• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 12:05
CEST 18:05
KST 01:05
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Season 1 - Final Week6[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall12HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, Rogue, Classic, GuMiho0
Community News
Esports World Cup 2025 - Brackets Revealed12Weekly Cups (July 7-13): Classic continues to roll4Team TLMC #5 - Submission extension3Firefly given lifetime ban by ESIC following match-fixing investigation17$25,000 Streamerzone StarCraft Pro Series announced7
StarCraft 2
General
RSL Revival patreon money discussion thread The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings Esports World Cup 2025 - Brackets Revealed Who will win EWC 2025? Weekly Cups (July 7-13): Classic continues to roll
Tourneys
Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series $5,100+ SEL Season 2 Championship (SC: Evo) WardiTV Mondays
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 482 Wheel of Misfortune Mutation # 481 Fear and Lava Mutation # 480 Moths to the Flame Mutation # 479 Worn Out Welcome
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion Flash Announces (and Retracts) Hiatus From ASL BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Starcraft in widescreen A cwal.gg Extension - Easily keep track of anyone
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues Cosmonarchy Pro Showmatches CSL Xiamen International Invitational [BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers I am doing this better than progamers do.
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile CCLP - Command & Conquer League Project The PlayStation 5
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Segway man no more. Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Stop Killing Games - European Citizens Initiative
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 2024 - 2025 Football Thread NBA General Discussion NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Men Take Risks, Women Win Ga…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 833 users

2 vs 2 (Terran/protoss) strategy: void ray rush

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
Post a Reply
Corvuus
Profile Joined April 2010
United States9 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-05 16:28:12
May 05 2010 15:01 GMT
#1
I don't know if this is the right forum thread for this but hopefully mod and other helpful people can decide that since I have 1 part general, 1 part strategy.

Got sc2 beta from pre-ordering and played a few games with a friend and things seem fairly balanced for 1on1 but for 2on2, it can quite literally be a steamroll.

----

Only in 2on2.

You can share resources. This is deactivated for the first few minutes but basically after 5-7 minutes ish, you can send any amount of resources to each other. I was 'wtf' when i saw this just by random clicking on things to see what they did.

----

ok. edit out. I only play terran and someone mentioned chronoing working on allies to me. Gold league in 2vs2.

added a replay. The other team isn't good in this one (compared to the other ones we did this on. In the other ones, I messed up wall and other aspects but mass voids still trumped all) and we messed up several macro/micro parts throughout and could have ended it much much earlier. On average though, the end comes at around 15-19 minute mark with mass void rays + mixed terran army. My macro is usually better but since the enemy didn't scout (only 1 scan on our mid and saw nothing i think?) I got pretty lazy since scanning them was disappointing and I felt the voids could win it all so I slacked off on workers/production and didn't group up with him.

Personally, I think he shouldn't have expanded but walked over them. he also would have then had his voids in base so better players who may run in with mass voids/mutalisk would run into 10+ voids.
On a sidenote: ignore what I type . I do think void rays are much more useful than phoenix. (especially in 2vs2 context with vikings filling that role).
------------

2vs2replay

------

So here is the strategy (i can try uploading replays later).
For the sake of argument, this is ONLY on Twilight Fortress (i don't think it is that great of a map personally but the main aspect is 1 ramp for both allies).

2vs2: Terran and Protoss versus 2.

Terran plays a 1-base rushing d type strategy. Blocks the ramp early (2 supply depot, rax, 2 bunkers). You will see any early probe trying to cannon rush and any scouts sent 'late' due to size of the map will NOT make it inside (i.e. no gas, produce two bunkers/block EARLY). Terran masses marines, patrols ridge (for overlord and reapers, 3-4 marines standing on a ridge will decimate any small amount of 'early' reapers), engineering bay for some turrets around the outer ridge and mid. Basically a terran turtle with enough marines to easily defend a rush done by only 1 enemy, maybe even 2.

The terran will eventually expand to his expo, grab tanks, vikings, medivac while taking defensive tech (i.e. increase missle range on turrets, armor on building upgrade for bunker/missle turrets). The terran force is just designed to stop any early ground push for the first 15 minutes and any 'all in' air.

Protoss player doesn't build any units except a few sentries while rushing early expo and going for void rays. I.e. gateway, core, stargate and fleet beacon are essential with void rays, void ray speed upgrade + air upgrades as focus.

Terran player uses comsat 3 times on enemy (rest on muleing when possible). One on each player (placed in middle between main and their expo will let you see 'most' buildings) and one at their ramp will generally let you see 'most' of their standing army composition. If big ground push seems imminent (easy to send out one marine to mid xel naga tower, plus comsat), terran focus on tank and toss gets more sentries to just force field 'funnel' the ramp. i.e. focus into narrow channel.

With fast expo, strict teching; protoss player can mass a significant amount of void rays within 14-19 minutes (3 or so at 8-10, 10+ by 15). By 19 minute mark, toss (with multiple stargates and chrono boosting, only void rays with a few sentries) will easily have a critical mass of void rays with speed and other upgrades and end the game.

Terran player (who had severely set back economy, but can be given resources by toss at critical points) will have ONLY marines, tanks, medivacs and vikings (reactor only units, except 3-4 tanks) in standard build.

If enemy has weak point (check with scan), medivacs carry ground troops, vikings massed provide air vs air support. By 19 minute, several medivacs filled w/ marines, a few tanks and 10-12 vikings is easily do-able while also leaving behind marines in bunker/defense. energy can be used on supply depot instead of mule to amass 150+ supply army of marines/vikings/medivacs + few tanks.

Void rays walk in and easily thwack any static anti-air since they are a huge critical mass and are now 'charging'. Terran drop ship lands immediately and marines + tanks can face off vs ground army (hydras, marines) while 10+ void rays are fully charged and killing EVERYTHING including their 'counters'.

Terran army most likely wiped out first (but with reactors) can easily mass reinforcements back to 160+ supply cannonfodder army. Protoss void ray army in some cases will outright kill 1 player if not both, or significantly dent 1 player so that they can't recover.

Depending on time, army compositions, the terran player uses 1-2 tech labs for everything. tech lab on rax for marine health and stimpack, tech lab on factory for tanks and siege mode. Switch tech lab with a later starport to start massing ravens. Raven PPD (point defense) used in conjunction with void rays can negate most late game anti-void ray counters if the 1st push fails or is delayed.

Due to tight space of enemy base and confined area, mass thors (if gotten) are too slow and big to stop speedy voids from walking all over. Voids hit expo, move to main, then fly over to the other main if large ground forces survive/kill terran ground and still chase them. The critical mass of voids can easily (at max charge) pop several key buildings while kiting. Even if response is 'quick', terran army can be abandoned and void rays butter slicing through building 'deeper' in quickly and transitioning due to high speed.

I'd like to hear strategies against this and perhaps some comments on 2vs2 in general and whether people think it is 'balanced'. Personally, Void rays are the only thing i feel is 'overpowered' since a critical mass of voids rolls of EVERYTHING including their counters.

General notes from games I played: Terran is responsible for scouting/defending (1 marine at xel naga, 1 marine at their closest gold expo) while toss tech (1-2 sentries with force field are just in case on toss part. If no real push, may not even bother). Done relatively early to get energy and easily 3-4 force field casts.
Against Terran/Zerg lineup: Some tried to break the wall, some tried reaper harass. Unless terran 'all-in' reapers, they won't have enough to get past 2-3 marines patrolling terran AND toss ridge. Could throw up a 'scanning station' as terran as well. (I personally don't and I think reapers are a waste of gas). Zerg with ground troops should not be able to beat 2-3 bunkers (repairing) + marines behind the wall + sentry force fields. By the time terran gets tanks to bust the wall, (and due to distance, toss feeding me gas), terran will have siege tanks as well. In most cases, due to scouting/scan/futility of beating strong wall, both terran/zerg will go air.

At 15-19 minute mark when we show up, they generally have a mixed army of vikings, MnMnM, tanks (maybe a few banshees, all this depends on what they did early game) and zerg can have hydras, mutalisk, etc. and due to scan one time by enemy terran, 1 zerg had 12+ corrupters. Vikings+void rays wipe out the air units (12+ void and 12+vikings), terran ground was 'cover fire/cannon fodder' and due to small spacing in most enemy bases, can't surround and use the majority of their ground forces.

Against Protoss/Other lineup:
If Toss does anything other than void rays (also potentially high templars) then the game is pretty much over. Carriers, phoenix, mothership (in terms of 15-19 minutes) are ripped apart by mass voids. Stalkers don't do enough damage to be a serious threat and immortals aren't that much better.
If the toss didn't do what we did, then they won't have more void rays then us either and depending on scouting, may have mixed army.
Other (terran or zerg) will contribute the usual amount (above) but even the 'hard counters' to voids get melted.

Toss/Toss lineup: 1 toss walls, the other toss teches/void rays is possible but I think loses to Terran/Toss. If (by scouting) enemy wall is weak, we can land push with void rays at earlier 14 minute mark or they are extreme turtling, we can shift into expanding to gold/outside expo and ramp up critical mass of late game units.

Corvuus
P.S. saying 2vs2 is imbalanced is a legit comment I will accept ;P.
P.P.S. This is ONLY twilight map (1 ramp for both allies). Obviously if the bases are separate with different ramps, you can't wall and defend both. Saying the map is bad is acceptable but try to think of a strategy to beat this on this map.
P.P.P.S. Terran upgrades are building armor, missle turret range (raven ability lasts longer (PDD for the win), marine health, stim and siege tank mode. multiple reactors, 2-3 tech labs (can lift to switch if needed). Toss can give gas (in all my games we didn't need to abuse it aside from 100 gas early) if certain tech is needed earlier. This can also give illusion of thinking terran is normal build since he can build factory/starport relatively on time (more starport than factory, no gas units) so scan/scouting won't notice how far back terran is and how far 'forward' toss is.


areyoucrazy?
Excalibur_Z
Profile Joined October 2002
United States12235 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-05 15:09:08
May 05 2010 15:07 GMT
#2
Uh you can't Chrono allied buildings anymore. That was removed in one of the first patches. What league are you in?

And for every strategy you propose you need to upload replays to back it up. Read the sticky.
Moderator
Jadix
Profile Joined September 2004
United States134 Posts
May 06 2010 22:33 GMT
#3
hey its excalibur_z, i haven't been around in years, but i remember you helped with a BW strategy site i made way back when.
YoureFired
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States822 Posts
May 06 2010 23:45 GMT
#4
I think you're over complicating the strategy by having so many trivial details (i.e. have a marine at this tower, harass vikings at X expo, send void rays to take down X building).

You need to remember that no plan survives contact with the enemy and your "you will have this unit at this time and do this action" won't work in the majority of games. Trying to create a supply-by-supply strategy past around 10 minutes maximum isn't very useful for this reason.

ted cruz is the zodiac killer
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
16:00
Warm Up Cup 3
uThermal329
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
uThermal 329
mcanning 257
MindelVK 13
BRAT_OK 11
UpATreeSC 6
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 1831
EffOrt 1405
Larva 895
Stork 692
Barracks 228
Dewaltoss 119
ToSsGirL 86
Rush 58
Shinee 56
sSak 54
[ Show more ]
Aegong 43
Rock 23
GoRush 21
scan(afreeca) 18
Shine 17
Terrorterran 16
Bale 10
IntoTheRainbow 9
Hm[arnc] 5
ivOry 2
Stormgate
NightEnD19
Dota 2
Gorgc10272
singsing3210
qojqva2223
syndereN233
Counter-Strike
sgares482
flusha301
markeloff234
kRYSTAL_65
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King72
Other Games
FrodaN2235
Hui .230
KnowMe178
ArmadaUGS103
Trikslyr83
QueenE63
Skadoodle53
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick3664
BasetradeTV23
StarCraft 2
angryscii 12
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• poizon28 41
• sitaska19
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos1017
• TFBlade558
Upcoming Events
The PondCast
17h 55m
OSC
20h 55m
WardiTV European League
23h 55m
Fjant vs Babymarine
Mixu vs HiGhDrA
Gerald vs ArT
goblin vs MaNa
Jumy vs YoungYakov
Replay Cast
1d 7h
Epic.LAN
1d 19h
CranKy Ducklings
2 days
Epic.LAN
2 days
CSO Contender
3 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
3 days
Bonyth vs Sziky
Dewalt vs Hawk
Hawk vs QiaoGege
Sziky vs Dewalt
Mihu vs Bonyth
Zhanhun vs QiaoGege
QiaoGege vs Fengzi
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
[ Show More ]
Online Event
3 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
4 days
Bonyth vs Zhanhun
Dewalt vs Mihu
Hawk vs Sziky
Sziky vs QiaoGege
Mihu vs Hawk
Zhanhun vs Dewalt
Fengzi vs Bonyth
Esports World Cup
5 days
ByuN vs Astrea
Lambo vs HeRoMaRinE
Clem vs TBD
Solar vs Zoun
SHIN vs Reynor
Maru vs TriGGeR
herO vs Lancer
Cure vs ShoWTimE
Esports World Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
RSL Revival: Season 1
Murky Cup #2

Ongoing

BSL 2v2 Season 3
Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL20 Non-Korean Championship
Championship of Russia 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters

Upcoming

CSL Xiamen Invitational
CSL Xiamen Invitational: ShowMatche
2025 ACS Season 2
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
K-Championship
RSL Revival: Season 2
SEL Season 2 Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
FEL Cracov 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
Underdog Cup #2
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.