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On September 11 2017 04:58 Parrek wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 04:53 Heyjoray wrote:
Is this the kind of "Foreigner Starcraft" people were looking for? It has to be the worst Major experience ever. It is so bad that the best player are missing Neeb is on another level, but I enjoyed many of the matches. I had GSL on for Dark vs Innovation and was bored to tears because I didn't really care for the two players.
Why? What are the reasons you would care for neeb?
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On September 11 2017 04:56 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 04:53 sharkie wrote:
why is neeb so much superior to other foreigners? more talented
Curiously he wasn't talented as terran 
Something is wrong in protoss design nowadays.
They have the easiest mechanics because it was the "micro race" , but this isn't true anymore.
So :
- easier to defend
- easier to macro
- easier to micro
- easier to multitask
Some protosses with the exaggerated ego will say that it is false, but all these points are true.
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On September 11 2017 04:59 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 04:58 Parrek wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 Heyjoray wrote:
Is this the kind of "Foreigner Starcraft" people were looking for? It has to be the worst Major experience ever. It is so bad that the best player are missing Neeb is on another level, but I enjoyed many of the matches. I had GSL on for Dark vs Innovation and was bored to tears because I didn't really care for the two players. If you managed to get bored by that series I have to say your priorities are not great
TBF some of the games were kinda anticlimactic. Others were really exciting though. Overall a good series though.
On September 11 2017 05:01 DieuCure wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 04:56 Charoisaur wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 sharkie wrote:
why is neeb so much superior to other foreigners? more talented Curiously he wasn't talented as terran Something is wrong in protoss design nowadays. They have the easiest mechanics because it was the "micro race" , but this isn't true anymore. So : - easier to defend - easier to macro - easier to micro - easier to multitask Some protosses with the exaggerated ego will say that it is false, but all these points are true.
It's really not true though
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On September 11 2017 05:01 Heyjoray wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 04:58 Parrek wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 Heyjoray wrote:
Is this the kind of "Foreigner Starcraft" people were looking for? It has to be the worst Major experience ever. It is so bad that the best player are missing Neeb is on another level, but I enjoyed many of the matches. I had GSL on for Dark vs Innovation and was bored to tears because I didn't really care for the two players. Why? What are the reasons you would care for neeb?
Just watch Shellshock's troll thread on reddit , Tarrek still affirms that Koreans are faceless etc, it's just a racist.
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On September 11 2017 05:01 Heyjoray wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 04:58 Parrek wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 Heyjoray wrote:
Is this the kind of "Foreigner Starcraft" people were looking for? It has to be the worst Major experience ever. It is so bad that the best player are missing Neeb is on another level, but I enjoyed many of the matches. I had GSL on for Dark vs Innovation and was bored to tears because I didn't really care for the two players. Why? What are the reasons you would care for neeb?
USAUSAUSA
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Canada8989 Posts
Back home from Dreamhack, great event overall even if I would have love a closer grand final. But Neeb's just too good, should be fun seeing him at Blizcon.
The crowd was also amazing it was pretty much full for all of saturday and sunday with people on their feet on the side.
Would have been nice to have the bigger stage seeing that CSGO crowd was a lot smaller, and it was sometime hard to find places to sit for sc2.
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On September 11 2017 05:01 The_Red_Viper wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 04:59 Elentos wrote:On September 11 2017 04:58 Parrek wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 Heyjoray wrote:
Is this the kind of "Foreigner Starcraft" people were looking for? It has to be the worst Major experience ever. It is so bad that the best player are missing Neeb is on another level, but I enjoyed many of the matches. I had GSL on for Dark vs Innovation and was bored to tears because I didn't really care for the two players. If you managed to get bored by that series I have to say your priorities are not great TBF
No
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On September 11 2017 05:02 DieuCure wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 05:01 Heyjoray wrote:On September 11 2017 04:58 Parrek wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 Heyjoray wrote:
Is this the kind of "Foreigner Starcraft" people were looking for? It has to be the worst Major experience ever. It is so bad that the best player are missing Neeb is on another level, but I enjoyed many of the matches. I had GSL on for Dark vs Innovation and was bored to tears because I didn't really care for the two players. Why? What are the reasons you would care for neeb? Just watch Shellshock's troll thread on reddit , Tarrek still affirms that Koreans are faceless etc, it's just a racist.
People on both sides are fucking stupid. I am a person who basically only really cares for korean sc2 and i still can see where these people are coming from. It simply is harder to get a connection to players who don't speak your language. It's really not hard to understand.
On September 11 2017 05:03 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 05:01 The_Red_Viper wrote:On September 11 2017 04:59 Elentos wrote:On September 11 2017 04:58 Parrek wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 Heyjoray wrote:
Is this the kind of "Foreigner Starcraft" people were looking for? It has to be the worst Major experience ever. It is so bad that the best player are missing Neeb is on another level, but I enjoyed many of the matches. I had GSL on for Dark vs Innovation and was bored to tears because I didn't really care for the two players. If you managed to get bored by that series I have to say your priorities are not great TBF No
I don't know man, there were games where Dark just died to the first bigger push basically. Not that amazing/exciting
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On September 11 2017 05:01 DieuCure wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 04:56 Charoisaur wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 sharkie wrote:
why is neeb so much superior to other foreigners? more talented Curiously he wasn't talented as terran Something is wrong in protoss design nowadays. They have the easiest mechanics because it was the "micro race" , but this isn't true anymore. So : - easier to defend - easier to macro - easier to micro - easier to multitask Some protosses with the exaggerated ego will say that it is false, but all these points are true.
thanks for explaining why protoss players would disagree, i was wondering
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On September 11 2017 04:57 The_Red_Viper wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 04:56 Charoisaur wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 sharkie wrote:
why is neeb so much superior to other foreigners? more talented and not as lazy
Do you really think all the other foreigners are lazy? Winning or performing well in tournaments isn´t a simple question of "who trained the most", it´s only one part of the puzzel to become a champ.
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On September 11 2017 05:05 MrWayne wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 04:57 The_Red_Viper wrote:On September 11 2017 04:56 Charoisaur wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 sharkie wrote:
why is neeb so much superior to other foreigners? more talented and not as lazy Do you really think all the other foreigners are lazy? Winning or performing well in tournaments isn´t a simple question of "who trained the most", it´s only one part of the puzzel to become a champ.
I think compared to neeb they are lazy yeah
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On September 11 2017 05:01 The_Red_Viper wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 04:59 Elentos wrote:On September 11 2017 04:58 Parrek wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 Heyjoray wrote:
Is this the kind of "Foreigner Starcraft" people were looking for? It has to be the worst Major experience ever. It is so bad that the best player are missing Neeb is on another level, but I enjoyed many of the matches. I had GSL on for Dark vs Innovation and was bored to tears because I didn't really care for the two players. If you managed to get bored by that series I have to say your priorities are not great TBF some of the games were kinda anticlimactic. Others were really exciting though. Overall a good series though. Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 05:01 DieuCure wrote:On September 11 2017 04:56 Charoisaur wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 sharkie wrote:
why is neeb so much superior to other foreigners? more talented Curiously he wasn't talented as terran Something is wrong in protoss design nowadays. They have the easiest mechanics because it was the "micro race" , but this isn't true anymore. So : - easier to defend - easier to macro - easier to micro - easier to multitask Some protosses with the exaggerated ego will say that it is false, but all these points are true. It's really not true though
I don't think a protoss will lie saying the macro is near of zerg or terran one
Defend = msc did a lot to makes it easier as protoss
Micro isn't hard if you compare with lings or bio and nowadays protoss comps
Multitask = trolol phoenix , WP 10 zealots in late game, or shades, nowhere near of medivac harass + others race can't defend with pylons
The only thing a little bit harder as protoss is thinking
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On September 11 2017 05:05 MrWayne wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 04:57 The_Red_Viper wrote:On September 11 2017 04:56 Charoisaur wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 sharkie wrote:
why is neeb so much superior to other foreigners? more talented and not as lazy Do you really think all the other foreigners are lazy? Winning or performing well in tournaments isn´t a simple question of "who trained the most", it´s only one part of the puzzel to become a champ.
It was a joke because Neeb himself said he is one of the harder working players in the foreign scene. Blame him 
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On September 11 2017 04:47 [PkF] Wire wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 04:44 Charoisaur wrote:On September 11 2017 04:42 [PkF] Wire wrote:On September 11 2017 04:39 Charoisaur wrote:On September 11 2017 04:35 Nerchio wrote:On September 11 2017 04:31 SnowfaLL wrote:On September 11 2017 04:26 Myrddrael wrote:On September 11 2017 04:20 SnowfaLL wrote:On September 11 2017 04:12 Trizz wrote:
Zerg has no micro options, all they can do is flank.
In battles like these with hydra/base vs sentry/storm it's all on the protoss and none on the zerg.
Something has to change, honestly. Well, take NEEB out of the tournament and here is your top 16 ZvP matches: TRUE 3:0 DnS Scarlett 3:2 Harstrem Serral 3:0 MaNa Snute 3:1 Has So, in actual matchups without Neeb in the game, zerg won 4 out of 4 matchups. Yeah, really weak race. How about just admitting Neeb is SO FAR ahead of all these nerds - thats why these finals are always so one sided despite zerg DOMINATING the rest of the tournament. (6 zerg out of top 8?? yeah. so bad.) This. Have a Zerg and a Terran as good as Neeb is and things would be different. Zerg tears tho And the really sad thing is that Snute and Scarlett are both mechanically as good as Neeb, but for some stupid reason, they have this mental block vs a great protoss like Neeb and just do terrible all-ins and stupid decisions that lose them the series in 30 minutes.. (causing casual watchers to think zerg is weak rofl).. They dont do that vs other protosses like Has or MaNa, but vs Neeb they just go "Welp, I cant win anyways so mise well do a terrible 2 base timing!" - Its basically the mentality of foreigner zerg since the artosis/idra days - they are so ingrained with the balance whining that they dont even try unless they THINK they are massively superior vs an opponent. If Neeb switched to Zerg, he would be GSL level. He is just a superior player in all aspects of the game. The problem was always that you can talk whatever shit you want but I need to prove the imbalance in 50 page essays. To be honest no % statistics that you can bring up will show if PvZ is broken or not. Try asking all top50 zergs and top50 protosses if PvZ is fair at the moment and then draw some conclusions. 49 out of 50 zergs(except TLO) will say it's not and probably even half of protosses will say the same. then why is only 1 toss in the top 8 WCS standings? because only Neeb and ShoWTime were sufficiently skilled in the foreign scene to be able to seize the opportunity, and ShoWTime had an awful year for reasons. The other highly talented players of the foreign scene are Z (most of them) and T (roughly as many legit T as there are P). Ah yeah, PvZ is imbalanced in favor of protoss but we don't see it because foreign Zergs are that much more talented than foreign Protoss. Well, it's just my opinion. When I watch high level P play, they always look in total control, especially because of oracles. I'm not saying what they do takes no skill ; of course it does, otherwise lesser P would start winning games they shouldn't, and this doesn't happen atm. Nevertheless, I can't help but think PvZ (and PvT too) is slightly P favored atm because of how versatile P can be, how much map control they seize early on, how stronger they get their eco going compared to hots, etc. Then again, that's just my low level player opinion and you can disagree on it completely. But I think you need to watch further than numbers and see how the games play out.
Nothings changed much in PvZ with the invent of mass oracles other than lower level protosses squeaking out a few more wins vs weak-minded zergs. Good zergs dont fall for it (lots of proof of that in RO16 this weekend, as zerg won 4 of 4 matchups when Neeb wasnt playing) - Watch Neeb or Stats or sOs before the oracle invent, they look in control at all points of the game back then too. Know why? They are simply better players. Stronger control, much stronger micro, stronger mind.
It's always some excuse with foreign zergs. Even during BL-Infestor era, people like Nerchio claimed zerg was weakest. The only foreign zerg who actually didnt make excuses for his losses was Stephano, and he just wrecked everyone including koreans. Know why?? Cause Stephano knew if he just played his A game, he'd win regardless of what a TL balance thread said.
The better player always wins out in Starcraft. If you lose, its not because your race was weaker. Of course, even sponsored foreign pros as proof in this thread will never learn this lesson and hence why the korean scene has such stronger players. Stop making excuses for your loss and just practice?
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On September 11 2017 05:03 The_Red_Viper wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 05:02 DieuCure wrote:On September 11 2017 05:01 Heyjoray wrote:On September 11 2017 04:58 Parrek wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 Heyjoray wrote:
Is this the kind of "Foreigner Starcraft" people were looking for? It has to be the worst Major experience ever. It is so bad that the best player are missing Neeb is on another level, but I enjoyed many of the matches. I had GSL on for Dark vs Innovation and was bored to tears because I didn't really care for the two players. Why? What are the reasons you would care for neeb? Just watch Shellshock's troll thread on reddit , Tarrek still affirms that Koreans are faceless etc, it's just a racist. People on both sides are fucking stupid. I am a person who basically only really cares for korean sc2 and i still can see where these people are coming from. It simply is harder to get a connection to players who don't speak your language. It's really not hard to understand. Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 05:03 Elentos wrote:On September 11 2017 05:01 The_Red_Viper wrote:On September 11 2017 04:59 Elentos wrote:On September 11 2017 04:58 Parrek wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 Heyjoray wrote:
Is this the kind of "Foreigner Starcraft" people were looking for? It has to be the worst Major experience ever. It is so bad that the best player are missing Neeb is on another level, but I enjoyed many of the matches. I had GSL on for Dark vs Innovation and was bored to tears because I didn't really care for the two players. If you managed to get bored by that series I have to say your priorities are not great TBF No I don't know man, there were games where Dark just died to the first bigger push basically. Not that amazing/exciting
I can understand people who prefer cheering for foreigners. But they shouldn't call koreans bland/boring/faceless when that's just not true when you compare them to foreigners
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On September 11 2017 05:01 DieuCure wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 04:56 Charoisaur wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 sharkie wrote:
why is neeb so much superior to other foreigners? more talented Curiously he wasn't talented as terran Something is wrong in protoss design nowadays. They have the easiest mechanics because it was the "micro race" , but this isn't true anymore. So : - easier to defend - easier to macro - easier to micro - easier to multitask Some protosses with the exaggerated ego will say that it is false, but all these points are true.
Eh, I think the general consensus is that Z is the easiest race in the game. Neeb is just on another level from the foreigners... he'll still get stomped at Blizzcon but he's like the missing link between foreigners and koreans in terms of skill.
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On September 11 2017 05:06 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 05:03 The_Red_Viper wrote:On September 11 2017 05:02 DieuCure wrote:On September 11 2017 05:01 Heyjoray wrote:On September 11 2017 04:58 Parrek wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 Heyjoray wrote:
Is this the kind of "Foreigner Starcraft" people were looking for? It has to be the worst Major experience ever. It is so bad that the best player are missing Neeb is on another level, but I enjoyed many of the matches. I had GSL on for Dark vs Innovation and was bored to tears because I didn't really care for the two players. Why? What are the reasons you would care for neeb? Just watch Shellshock's troll thread on reddit , Tarrek still affirms that Koreans are faceless etc, it's just a racist. People on both sides are fucking stupid. I am a person who basically only really cares for korean sc2 and i still can see where these people are coming from. It simply is harder to get a connection to players who don't speak your language. It's really not hard to understand. On September 11 2017 05:03 Elentos wrote:On September 11 2017 05:01 The_Red_Viper wrote:On September 11 2017 04:59 Elentos wrote:On September 11 2017 04:58 Parrek wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 Heyjoray wrote:
Is this the kind of "Foreigner Starcraft" people were looking for? It has to be the worst Major experience ever. It is so bad that the best player are missing Neeb is on another level, but I enjoyed many of the matches. I had GSL on for Dark vs Innovation and was bored to tears because I didn't really care for the two players. If you managed to get bored by that series I have to say your priorities are not great TBF No I don't know man, there were games where Dark just died to the first bigger push basically. Not that amazing/exciting I can understand people who prefer cheering for foreigners. But they shouldn't call koreans bland/boring/faceless when that's just not true when you compare them to foreigners
Compared to Neeb of all people. I wish Neeb had 1/10th the personality of Dark.
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Ah ye and storms or aoe vs bio or hydra... is much easier for protoss than dealing with wm or banes
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edit because wtf happened there
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On September 11 2017 05:07 Bayaz90 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 05:01 DieuCure wrote:On September 11 2017 04:56 Charoisaur wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 sharkie wrote:
why is neeb so much superior to other foreigners? more talented Curiously he wasn't talented as terran Something is wrong in protoss design nowadays. They have the easiest mechanics because it was the "micro race" , but this isn't true anymore. So : - easier to defend - easier to macro - easier to micro - easier to multitask Some protosses with the exaggerated ego will say that it is false, but all these points are true. Eh, I think the general consensus is that Z is the easiest race in the game. Neeb is just on another level from the foreigners... he'll still get stomped at Blizzcon but he's like the missing link between foreigners and koreans in terms of skill.
Yeah, Neeb can put up a good fight against top Koreans but I doubt he will win a long series.
On September 11 2017 05:08 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 05:06 Charoisaur wrote:On September 11 2017 05:03 The_Red_Viper wrote:On September 11 2017 05:02 DieuCure wrote:On September 11 2017 05:01 Heyjoray wrote:On September 11 2017 04:58 Parrek wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 Heyjoray wrote:
Is this the kind of "Foreigner Starcraft" people were looking for? It has to be the worst Major experience ever. It is so bad that the best player are missing Neeb is on another level, but I enjoyed many of the matches. I had GSL on for Dark vs Innovation and was bored to tears because I didn't really care for the two players. Why? What are the reasons you would care for neeb? Just watch Shellshock's troll thread on reddit , Tarrek still affirms that Koreans are faceless etc, it's just a racist. People on both sides are fucking stupid. I am a person who basically only really cares for korean sc2 and i still can see where these people are coming from. It simply is harder to get a connection to players who don't speak your language. It's really not hard to understand. On September 11 2017 05:03 Elentos wrote:On September 11 2017 05:01 The_Red_Viper wrote:On September 11 2017 04:59 Elentos wrote:On September 11 2017 04:58 Parrek wrote:On September 11 2017 04:53 Heyjoray wrote:
Is this the kind of "Foreigner Starcraft" people were looking for? It has to be the worst Major experience ever. It is so bad that the best player are missing Neeb is on another level, but I enjoyed many of the matches. I had GSL on for Dark vs Innovation and was bored to tears because I didn't really care for the two players. If you managed to get bored by that series I have to say your priorities are not great TBF No I don't know man, there were games where Dark just died to the first bigger push basically. Not that amazing/exciting I can understand people who prefer cheering for foreigners. But they shouldn't call koreans bland/boring/faceless when that's just not true when you compare them to foreigners Compared to Neeb of all people. I wish Neeb had 1/10th the personality of Dark.
Neeb is the Maru/Inno interview equivalent, incredibly bland about everything
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