly that out of Reynor, Serral, Clem and Heromarine at this point only 2 players can qualify for the season finals? And either of the Showtime, MarineLord, Denver and Maxpax will take the other 2 slots? Fascinating Yes | ||
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dysenterymd
1237 Posts
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Crocolisk Dundee
870 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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stilt
France2749 Posts
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dysenterymd
1237 Posts
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Pandain
United States12989 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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buzz_bender
445 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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stilt
France2749 Posts
One year ago ? | ||
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buzz_bender
445 Posts
On October 16 2021 02:16 tigera6 wrote: Seems like Clem need to tune down his aggression a little bit, Serral lingbane was walking in and out of Clem base like its their backyard for the whole last game. Exactly, he needs to learn to adapt and play a different style according to the situation of the match. Serral changed up his style this match, and he managed to beat Clem. This is what I've been saying about what Serral/Reynor needs to do to beat Clem. Clem is just too good against Ling Bane into lurkers now. They needed to mix it up, and Serral did - taking a page out of Rogue's playbook. | ||
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fLyiNgDroNe
Belgium4009 Posts
On October 16 2021 02:16 stilt wrote: When was the last time clem lost to reynor or serral ? One year ago ? Dec 15th 2020 2-3 vs Serral Jan 24th 2021 1-2 vs Reynor Its been a while! | ||
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HolydaKing
21254 Posts
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fLyiNgDroNe
Belgium4009 Posts
On October 16 2021 02:32 HolydaKing wrote: After all, Reynor was right in believing that Serral beats Clem this time around. Question is, will Reynor go roach (knowing he hates the unit)? | ||
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tigera6
3397 Posts
On October 16 2021 02:34 fLyiNgDroNe wrote: Question is, will Reynor go roach (knowing he hates the unit)? Reynor is more flexible than Serral imo, saw him used Roach and all-in in TvZ before. The question is also, can Clem really get enough practice to play well against the Roach style, his reaction was all over the place today against the Roach push. | ||
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stilt
France2749 Posts
On October 16 2021 02:39 tigera6 wrote: Reynor is more flexible than Serral imo, saw him used Roach and all-in in TvZ before. The question is also, can Clem really get enough practice to play well against the Roach style, his reaction was all over the place today against the Roach push. Serral already played this style against him in ladder. And I am pretty sure his buddy Denver who loves tricky stuff can decently play this style. I think the main reason clem lost is the one stated by reynor, he didn't practise much lately. | ||
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SmoKim
Denmark10305 Posts
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darklycid
3510 Posts
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stilt
France2749 Posts
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Durnuu
13320 Posts
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stilt
France2749 Posts
The bad engage and the dt follow up reversed the game in 1 minutes, must have been so tilting tbh | ||
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TheCheapSkate
Slovenia316 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
On October 16 2021 03:37 Durnuu wrote: Damn those better tools Yeah, and MLord will see more of those tools from MaxPax. Poor the man, playing his best SC2 and getting tooled. | ||
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stilt
France2749 Posts
On October 16 2021 03:41 TheCheapSkate wrote: Shouldnt players get DQed for such a BM move? Because he said tooled ? Lol this is esl, not kespa | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15961 Posts
On October 16 2021 03:43 stilt wrote: Because he said tooled ? Lol this is esl, not kespa imagine playing your heart out and then your opponent tries to publicy discredit your win. he probably wouldn't like it either if Reynor typed "stim and amove go brrrrr" after ML beat him | ||
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Mlord
France135 Posts
On October 16 2021 04:01 Charoisaur wrote: imagine playing your heart out and then your opponent tries to publicy discredit your win. he probably wouldn't like it either if Reynor typed "stim and amove go brrrrr" after ML beat him You know why showtime still likes me even tho i "discredited his win", because we share the same opinion about dt blink | ||
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darklycid
3510 Posts
On October 16 2021 04:33 Mlord wrote: You know why showtime still likes me even tho i "discredited his win", because we share the same opinion about dt blink I think most reasonable ppl share that opinion about dt blink, still feels a lil bad when every terran reacts like this when a good protoss wins :/ | ||
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StasisField
United States1086 Posts
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Nebuchad
Switzerland12177 Posts
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dysenterymd
1237 Posts
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Pandain
United States12989 Posts
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buzz_bender
445 Posts
On October 16 2021 05:42 StasisField wrote: Didn't the korean terrans figure out late game DT blink over a year ago? PartinG popularized the style over there, Koreans literally started making an extra planetary and missle turret at their bases, and the DTs didn't have the DPS to chew through everything. How are EU terrans losing to a strategy that's already been solved? Zest was the first one to go mass blink DT late game against Terran. PartinG then began using it too, but TY is the one who started figuring out how to counter it in their series | ||
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stilt
France2749 Posts
On October 16 2021 04:33 Mlord wrote: You know why showtime still likes me even tho i "discredited his win", because we share the same opinion about dt blink A bit sad to see that some people on tl really think the counter to dt blink is to build two planetary per base but what can you do. | ||
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Poopi
France12883 Posts
On October 16 2021 05:42 StasisField wrote: Didn't the korean terrans figure out late game DT blink over a year ago? PartinG popularized the style over there, Koreans literally started making an extra planetary and missle turret at their bases, and the DTs didn't have the DPS to chew through everything. How are EU terrans losing to a strategy that's already been solved? The problem is usually not DT blink alone, but combined with the deathball / AoE armies. And Korean terrans did not figure out anything, otherwise Maru should theoretically never loses TvP since he is the perfect Terran, yet he loses too. | ||
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Durnuu
13320 Posts
On October 16 2021 20:20 Poopi wrote: The problem is usually not DT blink alone, but combined with the deathball / AoE armies. And Korean terrans did not figure out anything, otherwise Maru should theoretically never loses TvP since he is the perfect Terran, yet he loses too. rofl | ||
Mizenhauer
United States1875 Posts
On October 16 2021 20:20 Poopi wrote: The problem is usually not DT blink alone, but combined with the deathball / AoE armies. And Korean terrans did not figure out anything, otherwise Maru should theoretically never loses TvP since he is the perfect Terran, yet he loses too. It's likely soO was the perfect Terran. Really good micro with core units, excellent in the mid game, a willingness to cheese, but he rolled over in the late game. | ||
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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Poopi
France12883 Posts
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dysenterymd
1237 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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Charoisaur
Germany15961 Posts
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dysenterymd
1237 Posts
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Charoisaur
Germany15961 Posts
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Calliope
297 Posts
On October 17 2021 01:08 Charoisaur wrote: wow how fast did he target-fire there Yes, I thought he would walk into that for sure. How is such quick reacting even physically possible? | ||
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swarminfestor
Malaysia2449 Posts
P/s: I am surprised that casters always talked about Rogue's gameplays whenever involved Clem's TvZ matches, but failed to point out about how Dark was the first one to stop the Clem's invisible TvZ win. Clem's TvZ weakness should not be limited to Roaches/Ravagers one-to-one timing only. | ||
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tigera6
3397 Posts
On October 17 2021 01:15 swarminfestor wrote: Reynor refused to embrace Rogue's playstyles just like Serral did, ended up that he lost series 3-0. P/s: I am surprised that casters always talked about Rogue's gameplays whenever involved Clem's TvZ matches, but failed to point out about how Dark was the first one to stop the Clem's invisible TvZ win. Clem's TvZ weakness should not be limited to Roaches/Ravagers one-to-one timing only. Seems like Reynor was never really comfortable with Roach, even in game 1 when he used them he tried to transitioned out of it way too quickly. And the reason why Rogue is mentioned more because it was more recent, and the way Rogue did it was way too dominant, similar to the way he stomped Maru in GSL Final (where some people said Clem would have won back then). | ||
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buzz_bender
445 Posts
On October 17 2021 01:21 tigera6 wrote: And the reason why Rogue is mentioned more because it was more recent, and the way Rogue did it was way too dominant, similar to the way he stomped Maru in GSL Final (where some people said Clem would have won back then). I think this is exactly it - how dominant Rogue looked in beating Clem, and how the narrative was that Clem would have won that GSL. I think many people just underestimate how well Rogue played, both in terms of strategies and mindgames. | ||
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Poopi
France12883 Posts
On October 17 2021 01:25 buzz_bender wrote: I think this is exactly it - how dominant Rogue looked in beating Clem, and how the narrative was that Clem would have won that GSL. I think many people just underestimate how well Rogue played, both in terms of strategies and mindgames. People thought Clem was better than Maru because he smashed Reynor and Serral while Maru struggled, but cross servers matches at bad hours can’t be compared to playing with perfect ping. Katowice 2022 will be the real test! | ||
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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Argonauta
Spain4948 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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Argonauta
Spain4948 Posts
On October 17 2021 01:58 [PkF] Wire wrote: playing vs Serral in that kind of lategame must be soul-wrenching It can be dangerous though for Serral, he hesitate several times to finish the game. | ||
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tigera6
3397 Posts
Showtime plan crumbled the moment 20 Corruptors destroyed all of his air units. | ||
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starkiller123
United States4030 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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fLyiNgDroNe
Belgium4009 Posts
On October 17 2021 01:21 tigera6 wrote: Seems like Reynor was never really comfortable with Roach, even in game 1 when he used them he tried to transitioned out of it way too quickly. And the reason why Rogue is mentioned more because it was more recent, and the way Rogue did it was way too dominant, similar to the way he stomped Maru in GSL Final (where some people said Clem would have won back then). its ok, Reynor is still more flexible than Serral, so it all worked out | ||
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tigera6
3397 Posts
On October 17 2021 02:27 fLyiNgDroNe wrote: its ok, Reynor is still more flexible than Serral, so it all worked out Yeah, I am eating my word on that. Somehow Reynor want to win his way, when its clearly not working against Clem. | ||
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tigera6
3397 Posts
Edit: 3rd time is a charm, and Showtime got the absolute worst build against it as well. | ||
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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Xamo
Spain880 Posts
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fLyiNgDroNe
Belgium4009 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
On October 17 2021 03:00 fLyiNgDroNe wrote: Showtime is in incredible form this time around, really good to have him back in the season finals. This is the first time Showime get to the Season Final, kinda shocking but other than the big 3 in EU, not seeing Showtime all these time in the Global Final is kinda suprising. | ||
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stilt
France2749 Posts
On October 17 2021 03:09 tigera6 wrote: This is the first time Showime get to the Season Final, kinda shocking but other than the big 3 in EU, not seeing Showtime all these time in the Global Final is kinda suprising. He chocked quite a lot in the past, getting rekt by hm (not to say that hm shouldn't beat him but not consistently like that) , beaten by drogo or lambo... He finally is performing at his level. | ||
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tantalus
69 Posts
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Darpa
Canada4413 Posts
Seen this in several of the games vs marinelord both today and in previous series. | ||
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tigera6
3397 Posts
On October 17 2021 03:36 Darpa wrote: Ive noticed alot in Clems TVT, that he only ever gets +2 attack and no armor on his tanks (or sometimes plus one) and then his tanks get obliterated by heavy upgrades in the late game. Seen this in several of the games vs marinelord both today and in previous series. There is a reason for that. Because +2 Attack Seiged Tanks can 1 shot Marine with +3 armor, basically you dont use tank to kill tank, you use tank to kill Marines. Armor upgrade for tanks also does not matter as much because it still take 3 shot from Tank in Seige mode to kill a tank. And Clem was never that rich in economy, I can see why he skipped those upgrade for more production. | ||
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koalabro
59 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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Darpa
Canada4413 Posts
On October 17 2021 03:42 tigera6 wrote: There is a reason for that. Because +2 Attack Seiged Tanks can 1 shot Marine with +3 armor, basically you dont use tank to kill tank, you use tank to kill Marines. Armor upgrade for tanks also does not matter as much because it still take 3 shot from Tank in Seige mode to kill a tank. And Clem was never that rich in economy, I can see why he skipped those upgrade for more production. Im mean you say that but i have watched him lose tank pushes time and again because of it versus hero marine and marine lord when they get into those stalemated third sieges. I understand the logic of the + 2 but he still sometimes just straight up loses to better tanks alot. And its almost always when they have way more upgrades than him. The other terrans are building them and winning with it in the late game against him. | ||
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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darklycid
3510 Posts
Also Terrans: widow mines  | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland25333 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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dysenterymd
1237 Posts
On October 18 2021 02:18 darklycid wrote: Terrans: invisible units that ravage you eco are bullshit! Also Terrans: widow mines Marinelord should offrace whatever Clem's playing to bolster his chances against Protoss. | ||
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buzz_bender
445 Posts
Edit: Wait, there were four WCS events in 2018 and Serral won them all. I was wrong! | ||
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Heartland
Sweden24580 Posts
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Heartland
Sweden24580 Posts
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dysenterymd
1237 Posts
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royalroadweed
United States8301 Posts
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Nakajin
Canada8989 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
On October 18 2021 03:07 dysenterymd wrote: Serral kept up really well for a while but Clem was just too fast in late game. Hope he goes for more offbeat styles now. The moment mines are out for tanks, Serral start losing like any other match vs Clem. | ||
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Calliope
297 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
On October 18 2021 03:07 Nakajin wrote: Some classic ultra into lose right there Ultra wasnt a bad move, better than dying to mine blast, but the lack of Infestor was sad. | ||
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royalroadweed
United States8301 Posts
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Plastice
2 Posts
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egrimm
Poland1199 Posts
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Supter
France382 Posts
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Captain Peabody
United States3110 Posts
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Nakajin
Canada8989 Posts
On October 18 2021 03:22 Captain Peabody wrote: feels like Clem maybe being a little bit overly aggressive? Ya I feel like he could have sat back and taken a 5th at some point | ||
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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dysenterymd
1237 Posts
On October 18 2021 03:22 Captain Peabody wrote: feels like Clem maybe being a little bit overly aggressive? I think this is why Clem struggles with roach (as well as being less prepared), against roaches you really just need to sit back a lot of the time but Clem is great at and enjoys aggression. Hopefully with time he'll become a more mature player and be more disciplined against roach. | ||
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Calliope
297 Posts
On October 18 2021 03:22 Supter wrote: I don't watch Starcraft 2 super often these days, but man I'm amazed at Clem. Sure he's losing here, but I would never have imagined that we would ever have such an oppressive and mechanically clean foreign terran. He's putting so much pressure all over the map after being 50 pop and down in tech Completely agree ^^ Always felt like this race was not for foreigners but Clem is getting extremely consistent, almost always placing high. | ||
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tigera6
3397 Posts
On October 18 2021 03:30 dysenterymd wrote: I think this is why Clem struggles with roach (as well as being less prepared), against roaches you really just need to sit back a lot of the time but Clem is great at and enjoys aggression. Hopefully with time he'll become a more mature player and be more disciplined against roach. I would disagree a bit on this. You only want to play defensive if its a Roach timing like the one Rogue did. As long as Terran can survive, they will be in much better position. Serral play Roach but also teching up his army into Lurker and Spellcaster, even going back to ling. Its not a good think to just sit back against that style because you will be behind before long. I thought Clem did the right thing, but he should keep his tanks at home to defend and move out with Bio only, until he can reach the critical numer of tanks. | ||
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Captain Peabody
United States3110 Posts
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dysenterymd
1237 Posts
On October 18 2021 03:35 tigera6 wrote: I would disagree a bit on this. You only want to play defensive if its a Roach timing like the one Rogue did. As long as Terran can survive, they will be in much better position. Serral play Roach but also teching up his army into Lurker and Spellcaster, even going back to ling. Its not a good think to just sit back against that style because you will be behind before long. I thought Clem did the right thing, but he should keep his tanks at home to defend and move out with Bio only, until he can reach the critical numer of tanks. True harassing with bio is fine, it was the tanks that were the issue. Wonder why Clem didn't transition into mines this game, I get why he went for a few tanks early because he was scared of roach but he could have transitioned like he did on lightshade. Maybe he just expected lurkers to be the final tech this map, but either way midgame was awful for him | ||
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Captain Peabody
United States3110 Posts
On October 18 2021 03:35 tigera6 wrote: I would disagree a bit on this. You only want to play defensive if its a Roach timing like the one Rogue did. As long as Terran can survive, they will be in much better position. Serral play Roach but also teching up his army into Lurker and Spellcaster, even going back to ling. Its not a good think to just sit back against that style because you will be behind before long. I thought Clem did the right thing, but he should keep his tanks at home to defend and move out with Bio only, until he can reach the critical numer of tanks. Right, it seems like his main problem both this & last game has been his inability to build up a strong tank count. He's keeping fights away from his own bases and doing some damage, but his siege tanks keep dying so he can't take the big fights when they come. | ||
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Heartland
Sweden24580 Posts
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Captain Peabody
United States3110 Posts
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tilhorizon
Germany191 Posts
game 1 it was like 80% certain that clem opens fast 3 base on this map and you go oracle first ? game 2 sure after you lost your economy you could not keep up in a long game but this was no ladder game where you just type gg ,,you had same army suply , go for a all in after that catastrophe start, take your probes what ever it takes ,sure you only have a 5% chance that your all in is winning but do, it is still 5% and better than a gg game 3 so uninspired like the 5 game vs serral chosing this poor zealot opening that failed against serral from all protoss why dont we see a single blink pressure stalker opening vs clem? just because you are great defensiv player great macro player you still can and have to open aggresive builds those aggro builds dont always have to win the game immediately but they can put you in a greater position to than go what ever the time where you did win a great european championship it was vs nerchio where you did that great all in adept build on the final 5 game please by the love of god do more aggressive builds, stop building worker some times for that ,watch some zest games just because you are so great defensive and macro doesnt mean that you have to start most games like you want to go to endgame comp you have the skill to do that but to often you think its to great a risk but in fact not doing that is the bigger "risk" | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15961 Posts
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stilt
France2749 Posts
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TheLordofAwesome
Korea (South)2655 Posts
On October 18 2021 03:45 stilt wrote: That was a epic game but quite a early gg Yeah I have no idea why he did that. Think he probably misread the situation / thought Serral was maxed with huge bank. | ||
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fLyiNgDroNe
Belgium4009 Posts
On October 18 2021 03:46 TheLordofAwesome wrote: Yeah I have no idea why he did that. Think he probably misread the situation / thought Serral was maxed with huge bank. Clem couldn't move out, he was just defending and losing CC's over and over again. It was a matter of time or counting on Serral making a huge mistake which he probably decided not to do ... | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15961 Posts
On October 18 2021 03:46 TheLordofAwesome wrote: Yeah I have no idea why he did that. Think he probably misread the situation / thought Serral was maxed with huge bank. I mean, he was pretty dead. Behind in army and eco and most of his tech units died | ||
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Captain Peabody
United States3110 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
Edit: Also, if Clem was losing Ghost, maybe its better to research Cloak and aim for the Overseer first. | ||
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fLyiNgDroNe
Belgium4009 Posts
On October 18 2021 03:49 tigera6 wrote: Didnt see how many Ghost Clem had in the end, did he lose many of them? I think the issue was Clem could not protect his mining base with only the Orbital, and Serral will just keep sending lings over to stop Clem from mining. Meanwhile Serral got that new fresh base all the way to top right that Clem cant really push into, without losing more of his economy at home. Catz said Clem only had 3 ghosts at the end | ||
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Captain Peabody
United States3110 Posts
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Captain Peabody
United States3110 Posts
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Heartland
Sweden24580 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
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Calliope
297 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
On October 18 2021 03:59 Calliope wrote: How is it possible that Serral starts with 1 victory and still they have to play on Jagganatha? Neither Clem nor Serral get to pick which map is removed. I think they take turn to pick the map played in the Final, the one left at the end shall be removed. | ||
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Topin
Peru10078 Posts
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stilt
France2749 Posts
On October 18 2021 03:59 Calliope wrote: How is it possible that Serral starts with 1 victory and still they have to play on Jagganatha? It's weird but seems like the player from the winner bracket can ban the map he doesn't like or sth like this. Pretty sure I saw the zerg play on beckett when clem was coming out the winner brackett too. | ||
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Kreuger
Sweden728 Posts
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stilt
France2749 Posts
And he actually said he played really well, that's something haha | ||
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Ciaus_Dronu
South Africa1848 Posts
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mcmartini
Australia1972 Posts
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Topin
Peru10078 Posts
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AzAlexZ
Australia3303 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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Poaktree
165 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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stilt
France2749 Posts
Even in this shitty spot for the zerg, dealing with queen march without aoe is always a bit scary. | ||
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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Topin
Peru10078 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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warnull
United States280 Posts
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Topin
Peru10078 Posts
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Husyelt
United States832 Posts
Congrats to Scarlett as well. She looked quite formidable in the ZvP matchup. This tournament overall has had some ridiculous comebacks and insane games. | ||
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tigera6
3397 Posts
Also, the lack of transition between Mines and Tanks hurt the fight against LingBane and Roach/Lurker as well. | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15961 Posts
On October 18 2021 11:55 Husyelt wrote: Serral pummeling Clem 6-2 in overall match score is quite the statement. Clem is the one who now needs to adjust. Dark showed that if you put Clem on the defense or play in his face, it shakes up his rhythm. Edit: Clem if you are reading this, you are fucking incredible, you were made for SC2 Terran. Congrats to Scarlett as well. She looked quite formidable in the ZvP matchup. This tournament overall has had some ridiculous comebacks and insane games. Well, I don't think Clem got outclassed or so, things just went Serral's way those games and in some games Clem had a few uncharacteristic sloppy mistakes which didn't help. If they faced again tomorrow I'd still think it wouldn't be worse than 50/50 winchance for Clem. | ||
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