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stephano such a boss as ever
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On March 05 2012 06:52 Seraphone wrote:
but isn't good enough to be Code S all the time
Ah, ok, I get it.
Your idea of being "a codeS player" is not being in motherfuckiong codeS, but the idea of someone who consistently gets codeS multiple times in a row.
So roughly the top8 players in the world.
lol, arguing such blatant cluelessness is tiring and brings nowhere.
I'm done, enjoy your hating.
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Aaaaaand 2 - 2, as I said before, relying too much on micro, slight hole in the wall = loss.
That's sad, he had the upper hand, better strategy and stronger opening, but no baneling...
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You have to play banelings on taldarim...
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what was the opening for the 4rth game ? didn't looked
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On March 05 2012 06:58 hrvoje07 wrote:
You have to play banelings on taldarim...
Exactly, no ramp to block so they can just walk past
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Why does every thread turn into a stephano debate
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On March 05 2012 06:46 Ylrahc wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2012 06:40 revel8 wrote:On March 05 2012 06:33 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 06:19 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:08 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:55 Zealot Orgy wrote:On March 05 2012 05:53 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:50 Crying wrote:
Stephano could easily be Code S , if he was training in Korea,that guy is a monster guys. Just stop. Stephano's record vs top end Koreans is quite poor since ESWC. 2 messages in a row hating on Stephano, I know I shouldn't even answer, but whatever: He said he can be in codeS, he didn't say he can beat every "top end Korean" he faces. he wins under 50% of his games vs Koreans Proof ?
Stephano's record vs Korean players on LAN who actually competed in Season 1 of GSL 2012.
0-2 vs MKP
0-2 vs MC
1-4 vs Polt.
You take only LAN event, online events with $$ prizes aren't meaningful ? You disregard online events as well as events in winter 2011, I disregard HSC, it's my right as well as it's yours. See my point ? Thing is, it's your opinion vs mine, we both have "facts" to back it up, and while it's interesting to discuss it it's however tiring in the end because the same arguments are rehearsed every time. And we will never know, as Stephano will never play in GSL  And it looks like Stephano is (again) going to take another EU tournament  Online results are meaningless. You have no idea how much anyone is lagging or what hour of the night they're played in. It's just worthless for both sides. Stephano's record vs Koreans in full. 1-4 vs Polt 3-0 vs Puma 0-2 vs MKP 0-2 vs MC 0-2 vs Sound 0-1 vs MVP 0-1 vs MC 1-0 vs DRG 1-0 vs Hero 3-2 vs Tails 2-0 vs MKP 1-2 vs Boxer 0-2 vs TheSTC 4-0 vs Lucky 3-1 vs TheSTC 2-1 vs Inori 2-0 vs Violet 2-0 Boxer 0-2 vs Alive 0-2 vs MC In terms of series that's 10-10, in terms of games that's 25-24. Which means overall he has a 50% win rate. It's worth point out that half of his series and game wins were at IPL. If we only use games since IPL his record is 5-8. If we only use games in 2012 his record is 1-4 in series and 4-10. That's a 28% win rate vs Korean players (not all of whom were Code S/A) in 2012. You are just ignoring those results that are in favour of Stephano. You are ignoring the Blizzard Cup and pretending they are meaningless because they show Stephano can live with top level Koreans. Also you conveniently forgot that Stephano beat Real 2-0 at Assembly. So that means according to your own figures, Stephano has defeated Koreans most of the times he has played against them. No, he is not. And 2 0 vs Alive was at IPL pool play, so it's valid. Seraphone is maybe not a Stephano fan, but I think the list he gave is valid Show nested quote +
This debate has run its course. Stephano's record in 2012 vs Koreans who actually playing in GSL speaks for itself.
And what makes 01 / 01 / 2012 such an amazing date we have to skip all results before it ? If you want to pick a start date, you should pick the one when Stephano decided to become a pro, and that's around july 2011. 2 - 1 , gg Slivko. Would be nice to see a bo war won by Stephano for the next one
I think Stephano did a lot better when Koreans didn't expect his style especially vs Terran. He's still extremely good vs Protoss (although not MC but MC doesn't play like anyone else). He has barely played ZvZ vs Koreans so I can't comment on that.
But a lot of Koreans played Stephano at IPL and ESWC expecting Muta/Ling/Bane and what they got was Ling/Infestor/Ultra with super fast ups. Since Koreans started stealing his build and Terran's went into games vs Stephano knowing he plays like this Stephano has struggled badly. The reason I use 2012 is because it was when Koreans started playing Stephano knowing they were playing Stephano and not a standard Zerg. Once they realised that Stephano has struggled to win at all vs Korean Terran's.
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On March 05 2012 06:59 Demonaz wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2012 06:58 hrvoje07 wrote:
You have to play banelings on taldarim... Exactly, no ramp to block so they can just walk past
I think ive seen them playing each other recently in a tournament and it s exactly the same games lol xD
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ohhh, game 5. Might Stephano lose this...
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On March 05 2012 07:00 Seraphone wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2012 06:46 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:40 revel8 wrote:On March 05 2012 06:33 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 06:19 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:08 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:55 Zealot Orgy wrote:On March 05 2012 05:53 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:50 Crying wrote:
Stephano could easily be Code S , if he was training in Korea,that guy is a monster guys. Just stop. Stephano's record vs top end Koreans is quite poor since ESWC. 2 messages in a row hating on Stephano, I know I shouldn't even answer, but whatever: He said he can be in codeS, he didn't say he can beat every "top end Korean" he faces. he wins under 50% of his games vs Koreans Proof ?
Stephano's record vs Korean players on LAN who actually competed in Season 1 of GSL 2012.
0-2 vs MKP
0-2 vs MC
1-4 vs Polt.
You take only LAN event, online events with $$ prizes aren't meaningful ? You disregard online events as well as events in winter 2011, I disregard HSC, it's my right as well as it's yours. See my point ? Thing is, it's your opinion vs mine, we both have "facts" to back it up, and while it's interesting to discuss it it's however tiring in the end because the same arguments are rehearsed every time. And we will never know, as Stephano will never play in GSL And it looks like Stephano is (again) going to take another EU tournament Online results are meaningless. You have no idea how much anyone is lagging or what hour of the night they're played in. It's just worthless for both sides. Stephano's record vs Koreans in full. 1-4 vs Polt 3-0 vs Puma 0-2 vs MKP 0-2 vs MC 0-2 vs Sound 0-1 vs MVP 0-1 vs MC 1-0 vs DRG 1-0 vs Hero 3-2 vs Tails 2-0 vs MKP 1-2 vs Boxer 0-2 vs TheSTC 4-0 vs Lucky 3-1 vs TheSTC 2-1 vs Inori 2-0 vs Violet 2-0 Boxer 0-2 vs Alive 0-2 vs MC In terms of series that's 10-10, in terms of games that's 25-24. Which means overall he has a 50% win rate. It's worth point out that half of his series and game wins were at IPL. If we only use games since IPL his record is 5-8. If we only use games in 2012 his record is 1-4 in series and 4-10. That's a 28% win rate vs Korean players (not all of whom were Code S/A) in 2012. You are just ignoring those results that are in favour of Stephano. You are ignoring the Blizzard Cup and pretending they are meaningless because they show Stephano can live with top level Koreans. Also you conveniently forgot that Stephano beat Real 2-0 at Assembly. So that means according to your own figures, Stephano has defeated Koreans most of the times he has played against them. No, he is not. And 2 0 vs Alive was at IPL pool play, so it's valid. Seraphone is maybe not a Stephano fan, but I think the list he gave is valid
This debate has run its course. Stephano's record in 2012 vs Koreans who actually playing in GSL speaks for itself.
And what makes 01 / 01 / 2012 such an amazing date we have to skip all results before it ? If you want to pick a start date, you should pick the one when Stephano decided to become a pro, and that's around july 2011. 2 - 1 , gg Slivko. Would be nice to see a bo war won by Stephano for the next one I think Stephano did a lot better when Koreans didn't expect his style especially vs Terran. He's still extremely good vs Protoss (although not MC but MC doesn't play like anyone else). He has barely played ZvZ vs Koreans so I can't comment on that. But a lot of Koreans played Stephano at IPL and ESWC expecting Muta/Ling/Bane and what they got was Ling/Infestor/Ultra with super fast ups. Since Koreans started stealing his build and Terran's went into games vs Stephano knowing he plays like this Stephano has struggled badly. The reason I use 2012 is because it was when Koreans started playing Stephano knowing they were playing Stephano and not a standard Zerg. Once they realised that Stephano has struggled to win at all vs Korean Terran's.
AS HAS EVERY ZERG BUT DRG. OR?
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On March 05 2012 07:00 Seraphone wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2012 06:46 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:40 revel8 wrote:On March 05 2012 06:33 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 06:19 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:08 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:55 Zealot Orgy wrote:On March 05 2012 05:53 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:50 Crying wrote:
Stephano could easily be Code S , if he was training in Korea,that guy is a monster guys. Just stop. Stephano's record vs top end Koreans is quite poor since ESWC. 2 messages in a row hating on Stephano, I know I shouldn't even answer, but whatever: He said he can be in codeS, he didn't say he can beat every "top end Korean" he faces. he wins under 50% of his games vs Koreans Proof ?
Stephano's record vs Korean players on LAN who actually competed in Season 1 of GSL 2012.
0-2 vs MKP
0-2 vs MC
1-4 vs Polt.
You take only LAN event, online events with $$ prizes aren't meaningful ? You disregard online events as well as events in winter 2011, I disregard HSC, it's my right as well as it's yours. See my point ? Thing is, it's your opinion vs mine, we both have "facts" to back it up, and while it's interesting to discuss it it's however tiring in the end because the same arguments are rehearsed every time. And we will never know, as Stephano will never play in GSL And it looks like Stephano is (again) going to take another EU tournament Online results are meaningless. You have no idea how much anyone is lagging or what hour of the night they're played in. It's just worthless for both sides. Stephano's record vs Koreans in full. 1-4 vs Polt 3-0 vs Puma 0-2 vs MKP 0-2 vs MC 0-2 vs Sound 0-1 vs MVP 0-1 vs MC 1-0 vs DRG 1-0 vs Hero 3-2 vs Tails 2-0 vs MKP 1-2 vs Boxer 0-2 vs TheSTC 4-0 vs Lucky 3-1 vs TheSTC 2-1 vs Inori 2-0 vs Violet 2-0 Boxer 0-2 vs Alive 0-2 vs MC In terms of series that's 10-10, in terms of games that's 25-24. Which means overall he has a 50% win rate. It's worth point out that half of his series and game wins were at IPL. If we only use games since IPL his record is 5-8. If we only use games in 2012 his record is 1-4 in series and 4-10. That's a 28% win rate vs Korean players (not all of whom were Code S/A) in 2012. You are just ignoring those results that are in favour of Stephano. You are ignoring the Blizzard Cup and pretending they are meaningless because they show Stephano can live with top level Koreans. Also you conveniently forgot that Stephano beat Real 2-0 at Assembly. So that means according to your own figures, Stephano has defeated Koreans most of the times he has played against them. No, he is not. And 2 0 vs Alive was at IPL pool play, so it's valid. Seraphone is maybe not a Stephano fan, but I think the list he gave is valid
This debate has run its course. Stephano's record in 2012 vs Koreans who actually playing in GSL speaks for itself.
And what makes 01 / 01 / 2012 such an amazing date we have to skip all results before it ? If you want to pick a start date, you should pick the one when Stephano decided to become a pro, and that's around july 2011. 2 - 1 , gg Slivko. Would be nice to see a bo war won by Stephano for the next one I think Stephano did a lot better when Koreans didn't expect his style especially vs Terran. He's still extremely good vs Protoss (although not MC but MC doesn't play like anyone else). He has barely played ZvZ vs Koreans so I can't comment on that. But a lot of Koreans played Stephano at IPL and ESWC expecting Muta/Ling/Bane and what they got was Ling/Infestor/Ultra with super fast ups. Since Koreans started stealing his build and Terran's went into games vs Stephano knowing he plays like this Stephano has struggled badly. The reason I use 2012 is because it was when Koreans started playing Stephano knowing they were playing Stephano and not a standard Zerg. Once they realised that Stephano has struggled to win at all vs Korean Terran's.
I agree with your comment but still Stephano is a great player, id put him top 10-15...
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On March 05 2012 06:58 kubiks wrote:
what was the opening for the 4rth game ? didn't looked
Can anyone respond to my question, instead of discussing about stephano ?
It's a goddamn livethread, not a general forum thread or stephano fanclub !
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On March 05 2012 06:55 revel8 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2012 06:43 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 06:40 revel8 wrote:On March 05 2012 06:33 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 06:19 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:08 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:55 Zealot Orgy wrote:On March 05 2012 05:53 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:50 Crying wrote:
Stephano could easily be Code S , if he was training in Korea,that guy is a monster guys. Just stop. Stephano's record vs top end Koreans is quite poor since ESWC. 2 messages in a row hating on Stephano, I know I shouldn't even answer, but whatever: He said he can be in codeS, he didn't say he can beat every "top end Korean" he faces. he wins under 50% of his games vs Koreans Proof ?
Stephano's record vs Korean players on LAN who actually competed in Season 1 of GSL 2012.
0-2 vs MKP
0-2 vs MC
1-4 vs Polt.
You take only LAN event, online events with $$ prizes aren't meaningful ? You disregard online events as well as events in winter 2011, I disregard HSC, it's my right as well as it's yours. See my point ? Thing is, it's your opinion vs mine, we both have "facts" to back it up, and while it's interesting to discuss it it's however tiring in the end because the same arguments are rehearsed every time. And we will never know, as Stephano will never play in GSL And it looks like Stephano is (again) going to take another EU tournament Online results are meaningless. You have no idea how much anyone is lagging or what hour of the night they're played in. It's just worthless for both sides. Stephano's record vs Koreans in full. 1-4 vs Polt 3-0 vs Puma 0-2 vs MKP 0-2 vs MC 0-2 vs Sound 0-1 vs MVP 0-1 vs MC 1-0 vs DRG 1-0 vs Hero 3-2 vs Tails 2-0 vs MKP 1-2 vs Boxer 0-2 vs TheSTC 4-0 vs Lucky 3-1 vs TheSTC 2-1 vs Inori 2-0 vs Violet 2-0 Boxer 0-2 vs Alive 0-2 vs MC In terms of series that's 10-10, in terms of games that's 25-24. Which means overall he has a 50% win rate. It's worth point out that half of his series and game wins were at IPL. If we only use games since IPL his record is 5-8. If we only use games in 2012 his record is 1-4 in series and 4-10. That's a 28% win rate vs Korean players (not all of whom were Code S/A) in 2012. You are just ignoring those results that are in favour of Stephano. You are ignoring the Blizzard Cup and pretending they are meaningless because they show Stephano can live with top level Koreans. Also you conveniently forgot that Stephano beat Real 2-0 at Assembly. So that means according to your own figures, Stephano has defeated Koreans most of the times he has played against them. Real is not a representative of the Korean scene. He might be from Korea but he lives in Germany, plays on a foreign team and has never played in the GSL. This debate has run its course. Stephano's record in 2012 vs Koreans who actually playing in GSL speaks for itself. The debate has not run it's course but possibly you're arguments have. You have just selectively ignored those Korean results that weaken your argument. Why ignore the Zenio result this weekend? Why ignore the Real result? Why ignore the Blizzard Cup results? Why ignore the MMA result? All these results are part of the data-set and cannot be swept under the carpet. If you are going to have a complete list of Korean results, then make it a complete list or don't bother.
Online tournaments have zero worth for comparing player skill.
One player might have 500ms, he might be playing at 4am from a PC Bang. He might be travelling and playing from another LAN. They are entirely without merit in any serious discussion over player ability.
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On March 05 2012 07:00 Seraphone wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2012 06:46 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:40 revel8 wrote:On March 05 2012 06:33 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 06:19 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:08 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:55 Zealot Orgy wrote:On March 05 2012 05:53 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:50 Crying wrote:
Stephano could easily be Code S , if he was training in Korea,that guy is a monster guys. Just stop. Stephano's record vs top end Koreans is quite poor since ESWC. 2 messages in a row hating on Stephano, I know I shouldn't even answer, but whatever: He said he can be in codeS, he didn't say he can beat every "top end Korean" he faces. he wins under 50% of his games vs Koreans Proof ?
Stephano's record vs Korean players on LAN who actually competed in Season 1 of GSL 2012.
0-2 vs MKP
0-2 vs MC
1-4 vs Polt.
You take only LAN event, online events with $$ prizes aren't meaningful ? You disregard online events as well as events in winter 2011, I disregard HSC, it's my right as well as it's yours. See my point ? Thing is, it's your opinion vs mine, we both have "facts" to back it up, and while it's interesting to discuss it it's however tiring in the end because the same arguments are rehearsed every time. And we will never know, as Stephano will never play in GSL And it looks like Stephano is (again) going to take another EU tournament Online results are meaningless. You have no idea how much anyone is lagging or what hour of the night they're played in. It's just worthless for both sides. Stephano's record vs Koreans in full. 1-4 vs Polt 3-0 vs Puma 0-2 vs MKP 0-2 vs MC 0-2 vs Sound 0-1 vs MVP 0-1 vs MC 1-0 vs DRG 1-0 vs Hero 3-2 vs Tails 2-0 vs MKP 1-2 vs Boxer 0-2 vs TheSTC 4-0 vs Lucky 3-1 vs TheSTC 2-1 vs Inori 2-0 vs Violet 2-0 Boxer 0-2 vs Alive 0-2 vs MC In terms of series that's 10-10, in terms of games that's 25-24. Which means overall he has a 50% win rate. It's worth point out that half of his series and game wins were at IPL. If we only use games since IPL his record is 5-8. If we only use games in 2012 his record is 1-4 in series and 4-10. That's a 28% win rate vs Korean players (not all of whom were Code S/A) in 2012. You are just ignoring those results that are in favour of Stephano. You are ignoring the Blizzard Cup and pretending they are meaningless because they show Stephano can live with top level Koreans. Also you conveniently forgot that Stephano beat Real 2-0 at Assembly. So that means according to your own figures, Stephano has defeated Koreans most of the times he has played against them. No, he is not. And 2 0 vs Alive was at IPL pool play, so it's valid. Seraphone is maybe not a Stephano fan, but I think the list he gave is valid
This debate has run its course. Stephano's record in 2012 vs Koreans who actually playing in GSL speaks for itself.
And what makes 01 / 01 / 2012 such an amazing date we have to skip all results before it ? If you want to pick a start date, you should pick the one when Stephano decided to become a pro, and that's around july 2011. 2 - 1 , gg Slivko. Would be nice to see a bo war won by Stephano for the next one I think Stephano did a lot better when Koreans didn't expect his style especially vs Terran. He's still extremely good vs Protoss (although not MC but MC doesn't play like anyone else). He has barely played ZvZ vs Koreans so I can't comment on that. But a lot of Koreans played Stephano at IPL and ESWC expecting Muta/Ling/Bane and what they got was Ling/Infestor/Ultra with super fast ups. Since Koreans started stealing his build and Terran's went into games vs Stephano knowing he plays like this Stephano has struggled badly. The reason I use 2012 is because it was when Koreans started playing Stephano knowing they were playing Stephano and not a standard Zerg. Once they realised that Stephano has struggled to win at all vs Korean Terran's.
every zergs are struggling hard vs terran atm
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On March 05 2012 07:00 Seraphone wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2012 06:46 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:40 revel8 wrote:On March 05 2012 06:33 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 06:19 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:08 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:55 Zealot Orgy wrote:On March 05 2012 05:53 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:50 Crying wrote:
Stephano could easily be Code S , if he was training in Korea,that guy is a monster guys. Just stop. Stephano's record vs top end Koreans is quite poor since ESWC. 2 messages in a row hating on Stephano, I know I shouldn't even answer, but whatever: He said he can be in codeS, he didn't say he can beat every "top end Korean" he faces. he wins under 50% of his games vs Koreans Proof ?
Stephano's record vs Korean players on LAN who actually competed in Season 1 of GSL 2012.
0-2 vs MKP
0-2 vs MC
1-4 vs Polt.
You take only LAN event, online events with $$ prizes aren't meaningful ? You disregard online events as well as events in winter 2011, I disregard HSC, it's my right as well as it's yours. See my point ? Thing is, it's your opinion vs mine, we both have "facts" to back it up, and while it's interesting to discuss it it's however tiring in the end because the same arguments are rehearsed every time. And we will never know, as Stephano will never play in GSL And it looks like Stephano is (again) going to take another EU tournament Online results are meaningless. You have no idea how much anyone is lagging or what hour of the night they're played in. It's just worthless for both sides. Stephano's record vs Koreans in full. 1-4 vs Polt 3-0 vs Puma 0-2 vs MKP 0-2 vs MC 0-2 vs Sound 0-1 vs MVP 0-1 vs MC 1-0 vs DRG 1-0 vs Hero 3-2 vs Tails 2-0 vs MKP 1-2 vs Boxer 0-2 vs TheSTC 4-0 vs Lucky 3-1 vs TheSTC 2-1 vs Inori 2-0 vs Violet 2-0 Boxer 0-2 vs Alive 0-2 vs MC In terms of series that's 10-10, in terms of games that's 25-24. Which means overall he has a 50% win rate. It's worth point out that half of his series and game wins were at IPL. If we only use games since IPL his record is 5-8. If we only use games in 2012 his record is 1-4 in series and 4-10. That's a 28% win rate vs Korean players (not all of whom were Code S/A) in 2012. You are just ignoring those results that are in favour of Stephano. You are ignoring the Blizzard Cup and pretending they are meaningless because they show Stephano can live with top level Koreans. Also you conveniently forgot that Stephano beat Real 2-0 at Assembly. So that means according to your own figures, Stephano has defeated Koreans most of the times he has played against them. No, he is not. And 2 0 vs Alive was at IPL pool play, so it's valid. Seraphone is maybe not a Stephano fan, but I think the list he gave is valid
This debate has run its course. Stephano's record in 2012 vs Koreans who actually playing in GSL speaks for itself.
And what makes 01 / 01 / 2012 such an amazing date we have to skip all results before it ? If you want to pick a start date, you should pick the one when Stephano decided to become a pro, and that's around july 2011. 2 - 1 , gg Slivko. Would be nice to see a bo war won by Stephano for the next one I think Stephano did a lot better when Koreans didn't expect his style especially vs Terran. He's still extremely good vs Protoss (although not MC but MC doesn't play like anyone else). He has barely played ZvZ vs Koreans so I can't comment on that. But a lot of Koreans played Stephano at IPL and ESWC expecting Muta/Ling/Bane and what they got was Ling/Infestor/Ultra with super fast ups. Since Koreans started stealing his build and Terran's went into games vs Stephano knowing he plays like this Stephano has struggled badly. The reason I use 2012 is because it was when Koreans started playing Stephano knowing they were playing Stephano and not a standard Zerg. Once they realised that Stephano has struggled to win at all vs Korean Terran's.
Puma says otherwise! Of course you will have to now say Puma is a bad player because otherwise his 3-0 loss weakens your theory.
Oh and you forgot a defeat for TSL_MyWay/Hyun off your 'complete list' too. Strange that.
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On March 05 2012 07:02 Sea_aeS wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2012 07:00 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 06:46 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:40 revel8 wrote:On March 05 2012 06:33 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 06:19 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:08 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:55 Zealot Orgy wrote:On March 05 2012 05:53 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:50 Crying wrote:
Stephano could easily be Code S , if he was training in Korea,that guy is a monster guys. Just stop. Stephano's record vs top end Koreans is quite poor since ESWC. 2 messages in a row hating on Stephano, I know I shouldn't even answer, but whatever: He said he can be in codeS, he didn't say he can beat every "top end Korean" he faces. he wins under 50% of his games vs Koreans Proof ?
Stephano's record vs Korean players on LAN who actually competed in Season 1 of GSL 2012.
0-2 vs MKP
0-2 vs MC
1-4 vs Polt.
You take only LAN event, online events with $$ prizes aren't meaningful ? You disregard online events as well as events in winter 2011, I disregard HSC, it's my right as well as it's yours. See my point ? Thing is, it's your opinion vs mine, we both have "facts" to back it up, and while it's interesting to discuss it it's however tiring in the end because the same arguments are rehearsed every time. And we will never know, as Stephano will never play in GSL And it looks like Stephano is (again) going to take another EU tournament Online results are meaningless. You have no idea how much anyone is lagging or what hour of the night they're played in. It's just worthless for both sides. Stephano's record vs Koreans in full. 1-4 vs Polt 3-0 vs Puma 0-2 vs MKP 0-2 vs MC 0-2 vs Sound 0-1 vs MVP 0-1 vs MC 1-0 vs DRG 1-0 vs Hero 3-2 vs Tails 2-0 vs MKP 1-2 vs Boxer 0-2 vs TheSTC 4-0 vs Lucky 3-1 vs TheSTC 2-1 vs Inori 2-0 vs Violet 2-0 Boxer 0-2 vs Alive 0-2 vs MC In terms of series that's 10-10, in terms of games that's 25-24. Which means overall he has a 50% win rate. It's worth point out that half of his series and game wins were at IPL. If we only use games since IPL his record is 5-8. If we only use games in 2012 his record is 1-4 in series and 4-10. That's a 28% win rate vs Korean players (not all of whom were Code S/A) in 2012. You are just ignoring those results that are in favour of Stephano. You are ignoring the Blizzard Cup and pretending they are meaningless because they show Stephano can live with top level Koreans. Also you conveniently forgot that Stephano beat Real 2-0 at Assembly. So that means according to your own figures, Stephano has defeated Koreans most of the times he has played against them. No, he is not. And 2 0 vs Alive was at IPL pool play, so it's valid. Seraphone is maybe not a Stephano fan, but I think the list he gave is valid
This debate has run its course. Stephano's record in 2012 vs Koreans who actually playing in GSL speaks for itself.
And what makes 01 / 01 / 2012 such an amazing date we have to skip all results before it ? If you want to pick a start date, you should pick the one when Stephano decided to become a pro, and that's around july 2011. 2 - 1 , gg Slivko. Would be nice to see a bo war won by Stephano for the next one I think Stephano did a lot better when Koreans didn't expect his style especially vs Terran. He's still extremely good vs Protoss (although not MC but MC doesn't play like anyone else). He has barely played ZvZ vs Koreans so I can't comment on that. But a lot of Koreans played Stephano at IPL and ESWC expecting Muta/Ling/Bane and what they got was Ling/Infestor/Ultra with super fast ups. Since Koreans started stealing his build and Terran's went into games vs Stephano knowing he plays like this Stephano has struggled badly. The reason I use 2012 is because it was when Koreans started playing Stephano knowing they were playing Stephano and not a standard Zerg. Once they realised that Stephano has struggled to win at all vs Korean Terran's. I agree with your comment but still Stephano is a great player, id put him top 10-15...
Stephano is definitely still a really good player (the best outside of Korea) but I have major issues with people saying he can make Code S easy.
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On March 05 2012 07:03 Seraphone wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2012 06:55 revel8 wrote:On March 05 2012 06:43 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 06:40 revel8 wrote:On March 05 2012 06:33 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 06:19 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:08 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:55 Zealot Orgy wrote:On March 05 2012 05:53 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:50 Crying wrote:
Stephano could easily be Code S , if he was training in Korea,that guy is a monster guys. Just stop. Stephano's record vs top end Koreans is quite poor since ESWC. 2 messages in a row hating on Stephano, I know I shouldn't even answer, but whatever: He said he can be in codeS, he didn't say he can beat every "top end Korean" he faces. he wins under 50% of his games vs Koreans Proof ?
Stephano's record vs Korean players on LAN who actually competed in Season 1 of GSL 2012.
0-2 vs MKP
0-2 vs MC
1-4 vs Polt.
You take only LAN event, online events with $$ prizes aren't meaningful ? You disregard online events as well as events in winter 2011, I disregard HSC, it's my right as well as it's yours. See my point ? Thing is, it's your opinion vs mine, we both have "facts" to back it up, and while it's interesting to discuss it it's however tiring in the end because the same arguments are rehearsed every time. And we will never know, as Stephano will never play in GSL And it looks like Stephano is (again) going to take another EU tournament Online results are meaningless. You have no idea how much anyone is lagging or what hour of the night they're played in. It's just worthless for both sides. Stephano's record vs Koreans in full. 1-4 vs Polt 3-0 vs Puma 0-2 vs MKP 0-2 vs MC 0-2 vs Sound 0-1 vs MVP 0-1 vs MC 1-0 vs DRG 1-0 vs Hero 3-2 vs Tails 2-0 vs MKP 1-2 vs Boxer 0-2 vs TheSTC 4-0 vs Lucky 3-1 vs TheSTC 2-1 vs Inori 2-0 vs Violet 2-0 Boxer 0-2 vs Alive 0-2 vs MC In terms of series that's 10-10, in terms of games that's 25-24. Which means overall he has a 50% win rate. It's worth point out that half of his series and game wins were at IPL. If we only use games since IPL his record is 5-8. If we only use games in 2012 his record is 1-4 in series and 4-10. That's a 28% win rate vs Korean players (not all of whom were Code S/A) in 2012. You are just ignoring those results that are in favour of Stephano. You are ignoring the Blizzard Cup and pretending they are meaningless because they show Stephano can live with top level Koreans. Also you conveniently forgot that Stephano beat Real 2-0 at Assembly. So that means according to your own figures, Stephano has defeated Koreans most of the times he has played against them. Real is not a representative of the Korean scene. He might be from Korea but he lives in Germany, plays on a foreign team and has never played in the GSL. This debate has run its course. Stephano's record in 2012 vs Koreans who actually playing in GSL speaks for itself. The debate has not run it's course but possibly you're arguments have. You have just selectively ignored those Korean results that weaken your argument. Why ignore the Zenio result this weekend? Why ignore the Real result? Why ignore the Blizzard Cup results? Why ignore the MMA result? All these results are part of the data-set and cannot be swept under the carpet. If you are going to have a complete list of Korean results, then make it a complete list or don't bother. Online tournaments have zero worth for comparing player skill. One player might have 500ms, he might be playing at 4am from a PC Bang. He might be travelling and playing from another LAN. They are entirely without merit in any serious discussion over player ability. lol you are amusing ... keep it up
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On March 05 2012 07:03 JohnMatrix wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2012 07:00 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 06:46 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:40 revel8 wrote:On March 05 2012 06:33 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 06:19 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:08 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:55 Zealot Orgy wrote:On March 05 2012 05:53 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:50 Crying wrote:
Stephano could easily be Code S , if he was training in Korea,that guy is a monster guys. Just stop. Stephano's record vs top end Koreans is quite poor since ESWC. 2 messages in a row hating on Stephano, I know I shouldn't even answer, but whatever: He said he can be in codeS, he didn't say he can beat every "top end Korean" he faces. he wins under 50% of his games vs Koreans Proof ?
Stephano's record vs Korean players on LAN who actually competed in Season 1 of GSL 2012.
0-2 vs MKP
0-2 vs MC
1-4 vs Polt.
You take only LAN event, online events with $$ prizes aren't meaningful ? You disregard online events as well as events in winter 2011, I disregard HSC, it's my right as well as it's yours. See my point ? Thing is, it's your opinion vs mine, we both have "facts" to back it up, and while it's interesting to discuss it it's however tiring in the end because the same arguments are rehearsed every time. And we will never know, as Stephano will never play in GSL And it looks like Stephano is (again) going to take another EU tournament Online results are meaningless. You have no idea how much anyone is lagging or what hour of the night they're played in. It's just worthless for both sides. Stephano's record vs Koreans in full. 1-4 vs Polt 3-0 vs Puma 0-2 vs MKP 0-2 vs MC 0-2 vs Sound 0-1 vs MVP 0-1 vs MC 1-0 vs DRG 1-0 vs Hero 3-2 vs Tails 2-0 vs MKP 1-2 vs Boxer 0-2 vs TheSTC 4-0 vs Lucky 3-1 vs TheSTC 2-1 vs Inori 2-0 vs Violet 2-0 Boxer 0-2 vs Alive 0-2 vs MC In terms of series that's 10-10, in terms of games that's 25-24. Which means overall he has a 50% win rate. It's worth point out that half of his series and game wins were at IPL. If we only use games since IPL his record is 5-8. If we only use games in 2012 his record is 1-4 in series and 4-10. That's a 28% win rate vs Korean players (not all of whom were Code S/A) in 2012. You are just ignoring those results that are in favour of Stephano. You are ignoring the Blizzard Cup and pretending they are meaningless because they show Stephano can live with top level Koreans. Also you conveniently forgot that Stephano beat Real 2-0 at Assembly. So that means according to your own figures, Stephano has defeated Koreans most of the times he has played against them. No, he is not. And 2 0 vs Alive was at IPL pool play, so it's valid. Seraphone is maybe not a Stephano fan, but I think the list he gave is valid
This debate has run its course. Stephano's record in 2012 vs Koreans who actually playing in GSL speaks for itself.
And what makes 01 / 01 / 2012 such an amazing date we have to skip all results before it ? If you want to pick a start date, you should pick the one when Stephano decided to become a pro, and that's around july 2011. 2 - 1 , gg Slivko. Would be nice to see a bo war won by Stephano for the next one I think Stephano did a lot better when Koreans didn't expect his style especially vs Terran. He's still extremely good vs Protoss (although not MC but MC doesn't play like anyone else). He has barely played ZvZ vs Koreans so I can't comment on that. But a lot of Koreans played Stephano at IPL and ESWC expecting Muta/Ling/Bane and what they got was Ling/Infestor/Ultra with super fast ups. Since Koreans started stealing his build and Terran's went into games vs Stephano knowing he plays like this Stephano has struggled badly. The reason I use 2012 is because it was when Koreans started playing Stephano knowing they were playing Stephano and not a standard Zerg. Once they realised that Stephano has struggled to win at all vs Korean Terran's. every zergs are struggling hard vs terran atm
this thread keeps getting better :D
SLIVKO SHOW THEM STEPHANO IS MORTAL!
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On March 05 2012 07:00 Seraphone wrote:Show nested quote +On March 05 2012 06:46 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:40 revel8 wrote:On March 05 2012 06:33 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 06:19 Ylrahc wrote:On March 05 2012 06:08 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:55 Zealot Orgy wrote:On March 05 2012 05:53 Seraphone wrote:On March 05 2012 05:50 Crying wrote:
Stephano could easily be Code S , if he was training in Korea,that guy is a monster guys. Just stop. Stephano's record vs top end Koreans is quite poor since ESWC. 2 messages in a row hating on Stephano, I know I shouldn't even answer, but whatever: He said he can be in codeS, he didn't say he can beat every "top end Korean" he faces. he wins under 50% of his games vs Koreans Proof ?
Stephano's record vs Korean players on LAN who actually competed in Season 1 of GSL 2012.
0-2 vs MKP
0-2 vs MC
1-4 vs Polt.
You take only LAN event, online events with $$ prizes aren't meaningful ? You disregard online events as well as events in winter 2011, I disregard HSC, it's my right as well as it's yours. See my point ? Thing is, it's your opinion vs mine, we both have "facts" to back it up, and while it's interesting to discuss it it's however tiring in the end because the same arguments are rehearsed every time. And we will never know, as Stephano will never play in GSL And it looks like Stephano is (again) going to take another EU tournament Online results are meaningless. You have no idea how much anyone is lagging or what hour of the night they're played in. It's just worthless for both sides. Stephano's record vs Koreans in full. 1-4 vs Polt 3-0 vs Puma 0-2 vs MKP 0-2 vs MC 0-2 vs Sound 0-1 vs MVP 0-1 vs MC 1-0 vs DRG 1-0 vs Hero 3-2 vs Tails 2-0 vs MKP 1-2 vs Boxer 0-2 vs TheSTC 4-0 vs Lucky 3-1 vs TheSTC 2-1 vs Inori 2-0 vs Violet 2-0 Boxer 0-2 vs Alive 0-2 vs MC In terms of series that's 10-10, in terms of games that's 25-24. Which means overall he has a 50% win rate. It's worth point out that half of his series and game wins were at IPL. If we only use games since IPL his record is 5-8. If we only use games in 2012 his record is 1-4 in series and 4-10. That's a 28% win rate vs Korean players (not all of whom were Code S/A) in 2012. You are just ignoring those results that are in favour of Stephano. You are ignoring the Blizzard Cup and pretending they are meaningless because they show Stephano can live with top level Koreans. Also you conveniently forgot that Stephano beat Real 2-0 at Assembly. So that means according to your own figures, Stephano has defeated Koreans most of the times he has played against them. No, he is not. And 2 0 vs Alive was at IPL pool play, so it's valid. Seraphone is maybe not a Stephano fan, but I think the list he gave is valid
This debate has run its course. Stephano's record in 2012 vs Koreans who actually playing in GSL speaks for itself.
And what makes 01 / 01 / 2012 such an amazing date we have to skip all results before it ? If you want to pick a start date, you should pick the one when Stephano decided to become a pro, and that's around july 2011. 2 - 1 , gg Slivko. Would be nice to see a bo war won by Stephano for the next one I think Stephano did a lot better when Koreans didn't expect his style especially vs Terran. He's still extremely good vs Protoss (although not MC but MC doesn't play like anyone else). He has barely played ZvZ vs Koreans so I can't comment on that. But a lot of Koreans played Stephano at IPL and ESWC expecting Muta/Ling/Bane and what they got was Ling/Infestor/Ultra with super fast ups. Since Koreans started stealing his build and Terran's went into games vs Stephano knowing he plays like this Stephano has struggled badly. The reason I use 2012 is because it was when Koreans started playing Stephano knowing they were playing Stephano and not a standard Zerg. Once they realised that Stephano has struggled to win at all vs Korean Terran's.
Yeah, MKP at ESWC who knew what was coming, and Puma at Assembly do agree with you Very few korean terrans give him a hard time, not many, maybe 5 ot 6, can do what Polt did at Assembly. 4 1 doesn't reflect how close and tense the game were, 2 or 3 of these games could have been won by Stephano had he better endgame vs Terran. But well, he is no DRG
On topic, I really hate the no-baneling style from Stephano, when he makes it work it looks brillant, but you can't make one SINGLE micro error or you're done. And half of the time, the error comes :s
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EPT
