We have all noticed the absence of Casy. His last Proleague performance was in May, and since then he has only played 5 games, (all in OSL or ODT) which he all lost. On the day of the Survivor Preliminaries, Casy called in sick and was unable to participate. And last week, during the OGN vs MBC showmatch, Casy could not be found anywhere on the roster for OGN. What is the story behind Casy?
- Where did it begin?
According to Casy, the trouble began during negotiations between KOR (before OGN Sparkyz) and "Player A" (who is speculated to be either Qoo)Max or terato... most likely max). He says that he stepped in and told the coach that if negotiations did not continue with "A" then he would not negotiate his contract as well. However, eventually "Player A" left the team, leaving Casy in an awkward state. After his OSL win Casy says that his head coach was unreasonably unfair to him, and he was getting scoled often.
Coach Lee Myung-Geun states that he did scold Casy, but only because Casy "changed". His statements is that after Casy's OSL win, he was slacking off and spending more time on personal affairs. He admits to scolding Casy, but only to keep him in check and treat him fairly.
What is for certain, is that Casy (Han Dong-Wook) and Lee started to clash after '06 Shinhan 1 OSL.
Casy states that "afterwards I asked Manager Lee for forgiveness and I was able to continue at HQ without any problems" but then he states "Then Shinhan Proleague started and after losing a match I hear some slander. Afterwards I was always getting in trouble from the team coaches and my team brothers even told me to stay away from them".
- Offering to Transfer Teams, when and why?
Casy states that "I asked the coach to forgive me and tried to continue without any problems in the team, but I heard from my team brothers that I was to not be used in Proleague and was not going to be given a chance to play. And that was it. And so I went up to the front and requested a "Team Transfer".
According to Manager Lee, he explains that "After Casy won the OSL he asked for money more than that was offered. And becuase I was not in the position to offer more money I suggested transfering to a team who would offer him the money."
- No Proleague for Casy?
Since his May 13th match with Samsung, Casy was not put in OGN's lineup. Casy explains that "my brothers told me that I was not to be used in proleague, and this exploded to feeling that was kept inside me".
Manger Lee states that "Until he left the team's HQ I used him often. But after the incident how do you expect me to use a player who had not practiced with the team during that time and use a unprepared player in proleague".
- OGN refused the Transfer?
OGN states that they negotiated with teams to make a trade. But because the offers did not satisfy the negotiations did not work out.
Casy states that OGN asked for a lot of money for the trade giving Casy no option but to stay with the team or leave.
- Manager Lee refuses Casy?
After Casy cancelled his Team Transfer offer on August 9th, he announced that he will be going back to OGN HQ and work out his condition with Manager Lee and when he was moving back in.
Casy states that "I was waiting for the trade negotiations to complete but due to personal reasons I withdrew my offer and asked to come back. But Manager Lee told me that the trade was nearly complete and to wait for his call. But he never did."
Manager admits that he specifically refused to let Casy back in. He explains that he decided it was impossible to repair that damage and that it would not work out, and that he had already started making plans that did not include Casy in the equation.
- So what now for Casy?
What is certain is that Casy will no longer wear the OGN Sparkyz uniform.
Casy states that "At first I didn't care what team, I just wanted to move. But now that that seems unlikely I am only left with the option to join the army and try to join the Airforce team."
Manager Lee states that "It is impossible for Casy to return to the team. He has lost the basic mind of being a progamer" and said that "this decision does not come from only me but is agreed with the entire coaching staff".
Lastly OGN states that "It was he who first mentioned to join the army and we respected his wishes. If now the player still wants to join the army then we will of course allow him."
In other words, Casys only chance of continueing as a gamer would be through the Airforce Ace.
FighterForum's Interview with Casy:
- How do you feel? Casy - Complicated. I wished things would have worked out but it did not and it has come down to this. I still want to continue to be a progamer but I no longer wish to do so under the name of OGN.
- How did the two become so distant? Casy - From the beginning of the team's creation (Sparkyz, not KOR) I lost a lot of respect from the manager, and I was recieving treatment I did not understand why I deserved. And so it became difficult for me and our points did not connect and I think that's why we became distant.
- Why did you leave HQ? Casy - At first I came to the vice-chief with complaints of the manager. But he told me that I probably did something wrong so I swallowed my pride and begged for forgiveness. I did my best to help out with the team's practice and there were no problems in our daily activities. But then 2 days later after the loss to MBCGame the arrows were pointed at me, despite the fact that I didn't even play. Later everyone from the team except for me was called in for discussion. Later one they told me that it was to talk ill of me. And without a word to me I was not to be used for proleague.
After that I was furious and did not want to see Manager Lee's face and wanted to leave. Vice-chief told me that after I asked for forgiveness and fixed my problems if the problem continued he would allow the team transfer. So I went to him again and he allowed the transfer. I asked if I could leave HQ and he told me to do as I wish. So stating that I was ill I left.
- Were there any problems with salary negotiations? Casy - During renegotiations for our contracts they gave me two options. Options 1 was to sign in permanently with the team, but if I wanted to transfer then I was to pick Option 2. The money for Option 2 was about regular salary compared to Option 1, but I wanted the option to transfer and I told the vice-chief that I did not care if the teams offered me regular pay. He told me that under those conditions it would be possible, and the transfer fee was not to be too expensive. So I picked Option 2. I was prepared to be payed less but work hard on another team.
- Why did you decide to join the army? Casy - Watching other players play at home really effected me. That is where I was suppose to be but being stuck here really killed me, and I didn't want to quit here. But no matter how long I waited the transfer did not happen. And so I decided to join the army and told the front that as well. Then after that things became difficult at my house. I felt guilty watching family struggle with it and so I wanted to swallow it and rejoin the team. I was to rejoin on August 15th but the manager prevented it, and after being elminated from prelims father found out and became very stressed. Afterwards my father and I went up to OGN to negotiated but they refused to Transfer, Trade or Waver. So we talked it over and decided on the army.
- How are you now? Casy - I am very nervous. I chose the Airforce but unless they want me it isn't decided if I will get accepted.
- If you don't get accepted into the Air Force? Casy - Then I have no choice, I'd have to quit.
Sooo!! Summary: - Casy and Lee didn't hit it off to begin with. - After Casy won OSL, he was apparently acting out (partying and clubbing maybe?) and so Lee became strict with him. Casy felt he was being treated unfairly. - Things got worst between the two, and Casy asked for transfer. Vice-chief sait to give it a second chance. Casy fixed his bad habits, and tried to fit in and help out (or so he says). Then cames the MBCGame incident and the manager talked smack behind his back to the team, and banned him from proleague. - Casy got angry and asked for the transfer again. He was allowed. Renegotions for contracts were during that time so he chose the option with lower pay because it included the option to transfer. - Transfer did not work out. OGN claims that their terms with the other teams did not match. Fans are wondering if OGN even tried hard enough. - Running out of options, Casy announced that he will join the army instead. - Things go bad in Casy's family. Casy decides to give in and rejoin Sparkyz, but Manager Lee out right refuses. (according to Lee, this is the decision of the staff, not only himself) - Casy and dad go to OGN to negotiate. All options fail. Casy decides on the army again. - If Casy does not make it into AirForce, he says that he would have no choice but to quit. (what about the navy?!!?!?!?)
Hey, maybe we can do something about it. If we can raise say $100,000 USD a year, we can sponsor him. We'll be a one-man team and he'll fight on behalf of TL.net.
Secondly, if he does join AirForce, let's pray that he wins a league again so that OGN truly regrets their decision!
On September 04 2007 12:01 StripedBlueCrow wrote: Hey, maybe we can do something about it. If we can raise say $100,000 USD a year, we can sponsor him. We'll be a one-man team and he'll fight on behalf of TL.net.
Secondly, if he does join AirForce, let's pray that he wins a league again so that OGN truly regrets their decision!
Discipline seems to be low what with players changing their name on a whim all the time.
People who SHOULD change their names don't.
They still can't get passable protosses.
It just seems like a mess of a team. With Casy leaving, they're losing another veteran. While it has always had the image of the young scrappy team.. meh. Just seems bad.
Guys. Please stop bashing on the coach. In my opinion, FiFo posted the interview in an extremely biased and emotional way. Remember, an interview is a story from just one side. In Casy's view, he was treated extremely unfairly and unjustly by OGN. In reality, I don't think the coach was being a complete dick like the interview portrayed him. Perhaps the coach was at fault. But to assume that Casy is without fault is downright stupid. We can (and should, imo) form our opinions after we hear the statements from both sides: Casy and the OGN coaching staff.
Summary: To read an one-sided interview and make quick judgements about others is wrong.
Sucks for the reality of progamers.. The life of Starcraft 24/7 seems tempting and all, but in the end you're left with no skills in the workforce. So the only option is to keep on playing SC, keep on playing SC..
On September 04 2007 12:45 infinity21 wrote: Guys. Please stop bashing on the coach. In my opinion, FiFo posted the interview in an extremely biased and emotional way. Remember, an interview is a story from just one side. In Casy's view, he was treated extremely unfairly and unjustly by OGN. In reality, I don't think the coach was being a complete dick like the interview portrayed him. Perhaps the coach was at fault. But to assume that Casy is without fault is downright stupid. We can (and should, imo) form our opinions after we hear the statements from both sides: Casy and the OGN coaching staff.
Summary: To read an one-sided interview and make quick judgements about others is wrong.
even if casy acted like a homo, he deserves another chance. The coach is older and should know better, maybe have some serious talks with casy or whatever. Honestly to prevent someone from playing and kicking them off the team indefinately is bogus. Then to not allow them to transfer is just lame. He basically is ruining the mans life by not allowing him to earn a living. How old is casy? Hes got to be under 25, people make mistakes, teach him a lesson and let him back on. Sounds like the coach went on a power trip and is holding a vendetta against him. Obviously its one side to a story, but either way to not let him leave and preventing him from making money (and thereby forcing his hand to join the service) is disgusting
On September 04 2007 12:45 infinity21 wrote: Guys. Please stop bashing on the coach. In my opinion, FiFo posted the interview in an extremely biased and emotional way. Remember, an interview is a story from just one side. In Casy's view, he was treated extremely unfairly and unjustly by OGN. In reality, I don't think the coach was being a complete dick like the interview portrayed him. Perhaps the coach was at fault. But to assume that Casy is without fault is downright stupid. We can (and should, imo) form our opinions after we hear the statements from both sides: Casy and the OGN coaching staff.
Summary: To read an one-sided interview and make quick judgements about others is wrong.
even if casy acted like a homo, he deserves another chance. The coach is older and should know better, maybe have some serious talks with casy or whatever. Honestly to prevent someone from playing and kicking them off the team indefinately is bogus. Then to not allow them to transfer is just lame. He basically is ruining the mans life by not allowing him to earn a living. How old is casy? Hes got to be under 25, people make mistakes, teach him a lesson and let him back on. Sounds like the coach went on a power trip and is holding a vendetta against him. Obviously its one side to a story, but either way to not let him leave and preventing him from making money (and thereby forcing his hand to join the service) is disgusting
That being said, I think at this point in time it's stupid to consider this based on how the coach has reacted (of course, BASED on the interviews).
On September 04 2007 12:45 infinity21 wrote: Guys. Please stop bashing on the coach. In my opinion, FiFo posted the interview in an extremely biased and emotional way. Remember, an interview is a story from just one side. In Casy's view, he was treated extremely unfairly and unjustly by OGN. In reality, I don't think the coach was being a complete dick like the interview portrayed him. Perhaps the coach was at fault. But to assume that Casy is without fault is downright stupid. We can (and should, imo) form our opinions after we hear the statements from both sides: Casy and the OGN coaching staff.
Summary: To read an one-sided interview and make quick judgements about others is wrong.
even if casy acted like a homo, he deserves another chance. The coach is older and should know better, maybe have some serious talks with casy or whatever. Honestly to prevent someone from playing and kicking them off the team indefinately is bogus. Then to not allow them to transfer is just lame. He basically is ruining the mans life by not allowing him to earn a living. How old is casy? Hes got to be under 25, people make mistakes, teach him a lesson and let him back on. Sounds like the coach went on a power trip and is holding a vendetta against him. Obviously its one side to a story, but either way to not let him leave is appalling.
I know what you're saying. But I still think it's wrong to bash only on the coach for doing something so cruel. After reading an interview of both Casy and coach Lee Myung-Geun, I'm still left in the dark. We don't know what Casy could have done that made his entire team, including the players and the coaching staff turn against him. We need details, details!
Hopefully he gets into Airforce. He didn't deserve how he was treated. Players need to be given more power in negotiations with their teams. Hopefully KesPA will get off its ass and do something.
On September 04 2007 13:20 CustomXSpunjah wrote: ya dude, im still so confused i don't know how any of you can be mad at the coach without even knowing what Casy did
what could he have done that would prevent you from allowing to leave and make his living?
You arent even giving him a chance to go and make his money elsewhere, thats where I think its shitty. If you have irreconcilable differences whatever, but let the man go somewhere else if you no intention of keeping him.
They are basically blackballing him from progaming
On September 04 2007 13:20 CustomXSpunjah wrote: ya dude, im still so confused i don't know how any of you can be mad at the coach without even knowing what Casy did
what could he have done that would prevent you from allowing to leave and make his living?
You arent even giving him a chance to go and make his money elsewhere, thats where I think its shitty. If you have irreconcilable differences whatever, but let the man go somewhere else if you no intention of keeping him.
They are basically blackballing him from progaming
Well think about it...I'm not saying he did, but like infinity21 mentioned to me while we were talking about this a second ago, what if he was missing practice sessions, partying at nightclubs, doing nothing while the cash flowed in? Maybe he dosen't want other coaches to get the same deal he got? Who knows....
On September 04 2007 13:20 CustomXSpunjah wrote: ya dude, im still so confused i don't know how any of you can be mad at the coach without even knowing what Casy did
what could he have done that would prevent you from allowing to leave and make his living?
You arent even giving him a chance to go and make his money elsewhere, thats where I think its shitty. If you have irreconcilable differences whatever, but let the man go somewhere else if you no intention of keeping him.
They are basically blackballing him from progaming
Well think about it...I'm not saying he did, but like infinity21 mentioned to me while we were talking about this a second ago, what if he was missing practice sessions, partying at nightclubs, doing nothing while the cash flowed in? Maybe he dosen't want other coaches to get the same deal he got? Who knows....
if they are still paying him they can do whatever they want I guess, but if hes not being paid he should be allowed to freely go to whatever team he wants to go to.
Things like this are not legal in sports in america(at least if hes not being paid)
On September 04 2007 13:20 CustomXSpunjah wrote: ya dude, im still so confused i don't know how any of you can be mad at the coach without even knowing what Casy did
what could he have done that would prevent you from allowing to leave and make his living?
You arent even giving him a chance to go and make his money elsewhere, thats where I think its shitty. If you have irreconcilable differences whatever, but let the man go somewhere else if you no intention of keeping him.
They are basically blackballing him from progaming
Well think about it...I'm not saying he did, but like infinity21 mentioned to me while we were talking about this a second ago, what if he was missing practice sessions, partying at nightclubs, doing nothing while the cash flowed in? Maybe he dosen't want other coaches to get the same deal he got? Who knows....
if they are still paying him they can do whatever they want I guess, but if hes not being paid he should be allowed to freely go to whatever team he wants to go to.
Things like this are not legal in sports in america(at least if hes not being paid)
On September 04 2007 13:20 CustomXSpunjah wrote: ya dude, im still so confused i don't know how any of you can be mad at the coach without even knowing what Casy did
what could he have done that would prevent you from allowing to leave and make his living?
You arent even giving him a chance to go and make his money elsewhere, thats where I think its shitty. If you have irreconcilable differences whatever, but let the man go somewhere else if you no intention of keeping him.
They are basically blackballing him from progaming
True, I cannot imagine Casy doing something bad enough to deserve this. Life of a progamer is never easy, especially of the good ones. No matter what Casy did, the coach is older and has more power, you don't need to understand everything to tell that the fucking coach should not corner him like this.
On September 04 2007 13:20 CustomXSpunjah wrote: ya dude, im still so confused i don't know how any of you can be mad at the coach without even knowing what Casy did
what could he have done that would prevent you from allowing to leave and make his living?
You arent even giving him a chance to go and make his money elsewhere, thats where I think its shitty. If you have irreconcilable differences whatever, but let the man go somewhere else if you no intention of keeping him.
They are basically blackballing him from progaming
True, I cannot imagine Casy doing something bad enough to deserve this. Life of a progamer is never easy, especially of the good ones. No matter what Casy did, the coach is older and has more power, you don't need to understand everything to tell that the fucking coach should not corner him like this.
sounds really weird to me that the team can disallow him to transfer... in any other sport where the player gets in a fight with the manager/team he's on he'll just be transferred.
I've been saying for a while that pro-gamers need unions. Even though I despise unions, pro-gamers are some of the people that really need a union.
What I don't get is the non-fulltime contract that Casy signed. Surely if it is non-fulltime contract he should be able to cancel it (eg. He should be able to quit the team). If he's not able to do that then the contract must have been very dodgy.
It seems to me like the coach tricked Casy into signing a contract that will pay him less money (a normal salary), and then screwed him. This way the manager doesn't have to pay that much, and it's not costing the team much to keep him from playing. This was clearly deliberate on the side of the manager/coach.
So yeah, even though we don't know what Casy did, the coach has no right to destroy his livelihood like this. If the player is a menace to the team, transfer him to some team that can handle him. This is clearly personal, as the coach is even willing to lose money just to stop Casy from playing.
The only options that Casy has is to: #1 Join the AirForce, something that seems to be allowed in their contracts. #2, Wait for the contract to expire and join a new team, something that will probably take a year, maybe two. He can take those two years to study, since he'll be payed in anycase. The coach can't fire him, so he can basically do what he wants to do. #3, Contact the sponsors. If Casy contacts the OGN bigwigs (or the MBC channel, I'm sure they wouldn't mind getting some dirt on Casy) he could generate a LOT of bad publicity for OGN Sparkyz, and as such for OGN. The sponsors will also not be happy knowing that their money is being spent on keeping a player from playing, instead of helping a player to play. The sponsors can surely pressure the manager into letting Casy go.
Either way, pro-gamers need someone to defend their rights. Pro-gamers are usually young when they join a team, and as such can't really understand the contractual terms. Furthermore, players are only to glad to become "pro-gamers", and they'd sign almost any contract to do this.
I feel really bad for Casy, even though I dislike him. No young person should have their futures fucked with so completely.
I dont understand why he has to quit progaming if he cant go to airforce. What I mean is, if he is without a team for half a year or so, wouldnt some of the other teams pick him up immediatelly?
On September 04 2007 12:25 Adaptation wrote: If he goes in the air force, its almost certain they will take him. But its not sure that the air force will take him.
On September 04 2007 12:45 infinity21 wrote: Guys. Please stop bashing on the coach. In my opinion, FiFo posted the interview in an extremely biased and emotional way. Remember, an interview is a story from just one side. In Casy's view, he was treated extremely unfairly and unjustly by OGN. In reality, I don't think the coach was being a complete dick like the interview portrayed him. Perhaps the coach was at fault. But to assume that Casy is without fault is downright stupid. We can (and should, imo) form our opinions after we hear the statements from both sides: Casy and the OGN coaching staff.
Summary: To read an one-sided interview and make quick judgements about others is wrong.
Thank god someone else is realizing this. I think Casy might have been clubbing alot or whatever, being all famous after his OSL win and this perhaps caused the beef between him and the coach.
People always read whatever news completely obvlivious to the fact that news are easily biased.
On September 04 2007 12:25 Adaptation wrote: If he goes in the air force, its almost certain they will take him. But its not sure that the air force will take him.
lol, come again?
If he goes in the air force, its almost certain they [ACE] will take him. But its not sure that the air force will take him.
On September 04 2007 12:45 infinity21 wrote: Guys. Please stop bashing on the coach. In my opinion, FiFo posted the interview in an extremely biased and emotional way. Remember, an interview is a story from just one side. In Casy's view, he was treated extremely unfairly and unjustly by OGN. In reality, I don't think the coach was being a complete dick like the interview portrayed him. Perhaps the coach was at fault. But to assume that Casy is without fault is downright stupid. We can (and should, imo) form our opinions after we hear the statements from both sides: Casy and the OGN coaching staff.
Summary: To read an one-sided interview and make quick judgements about others is wrong.
Thank god someone else is realizing this. I think Casy might have been clubbing alot or whatever, being all famous after his OSL win and this perhaps caused the beef between him and the coach.
People always read whatever news completely obvlivious to the fact that news are easily biased.
you think its ok to blackball someone from an industry because they were clubbing? Release him from his contract and let him go somewhere else if thats the case. The guy is doing this simply to screw him over. He hasnt played since may already aside from a league, dont you think that is punishment enough?
Of course he did something wrong, but hed have to do something historically bad to get blackballed from the industry by his own team unless its a personal vendetta
On September 04 2007 12:45 infinity21 wrote: Guys. Please stop bashing on the coach. In my opinion, FiFo posted the interview in an extremely biased and emotional way. Remember, an interview is a story from just one side. In Casy's view, he was treated extremely unfairly and unjustly by OGN. In reality, I don't think the coach was being a complete dick like the interview portrayed him. Perhaps the coach was at fault. But to assume that Casy is without fault is downright stupid. We can (and should, imo) form our opinions after we hear the statements from both sides: Casy and the OGN coaching staff.
Summary: To read an one-sided interview and make quick judgements about others is wrong.
Thank god someone else is realizing this. I think Casy might have been clubbing alot or whatever, being all famous after his OSL win and this perhaps caused the beef between him and the coach.
People always read whatever news completely obvlivious to the fact that news are easily biased.
you think its ok to blackball someone from an industry because they were clubbing? Release him from his contract and let him go somewhere else if thats the case. The guy is doing this simply to screw him over. He hasnt played since may already aside from a league, dont you think that is punishment enough?
Of course he did something wrong, but hed have to do something historically bad to get blackballed from the industry by his own team unless its a personal vendetta
You might find this weird but there's this mentality with Koreans that I can see in the coach right now. I can understand why he's doing this. It's not that weird for the coach to do this to Casy in Korean culture. Of course, it's wrong, but it's understandable. I guess this is where the differences in traditional Korean culture and American culture comes in.
Well, since Daigomi mentioned a contract, and Manager Lee is not letting him leave the team or join another team or sumthin'
I asked already, he can definitely sue. Just as long as he has the "contract" and he does not get income and is not allowed to go out of the team to get his own job, he CAN sue.
edit: I mean, Manager Lee can't destroy his life in any way. I mean, ProGamers are human, too, and they too have rights.
I'd tread carefully when covering this issue. There are so many conflicting accounts of what happened from various sources, no one can really be sure what is going on. All the Korean media is confused as hell, and most of the 'conclusions' that have been come to are fans doing guesswork and trying to find plausible explanations.
On September 04 2007 22:24 Waxangel wrote: I'd tread carefully when covering this issue. There are so many conflicting accounts of what happened from various sources, no one can really be sure what is going on. All the Korean media is confused as hell, and most of the 'conclusions' that have been come to are fans doing guesswork and trying to find plausible explanations.
even so, unless he purposely threw a game or something, I dont see how it would be alright with people if he was banned from progaming indefinately, thats bogus.
Basically they are not letting him join back OGN nor letting him be traded to other team. When the other team asked for trade, they come up with ridiculous number which conflicts the trade. Good friend of Casy, Byun Hyungtae aka Iris[GM] asked CJ to get him into the team even if it means, his own pay is cut and they attempted trade which failed. The OGN side are even RECOMMENDING Casy to join Air Force.
No matter what Casy did, they are trying to take him out of the league and that's not acceptable. BTW, for some that doesn't know, ACE team don't take just any players. He needs to be tested and be accepted to the team.
Sadist might be totally wrong because of interview bias, but either way Casy shouldn't be sent into space. Depending on how it was he should stay or leave. First option isn't available from what we see, second one, under rules of contracts and how proscene is being run means quitting. His fault or not, they shouldn't use their power to mess up his life. What would it hurt coach and others if he transferred. Now hes not on a team, not outside, can't stay and can't join other. Hes in space, or some kind of margin where normal relations with other people don't apply.
On September 05 2007 01:51 Pafnucy wrote: Sadist might be totally wrong because of interview bias, but either way Casy shouldn't be sent into space. Depending on how it was he should stay or leave. First option isn't available from what we see, second one, under rules of contracts and how proscene is being run means quitting. His fault or not, they shouldn't use their power to mess up his life. What would it hurt coach and others if he transferred. Now hes not on a team, not outside, can't stay and can't join other. Hes in space, or some kind of margin where normal relations with other people don't apply.
On September 05 2007 01:11 nullmind wrote: Basically they are not letting him join back OGN nor letting him be traded to other team. When the other team asked for trade, they come up with ridiculous number which conflicts the trade. Good friend of Casy, Byun Hyungtae aka Iris[GM] asked CJ to get him into the team even if it means, his own pay is cut and they attempted trade which failed. The OGN side are even RECOMMENDING Casy to join Air Force.
No matter what Casy did, they are trying to take him out of the league and that's not acceptable. BTW, for some that doesn't know, ACE team don't take just any players. He needs to be tested and be accepted to the team.
OGN did not come up with ridiculous number. The story is false. Iris did not ask Casy to get him into CJ. The story is false. The OGN side did not recommend Casy to join ACE. Casy said that he will go there himself.
On September 04 2007 23:56 Purind wrote: So... lemme get this straight.
He's not allowed to leave OGN team, yet he'll never be able to join it.
I don't even understand.
It's like OGN imprisoned Casy in hell, a punishment he certainly does not deserve. Whatever Casy did, it should be something huge, and not something so small I can trip off a chair because of it. O.o
Some of you should try to lead a team and see what happens if one of your team is allowed to party while the others have to train all day. Especially if that someone is supposed to be a champion and a rolemodel.
Why would other teams automatically sign a player that has caused trouble on his last team? What are you telling your team if you sign a player that didn't train/behave properly on his last team (even if you suspect the coach was partly to blame)?
But just like everyone here I have no clue who said what, and who did what, I just wanted to mention that leaders have to consider these things.
I'm pretty sure if I was told I'm off the PL roster knowing I am one of the best 3 users on the team, I'd be a little pissed. Yeah, let's run people like Spear Shield or Leta over Casy -____-;;
Oddysay had previous conduct problems too on the Kor team ~_~.
I don't recall conduct problems on any other team cept Kor.
On September 05 2007 07:04 humblegar wrote: Some of you should try to lead a team and see what happens if one of your team is allowed to party while the others have to train all day. Especially if that someone is supposed to be a champion and a rolemodel.
Why would other teams automatically sign a player that has caused trouble on his last team? What are you telling your team if you sign a player that didn't train/behave properly on his last team (even if you suspect the coach was partly to blame)?
But just like everyone here I have no clue who said what, and who did what, I just wanted to mention that leaders have to consider these things.
even if that were the case, you can punish the player, but to punish them for their entire career is stupid.
He could have fined casy or something, or banned him from proleague for a month. Blackballing him from progaming and basically forcing him into joining the airforce is bad.
On September 05 2007 07:04 humblegar wrote: Some of you should try to lead a team and see what happens if one of your team is allowed to party while the others have to train all day. Especially if that someone is supposed to be a champion and a rolemodel.
Why would other teams automatically sign a player that has caused trouble on his last team? What are you telling your team if you sign a player that didn't train/behave properly on his last team (even if you suspect the coach was partly to blame)?
But just like everyone here I have no clue who said what, and who did what, I just wanted to mention that leaders have to consider these things.
If he didn't act like a champion / rolemodel and made bad influences on the team, then why don't they just fire him or kick him off the team instead of preventing him from every playing a game again?
It's like you did something wrong at work, and your boss is keeping you from leaving the job or going to another company with little pay. No bad behaviour deserves this.
Poor Casy, It sounds like what they did was put all the blame on 1 person because he was already having issues with the team. The Coach should be removed from the team for such bm. The little get together they had I'm sure was to make sure the other players and coaches were on the same foot in dealing with Casy.
Fact of the matter is Casy you are great and keep your head up high. Things always work out sometimes not for the best but eventually they will work out. You are a great man, great gamer, etc. GL with AirForce and tell BOXER we all say Hello :D
On September 04 2007 22:24 Waxangel wrote: I'd tread carefully when covering this issue. There are so many conflicting accounts of what happened from various sources, no one can really be sure what is going on. All the Korean media is confused as hell, and most of the 'conclusions' that have been come to are fans doing guesswork and trying to find plausible explanations.
Guys, as Wax and many others have said, we can't take a side just yet. While I was translating the posts I knew that the interview especially was extremely biased. We should wait for OGN to make their official statement before we start formulating plans on how to get the coach cruicified (Koreans are already getting ready to boycott OGN or something like that).
From what I understood, the initial problem with Casy was his lack of discipline. The things after that like the proleague incident may sound really bad and make Casy look innocent, but who knows? Perhaps the coach had put a temporary ban, or Casy hadn't really fixed his habits yet. We just don't know enough to speculate much.
Many of you have said that no matter what Casy did, he should not have been forced into this situation. But was he FORCED, or did he CHOSE? Both is possible, but neither is certain.
It was Casy who chose to get the transfer done. It was he who said "I will no longer play with OGN, get me transferred." Now his interview portrays him as a man who had no other choice but to transfer or live a life of constant slander. But is that the case? What if he did indeed deserve the slander. What if the OGN staff were trying to keep him under control (if he was out of control) and he just didn't like it, and said "look I'm not putting up with this, get me transferred).
I always wondered that. Perhaps the coach isn't the evil guy. What if Casy had done some really bad things in the past that forced the coaches to keep a tight grip on him. Maybe he was cought doing drugs, and the coaches really cracked down on him, and they refused to let it out in public to save his face (although now that I think about it that's a stupid theory). But you know what I'm trying to say.... something along those lines.
My point is this: Like the OGN/MBC vs KeSPA battle, we can't jump to conclusions until we hear the full story. Now OGN said they'll make an official statement by next week, so we'll wait for that.
On September 05 2007 12:13 Metal[x] wrote: im confused, if OGN isnt playing Casy - why cant he just leave OGN? then after a few months or whatever another team just pick him up? o_O
Casy basically said "I'm not playing for you, get me transfered". OGN tried, but other teams didn't agree with the terms (this could be because OGN made unreasonable demands, or simply because other teams didn't want casy that much). Then Casy came back after his personal troubles and said let me back, but the manager refused (again this could be because he's evil, or he doesn't want to go through the shit with Casy again, if Casy was really evil afterall).
So he can't go back, and no other team is willing to trade for him.
On September 05 2007 12:13 Metal[x] wrote: im confused, if OGN isnt playing Casy - why cant he just leave OGN? then after a few months or whatever another team just pick him up? o_O
Casy basically said "I'm not playing for you, get me transfered". OGN tried, but other teams didn't agree with the terms (this could be because OGN made unreasonable demands, or simply because other teams didn't want casy that much). Then Casy came back after his personal troubles and said let me back, but the manager refused (again this could be because he's evil, or he doesn't want to go through the shit with Casy again, if Casy was really evil afterall).
So he can't go back, and no other team is willing to trade for him.
I think Metal[x]'s qusetion was, why can't he just do it now.
The reason he couldn't get transferred was because OGN f**ked him over with high price trade deals. Why can't he just sit out the contract (since he didn't sign a permanent contract). Then when his contract is up, he'll just be a "free-trade" pickup player going to whatever team gives him the best offer.
Unless this is prevented by "Option 2 contract plan" that he signed which would be a continuuing employment of him which prevents his transfer, but I don't that's the case, because I DONT THINK that's legal to not pay him, allow him a "transfer" then being so dirty with the high transfer fees.
On September 04 2007 11:43 Live2Win wrote: According to Casy, the trouble began during negotiations between KOR (before OGN Sparkyz) and "Player A" (who is speculated to be either Qoo)Max or terato... most likely max). He says that he stepped in and told the coach that if negotiations did not continue with "A" then he would not negotiate his contract as well. However, eventually "Player A" left the team, leaving Casy in an awkward state.
He shouldn't have done this, he fucked himself. There's a reason people don't barter this way in business. He's a professional gamer. Act more professional, Casy. Earn those six-figures.
this is really a big event for progaming in korea, i think... a battle of progaming contracts and rights... something like this is necessary for the profession to evolve
Hi - i'm new, so take this with a pinch of salt: "I have no choice" - does he? how much power do the team coaches have? do they have the choice to genuinely end someone's progaming career if they feel like it? (I genuinely don't know).
from what has been said, seems as though the bosses in progaming use the players nearly as slaves, they dominate the players, probably working far fewer hours, this augmented by the fact that that they have the final say in the player's whole career by refusing transfers. seems the stars have little to no say in anything with that around their necks.
disallowing a worker to continue in the profession that he is trained in by simply not agreeing to let him work, or allowing him to move to some where he could is clearly unfair.
granted, if everything said so far has been true..
Unfortunatly he himself started that with treatening his Coach, he should have known how this coach will react, he is not known as the most warm and most friendly one, he is a buisnessman. I feel just sry for him, he tried to help a friend and killed himself
On September 05 2007 07:04 humblegar wrote: Some of you should try to lead a team and see what happens if one of your team is allowed to party while the others have to train all day. Especially if that someone is supposed to be a champion and a rolemodel.
Why would other teams automatically sign a player that has caused trouble on his last team? What are you telling your team if you sign a player that didn't train/behave properly on his last team (even if you suspect the coach was partly to blame)?
But just like everyone here I have no clue who said what, and who did what, I just wanted to mention that leaders have to consider these things.
even if that were the case, you can punish the player, but to punish them for their entire career is stupid.
He could have fined casy or something, or banned him from proleague for a month. Blackballing him from progaming and basically forcing him into joining the airforce is bad.
Of course, I was posting because some think its a small thing for a coach to live with a star player that skip practice a.s.o. It is in fact extremely damaging to a team for obvious reasons.
I hope the blackballing/banning part is not true, like everyone else (and so far we really don't know?).
On September 05 2007 20:11 SuperJongMan wrote: If Casy's career ends, I'll quit all things SC related.
I might just do the same. Looking back over 2006, this is almost heart breaking to see how much promise Casy had, He quickly earned himself a name amongst one of my fav players and for him to leave like this would just be a damn shame
On September 05 2007 16:29 a-game wrote: the thing people are most angry at is the concept that ogn might be not only not paying casy but also preventing other teams from paying casy.
all we're saying is that ogn shouldn't be able to give him 0 money while also owning his player rights.
we're not saying that's confirmably the case, but if it is the case, then it's wrong, no matter what.
From what I understood, OGN is paying Casy (still paying out his contract). They just won't play him and will ban him from the dorms.
On September 05 2007 20:11 SuperJongMan wrote: If Casy's career ends, I'll quit all things SC related.
I might just do the same. Looking back over 2006, this is almost heart breaking to see how much promise Casy had, He quickly earned himself a name amongst one of my fav players and for him to leave like this would just be a damn shame
That starleague had way too many players, and way too many chances to let players back in after they'd lost.
On September 05 2007 12:13 Metal[x] wrote: im confused, if OGN isnt playing Casy - why cant he just leave OGN? then after a few months or whatever another team just pick him up? o_O
Casy basically said "I'm not playing for you, get me transfered". OGN tried, but other teams didn't agree with the terms (this could be because OGN made unreasonable demands, or simply because other teams didn't want casy that much). Then Casy came back after his personal troubles and said let me back, but the manager refused (again this could be because he's evil, or he doesn't want to go through the shit with Casy again, if Casy was really evil afterall).
So he can't go back, and no other team is willing to trade for him.
Are you telling me that all of the teams would have refused a paycut-taking Casy?
I wouldn't. It seems likely that OGN added in money or requested a trade.
I never really liked Casy much, he was sort of a one hit wonder and a cute face to me, or maybe I should've payed more attention to his gaming. Oh well, it always sucks to see someone I don't absolutely hate quit, I think his skills will diminish on ACE though, seems like everyone else' has, though I can understand why.
I wouldn't really say poor Casy. Obviously in the eyes of the coaches (and his team it seems) he lost track of the team mindset (especially if what the manager said about asking for more money is true). A team doesn't want a selfish player within itself. That doesn't promote a team environment, no matter how good the player.
I bet if given the chance he'd have made better decisions in the past.
EPT
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