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Hey TL, I'll try to keep it short.
I'm a Zerg and whenever I play a Terran or a Protoss, I get really scared, there are so many potentially dangerous things which I need to watch out for 4/6Gate/Blueflame/Void Ray/Banshee (just to mention a few) all of these can potentially end the game if I'm not prepared for it without really setting back my opponent.
Not scouting or not being able to do so makes me feel like I'm on the verge of dying.
I want to know what the Zergs equivalent of that? When you're playing against Zerg, what are you scared of? Where do you get killed if you don't watch out?
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The way Zerg functions there's actually much less to be scared of. It's less being scared of an attack and being scared of a really scary economy that can pump out massive amounts of units. Zerg has to live in fear because of the drone mechanic. It's just how it works.
That and mutalisk harass, I guess. Or if you play like July and randomly kill them. But don't do that.
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Mutas. Always the damn mutas.
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I'm a bad Terran and I'm gold, I am always reluctant to take a third against zerg, I always feel that they have taken the whole map and are going to overwhelm me really fast, especially on the bigger maps.
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On April 01 2011 06:48 HRSA wrote:
The way Zerg functions there's actually much less to be scared of. It's less being scared of an attack and being scared of a really scary economy that can pump out massive amounts of units. Zerg has to live in fear because of the drone mechanic. It's just how it works.
That and mutalisk harass, I guess. Or if you play like July and randomly kill them. But don't do that.
Do that, or at least know how to do it. It's a real shame when you have a significant advantage over your opponent and you could go for the kill but you don't, since you're not yet on 4 bases/65 drones/200 army. And I know what I'm talking about, happens to me all the time.
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I'd have to go with Mutas as well. They give the zerg map control and make it a headache to take additional bases (beyond your natural).
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On April 01 2011 06:54 Ahelvin wrote:Show nested quote +On April 01 2011 06:48 HRSA wrote:
The way Zerg functions there's actually much less to be scared of. It's less being scared of an attack and being scared of a really scary economy that can pump out massive amounts of units. Zerg has to live in fear because of the drone mechanic. It's just how it works.
That and mutalisk harass, I guess. Or if you play like July and randomly kill them. But don't do that. Do that, or at least know how to do it. It's a real shame when you have a significant advantage over your opponent and you could go for the kill but you don't, since you're not yet on 4 bases/65 drones/200 army. And I know what I'm talking about, happens to me all the time.
If that fails, you can't recover. That's why I say you shouldn't. Aggressive Zerg before you establish yourself is incredibly volatile, and if you lose that all in, you lose the game.
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watch july vs jinro in the gsl world champion team league. jinro was scared beyond belief.
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Something either tyler or incontrol have said on state of the game is that zerg doesn't really have a unit where they get it and then win, like if a bio ball isn't ready for your storm or you have a few collosi and your opponant doesn't have corruptors.
In terms of harassment, burrowed roaches are overlooked sometimes although their low speed can spell disaster in some situations. Mutas can deal an extremely large amount of damage to a mineral line that isn't protected properly, they are probably the "scariest" single unit zerg gets.
zerg is the most defensive race though, the really scary thing is when you let zerg do what they want for too long.
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defilers ultralisks and cracklings
not anymore.. feels bad , man
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As Protoss, I fear only about 3 or 4 things Zerg can do.
1). Produce a ton of roaches and stomp my crappy gateway (usually off 2 bases).
2). As soon as I leave my base, run 20 speedlings into my mineral line.
3). Timing attack with roach/hydra just before my colossi come out.
4). Suddenly produce a ton of mutas when I neither have blink nor Phoenixes.
Once these cease being a danger, I usually feel more confident and win.
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Runbys! Thanks Aequos. Those are really good for scariness.
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I agree with people talking about map control. With lings early game and mutas later I'm always scared to move out of my base with anything less than a full-force push against Zerg. It makes scouting and expanding diffcult.
I'm also scared of Zerg tech switches late game. First you make vikings for brolords and wipe their army, thinking you've won, but the zerg immediately remaxes with ultras and wins the game. If I get that late game vs Zerg, I've usually lost.
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Roaches - cost-effective, can deal with most ground-units.
Mutas - I better invest money into static defense or watch my mineral line getting obliterated, followed by some tech/construction building.
Everything else seems OK - not easy, mind you - but those 2 units...I'd rather not face them.
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The fact that a good Zerg can max out in under 14 minutes is enough to scare me
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On April 01 2011 06:56 HRSA wrote:Show nested quote +On April 01 2011 06:54 Ahelvin wrote:On April 01 2011 06:48 HRSA wrote:
The way Zerg functions there's actually much less to be scared of. It's less being scared of an attack and being scared of a really scary economy that can pump out massive amounts of units. Zerg has to live in fear because of the drone mechanic. It's just how it works.
That and mutalisk harass, I guess. Or if you play like July and randomly kill them. But don't do that. Do that, or at least know how to do it. It's a real shame when you have a significant advantage over your opponent and you could go for the kill but you don't, since you're not yet on 4 bases/65 drones/200 army. And I know what I'm talking about, happens to me all the time. If that fails, you can't recover. That's why I say you shouldn't. Aggressive Zerg before you establish yourself is incredibly volatile, and if you lose that all in, you lose the game.
While it's quite true, it's not always true.
Let's say you are on two base, with quite some drones, and that a Toss 4-gate you (sounds familiar, right  ?). He fails. From that, if you go on heavy macro mode off three bases, the Toss can turtle hard and wait until he's maxed to come out. But if you actually know how to pump a scary wave of unit to do significant amounts of damage you'll do for sure since he has not much army left, you can end the game right now. And even you fail, well, you still have an expansion up and running whereas he hasn't.
It's situational, but it never hurts to KNOW how to attack when you have to IMO.
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I actually think, the thing that makes Zerg really scary are counterattacks. Thats also why Terrans hate mutas so much, they just can't leave their base and as long as they are in their base Zerg doesn't have to worry about them. Also I think as Zerg its worth it trading an expo with Terran/Protoss when countering. Basiclly my argument is that you are always one base ahead of your opponent. So if they are on 2 base and you are on 3 you have about 1.5 times the income (not counting mules, its always true for gas). If your opponents attacks you and kills one of your bases and you end up countering and kill one of his, its 1 base vs 2 base and you have 2 times the income.
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As Protoss; Speedling runbys, roach timing rushes, and mutalisks. Oh god the mutalisks.
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On April 01 2011 07:05 Ahelvin wrote:Show nested quote +On April 01 2011 06:56 HRSA wrote:On April 01 2011 06:54 Ahelvin wrote:On April 01 2011 06:48 HRSA wrote:
The way Zerg functions there's actually much less to be scared of. It's less being scared of an attack and being scared of a really scary economy that can pump out massive amounts of units. Zerg has to live in fear because of the drone mechanic. It's just how it works.
That and mutalisk harass, I guess. Or if you play like July and randomly kill them. But don't do that. Do that, or at least know how to do it. It's a real shame when you have a significant advantage over your opponent and you could go for the kill but you don't, since you're not yet on 4 bases/65 drones/200 army. And I know what I'm talking about, happens to me all the time. If that fails, you can't recover. That's why I say you shouldn't. Aggressive Zerg before you establish yourself is incredibly volatile, and if you lose that all in, you lose the game. While it's quite true, it's not always true. Let's say you are on two base, with quite some drones, and that a Toss 4-gate you (sounds familiar, right ?). He fails. From that, if you go on heavy macro mode off three bases, the Toss can turtle hard and wait until he's maxed to come out. But if you actually know how to pump a scary wave of unit to do significant amounts of damage you'll do for sure since he has not much army left, you can end the game right now. And even you fail, well, you still have an expansion up and running whereas he hasn't. It's situational, but it never hurts to KNOW how to attack when you have to IMO.
In the case of a failed all in from the opponent, I'll agree with you. I misinterpreted what you said and thought you meant just at a strange interval to all in, which I feel is more like July does.
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- Map control. Zerg can get with lings and mutas to control the map. If i move out to attack or take a 3rd i fear seeing a bunch of lings counter into my natural and rape my mineral line.
- Creep. It sucks trying to stop the spread of creep and knowing the Zerg knows where your army is while on it, and fear being surrounded or flanked if you're caught out of position since Zerg is very fast on creep.
- Banelings. When you look away for 2 seconds and have no detection then look back and your 30 marines have just exploded into a pool of acid from burrowed blings its the worst feeling ever.
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EPT
