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On March 03 2011 18:46 Angelbelow wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2011 18:43 ChApFoU wrote:On March 03 2011 18:40 Angelbelow wrote:
YES it was a bad engagement but TLO just explained it perfectly. Protoss on 3base is incredibly tough to play against. His chances of winning would still have been better if he choose not to attack rather than charging a collossi, sentry, stalker army in an alley with no air support. Maybe he thought Squirtle would have only one Collossus by the time. Absolutely false. Squirtle would have destroyed his main by abusing that back way. Ive seen Incontrol do it over and over on his stream. Its pretty rough for Zerg. IdrA was already behind after his roach bust got scouted. Squirtles army was already pretty scary too. If you dont believe me at least trust what TLO has to say. He summed it up perfectly.
It's always better to wait in your main with an arc as well as sunken spore than to go into a sure loss fight obviously.
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Even if he can't let toss have a third up there were really no reason to pick that fight there. His spire was on his way and it will take a while before the 3rd kicks in, so he could either flank with corruptors, or double expand himself and keep defending.
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On March 03 2011 18:44 StUfF wrote:
Anyone having issues with the IEM streams?
I'm getting disconnected/frozen images very often but it was very smooth the last two days.
Try to update your flash player. It worked for me.
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Russian Federation1849 Posts
I am glad that Squirtle advanced after all the yesterday's insane tiebreakers.
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On March 03 2011 18:45 Leetley wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2011 18:39 Na_Dann_Ma_GoGo wrote:
People don't understand, the Protoss who was already somewhat ahead in economy would've easily won the game with his 3rd up inbetween their bases and constant Collossi harass.
But then again, people don't understand hehe ;P Idra had 3rd base coming up and that engagement was just a terrible decision. He still had a change to win the game if he wouldn't have attacked there. Basically Idra just trashed everything.
Yea, so he should just let Squirtle get his third up, which is right next to Idra's main and allow him to slowly creep up with his army and slowly destroy Idra's base?
I'm pretty sure Idra knows what he's doing and the fact he committed to the engagement means that he had to prevent the third from going up.
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On March 03 2011 18:45 Leetley wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2011 18:39 Na_Dann_Ma_GoGo wrote:
People don't understand, the Protoss who was already somewhat ahead in economy would've easily won the game with his 3rd up inbetween their bases and constant Collossi harass.
But then again, people don't understand hehe ;P Idra had 3rd base coming up and that engagement was just a terrible decision. He still had a change to win the game if he wouldn't have attacked there. Basically Idra just trashed everything.
Dude 3 base vs 3 base when you're already in a terrible situation is a joke.
Yes, he could've waited with this attack. Sure why not? Well because he had even less of a chance against Squirtle after another 5mins.
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Time to watch JinrO in GSL, coming up in a few mins
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Jinro about to play in GSL for anyone who cares or may have forgotten about it.
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On March 03 2011 18:43 JoeSchmoe wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2011 18:41 Spectorials wrote:
The decision was:
- Lose now by not attacking and letting toss get 3 bases (none of which could be attacked).
- Try to kill the toss army while the Colossus count is low and catch him out while he is moving out.
I think he made the right decision to move down.
The reason why he lost is because he scouted that late and also his spire was not done... ... you are going to catch colossus w/sentries in a narrow passage without corrupters? please show me the replays
HI
Want to re-read and comment on the whole post?
He had 2 decisions to make: either attack and MAYBE have a chance of wittling down the Toss force OR he could not attack and let the Toss get a 3rd base which could not be attacked from that point forward in the game.
Never at any point did I say he could have a good chance of winning the fight. Idra is not dumb, the reason for attacking is because he knows it would have been close to impossible (and even MORE improbable) to win if the Toss had his 3rd base up.
The battle has to be analyzed in context of the game dude. Not just "oh no thats a bad engagement". Ofc its a bad engagement but it was a better choice than letting the Toss get a 3rd base.
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Event 2 stream is counterstrike for me - is my player not working correctly or?
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On March 03 2011 18:47 Longshank wrote:
You'd rather have a situation which is difficult to win than one that is impossible. That was Idra's stubborn 'fuck it all' mindset showing.
How can you not god damn see this?
IdrA had his army down there. If he LEFT, he would NEVER get down there again because of force field. If he ALLOWED that base to get running with cannons, 3 base protoss getting upgrades, vs 2 base zerg (he would lose his main 100%), it was over.
He had to kill the nexus.
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Time for Morrow to roll on! Which stream is he on though?
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On March 03 2011 18:44 idonthinksobro wrote:
all squirtle can do is abuse stuff, he didnt play a single straight up macro game ever.
Well i think the last attack from idra was OK, if that third bases goes up and squirtle puts cannons there the game is over too - he didnt have a spire down? did he? so trying to engage there was probably the best thing to do - i wonder what people have said if idra just didnt engange there and died like 10 minutes later.
What Idra did really poorly is not scout that squirtle is breaking his rocks - even if a phenix killed his spotter overlord thats the most important thing to replace.
yeah squirtle is just a massive abuser. please just stop commenting.
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On March 03 2011 18:45 doihy wrote:
How come Moon is able to beat Squirtle, but IdrA can't? Hmmmmm...... Idra has to admit either, Moon is better than him, or Moon plays differently in ZvP that allows him to beat most protoss (squirtle, socke) easily.
the latter. IdrA hasn't really trained against protoss, Moon, on the other hand, has ZvP down pat.
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For people who don't know: Liquid'Jinro ro16 GSL series is starting any minute now!
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On March 03 2011 18:49 philly5man wrote:
Event 2 stream is counterstrike for me - is my player not working correctly or?
No, it's ok. Next SC2 game will be in around an hour. 
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I will pray for not having a PvP finals
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On March 03 2011 18:49 philly5man wrote:
Event 2 stream is counterstrike for me - is my player not working correctly or?
Only thing going on right now. Next QF is in a bit on the main stage (so stream 1).
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On March 03 2011 18:44 StUfF wrote:
Anyone having issues with the IEM streams?
I'm getting disconnected/frozen images very often but it was very smooth the last two days.
Yea I live in Australia aswell and I'm also getting extreme lag/frozen screen issues. Makes it basically unwatchable for me.
I'm not happy since I want to watch moonglade play so badly haha 
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On March 03 2011 18:44 Malinor wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2011 18:39 Na_Dann_Ma_GoGo wrote:
People don't understand, the Protoss who was already somewhat ahead in economy would've easily won the game with his 3rd up inbetween their bases and constant Collossi harass.
But then again, people don't understand hehe ;P I believe people do understand. But even when the situation is bad, that is no reason to engage at the worst possible angle on the map. Commiting suicide (because he had to know that fight was unwinable) is not something I would do when otherwise there still might be a fighting chance later on. Squirtle still can mess up. But of course, after the failed Roach-Rush it was an uphill battle. But you are not forced to let that scotuing probe into your base, so still Idras own fault.
the roach rush wasnt failed, Idra forced cannons and killed the cyber core it was decent - normally if you go for ~5 roaches you dont expect to kill your opponent or do any damage at all.
his follow up was poor after delaying the core he should have made a lot more drones than he did - but the engagement he did was somewhat decent - waiting for voidray colossi to get cricital mass with the possibility to reeinforce with gateway units in your base basically is a bad spot.
Yeah could have dragged the game out rebuild his tech at another base and stuff but against a somewhat decent player that game is over.
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EPT
