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Creating a new race for Arcade: the Hybrid? - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 Maps & Custom Games
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ArcticRaven
Profile Joined August 2011
France1406 Posts
August 21 2012 20:32 GMT
#21
If anyone wants them I have plenty of ideas for units. Also :

I think that if we were to make new races, there should be three of them, separate from the real game. They should be very similar to BW.


Why make them BWesque ?
[Govie] Wierd shit, on a 6 game AP winning streak with KOTL in the trench. I searched gandalf quotes and spammed them all game long, trenchwarfare247, whateva it takes!
dUTtrOACh
Profile Joined December 2010
Canada2339 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-21 21:25:45
August 21 2012 21:25 GMT
#22
Why would anybody even bother creating the Hybrid? We already have Zerg and Protoss. Creating a race of Zerg-Protoss is just... lazy. How about the Xel'Naga? The ancient race that this game basically revolves around. The hybrid are more of an artificially created abomination than a race. Hybrid units can simply be part of the Xel'Naga arsenal. Bam!
twitch.tv/duttroach
arkstarcraft
Profile Joined January 2012
United States6 Posts
August 21 2012 23:46 GMT
#23
On August 16 2012 12:04 i.of.the.storm wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 15 2012 06:23 arkstarcraft wrote:
Just a while ago I was playing a Brood War mod on the Arcade when I got an intriguing idea. What if there was the SC2 WE all know and loved, but with a fourth race. Specifically the Hybrids.

For a long time I have heard fans fantasizing of What a fourth race would be like in SC2. And many people Point to the Hybrid as a legitimate realization of this DreAm. However, I have not seen anyone Propose that the community build the fourth race ourselves.

I'M talking a Unique tech Tree with Unique models. New units with New models, and so on. The challenge would be long and hard. But with so many mod makers already creating FanTastic custom play experience why couldn't it be done? Conceptualizers, designers, and mod makers could band together to make it happen.

Now, I know that this is most likely just a pipe DreAm. But being as the sC community has already produced countless masterpieces, why not attempt something bigger and better than them all. A New community created SC2 race. And What better foundation than the already existing Hybrid.

Please share your thoughts on the matter!

P.S. I am not a map Maker, nor have I attempted to use the custom game Maker. I am just opening up the subject for further discussion, and perhaps even bringing this to the attention of those WhO could make it happen.


Off topic, but I like your subtle references to teams and players with the funky upper case letters. Not sure what you're going for though?


Haha, yes I noticed that after posting. I saw a little Hydra icon above the post when writing it and decided to see what it does. Apparently it makes all of your player spelling accurate. Though I did not intend for any pro players to be referred to.

It was not intentional, only a mistake.
Callynn
Profile Joined December 2010
Netherlands917 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-22 15:27:08
August 22 2012 11:26 GMT
#24
For people interested in building such a race, be warned it's probably the hardest job to get done right in the arcade right now.

For reference, see this post.

At the bottom of that post I placed my own idea of the unique core of a Hybrid race, but I'll simply post it here as well. Spoiler because it's quite a wall of text.

+ Show Spoiler [Example of a Fictional Race] +
Fictional Starcraft 2 Race
The Ihanri

Ihanri Lore

Successfully reborn within unstable but powerful, hybridized Protoss-Zerg bodies, the Ihanri (or Xel'Naga) seek to retake control over their creations and reclaim their place in the universe. Regressed and inexperienced with the recent violent nature of the Koprullu sector, the Ihanri's scientific knowledge is all that keeps them from falling apart. Although supposedly superior to any other race, the hybridized creatures that host the Ihanri have a very high degree of conflict on a genetic level. This causes their bodies to become unstable when left without the proper technological support. Consequently the Ihanri are forced to fight the other races on equal footing.

Ihanri Gameplay Theme

The theme behind the Ihanri is a biotechnological race that is held intact by supernatural technologies. They may seem to behave like a hivemind, but are individuals that use robotized servants. Instead of regenerating, their buildings deteriorate if left unsupported by the nanogrid.

The nanogrid is a field generated by the Stabilizer wherein highly advanced nanobots reside. These nanobots prevent deterioration of Ihanri buildings, slowly regenerating buildings and units of the Ihanri race at 1.5x the rate at which Zerg regenerate naturally. Without a nanogrid, buildings slowly lose health over time. Ihanri units do not need a nanogrid to survive, but a nanogrid will give them slow life regeneration. In order to construct a building, nanogrid field is required. If the field falls away, the building is destroyed (not cancelled).

To construct a building, a Creator (Ihanri worker) must move to the target nanogrid powered location and becomes protected under the building that is being made. Once the building is finished, the Creator can return to mining.
The Stabilizer is the mobile Ihanri supply provider that generates a small 5 radius nanogrid field around it when moving. The Stabilizer can also be deployed in a stationary position, extending the nanogrid field around it to up to 8 radius over time. Stabilizers provide an important economic role, as they have the ability to double the next unit production queue on any Ihanri production building.

This mechanic will make Ihanri feel slightly less aggressive and more protective, requiring proper positioning of Stabilizers both in the base as well as within offensive army positions.

Ihanri Unique Economics


Constructor
Role: Foundation building
Build time: 100 seconds
Supply provided: 4
Produces: Creators and Stabilizers
Hit points: 1750
Armor: 1
Classification: Mechanical, Structure
Abilities: Vespene Isolation, Nanobot Shell
Allows: Canvass, Splicer, Absorber
Cost: 350 minerals
Starting energy: 0
Max energy: 200
Additional info: Like all Ihanri buildings, the Constructor requires a nanogrid to be built and sustained. The Constructor has two abilities, the economical Vespene Isolation which allows the mining of gas without the use of workers and the military Nanobot Shell which can be used to keep base defense alive and even offers cheesy building attack options. Constructors also build both the worker and the supply provider (which share the same production queue).

(Ability): Vespene Isolation
Instantly absorbs 50 gas from a Absorber or 25 gas from a naked Vespene Geyser within 8 range.
Cost: 50 energy
(Ability): Nanobot Shell
Covers a target friendly building with a protective shell of nanobots, increasing its armor by 2 and regenerating 500 hit points over 15 seconds. Has infinite map range. Cannot target Deployed Stabilizers.
Cost: 50 energy

Absorber
Role: Vespene Gas Building
Build time: 45 seconds
Hit points: 800
Armor: 1
Classification: Mechanical, Structure
Cost: 75 minerals
Additional info: The Absorber allows the Constructor's Vespene Isolation ability to be double as effective and allows Creators to mine Vespene Gas. Like all gas buildings, the Absorber allows up to 3 workers for optimal gathering efficiency. Like all Ihanri buildings, the Absorber requires a nanogrid to be built and sustained.


Stabilizer
Role: Supply provider
Build time: 20 seconds
Supply provided: 8
Speed: 0.750 (1.3 with Upgrade in tier 2)
Acceleration: 1.0625
Lateral acceleration: 46.0625
Deceleration: 0
Collision radius:1
Hit points: 250
Hit point regeneration: 0.3 / sec
Armor: 0
Classification: Mechanical, Air (mobile mode) Ground (deployed mode)
Abilities: Support, Deploy/Ascend, Nanogrid Field Generator
Cost: 100 minerals
Starting energy: 0
Max energy: 200
Additional info: The Ihanri Stabilizer is a flying robot that provides a nanogrid field around it to prevent Ihanri buildings from losing health and slowly regenerating Ihanri unit health. The nanogrid field can be extended from 5 to 8 radius by landing the Stabilizer, making it vulnerable to ground attack and removing its ability to move. Stabilizers can also double a Ihanri building's production rate by using their Support ability on the building. Stabilizers are built from the Constructor and take a queue position along with the Ihanri worker, the Creator.

(Ability): Support
Adds a second production queue to target production building, allowing the next two produced units to appear from the production building simultaneously. Support range is identical to the Stabilizer's current nanogrid field radius.
Cost: 25 energy
(Ability): Deploy / Ascend
When flying, deploys the Stabilizer on the ground, extending the radius of its nanogrid field by 3 but making the Stabilizer vulnerable to ground attacks. This also increases the range of Support by 3. When landed, ascends the Stabilizer into the air, decreasing the radius of its nanogrid field by 3 but allowing the Stabilizer to move and removing its vulnerability to ground attacks. This also decreases the range of Support by 3.
Cost: 0 energy
Cooldown: 4 seconds.

Creator
Role: Basic worker
Build time: 16 seconds
Speed: 2.8125
Acceleration: 2.5
Lateral acceleration: 46.0625
Deceleration: 0
Collision radius:1
Hit points: 45
Armor: 0
Armor type: Light
Classification: Biological, Ground
Cost: 50 minerals
Damage: 5
Targets: Ground
Attack Cooldown: 1.5
Additional info: Ihanri workers are built 1 second faster than a Drone. In exchange for this, the Constructor also produces the supply provider of the Ihanri, the Stabilizer, which takes 20 seconds to built. During this time, no Creator can be made. A Stabilizer can however use Support on the Constructor to double the production queue. This allows a highly skilled player to rapidly increase it's worker production.


Ihanri Economics Recap


As can be seen by the three basic cornerstones of the Ihanri race, their economic boost (equal to the Protoss' Chronoboost, the Zerg's Larva Inject and the Terran's MULE) is the Vespene Isolation ability on the Constructor. It provides a Ihanri player with the ability to mine 25 gas from a Vespene Geyser (within limited range), or 50 gas from a Absorber [i]without the use of workers. Overpowered? Consider that the Ihanri have no way to boost their mineral income except by simply letting their workers not mine gas, this ability compensates the lack of a mineral boost.
Ihanri players however must decide between using their Constructor's energy to boost their economy (by harvesting gas with Vespene Isolation) or to keep their energy for a offensive push or to defend against a rush. This is because the second Constructor ability, Nanobot Shell, will greatly improve the strength of a (defensive) building. This ability can be used for a 'building rush' (see the other buildings further below) or to ensure the survival of a rapidly dying, but very crucial Ihanri building. The choice of the energy cost on the abilities is based on the Terran mechanics (MULE and Call Down Supply), though I realize the energy cost on Nanobot Shell is strongly subject to balance as well the amount of Vespene gas gathered by Vespene Isolation. These abilities increase the race's skill cap (by occupying the player, they need to spend their Constructor's energy).
The Ihanri Stabilizer uses the combined mechanics of all three other races with some twists. When grounded, you can call the Stabilizer a Pylon. When flying, you can call the Stabilizer an Overlord. The field the Stabilizer generates will make the terrain around it favorable for combat engagements (like creep) because it increases unit health regeneration (only slightly more than Zerg though). However, because the nanogrid field is needed to make sure buildings survive, using a Stabilizer in an offensive manner will expose the Stabilizer to the enemy as well. Killing a Stabilizer is worse for an Ihanri player than an Overlord (which provides only vision and supply in tier 1), a Pylon (which only powers buildings and provides supply) or a Supply Depot (which only provides supply and can function as a gate in a wall). This is because the Stabilizer has not two, but four roles.
1. Increasing unit production.
2. Allow buildings to be constructed and alive by staying in range of them (including expansions!).
3. Create favorable terrain to fight on with Ihanri units.
4. Provide supply.

Now, one could argue that the Stabilizer also functions like a scout, because it can move (when in flying mode) like an Overlord. However, while the first Overlord can be used for scouting, the Stabilizer must remain within a certain place of the base to prevent the main building from dying (the Constructor needs a nanogrid to prevent losing health!) and to be able to build buildings. This means that the second Stabilizer is the only means for scouting (while this means you cannot expand with it). This makes the Stabilizer unfit for scouting in the early game but useful for scouting and improving terrain for the units in later stages of the game, unless the player decides to take big risks.
Some strategic decisions to be made due to the Stabilizer functionality:
1. You can decide to build a Stabilizer very fast instead of a worker. Ihanri start with 12 supply (8 from the starting Stabilizer and 4 from the Constructor). A player can move his initial Stabilizer (which is slightly faster than a Zerg Overlord) to the enemy base to do a proxy or 'cannon rush'. In exchange for this, his Constructor starts to die, so a new Stabilizer must be built quite fast. Because of the investment needed to keep the base alive, the rush timing will work out in balance with the rush timings of other races (balance testing needed of course).
2. You can decide to use your first Stabilizer for a fast expansion. A nanogrid field is needed to build and sustain the Constructor.
3. Because Stabilizers take 4 seconds longer to build than a Creator (Ihanri worker) and because they take up the same building queue as the worker, keeping a close eye on the supply and income is very important. At least one Stabilizer should use Support on a Constructor to prevent building time loss of a worker.
4. Stabilizers should be positioned within an army (especially when they have the speed upgrade) to increase the health regeneration of the Ihanri army. A well placed Stabilizer can makes the difference between winning and losing a battle. This also makes them attractive targets for the enemy to kill.
5. Once the enemy has a good air-to-air harassment (phoenix, muta) Stabilizers should be landed on the ground or properly protected.
Suggestion: Because it may become too hard to manage the Support ability on each individual Stabilizer, each production building can request the nearest Stabilizer to cast Support on them, actively removing the need for a lot of different control grouped Stabilizers.

Other Buildings


Splicer
Role: Infantry production
Build time: 75 seconds
Produces:
Hit points: 1250
Armor: 1
Classification: Mechanical, Structure
Allows: Implanter
Cost: 200 minerals
Requires: Constructor
Upgrades into: Implanter
Additional info: Like all Ihanri buildings, the Splicer requires a nanogrid to be built and sustained. Splicers are the Ihanri's tier one unit producer that can double up the next unit queue space if a Stabilizer's Support ability is used. If macroed correctly, this allows Splicers to produce two units from the start of the game, this is also why the Splicer's building cost is slightly higher.

Canvass
Role: Ground unit research center
Build time: 35 seconds
Hit points: 900
Armor: 1
Classification: Mechanical, Structure
Allows: Pulse Barrier, Sonar Battery
Cost: 100 minerals
Requires: Constructor
Researches available: Hybrid Armaments, Hybrid Shells, Biointegration
Additional info: Like all Ihanri buildings, the Canvass requires a nanogrid to be built and sustained. It allows ground unit damage and armor to be upgraded and also allows for the Biointegration upgrade, which reduces the rate at which buildings that are not in a nanogrid field lose health by 75%. The Canvass also unlocks the base defense structures Pulse Barrier and Sonar Battery.

(Upgrade): Hybrid Armaments
Costs: 125 minerals, 125 gas, 160 seconds research time
Improves the damage of all Ihanri ground units.

(Upgrade): Hybrid Shells
Costs: 125 minerals, 125 gas, 160 seconds research time
Improves the armor of all Ihanri ground units.

(Upgrade): Biointegration
Costs: 100 minerals, 50 gas, 60 seconds research time
Reduces the rate at which buildings lose health when not in a nanogrid field by 75%.

Pulse Barrier
Role: Ground to ground base defense
Build time: 50 seconds
Hit points: 350
Armor: 2
Classification: Mechanical, Structure
Cost: 150 minerals
Requires: Canvass
Damage: 10 (+10 versus light)
Attacks: 2
Attack Cooldown: 2.15 (slow)
Range: 7
Meta Target priority: 19
Kill score: 250
Production score: 50
Additional info: Like all Ihanri buildings, the Pulse Barrier requires a nanogrid to be built and sustained. Pulse Barriers can only attack ground targets, at which they shoot two pulses in a straight line. Pulse Barriers are especially effective against light targets, allowing them to oneshot a Zergling (40 damage) and twoshot a fully upgraded Marine. However, the Pulse Barrier's attack cooldown is 0.3 seconds longer than that of a Spine Crawler (1.85 -> 2.25).

Sonar Battery
Role: Air to Air base defense, Stationary detection
Build time: 25 seconds
Hit points: 350
Armor: 2
Classification: Mechanical, Structure
Cost: 100 minerals
Requires: Canvass
Damage: 5 (+5 versus massive)
Attacks: 3
Attack Cooldown: 0.88
Range: 7
Meta Target priority: 19
Kill score: 250
Production score: 50
Additional info: Like all Ihanri buildings, the Sonar Battery requires a nanogrid to be built and sustained. Sonar Batteries can only attack air targets, at which they shoot three sonar pulses per attack. Sonar Batteries provide a detection field, which can see invisible, cloaked and burrowed units. Sonar Batteries are exceptionally powerful against massive targets, dealing double damage to them, but they attack slightly slower than a Spore Crawler (0.02 seconds per attack slower).

Everything here is work in progress, and nothing more than unbalanced theory.
[/b]
Comparing BW with SCII is like comparing a beautiful three-master sailing ship with a modern battlecruiser. Both are beautiful in their own way, both perform the same task, but they are worlds apart in how they are built and how they are steered.
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