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On May 29 2010 05:51 DoctorK wrote:Show nested quote +On May 29 2010 01:30 StylishVODs wrote:
When I look back at the PR's one day and I see someone who made dual finals again after being so dominant not being nr1 I will only be satisfied with it if the #1 player clearly showed that he was the better player.
I guess thats the price you have to price you have to pay for winning too much. It's so impossibly hard to win both leagues at the same time and if you lose at the finals the opponent gets all the credit even if he's just in a single league. Basically this. If Jaedong doesn't completely dominate the finals and somehow gets #1 vs someone who made dual finals twice in a row while being nearly invincible in Proleague I'm not really sure how I'd react.
If Flash was truly the #1 player he would not go 0-2 in the finals. Yes he has been dominant and easily made it to both finals, but he should not be rewarded for losing the two biggest games of the season. And it is not as if Jaedong and Effort are only playing decent starcraft. Both of them went on 12 game win streaks.
I believe Flash would tell you himself he considers Jaedong the better player if he goes 0-2 in the MSL finals.
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The reason why Jaedong could be considered as #1 if he wins the MSL finals is that:
1. It will mean Jaedong is the wall Flash cannot surpass. This would be Jaedong's 4th victory in a bo5 over Flash.
2. Jaedong's recent record would feature a stronger win percentage. Someone pointed out that if Jaedong won by any margin, he'd have a better record in his last 30 games.
3. Jaedong's loss to Baby is a loss Flash didn't take, but you don't want to hang it too hard over Jaedong's head.
Of course, a close victory of 3-2 on behalf of Jaedong would arguably still leave the ball in Flash's court as the stronger overall gamer, considering how heavily put to the test Flash's game has been recently. But it's hard to say. I think at that point, many would want to crown Jaedong bonjwa, whereas the Flash camp would be unable to make that claim... but probably unsupportive of Jaedong's claim either.
In fact, unless this final is lopsided, the B-word might be a bit contentious.
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The bar has been set high for bonjwa. Flash was close with two finals appearances, but couldn't seal the deal. Jaedong is nowhere near that. An MSL won't be enough for him.
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On May 29 2010 15:28 J1.au wrote:
The bar has been set high for bonjwa. Flash was close with two finals appearances, but couldn't seal the deal. Jaedong is nowhere near that. An MSL won't be enough for him.
"an msl" ?
It would be a gold in the fourth straight season.
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Yeah the bar is set too high seriously. In the foreign forums (TL) anyway.
Flash couldn't convince people because his dominant time has only been a year so far, and jaedong can't convince people because he's got the golds spread out over a too long period. Since he's only into one league all the time he can't claim "total dominance".
The bar seems like, you have to get to back to back dual finals and win 4 golds and then keep it up for another 4-5years with 90% winratio in PL!!!
Imo both players deserve much better but I don't really care...
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Well, this finals has spared us from a lot of useless discussion. Flash is the better player right now, there can be no doubt.
Disappointed by JDs play. He has to be #2 anyway, but that was really not good.
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lol. + Show Spoiler +this makes the loss in the osl finals seem so... unnecessary. i guess he wanted to keep his best builds to himself but if he had deployed just one of them, it might have been enough
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Philadelphia, PA10406 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + So NOW what?
EffOrt #2?
I mean, Jaedong's reactions were essentially the exact same as EffOrt's. All of this "EffOrt can't defeat Flash in a macro game" garbage has been exposed as ridiculous. Flash doesn't play macro games fair. He grabs a huge advantage. Sometimes he outplays you in the late game (Game 2), and sometimes he get's outplayed (SPL Set 1). But he wins in the midgame with ridiculous econ play. The best counter in starcraft is to go kill your opponent. And EffOrt did that, and Jaedong couldn't.
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and Plexa calls zerg dirty lol.
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Ok, there is only word that should be in this month's PR description for flash. It starts with B.
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The last week, TL has been overrun with
"When Jaedong wins the MSL..."
"Jaedong never loses a Bo5"
"Flash is terrible against zerg"
"Flash never wins when it matters"
"Flash was just a fluke"
LOL I say
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Man I wasn't bitter one bit when Effort ling rushed Flash to death but here you guys come, angry as piss that Flash 14cc'd on two big macro maps, and 14cc'd when he scouted 12hatch.
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Kind of sad that it wasn't Flash winning the OSL and JD winning the MSL. No golden mice/badges.
Effort just had to fluke his way in and ruin the party for fanboys of both camps 
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Philadelphia, PA10406 Posts
On May 29 2010 18:44 TwoToneTerran wrote:
Man I wasn't bitter one bit when Effort ling rushed Flash to death but here you guys come, angry as piss that Flash 14cc'd on two big macro maps, and 14cc'd when he scouted 12hatch.
There's no need to pretend that Flash is some kind of victim. That was a dominant performance, and a total mind-game victory.
On May 29 2010 18:43 johanes wrote:
Ok, there is only word that should be in this month's PR description for flash. It starts with B.
Except that Flash lost in the OSL. He got wrecked in the last three games.
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I'm not even anti-cheese but so many people are shouting that 14cc is cheese and blah blah when it's the most sensical build on the first two maps and he just scouted for it on the third.
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On May 29 2010 18:44 TwoToneTerran wrote:
Man I wasn't bitter one bit when Effort ling rushed Flash to death but here you guys come, angry as piss that Flash 14cc'd on two big macro maps, and 14cc'd when he scouted 12hatch.
Yes, you are a saint. Flash fans in general where pretty pissed though, likewise Jaedong fans in general are probably pretty pissed while some take it for what it is, Flash winning because he outplayed and outsmarted Jaedong. Don't try to make it look like one side is better than the other 
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On May 29 2010 18:47 tree.hugger wrote:Show nested quote +On May 29 2010 18:44 TwoToneTerran wrote:
Man I wasn't bitter one bit when Effort ling rushed Flash to death but here you guys come, angry as piss that Flash 14cc'd on two big macro maps, and 14cc'd when he scouted 12hatch. There's no need to pretend that Flash is some kind of victim. That was a dominant performance, and a total mind-game victory. Show nested quote +On May 29 2010 18:43 johanes wrote:
Ok, there is only word that should be in this month's PR description for flash. It starts with B. Except that Flash lost in the OSL. He got wrecked in the last three games.
Yep, every B had always the perfect score and never lost any final
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i'm not quite sure there's a good justification for putting effort above jaedong. i don't have much doubt that jaedong is even right now the better all-around player. but i can see the argument and i don't think the point is worth hashing out two days before power rank comes out and two hours after the msl finals started.
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On May 29 2010 18:49 TwoToneTerran wrote:
I'm not even anti-cheese but so many people are shouting that 14cc is cheese and blah blah when it's the most sensical build on the first two maps and he just scouted for it on the third.
I think he scouted 12hat on 2nd game too before starting the cc. I'm not 100% about that but I think he did
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On May 29 2010 18:55 11cc wrote:Show nested quote +On May 29 2010 18:49 TwoToneTerran wrote:
I'm not even anti-cheese but so many people are shouting that 14cc is cheese and blah blah when it's the most sensical build on the first two maps and he just scouted for it on the third. I think he scouted 12hat on 2nd game too before starting the cc. I'm not 100% about that but I think he did
Nope, scouting distances are too long. He did scout the three hatch before pool after he 14cc'd which led to his followup timing push.
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EPT
