|
On November 22 2019 23:15 royalroadweed wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2019 23:02 stilt wrote:On November 22 2019 22:47 darklycid wrote:On November 22 2019 22:45 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 22:44 sneakyfox wrote:On November 22 2019 22:41 Wombat_NI wrote:On November 22 2019 22:30 Poopi wrote:On November 22 2019 22:09 Wombat_NI wrote:On November 22 2019 17:32 Schelim wrote:On November 22 2019 13:46 elluel wrote:
Am I the only one that has an issue with Winter's presence at HSC? I'm just very disappointed in the things he's doing to the other people. what's he doing to people? have not been able to watch much HSC yesterday I’ve nothing against him, nor am I a fan either. Only saw a little bit but I thought he did OK. The trio of Artosis/Special and him worked surprisingly well, Winter as the more casual guy, Artosis as the enthusiastic all things StarCraft nerd and Special as the incredibly biased but enthusiastic Terran playing nerd. I rarely have chat open for reasons of my own sanity, but there were plenty of Winter fans there, some of whom didn’t know who Artosis was. I’d always assumed that Winter’s audience were aware of the wider scene but just liked his style or w/e, but it seems some at least are a totally different segment of the SC community, so it’s probably good for them to get exposed to something like an HSC Not knowing Artosis? Wow, I almost thought all sc2 fans were people watching GSL on the "free" 180p (!) GOMplayer back in the days and stuff. Anyway first post patch PvZ I’ve seen thus far. Intrigued more than anything, feels like Lambo is playing as if the patch didn’t happen so hard to judge much. I think a more aggressive hydra into lurker style might be pretty potent because you can transition more easily and you don’t have that ‘sit back and let Stats build upgraded Carriers’, interested to see it experimented with anyway. We probably also have to consider the quite significant skill gap between two players like Lambo and Stats. And the fact zerg doesn't have any counter to mass carriers anymore. Yeah let's ignore 2018 PvZ where good Zergs still won lategame pvz without heavy infested terran usage. There are a few examples of Ultralisks/corrupters/Infests style which worked but the neural range nerf makes it probably useless, then we have the BL/corrupters/vipers which is the way to go but then the bl nerf hits hard as zoning out the ht is borderline impossible. ITs removal is not the only nerf zerg received, actually, every late game tools have received a nerf except the viper. That said, there are some ways against toss, terran with the super-thor is quite worrying as serral, Catz and every other top zergs pointed out. We literally just saw soo crush mass thors with roaches, banelings and 2 vipers an hour ago.
Not sure if you're trolling but he had produced 2 thors at 14 minutes, he has 2 thors in the second biggest engagement in the middle of the map. Bunny got destroyed by ling/ravagers/banes.
Then, he managed almost to hold a bl/roach/ravagers mass banelings push while being at 170 pop with 5 thors in prod, without any tanks or liberators and with 2 hellbats. The bl flock got almost os and was proved useless, the ling/bane surround did the job in combinaison of biles thanks to bunny already having lost because clearly, with more tanks and even better, liberators, ravagers is not a potent late game solution.
|
is it too soon to be upset over toss air? 
|
SoO didn't rly win lategame pre patch i don't see him doing anything in it post patch.
|
On November 22 2019 23:39 Harris1st wrote:
Clem and Bunny playing for the last playoffs spot right?
If Lambo 2-0s soO and Zanster he goes 7-7 and advances, but I'm not sure I am on point with the updates.
|
On November 22 2019 23:52 Penev wrote:is it too soon to be upset over toss air?
Everyone knows that toss air rolls zerg over whenever its not a broodlord infestor meta, so no its not too early.
|
On November 22 2019 23:54 Morbidius wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2019 23:52 Penev wrote:is it too soon to be upset over toss air? Everyone knows that toss air rolls zerg over whenever its not a broodlord infestor meta, so no its not too early.
phew
I'm upset then
|
On November 22 2019 23:52 Morbidius wrote:
Will we see PvZ lategame not being ridiculously favored towards one race in the next decade maybe?
Wasn't it ok in 2017 ? And 2018 which didn't see that many ITs feels fine to me.
And before the sh nerf it was terrible but somewhat balanced.
|
On November 22 2019 23:52 Penev wrote:is it too soon to be upset over toss air?
I would like to see the new ability at least once.
|
After DK balance team tends to change too much when they address a problem imo; Like nerfing both festers and BL's AND buff skillrays (and moma ship)
On November 22 2019 23:59 Harris1st wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2019 23:52 Penev wrote:is it too soon to be upset over toss air? I would like to see the new ability at least once.
I'd like to see it too but I don't expect much from it tbh
|
On November 22 2019 23:23 Poopi wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2019 23:10 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 23:01 Poopi wrote:On November 22 2019 22:56 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 22:47 darklycid wrote:On November 22 2019 22:45 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 22:44 sneakyfox wrote:On November 22 2019 22:41 Wombat_NI wrote:On November 22 2019 22:30 Poopi wrote:On November 22 2019 22:09 Wombat_NI wrote:
[quote]
I’ve nothing against him, nor am I a fan either. Only saw a little bit but I thought he did OK. The trio of Artosis/Special and him worked surprisingly well, Winter as the more casual guy, Artosis as the enthusiastic all things StarCraft nerd and Special as the incredibly biased but enthusiastic Terran playing nerd.
I rarely have chat open for reasons of my own sanity, but there were plenty of Winter fans there, some of whom didn’t know who Artosis was.
I’d always assumed that Winter’s audience were aware of the wider scene but just liked his style or w/e, but it seems some at least are a totally different segment of the SC community, so it’s probably good for them to get exposed to something like an HSC Not knowing Artosis? Wow, I almost thought all sc2 fans were people watching GSL on the "free" 180p (!) GOMplayer back in the days and stuff. Anyway first post patch PvZ I’ve seen thus far. Intrigued more than anything, feels like Lambo is playing as if the patch didn’t happen so hard to judge much. I think a more aggressive hydra into lurker style might be pretty potent because you can transition more easily and you don’t have that ‘sit back and let Stats build upgraded Carriers’, interested to see it experimented with anyway. We probably also have to consider the quite significant skill gap between two players like Lambo and Stats. And the fact zerg doesn't have any counter to mass carriers anymore. Yeah let's ignore 2018 PvZ where good Zergs still won lategame pvz without heavy infested terran usage. Sure, share with us these replays. Wasn't PvZ zerg favored in late 2018? Like at BlizzCon Stats stood no chance against either Rogue or Serral. The infested terran buff was introduced in 2017, so i don't see how zerg doing well in 2018 is a point to show that Zerg can do well without infested terrans... I'm pretty sure you guys were talking about 2018 PvZ. Anyways.
We didn't really see mass infestors in PvZ in late 2018.
PvZ wasn't Zerg favored, it was a balanced matchup with maybe a slight advantage for Z; that Stats would have stood no chance against Rogue is just your opinion, Serral was undoubtly the best lategame player and won against Stats accordingly but it's not like he rolled over him.
|
On November 22 2019 23:57 stilt wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2019 23:52 Morbidius wrote:
Will we see PvZ lategame not being ridiculously favored towards one race in the next decade maybe? Wasn't it ok in 2017 ? And 2018 which didn't see that many ITs feels fine to me. And before the sh nerf it was terrible but somewhat balanced.
2017 was the year of the legendary ''fist of neeb'' so no, it was one of the worst skytoss years ever. 2018 might have been fine, neither race seemed to want to go late.
|
On November 23 2019 00:01 Xain0n wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2019 23:23 Poopi wrote:On November 22 2019 23:10 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 23:01 Poopi wrote:On November 22 2019 22:56 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 22:47 darklycid wrote:On November 22 2019 22:45 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 22:44 sneakyfox wrote:On November 22 2019 22:41 Wombat_NI wrote:On November 22 2019 22:30 Poopi wrote:
[quote]
Not knowing Artosis? Wow, I almost thought all sc2 fans were people watching GSL on the "free" 180p (!) GOMplayer back in the days and stuff. Anyway first post patch PvZ I’ve seen thus far. Intrigued more than anything, feels like Lambo is playing as if the patch didn’t happen so hard to judge much. I think a more aggressive hydra into lurker style might be pretty potent because you can transition more easily and you don’t have that ‘sit back and let Stats build upgraded Carriers’, interested to see it experimented with anyway. We probably also have to consider the quite significant skill gap between two players like Lambo and Stats. And the fact zerg doesn't have any counter to mass carriers anymore. Yeah let's ignore 2018 PvZ where good Zergs still won lategame pvz without heavy infested terran usage. Sure, share with us these replays. Wasn't PvZ zerg favored in late 2018? Like at BlizzCon Stats stood no chance against either Rogue or Serral. The infested terran buff was introduced in 2017, so i don't see how zerg doing well in 2018 is a point to show that Zerg can do well without infested terrans... I'm pretty sure you guys were talking about 2018 PvZ. Anyways. We didn't really see mass infestors in PvZ in late 2018. PvZ wasn't Zerg favored, it was a balanced matchup with maybe a slight advantage for Z; that Stats would have stood no chance against Rogue is just your opinion, Serral was undoubtly the best lategame player and won against Stats accordingly but it's not like he rolled over him.
I mean Stats was also the best protoss lategame player, but yeah 2018 pvz lategame was pretty balanced that's why i think all the zergs hyperventilating about the matches we've seen so far is pretty stupid esp. when soO couldnt even win lategame last patch when zerg was bonkers vs protoss.
|
On November 23 2019 00:02 darklycid wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2019 00:01 Xain0n wrote:On November 22 2019 23:23 Poopi wrote:On November 22 2019 23:10 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 23:01 Poopi wrote:On November 22 2019 22:56 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 22:47 darklycid wrote:On November 22 2019 22:45 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 22:44 sneakyfox wrote:On November 22 2019 22:41 Wombat_NI wrote:
[quote]
Anyway first post patch PvZ I’ve seen thus far. Intrigued more than anything, feels like Lambo is playing as if the patch didn’t happen so hard to judge much.
I think a more aggressive hydra into lurker style might be pretty potent because you can transition more easily and you don’t have that ‘sit back and let Stats build upgraded Carriers’, interested to see it experimented with anyway. We probably also have to consider the quite significant skill gap between two players like Lambo and Stats. And the fact zerg doesn't have any counter to mass carriers anymore. Yeah let's ignore 2018 PvZ where good Zergs still won lategame pvz without heavy infested terran usage. Sure, share with us these replays. Wasn't PvZ zerg favored in late 2018? Like at BlizzCon Stats stood no chance against either Rogue or Serral. The infested terran buff was introduced in 2017, so i don't see how zerg doing well in 2018 is a point to show that Zerg can do well without infested terrans... I'm pretty sure you guys were talking about 2018 PvZ. Anyways. We didn't really see mass infestors in PvZ in late 2018. PvZ wasn't Zerg favored, it was a balanced matchup with maybe a slight advantage for Z; that Stats would have stood no chance against Rogue is just your opinion, Serral was undoubtly the best lategame player and won against Stats accordingly but it's not like he rolled over him. I mean Stats was also the best protoss lategame player, but yeah 2018 pvz lategame was pretty balanced that's why i think all the zergs hyperventilating about the matches we've seen so far is pretty stupid esp. when soO couldnt even win lategame last patch when zerg was bonkers vs protoss.
People aren't going bonkers because soO lost, its mostly because nothing good ever came out of an Skytoss meta in PvZ. By the way i really want to see Serral face a top Protoss in this meta(he won't in his group sadly) .
|
On November 23 2019 00:04 Morbidius wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2019 00:02 darklycid wrote:On November 23 2019 00:01 Xain0n wrote:On November 22 2019 23:23 Poopi wrote:On November 22 2019 23:10 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 23:01 Poopi wrote:On November 22 2019 22:56 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 22:47 darklycid wrote:On November 22 2019 22:45 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 22:44 sneakyfox wrote:
[quote]
We probably also have to consider the quite significant skill gap between two players like Lambo and Stats. And the fact zerg doesn't have any counter to mass carriers anymore. Yeah let's ignore 2018 PvZ where good Zergs still won lategame pvz without heavy infested terran usage. Sure, share with us these replays. Wasn't PvZ zerg favored in late 2018? Like at BlizzCon Stats stood no chance against either Rogue or Serral. The infested terran buff was introduced in 2017, so i don't see how zerg doing well in 2018 is a point to show that Zerg can do well without infested terrans... I'm pretty sure you guys were talking about 2018 PvZ. Anyways. We didn't really see mass infestors in PvZ in late 2018. PvZ wasn't Zerg favored, it was a balanced matchup with maybe a slight advantage for Z; that Stats would have stood no chance against Rogue is just your opinion, Serral was undoubtly the best lategame player and won against Stats accordingly but it's not like he rolled over him. I mean Stats was also the best protoss lategame player, but yeah 2018 pvz lategame was pretty balanced that's why i think all the zergs hyperventilating about the matches we've seen so far is pretty stupid esp. when soO couldnt even win lategame last patch when zerg was bonkers vs protoss. People aren't going bonkers because soO lost, its mostly because nothing good ever came out of an Skytoss meta in PvZ.
Because after 1,5 days of the new patch we can already say it's gonna be a skytoss meta.
|
On November 23 2019 00:02 darklycid wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2019 00:01 Xain0n wrote:On November 22 2019 23:23 Poopi wrote:On November 22 2019 23:10 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 23:01 Poopi wrote:On November 22 2019 22:56 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 22:47 darklycid wrote:On November 22 2019 22:45 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 22:44 sneakyfox wrote:On November 22 2019 22:41 Wombat_NI wrote:
[quote]
Anyway first post patch PvZ I’ve seen thus far. Intrigued more than anything, feels like Lambo is playing as if the patch didn’t happen so hard to judge much.
I think a more aggressive hydra into lurker style might be pretty potent because you can transition more easily and you don’t have that ‘sit back and let Stats build upgraded Carriers’, interested to see it experimented with anyway. We probably also have to consider the quite significant skill gap between two players like Lambo and Stats. And the fact zerg doesn't have any counter to mass carriers anymore. Yeah let's ignore 2018 PvZ where good Zergs still won lategame pvz without heavy infested terran usage. Sure, share with us these replays. Wasn't PvZ zerg favored in late 2018? Like at BlizzCon Stats stood no chance against either Rogue or Serral. The infested terran buff was introduced in 2017, so i don't see how zerg doing well in 2018 is a point to show that Zerg can do well without infested terrans... I'm pretty sure you guys were talking about 2018 PvZ. Anyways. We didn't really see mass infestors in PvZ in late 2018. PvZ wasn't Zerg favored, it was a balanced matchup with maybe a slight advantage for Z; that Stats would have stood no chance against Rogue is just your opinion, Serral was undoubtly the best lategame player and won against Stats accordingly but it's not like he rolled over him. I mean Stats was also the best protoss lategame player, but yeah 2018 pvz lategame was pretty balanced that's why i think all the zergs hyperventilating about the matches we've seen so far is pretty stupid esp. when soO couldnt even win lategame last patch when zerg was bonkers vs protoss.
Wasn't 2018 part of the "hydra/bane all in or die trying" meta?
|
On November 22 2019 23:52 Morbidius wrote:
Will we see PvZ lategame not being ridiculously favored towards one race in the next decade maybe?
Lol, skytoss is a thing still since WOL. By the way 60-80 % of the protoss in diamond just doing photon rush into skytoss vs zerg.
Sure eventually, when they met good master/GM player this strats stopped working during some period, but it was always incredibly easy to perform, and teamgame is full of 30 APM guys that mass carriers, because it's super strong and really hard to counter.
So skytoss is probably the best start if you want to be carried above your real skill, the fact this strat hasn't been nerfed since WOL is ridiculous. It even more ridiculous to make a balance patch that make this strat OP at the highest level...
|
Do none of them know how to waterslide right?
|
On November 23 2019 00:07 Lexender wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2019 00:02 darklycid wrote:On November 23 2019 00:01 Xain0n wrote:On November 22 2019 23:23 Poopi wrote:On November 22 2019 23:10 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 23:01 Poopi wrote:On November 22 2019 22:56 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 22:47 darklycid wrote:On November 22 2019 22:45 Tyrhanius wrote:On November 22 2019 22:44 sneakyfox wrote:
[quote]
We probably also have to consider the quite significant skill gap between two players like Lambo and Stats. And the fact zerg doesn't have any counter to mass carriers anymore. Yeah let's ignore 2018 PvZ where good Zergs still won lategame pvz without heavy infested terran usage. Sure, share with us these replays. Wasn't PvZ zerg favored in late 2018? Like at BlizzCon Stats stood no chance against either Rogue or Serral. The infested terran buff was introduced in 2017, so i don't see how zerg doing well in 2018 is a point to show that Zerg can do well without infested terrans... I'm pretty sure you guys were talking about 2018 PvZ. Anyways. We didn't really see mass infestors in PvZ in late 2018. PvZ wasn't Zerg favored, it was a balanced matchup with maybe a slight advantage for Z; that Stats would have stood no chance against Rogue is just your opinion, Serral was undoubtly the best lategame player and won against Stats accordingly but it's not like he rolled over him. I mean Stats was also the best protoss lategame player, but yeah 2018 pvz lategame was pretty balanced that's why i think all the zergs hyperventilating about the matches we've seen so far is pretty stupid esp. when soO couldnt even win lategame last patch when zerg was bonkers vs protoss. Wasn't 2018 part of the "hydra/bane all in or die trying" meta?
No.
|
On November 23 2019 00:08 Harris1st wrote:
Do none of them know how to waterslide right?
Did someone get a better time than 25sec yet? Misssed the last hour. I know Stats did like 35 sec, so there is quite a large gap between some guys.
|
On November 23 2019 00:08 Harris1st wrote:
Do none of them know how to waterslide right?
I've never seen anyone properly play table football either, I fear it's just starcraft
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
