• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 03:05
CEST 09:05
KST 16:05
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S Season 1 - RO8 Preview1[ASL21] Ro8 Preview Pt2: Progenitors8Code S Season 1 - RO12 Group A: Rogue, Percival, Solar, Zoun13[ASL21] Ro8 Preview Pt1: Inheritors16[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt2: All Star10
Community News
Weekly Cups (April 27-May 4): Clem takes triple0RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event11Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO12 Results12026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers25Maestros of the Game 2 announced9
StarCraft 2
General
Code S Season 1 - RO8 Preview Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book Weekly Cups (April 27-May 4): Clem takes triple Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO12 Results
Tourneys
GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event StarCraft Evolution League (SC Evo Biweekly) 2026 GSL Season 2 Qualifiers
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 524 Death and Taxes The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 523 Firewall Mutation # 522 Flip My Base
Brood War
General
(Spoiler) Asl ro8 D winner interview BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion Do we have a pimpest plays list? AI Question
Tourneys
[ASL21] Ro8 Day 4 [ASL21] Ro8 Day 3 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Ro8 Day 2
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Fighting Spirit mining rates What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Any training maps people recommend?
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Dawn of War IV OutLive 25 (RTS Game) Daigo vs Menard Best of 10 Nintendo Switch Thread
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread 3D technology/software discussion Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion McBoner: A hockey love story
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
streaming software Strange computer issues (software) [G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Movie Stars In Video Games: …
TrAiDoS
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1306 users

[DreamHack] Valencia Day 2 - Page 16

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 14 15 16 17 18 390 Next
Azarkon
Profile Joined January 2010
United States21060 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-09-23 08:49:35
September 23 2012 08:48 GMT
#301
On September 23 2012 17:43 FakeDeath wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 23 2012 17:34 iglocska wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:30 Carnate wrote:
Good decision making for votix


He's incredibly good. Foreigners finally catching up


Continue to dream on.
This is such a bad joke.

One series of ZvZ and foreigners are finally catching up?
More like lagging behind.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=366722


Koreans who are sent to NA / EU tournaments are mid-tier+, while NA / EU tournaments, due to their BYOG / OB format, contain a lot of low / mid-tier- NA / EU players - ie half of the players in DH Valencia.

An analysis has to be over the top, say, 20-30 NA / EU players rather than the entirety of NA / EU players to be useful.
ZwuckeL
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Germany563 Posts
September 23 2012 08:48 GMT
#302
On September 23 2012 17:46 iglocska wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 23 2012 17:45 Dodgin wrote:
Foreigners in general aren't catching up but a few of them can compete with the good Korean players.

It's the same as it's always been, the names are just Stephano Vortix and Lucifron instead of Idra Jinro and HuK.


That be right, for every player that seems to catch up, someone does seem to fall behind...


It's just the way the pro scene works. It's all about improving the fastest. Stephano Vortix etc simply improved quicker than Huk and his EG Curse - mates
MartinN
Profile Joined April 2011
Spain307 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-09-23 08:50:53
September 23 2012 08:49 GMT
#303
the first player to arrive in SC2 Area today was lucifroN ! training since early!

[image loading]
X3GoldDot
Profile Joined August 2011
Malaysia3840 Posts
September 23 2012 08:49 GMT
#304
On September 23 2012 17:45 iglocska wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 23 2012 17:43 FakeDeath wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:34 iglocska wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:30 Carnate wrote:
Good decision making for votix


He's incredibly good. Foreigners finally catching up


Continue to dream on.

One series of ZvZ and foreigners are finally catching up?
More like lagging behind.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=366722


I didn't really base it on that single match, but rather watching how those players play the matches out in general. WCS europe seemed to provide much higher quality games for example than I expected. Stephano going toe to toe with Taeja, and producing a similarly high quality games as against Lucifron is a good example.


compare top 20 koreans to top 20 foreigners, heck, even compare top 50 koreans to top 20 foreigners, i assure you, most of the top 50 koreans would beat all foreigners except for the top 3 or something
prime/startale/[SexComaZerg, RoyalRoaderZerg, SirLifealot] ingame ID = GoodGame
revel8
Profile Joined January 2012
United Kingdom3022 Posts
September 23 2012 08:49 GMT
#305
Lucifron might be thinking of going full-time and perhaps putting his studies on hold. If he can be competitive and win money then might be a good plan. I think Vortix will still stick with his studies though. Amazing these guys can be so good while still being students. Nerchio does it too.

Polt as well, although I think he has been on a break from his studies this year. I think he will have to go back to University at some point too.
Fusilero
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United Kingdom50293 Posts
September 23 2012 08:49 GMT
#306
On September 23 2012 17:49 X3GoldDot wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 23 2012 17:45 iglocska wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:43 FakeDeath wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:34 iglocska wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:30 Carnate wrote:
Good decision making for votix


He's incredibly good. Foreigners finally catching up


Continue to dream on.

One series of ZvZ and foreigners are finally catching up?
More like lagging behind.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=366722


I didn't really base it on that single match, but rather watching how those players play the matches out in general. WCS europe seemed to provide much higher quality games for example than I expected. Stephano going toe to toe with Taeja, and producing a similarly high quality games as against Lucifron is a good example.


compare top 20 koreans to top 20 foreigners, heck, even compare top 50 koreans to top 20 foreigners, i assure you, most of the top 50 koreans would beat all foreigners except for the top 3 or something

That's how it's been since the start of SC2, not much has changed except the names.
Glorious SEA doto
xrapture
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
United States1644 Posts
September 23 2012 08:50 GMT
#307
On September 23 2012 17:45 Dodgin wrote:
Foreigners in general aren't catching up but a few of them can compete with the good Korean players.

It's the same as it's always been, the names are just Stephano Vortix and Lucifron instead of Idra Jinro and HuK.


Please tell me which Koreans Lucifron has "competed" with. He got stomped by Violet.
Everyone is either delusional, a nihlilst, or dead from suicide.
Dodgin
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Canada39254 Posts
September 23 2012 08:51 GMT
#308
On September 23 2012 17:50 xrapture wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 23 2012 17:45 Dodgin wrote:
Foreigners in general aren't catching up but a few of them can compete with the good Korean players.

It's the same as it's always been, the names are just Stephano Vortix and Lucifron instead of Idra Jinro and HuK.


Please tell me which Koreans Lucifron has "competed" with. He got stomped by Violet.


I just named the top 3 of WCS EU as an example because I figure they are some of the best foreigners currently. I don't know if he can become a korean-slayer.
Notfragile
Profile Joined April 2011
Greece713 Posts
September 23 2012 08:51 GMT
#309
On September 23 2012 17:50 xrapture wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 23 2012 17:45 Dodgin wrote:
Foreigners in general aren't catching up but a few of them can compete with the good Korean players.

It's the same as it's always been, the names are just Stephano Vortix and Lucifron instead of Idra Jinro and HuK.


Please tell me which Koreans Lucifron has "competed" with. He got stomped by Violet.


Yes. Let us not doubt our Korean overlords.
They might not like it.

Gogo Elfi!
"The art of war is of vital importance to the state" || MVP.Keen fan since the day he stole my heart with a double 2rax. http://i.imgur.com/A82cl.gif
X3GoldDot
Profile Joined August 2011
Malaysia3840 Posts
September 23 2012 08:52 GMT
#310
On September 23 2012 17:48 Azarkon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 23 2012 17:43 FakeDeath wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:34 iglocska wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:30 Carnate wrote:
Good decision making for votix


He's incredibly good. Foreigners finally catching up


Continue to dream on.
This is such a bad joke.

One series of ZvZ and foreigners are finally catching up?
More like lagging behind.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=366722


Koreans who are sent to NA / EU tournaments are mid-tier+, while NA / EU tournaments, due to their BYOG / OB format, contain a lot of low / mid-tier- NA / EU players - ie half of the players in DH Valencia.

An analysis has to be over the top, say, 20-30 NA / EU players rather than the entirety of NA / EU players to be useful.


when a code B player gets 2nd in mlg, you realise that koreans are much better AS USUAL. as i said before, while the top 3 foreigners may go toe to toe with top 10 koreans, once you compare foreigner 5-20 to any code A korean, you would easily see the code A koreans winning
prime/startale/[SexComaZerg, RoyalRoaderZerg, SirLifealot] ingame ID = GoodGame
Dosey
Profile Joined September 2010
United States4505 Posts
September 23 2012 08:53 GMT
#311
StC has always struck me as a Korean version of TLO. So good in the beta and early on, always watched as a player and pretty famous, now he's just... meh.
CygnusAres
Profile Joined August 2011
Singapore893 Posts
September 23 2012 08:53 GMT
#312
And don't forget in Code B we have YongJwa, plus the swarm of elephants is not out yet from the zoo...
"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul" - Invictus. Favorite Players: TaeJa, Bogus, and Zest, Fighting!
iglocska
Profile Joined May 2011
Norway589 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-09-23 08:55:01
September 23 2012 08:54 GMT
#313
On September 23 2012 17:52 X3GoldDot wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 23 2012 17:48 Azarkon wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:43 FakeDeath wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:34 iglocska wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:30 Carnate wrote:
Good decision making for votix


He's incredibly good. Foreigners finally catching up


Continue to dream on.
This is such a bad joke.

One series of ZvZ and foreigners are finally catching up?
More like lagging behind.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=366722


Koreans who are sent to NA / EU tournaments are mid-tier+, while NA / EU tournaments, due to their BYOG / OB format, contain a lot of low / mid-tier- NA / EU players - ie half of the players in DH Valencia.

An analysis has to be over the top, say, 20-30 NA / EU players rather than the entirety of NA / EU players to be useful.


when a code B player gets 2nd in mlg, you realise that koreans are much better AS USUAL. as i said before, while the top 3 foreigners may go toe to toe with top 10 koreans, once you compare foreigner 5-20 to any code A korean, you would easily see the code A koreans winning


Yonghwa is a code B player that is slaughtering code S players left and right in Korea right now. Alicia and Losira, both code B, are known to be really strong players and I don't think anyone would be too surprised if they beat a code S player every now and then. It's not as simple as you make it out to be.

Oh and yes, half of the tournament may be full of low tier players, but we're watching Elfi right now go toe to toe with thestc. Quite the achievement I'd say.
Laryleprakon
Profile Joined May 2011
New Zealand9496 Posts
September 23 2012 08:54 GMT
#314
Lets go Elfi

deus.machinarum
Profile Joined September 2011
Austria658 Posts
September 23 2012 08:54 GMT
#315
On September 23 2012 17:53 Dosey wrote:
StC has always struck me as a Korean version of TLO. So good in the beta and early on, always watched as a player and pretty famous, now he's just... meh.



yeah, totally agree, kinda sad about TLO being in this place though...
Nothing worth having comes easy.
Fusilero
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United Kingdom50293 Posts
September 23 2012 08:55 GMT
#316
On September 23 2012 17:54 iglocska wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 23 2012 17:52 X3GoldDot wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:48 Azarkon wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:43 FakeDeath wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:34 iglocska wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:30 Carnate wrote:
Good decision making for votix


He's incredibly good. Foreigners finally catching up


Continue to dream on.
This is such a bad joke.

One series of ZvZ and foreigners are finally catching up?
More like lagging behind.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=366722


Koreans who are sent to NA / EU tournaments are mid-tier+, while NA / EU tournaments, due to their BYOG / OB format, contain a lot of low / mid-tier- NA / EU players - ie half of the players in DH Valencia.

An analysis has to be over the top, say, 20-30 NA / EU players rather than the entirety of NA / EU players to be useful.


when a code B player gets 2nd in mlg, you realise that koreans are much better AS USUAL. as i said before, while the top 3 foreigners may go toe to toe with top 10 koreans, once you compare foreigner 5-20 to any code A korean, you would easily see the code A koreans winning


Yonghwa is a code B player that is slaughtering code S players left and right in Korea right now. Alicia and Losira, both code B, are known to be really strong players and I don't think anyone would be too surprised if they beat a code S player every now and then. It's not as simple as you make it out to be.

What about players like revival and dream posting strong results at mlgs?
Glorious SEA doto
xrapture
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
United States1644 Posts
September 23 2012 08:55 GMT
#317
On September 23 2012 17:53 CygnusAres wrote:
And don't forget in Code B we have YongJwa, plus the swarm of elephants is not out yet from the zoo...


lol yup.

100+ Kespa players just switched to SC2 and they're all already better than almost all of WCS Europe.
Everyone is either delusional, a nihlilst, or dead from suicide.
iglocska
Profile Joined May 2011
Norway589 Posts
September 23 2012 08:56 GMT
#318
On September 23 2012 17:55 xrapture wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 23 2012 17:53 CygnusAres wrote:
And don't forget in Code B we have YongJwa, plus the swarm of elephants is not out yet from the zoo...


lol yup.

100+ Kespa players just switched to SC2 and they're all already better than almost all of WCS Europe.


That is true, but the Kespa players suddenly appearing and being as good as they are shouldn't take away from the fact that more foreigners seem to be able to go up against gsl players.
Dodgin
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Canada39254 Posts
September 23 2012 08:57 GMT
#319
That was hilariously one sided.
Laryleprakon
Profile Joined May 2011
New Zealand9496 Posts
September 23 2012 08:57 GMT
#320
On September 23 2012 17:56 iglocska wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 23 2012 17:55 xrapture wrote:
On September 23 2012 17:53 CygnusAres wrote:
And don't forget in Code B we have YongJwa, plus the swarm of elephants is not out yet from the zoo...


lol yup.

100+ Kespa players just switched to SC2 and they're all already better than almost all of WCS Europe.


That is true, but the Kespa players suddenly appearing and being as good as they are shouldn't take away from the fact that more foreigners seem to be able to go up against gsl players.


Is there really more players or are they just different from who was able to do it before?
Prev 1 14 15 16 17 18 390 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
PiGosaur Cup
00:00
#80 (TLMC 22 Edition)
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
-ZergGirl 85
StarCraft: Brood War
GuemChi 3952
Flash 2864
Mong 92
Noble 31
Bale 21
SilentControl 17
ZergMaN 12
Icarus 6
Dota 2
monkeys_forever215
League of Legends
JimRising 616
Counter-Strike
Coldzera 1666
Stewie2K1400
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King63
Other Games
summit1g7485
C9.Mang0640
Sick210
ROOTCatZ69
Nina39
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick640
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream31
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• LUISG 12
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Rush1116
• Stunt557
Upcoming Events
GSL
2h 25m
Classic vs Cure
Maru vs Rogue
GSL
1d 2h
SHIN vs Zoun
ByuN vs herO
OSC
1d 3h
OSC
1d 5h
Replay Cast
1d 16h
Escore
2 days
The PondCast
2 days
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
Zoun vs Ryung
Lambo vs ShoWTimE
OSC
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
[ Show More ]
CranKy Ducklings
3 days
RSL Revival
3 days
SHIN vs Bunny
ByuN vs Shameless
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
Krystianer vs TriGGeR
Cure vs Rogue
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3 days
BSL
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
RSL Revival
4 days
Cure vs Zoun
Clem vs Lambo
WardiTV Invitational
4 days
BSL
4 days
GSL
5 days
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
Monday Night Weeklies
5 days
Afreeca Starleague
6 days
CranKy Ducklings
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-05-05
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
Acropolis #4
YSL S3
SCTL 2026 Spring
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: W6
KK 2v2 League Season 1
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
Escore Tournament S2: W7
Escore Tournament S2: W8
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Maestros of the Game 2
2026 GSL S2
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
PGL Astana 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.