|
699 Posts
Monday, Nov 28 2:00am GMT (GMT+00:00)
EU: Monday, Nov 28 6:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00)
Finals Bracket Seed #16 Playoff
HON Week 7 Match 4
Reason Gaming vs Team EZ
Time: 8:05PM PST (GMT -8)
Keep up to date with NASLtv by following us on your favorite Social media websites!![[image loading]](http://www.cmg.org/images/facebook-icon.png) ![[image loading]](http://www.cmg.org/images/twitter-icon.png) ![[image loading]](http://www.journeyrecoverycenters.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/YouTubeIcon40x40.png)
|
|
|
Go Darkforce! Go darkforce! 
|
HwangSin, so he can go to the finals and cheese Hero out in the first round.
Would be hilarious.
|
Rain is really the only player out of these four that deserves to go.
|
On November 28 2011 06:30 Deindar wrote:
Rain is really the only player out of these four that deserves to go.
Darkforce participated in the last NASL finals by winning against sjow and naniwa,won against alive (in the finals) and only lost against sen in very close matches who won bronze.
im sure he deserves another chance
so id say both would deserve it
|
Winner of Darkforce/Rain takes this.
|
35 muta can beat his protoss army =/
|
|
|
Hwangsin's crisis management didn't seem to be all that sharp during that game. Well executed by Moonglade.
|
Lets gooo rain, I want to see you get above 3 bases man!
|
Darn i wanted moonglade to take this, oh well GOGOGOGO RAIN!
|
Did Gretorp just say that he didn't like Dual Sight for Zerg in ZvT? Seriously?
|
German armed forces commercials on every stream nowadays... wtf
Stupid propaganda. What a joke... the young gaming community is their "intended audience"
cut it!
|
We are seeing a return to 1~2 base timings/all ins.... IN ALL tounaments and ALL races... it is terrible!
MLG, IPL, DH, NASL...... Zerg 1 or 2 base roach busts against protoss, 2 base deathball timings for protoss, 2 rax, or 2 fact, or 2 starports all ins from terran.... it sucks, really.
|
On November 28 2011 12:15 Jotoco wrote:
We are seeing a return to 1~2 base timings/all ins.... IN ALL tounaments and ALL races... it is terrible!
MLG, IPL, DH, NASL...... Zerg 1 or 2 base roach busts against protoss, 2 base deathball timings for protoss, 2 rax, or 2 fact, or 2 starports all ins from terran.... it sucks, really.
Thats how the game evolves. People were getting greedier and greedier until the point where you see a lot of CC/Nexus first now.
|
Australia8532 Posts
On November 28 2011 11:55 1Eris1 wrote:
Lets gooo rain, I want to see you get above 3 bases man!
I suppose not for Game 2 hehe :p
|
|
|
On November 28 2011 12:20 bkrow wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2011 11:55 1Eris1 wrote:
Lets gooo rain, I want to see you get above 3 bases man! I suppose not for Game 2 hehe :p
We have at least 2 more games man, it could happen!
|
On November 28 2011 12:19 00Visor wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2011 12:15 Jotoco wrote:
We are seeing a return to 1~2 base timings/all ins.... IN ALL tounaments and ALL races... it is terrible!
MLG, IPL, DH, NASL...... Zerg 1 or 2 base roach busts against protoss, 2 base deathball timings for protoss, 2 rax, or 2 fact, or 2 starports all ins from terran.... it sucks, really. Thats how the game evolves. People were getting greedier and greedier until the point where you see a lot of CC/Nexus first now.
Yeah... but I think I will give the game a few months before I come back to watching any of it. If I'm lucky the play will not be SO crappy when I'm back and be back to watchable format.
I think it doesn't really have anything to do with greedy play. I think the game balance is off. Not RACE balance, but STRATEGY balance, where timing and all-ins are stronger than macro games.
|
Australia8532 Posts
Totally surprised to see HwangSin all in - i really don't expect this kind of play from him.
Well held Rain!
|
more all ins...
*Sigh*
Well... I will probably just go to sleep now
|
So Rain won I take it? Or am I just taking that the wrong way?
|
This whole night is one giant cripple fight.
|
Game 2 was hilariously bad.
|
That last game was painful to watch. Gogo Rain!
|
"And Rain is now only mining with 2 scv's and a mule"
Gretorp: "Standard"
ROFL!!!!
Oh Gretorp, you made me shake my head when you exclaimed that the natural command center wasn't being lifted when it was only being attacked by sentries and stalkers and already lower than half health, but that above comment came out so fast and cool.
|
On November 28 2011 12:47 Chrian wrote:
This whole night is one giant cripple fight.
QFT
|
I just noticed the nasl final is still a signle elimination tourney ... thats pretty sad, i thought they learned that we want more games this time  , i hope euro/kor won't be too pissed to loose in 15min
|
United States15275 Posts
Rain loses because he didn't place a supply depot in the right place.
|
Nooooooooooooooooo rainnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn
That was a cool build by Hwangsin though, I gotta say
|
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
Fucking brilliant by HwangSin
|
Germany442 Posts
Omg, HwangSin made it.....
|
Hwangsin showing that Protoss all-ins are still alive and strong. 
That being said, the last one had a lot of style in it. GG Hwangsin.
|
On November 28 2011 12:58 mark05 wrote:I just noticed the nasl final is still a signle elimination tourney ... thats pretty sad, i thought they learned that we want more games this time , i hope euro/kor won't be too pissed to loose in 15min
At least it's a Bo5 this time around instead of a Bo3. So make that 30 min.
Edit: Hwangsin gonna get paid!
|
Hwangsin officially gained no fans.
Too bad Rain, you are definitely the stronger player imho. :/
At least you'll never make that mistake again... lol
|
I don't know about this build, it seems hard countered by Terran building a supply depot over there.
|
On November 28 2011 13:00 SwizzY wrote:
Hwangsin officially gained no fans.
Too bad Rain, you are definitely the stronger player imho. :/
At least you'll never make that mistake again... lol
o_o;; the stronger player on the day is the one that wins, dude. It doesn't matter if they do it by cheesing or macroing..
|
Well Hwangsin, grats on winning! Now you have to play HerO. gl hf.
|
Pretty cheesy by Hwangsin, but nicely executed nonetheless... now lets see if all-ins work against HerO... x)
|
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
On November 28 2011 13:02 tgun wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2011 13:00 SwizzY wrote:
Hwangsin officially gained no fans.
Too bad Rain, you are definitely the stronger player imho. :/
At least you'll never make that mistake again... lol o_o;; the stronger player on the day is the one that wins, dude. It doesn't matter if they do it by cheesing or macroing..
I was a fan of the Warp Prism + sentry ff on the ramp, so call me a fan for a brief moment. So SwizzY is wrong
And that wasn't cheese. Nor do I call one base plays all in. You can always expand if you are able to do enough damage. All in = pull scvs/drones/probes
|
If HwangSin manages to cheese HerO out of the finals, this website will erupt.
|
On November 28 2011 13:04 lichter wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2011 13:02 tgun wrote:On November 28 2011 13:00 SwizzY wrote:
Hwangsin officially gained no fans.
Too bad Rain, you are definitely the stronger player imho. :/
At least you'll never make that mistake again... lol o_o;; the stronger player on the day is the one that wins, dude. It doesn't matter if they do it by cheesing or macroing.. I was a fan of the Warp Prism + sentry ff on the ramp, so call me a fan for a brief moment. So SwizzY is wrong And that wasn't cheese. Nor do I call one base plays all in. You can always expand if you are able to do enough damage. All in = pull scvs/drones/probes
You won't be welcome in livereport threads if you keep using logic! 
I think the reason most people call it cheese/allin is because it _has_ to do damage, but at the same time, people don't understand that attempting to drop about ~70% of your army (game 2), leaving very little to defend is also as cheesy, as say, a proxy gate.
|
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
On November 28 2011 13:06 tgun wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2011 13:04 lichter wrote:On November 28 2011 13:02 tgun wrote:On November 28 2011 13:00 SwizzY wrote:
Hwangsin officially gained no fans.
Too bad Rain, you are definitely the stronger player imho. :/
At least you'll never make that mistake again... lol o_o;; the stronger player on the day is the one that wins, dude. It doesn't matter if they do it by cheesing or macroing.. I was a fan of the Warp Prism + sentry ff on the ramp, so call me a fan for a brief moment. So SwizzY is wrong And that wasn't cheese. Nor do I call one base plays all in. You can always expand if you are able to do enough damage. All in = pull scvs/drones/probes You won't be welcome in livereport threads if you keep using logic! I think the reason most people call it cheese/allin is because it _has_ to do damage, but at the same time, people don't understand that attempting to drop about ~70% of your army (game 2), leaving very little to defend is also as cheesy, as say, a proxy gate.
Or they call it cheesy because Rain lost -____- ''
When Protoss and Terran do one base pressure (into an eventual expend) vs Zerg who FEs, it is okay (even standard), but when they do it against each other it is cheese? Come on.
Also: <3 tgun
|
Wow, at least 1 protoss in the semi-finals.
Let's not villify a player who uses "cheese". Cheese is a viable strategy in terms of mindgames and metagames, etc. Boxer, oov, July, Flash all have used cheese to great effect, because it works.
Congrats Hwangsin!
|
+ Show Spoiler +On November 28 2011 13:06 tgun wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2011 13:04 lichter wrote:On November 28 2011 13:02 tgun wrote:On November 28 2011 13:00 SwizzY wrote:
Hwangsin officially gained no fans.
Too bad Rain, you are definitely the stronger player imho. :/
At least you'll never make that mistake again... lol o_o;; the stronger player on the day is the one that wins, dude. It doesn't matter if they do it by cheesing or macroing.. I was a fan of the Warp Prism + sentry ff on the ramp, so call me a fan for a brief moment. So SwizzY is wrong And that wasn't cheese. Nor do I call one base plays all in. You can always expand if you are able to do enough damage. All in = pull scvs/drones/probes You won't be welcome in livereport threads if you keep using logic! I think the reason most people call it cheese/allin is because it _has_ to do damage, but at the same time, people don't understand that attempting to drop about ~70% of your army (game 2), leaving very little to defend is also as cheesy, as say, a proxy gate.
I feel bad that i'm lumped with all of those mindless blahblah OP/cheese chanters.
I didn't mean it like that, just saying, if Rain had even one supply depot on that ridge (which Hwangsin did not scout at all), Rain would have demolished the attack or at least repelled it.
Keep in mind that Hwangsin went immortal first, then continued to pump immortals then a warp prism. I don't think he got an observer at all.
It was a bold play that shouldn't have worked. Which is what I mean when I say that Rain definitely won't make that mistake again. Ever. Hwangsin's build was pretty crisp, if he denied the SCV scout he could've kept Rain in the dark enough to storm the front. But again, like I said, luck played a huge factor in that ending, and I would like to see someone try to argue otherwise.
All respect due to winner. But he has not won me as a fan with ballsyreckless play.
|
*sigh* Oh, mOOnGLaDe...
|
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
On November 28 2011 13:51 SwizzY wrote:I feel bad that i'm lumped with all of those mindless blahblah OP/cheese chanters. I didn't mean it like that, just saying, if Rain had even one supply depot on that ridge (which Hwangsin did not scout at all), Rain would have demolished the attack or at least repelled it. Keep in mind that Hwangsin went immortal first, then continued to pump immortals then a warp prism. I don't think he got an observer at all. It was a bold play that shouldn't have worked. Which is what I mean when I say that Rain definitely won't make that mistake again. Ever. Hwangsin's build was pretty crisp, if he denied the SCV scout he could've kept Rain in the dark enough to storm the front. But again, like I said, luck played a huge factor in that ending, and I would like to see someone try to argue otherwise. All respect due to winner. But he has not won me as a fan with ballsyreckless play.
I agree that it was crazy and depended a lot on his opponent having unfortunate depot placement. But it worked. The build order was also a bit weird and very bold (immortal first, lol)--had Rain not gone for an FE he would have killed HwangSin straight up, but these hypothetical situations don't matter.
It is weird, "shouldn't have worked!" strategies that make the game so exciting. I'd stop watching this game if every game played out the same way, with the same standard builds each and every time. Actually, maybe that's what a lot of players expect (standard) and the reason why Rain could never have anticipated what HwangSin was planning. I do agree that in many cases his plan would have failed, but it didn't. It was lucky, but it was pretty great.
So yeah, crazy build that got lucky, but that doesn't make it cheese or an all-in (it could have been though, if he had pulled probes or if the first attack failed and he continued attacking instead of expending etcetcetc).
|
On November 28 2011 13:04 lichter wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2011 13:02 tgun wrote:On November 28 2011 13:00 SwizzY wrote:
Hwangsin officially gained no fans.
Too bad Rain, you are definitely the stronger player imho. :/
At least you'll never make that mistake again... lol o_o;; the stronger player on the day is the one that wins, dude. It doesn't matter if they do it by cheesing or macroing.. I was a fan of the Warp Prism + sentry ff on the ramp, so call me a fan for a brief moment. So SwizzY is wrong And that wasn't cheese. Nor do I call one base plays all in. You can always expand if you are able to do enough damage. All in = pull scvs/drones/probes
Actually, That is exactly what defines an all-in. A strategy which you cannot transition out of unless you do crippling damage. It does not mean you literally bring all of your workers. An example, 4gate is all-in vs Terran and Zerg because you stop producing workers, whilst your opponent continues to, and you have no tech beyond warp-gate. If the 4gate fails to do economic damage, or fails to win the game outright, you will be far enough behind that the game will likely be over after a follow-up counter attack.
Cheese is an early game aggression strategy which relies on being unscouted to succeed.
|
Congrats to HwangSin, one thing I don't think everyone knows is that Hwang and Rain are very good friends, that practice together quite a bit. They really weren't looking forward to playing eachother in this. <3 Rain and HwangSin fighting! Can't wait to be hanging out again in a few days :D
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/SGnmu.png)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/2335.jpg)
vs ![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/1602.jpg)
HwangSin < Antiga Shipyard > 
mOOnGLaDe![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/1957.jpg)
vs ![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/1698.jpg)
