With IEM done for the day, TL:A is here to fill your SC2 cravings! Unfortunately, due to some technical difficulties, TL:A has had to be moved to the EU server. Since the guest list for today was based on the US server, they are able to play on EU. As such, we will be picking opponents for qxc from IRC! Opponents will be selected from the channel #TL-Attack so be sure to run over there once the broadcast starts at 18:00 GMT (+00:00)!
I don't know if anyone can top TLOwnage, but I look forward to seeing what QXC will bring ... I hope he can bring some hilarious builds and amazing plays.
I just dont get the normal screen, at the top I can see a small edge of battlenet, but the rest is just bright green with a bit dodgy edge which just reveals the stream..
Tried 3 different browsers but the video still isn't showing. Get a weird distortion at the top of the screen in IE but that's it. Someone please whisper Chill and ask him to restart the stream.
On August 22 2010 04:45 Promises wrote: If you kill (say Feedback) a Medivac carrying a Thor does it die with it?
whenever you kill a medivac carrying anything the unit inside dies aswell
Yea I know but I wasnt sure about the Thor, partly because of the animation of it hanging under it, partly just because it's massive and it feels harsh ^^
what happened to the good old map-edited-DT, hidden-minimap, etc.
this is just retarded, all they do is making fun of the lower-skilled players, seeing qxc failing miserably with drops and i think i saw qxc losing a scv to probe harass, commentators didnt even mention this with a word. lame
I think the format of TLA needs to be tweaked or something. The games are pretty boring and they are drawn out way too long. Only the superior dry wit of Incontrol saves the format.
Seems like something is missing to make this truly entertaining.
On August 22 2010 05:20 fueNN wrote: what happened to the good old map-edited-DT, hidden-minimap, etc.
this is just retarded, all they do is making fun of the lower-skilled players, seeing qxc failing miserably with drops and i think i saw qxc losing a scv to probe harass, commentators didnt even mention this with a word. lame
This TL:A was good........ The format needs a bit of tweaking, and the guest needs to be a bit more animated. I love qxc as a player, but he's not the best on the mic.
You can't have a show of a lifetime, every two weeks, it doesn't work like that. It would be the show of a fortnight, unless somehow you are advertising that you are increasing our lifespans, several lifetimes.
On August 22 2010 05:20 fueNN wrote: what happened to the good old map-edited-DT, hidden-minimap, etc.
this is just retarded, all they do is making fun of the lower-skilled players, seeing qxc failing miserably with drops and i think i saw qxc losing a scv to probe harass, commentators didnt even mention this with a word. lame
Yeah, I noticed Socke killed an SCV as well and was waiting for the commentators to say something.
Still, I think TLA was very enjoyable. I liked seeing what kinds of stuff qxc could pull off, and I thought watching him own bad players was hilarious.
People are way too critical of players right now. The skill difference and experience level of the players just isn't there yet for the games themselves to be entertaining, but the Nony one was so hilarious it doesn't matter.
Looking forward to the VOD's didn't catch the event
The commentary was great, but I personally found the games to be boring.
I'd prefer to see qxc play more and screw around less. Perhaps find some handicap that lets him actually try while still delivering a reasonably close game? (team melee with better players maybe?)
I think the format of TLA needs to be tweaked or something. The games are pretty boring and they are drawn out way too long. Only the superior dry wit of Incontrol saves the format.
Seems like something is missing to make this truly entertaining.
Most of the time it was just the Incontrol-rips-into-everything-show, which is fun but it lacks that oomph of actually having the star guest feel like the star guest. I think a bit more structure would go a long way here. Thinking on the fly is all and well for the commentators, but it seems like the players are having enough trouble dealing with the talking-and-playing aspect without having to think up ways to execute bizarre strategies without having thought about it first. Letting the players have some control of the format and the way things will play out ahead of time could make them more comfortable and make it easier to get conversation flowing between the casters and the players.
It was still very fun to watch, though. The commentators did a great job filling the dead space. The problem with that, though, is how obvious it was that the commentators were good at talking through the dead space - that the show was still entertaining despite the sheer amount of time nothing interesting was happening is impressive, but it's probably not what people are tuning in to see.
ok show, but i don't think the "guest has to do strategy X this game" really works. maybe the games are more interesting if you impose some restrictions instead, e.g. "guest may not build tanks", etc
Suggestion: Next time (for one game) find a bronze/silver contestant with a mic and do a reversal - invite the bad player on vent and have the commentators feed him information on what to do and what the hero is doing. (Make sure you find someone who will be able to take a joke)
I think the shows have been great so far. One thing I would love to see though: Handicaps are constantly being mentioned. I'd like to see the pro play with the in-game handicap provided (the bar with 100%) I'm curious to see how pros could do with say a 70% or 60% handicap, and perhaps play bronze/silver leaguers with a 50% handicap.
Have you guys seen the episode of the goat show where they play on the Goat Show Arena? (It's a UMS map where they put in a whole bunch of random handicaps that you can enable with dash commands once the game starts. Like lightshow, where it spam pings in random locations in the minimap for the star, making it practically unusable for him. Or zoo, where the noob gets to spawn critters in the star's base.) I laughed about 1000 times over the course of that two hours.
TL Attack has had a serious decline in quality for this third season. I’ve only watched the first so I don’t know what happened in the second but I can say that this new one disregards everything that made the first season as amazing as it was.
The problem right now is that all of the games feel like work and there is no excitement. Incontrol really isn’t helping with that; in fact, I feel that Incontrol is cancerous to the whole show (at least with his current approach). The way in which he commentates is very unprofessional. Marginalizing the guest players really dulls things down and so do all the completely irrelevant references. I mean, how are telling your viewers about how some person from Dubai would dump any girl who watches the show in any way conducive to its well-being.
I think this stems into the bigger issue of how little professionalism is being put into TL Attack overall. I mean it really doesn’t seem like anyone responsible on the production side of things has any ambition or passion for what is going on to the point where the show has just boiled down to Chill and Incontrol shooting the shit while some player works through a set of games.
I really miss the old format of players fighting with everything they have, often cheesing with whole-hearted effort, trying to claim the prized mousepad at stake as their own, the lobbies full within seconds of creation with players desperate to play a game, and most of all what I miss is the great social chemistry that once was between the starred guest and motivated commentators.
I really miss the old format of players fighting with everything they have, often cheesing with whole-hearted effort, trying to claim the prized mousepad at stake as their own, the lobbies full within seconds of creation with players desperate to play a game, and most of all what I miss is the great social chemistry that once was between the starred guest and motivated commentators.
I've never really watched any of the X attack shows (not the original Bnet Attack, nor TL attack), but I think for this point, at least, the blame rests with Blizzard for removing the chat channels from the game...
The problem right now is that all of the games feel like work and there is no excitement. Incontrol really isn’t helping with that; in fact, I feel that Incontrol is cancerous to the whole show (at least with his current approach). The way in which he commentates is very unprofessional. Marginalizing the guest players really dulls things down and so do all the completely irrelevant references. I mean, how are telling your viewers about how some person from Dubai would dump any girl who watches the show in any way conducive to its well-being.
I personally find iNcontroL to be the best part of TL Attack currently. So far Noony and qxc have both been lackluster in commentating and the ridiculous scrutinizing of the Guest and random comments liven the mood. Due to the real lack of commentating from the Guests thus far I feel that the current mood of the show is forced.
When I think of TL attack I generally think of the Guest commentating his own standard game along with the 2 actual commentators trying to distract him(like pointing out each error or questioning the play of the Guest). When you have the Guest trying to purposely do ridiculous strats and just not talking like at all the whole time it sort of removes the feel of the David v Distracted Goliath the show is supposed to represent.
Shows definitely lack something. I don't know what it is. We either need a more talkative guest or to just wait until people get better than the average players or something. I've read the suggestions and I don't feel they would solve the problem.
I think it's either the guests not talking along with the casters like they're total ballers not having to concentrate whilst squshing some newbies or the fact that the game is so young that the skill gap hasn't widend enough that a show like this can exploit the 'bad but think they're good' players that make the show an entertaining thing to watch. I think Chill and Incontrol are doing a fine job trying to bait the guest with questions and going off on tangents ignoring the game completely (its a nice balnce to have because the show concept screams non-proffionalism) but its a two way street and the guests have to be confident enough in their play to pull off the crazy stuff they can do with their race and still be entertaining to the viewers.
Thanks for letting me play tonight. It was fun to watch thoughout and I think qxc is a pretty funny guy when he starts talking post games but the during game conversation is what people want to see.
Thats all really. Thanks for telling me I have potential (LOL)
I enjoyed both this week and last week, love the Chill + Inc combo. I think Inc's exasperated coach-style comments can actually help this community quite a bit. Feedback vs casters... DUH. More than one overseer...DUH. Seeing someone get owned and then having someone extremely simply say what could have saved them can actually be very beneficial for a lot of people.
One way I think TLA could be improved is by using community maps. The Blizzard maps are boring and we all know them. There are tons of good looking maps in the SC2 map section already. It would be a great way to get even more of the community involved and promote some good, creative melee map making. It would also be an additional thing for the casters and player to talk about, as there is occasional dead air. The map makers could benefit greatly from pro player feedback. Collecting and selecting the maps ahead of time, making sure they are on the server, etc would create extra work for the people producing TLA but I feel it would be worth it and I'm sure there are lots of people here that would be willing to help out.
I really like Chill and Incontrol, I cought me watching TV with the sound being really low and while listening to the cast, now and then I did actualy watch. The problem I think is that StarCraft II is just too young.
The skill distance between a good player(the TL ATTACKER) and some random noob is just not big enough yet. That means that when trying funny, crazy showtactics it becomes hard to pull them off and often stretch among a long period of time because the first attack did not work, then the "noob" causes some trouble as well, so it becomes a little boring after a while.
I do think that TL Attack coustom maps, could help this temporarly. You could design the maps in such a fashion that you can guarantee faster games and yet still being able to pull of the crazy stategies. But I can really tell, I play Broodwar still, so I only watch SC II
But after all, I liked this tl attack and I think qxc is a funny lad :>
Probably waiting until players get better is the best option. I would hold off the TL: Attack until then. Unless you get the powerhouses like IdrA and stuff in TL:A, it won't be too interesting because these "good, but not retardedly amazing" players can't pull off crazy shit, and the game hasn't developed enough to separate your average Diamond player from a tournament competing player. Obviously, there is a separation, but not enough to make stupid builds work.
If you can get IdrA on, it would be great. It seems that Zerg/Protoss will put on the best TL: Attack because they have so many not-viable compositions. Only Banelings versus Protoss. Mass Queens. 1/2 Base Ultra Rush. Mass Spine Crawler...ect. ect.
This show was fine but I really wasn't a fan of incontrol's 1. terran bashing 2. bad comments. Kind of meh although qxc was hilarious at times, despite being way too tryhard with the no-talking during micro
Also: what happened to the randomized handicaps? I was always impressed how the hero was able to beat some guys with like 3-4 handicaps attached.
Though as was mentioned before, the skill gap isn't that great yet, so stuff like 'no MULE' or 'no reactors' could pretty much devastate the hero. (no MULE much more than no reactors of course )
I for one would like a come back of these features.
On August 22 2010 12:15 disformation wrote: Also: what happened to the randomized handicaps? I was always impressed how the hero was able to beat some guys with like 3-4 handicaps attached.
Though as was mentioned before, the skill gap isn't that great yet, so stuff like 'no MULE' or 'no reactors' could pretty much devastate the hero. (no MULE much more than no reactors of course )
I for one would like a come back of these features.
That was TL Arena...this is TL Attack, they are different.
I guess it's a silly expectation but it would have been nice to see more wins from qxc. Still I like how he actually talked (not like nony) and even took the jabs from incontrol and chill. He was def a good sport about it.
On August 22 2010 12:59 lac29 wrote: I guess it's a silly expectation but it would have been nice to see more wins from qxc. Still I like how he actually talked (not like nony) and even took the jabs from incontrol and chill. He was def a good sport about it.
but he did completely ridiculous strats right from the start man, maaaaad respect for that
nony actually tried until he got an advantage then went from there.
feedback ummm
more questions for QXC! or whoever you have on, they're the star they need to be harassed all the time.
encourage the star to random or offrace at least once especially if you are aware the person they're playing against is bad/not the smurf
try to force them to use any unused/underused features of the game (though you guys did push for this often enough, it is sadly harder for a terran to get funky)
It's pretty lame when the guest tries to do some wacky strategy and epically fails at it. I mean, I know he's trying to show off how good he is by beating noobs in an entertaining way, but when it backfires and he loses to the noobs, it just looks like 2 silver league players going at it. It should be a prerequisite that the guests are good enough to actually win most of their games.
On August 22 2010 14:24 Luddite wrote: It's pretty lame when the guest tries to do some wacky strategy and epically fails at it. I mean, I know he's trying to show off how good he is by beating noobs in an entertaining way, but when it backfires and he loses to the noobs, it just looks like 2 silver league players going at it. It should be a prerequisite that the guests are good enough to actually win most of their games.
... What? If qxc isn't good enough to be on this show then you standards are absurd.
On August 22 2010 14:24 Luddite wrote: It's pretty lame when the guest tries to do some wacky strategy and epically fails at it. I mean, I know he's trying to show off how good he is by beating noobs in an entertaining way, but when it backfires and he loses to the noobs, it just looks like 2 silver league players going at it. It should be a prerequisite that the guests are good enough to actually win most of their games.
... What? If qxc isn't good enough to be on this show then you standards are absurd.
luddite, wtf??? have you even watched any of qxc's tournament matches. he's one of, if not THE best terrans on the american servers. watch his games against IntoTheRainbow in the king of the beta tournament. incredible.
oh, and loved all the ridiculous strats even if they failed + chill and incontrol were phenomenal as always.
On August 22 2010 09:32 Chill wrote: Shows definitely lack something. I don't know what it is. We either need a more talkative guest or to just wait until people get better than the average players or something. I've read the suggestions and I don't feel they would solve the problem.
edit: I Missed this so I was watching the vods
This took A LOT of effort for me to watch and I really wanted to watch it because I was on vent with Kevin when he was trying to think up stuff to do. Theres a few things in particular
The stream had no tabs open just leave it on production the whole time or something so we can see what hte other player is doing since they tended to focus on the star which is fine.
qxc didn't feel like he was the star, Incontrol kind of dominated the entire thing, and by this before he showed up with his mic being borked qxc was having fun and talking a lot and cracking jokes but the instant incontrol showed up and started constantly making fun of him for everything he said and did he just shut down. Then Incontrol tried to get him to talk more by making fun of him more so he stopped talking even more it was kind of a vicious cycle and hard to watch.
I feel like the guest should be the star of the show but Incontrol was trying too hard to be the star :/ If you were using vent please don't because there were issues with not being able to hear when you guys tried to talk at the same time which the few times that qxc did try to talk I couldn't hear him because incontrol was talking at the same time that kind of thing.
qxc was trying to do fun things but you guys kept focusing too much on how is this isn't going to work which takes away a lot of the suspense of knowing what he's going to do ahead of time then telling us it wont work. It's kind of like why are we watching then?
On August 22 2010 14:24 Luddite wrote: It's pretty lame when the guest tries to do some wacky strategy and epically fails at it. I mean, I know he's trying to show off how good he is by beating noobs in an entertaining way, but when it backfires and he loses to the noobs, it just looks like 2 silver league players going at it. It should be a prerequisite that the guests are good enough to actually win most of their games.
... What? If qxc isn't good enough to be on this show then you standards are absurd.
I meant, good enough to win even the games where they're using ridiculous strategies. The first game was like, "oh wow an scv rush i wonder how this will turn out? Oh, it turns out that qxc got his ass kicked by a complete noob." There was no chance that could have ever worked against anyone who has played the game before.
For me the most entertaining show was the one with TLO doing placement matches, since not only did he use rediculous strategies, but it was clear that he put some thought into them and actually made them work.
On August 22 2010 14:24 Luddite wrote: It's pretty lame when the guest tries to do some wacky strategy and epically fails at it. I mean, I know he's trying to show off how good he is by beating noobs in an entertaining way, but when it backfires and he loses to the noobs, it just looks like 2 silver league players going at it. It should be a prerequisite that the guests are good enough to actually win most of their games.
... What? If qxc isn't good enough to be on this show then you standards are absurd.
I meant, good enough to win even the games where they're using ridiculous strategies. The first game was like, "oh wow an scv rush i wonder how this will turn out? Oh, it turns out that qxc got his ass kicked by a complete noob." There was no chance that could have ever worked against anyone who has played the game before.
For me the most entertaining show was the one with TLO doing placement matches, since not only did he use rediculous strategies, but it was clear that he put some thought into them and actually made them work.
Those strategies only work in placement cuz you get matched vs bronze players who have never really played the game effectively. THe thing about TLA in Broodwar was the players knew the game kind of they just weren't good at it. Go watch some of the old episodes they were trying to do proper builds but the other player just had way better mechanics and that's tougher to do in sc2 unless you bring in just bronze players. And if every player is bronze then the suspense of "OH will this work?" is gone. It becomes oh what can I bash people with today? It's actually pretty difficult to set up a good TLA and seeing as this is their second try with the new game cut them some slack.
On August 22 2010 14:24 Luddite wrote: It's pretty lame when the guest tries to do some wacky strategy and epically fails at it. I mean, I know he's trying to show off how good he is by beating noobs in an entertaining way, but when it backfires and he loses to the noobs, it just looks like 2 silver league players going at it. It should be a prerequisite that the guests are good enough to actually win most of their games.
... What? If qxc isn't good enough to be on this show then you standards are absurd.
I meant, good enough to win even the games where they're using ridiculous strategies. The first game was like, "oh wow an scv rush i wonder how this will turn out? Oh, it turns out that qxc got his ass kicked by a complete noob." There was no chance that could have ever worked against anyone who has played the game before.
For me the most entertaining show was the one with TLO doing placement matches, since not only did he use rediculous strategies, but it was clear that he put some thought into them and actually made them work.
It's like you didn't listen to the start of the stream. They pretty much told qxc to not worry about winning and just do crazy things since Tyler was too concerned about winning and not putting on a show. The point is to put on a show of a lifetime. Your lifetime.
On August 22 2010 14:24 Luddite wrote: It's pretty lame when the guest tries to do some wacky strategy and epically fails at it. I mean, I know he's trying to show off how good he is by beating noobs in an entertaining way, but when it backfires and he loses to the noobs, it just looks like 2 silver league players going at it. It should be a prerequisite that the guests are good enough to actually win most of their games.
... What? If qxc isn't good enough to be on this show then you standards are absurd.
I meant, good enough to win even the games where they're using ridiculous strategies. The first game was like, "oh wow an scv rush i wonder how this will turn out? Oh, it turns out that qxc got his ass kicked by a complete noob." There was no chance that could have ever worked against anyone who has played the game before.
For me the most entertaining show was the one with TLO doing placement matches, since not only did he use rediculous strategies, but it was clear that he put some thought into them and actually made them work.
Those strategies only work in placement cuz you get matched vs bronze players who have never really played the game effectively. THe thing about TLA in Broodwar was the players knew the game kind of they just weren't good at it. Go watch some of the old episodes they were trying to do proper builds but the other player just had way better mechanics and that's tougher to do in sc2 unless you bring in just bronze players. And if every player is bronze then the suspense of "OH will this work?" is gone. It becomes oh what can I bash people with today? It's actually pretty difficult to set up a good TLA and seeing as this is their second try with the new game cut them some slack.
How is it hard to find matches in SC2 where the other player sort of knows the game but doesn't have good mechanics? That's like, 99% of SC2 players right there.
And strategies like carrier rush or ghost nuke rush... well they're not exactly great strategies, but at least I can see how they might possibly work. But an scv rush, or building 1 BC at a time in a TvT just... no matter how bad the opponent is I can't imagine that ever working. Even someone doing their first placement match would probably be able to beat that.
On August 22 2010 14:24 Luddite wrote: It's pretty lame when the guest tries to do some wacky strategy and epically fails at it. I mean, I know he's trying to show off how good he is by beating noobs in an entertaining way, but when it backfires and he loses to the noobs, it just looks like 2 silver league players going at it. It should be a prerequisite that the guests are good enough to actually win most of their games.
... What? If qxc isn't good enough to be on this show then you standards are absurd.
I meant, good enough to win even the games where they're using ridiculous strategies. The first game was like, "oh wow an scv rush i wonder how this will turn out? Oh, it turns out that qxc got his ass kicked by a complete noob." There was no chance that could have ever worked against anyone who has played the game before.
For me the most entertaining show was the one with TLO doing placement matches, since not only did he use rediculous strategies, but it was clear that he put some thought into them and actually made them work.
It's like you didn't listen to the start of the stream. They pretty much told qxc to not worry about winning and just do crazy things since Tyler was too concerned about winning and not putting on a show. The point is to put on a show of a lifetime. Your lifetime.
I don't really care if he wins or not, but there should at least be a good chance of him winning. If he's just going to mess around with random nonsense then i mean... i can do that. Let's see what happens when I attack with 1 ling at a time and never build drones! Hmm didn't work? LOL that was fun, show of a lifetime lol.
On August 22 2010 14:24 Luddite wrote: It's pretty lame when the guest tries to do some wacky strategy and epically fails at it. I mean, I know he's trying to show off how good he is by beating noobs in an entertaining way, but when it backfires and he loses to the noobs, it just looks like 2 silver league players going at it. It should be a prerequisite that the guests are good enough to actually win most of their games.
... What? If qxc isn't good enough to be on this show then you standards are absurd.
I meant, good enough to win even the games where they're using ridiculous strategies. The first game was like, "oh wow an scv rush i wonder how this will turn out? Oh, it turns out that qxc got his ass kicked by a complete noob." There was no chance that could have ever worked against anyone who has played the game before.
For me the most entertaining show was the one with TLO doing placement matches, since not only did he use rediculous strategies, but it was clear that he put some thought into them and actually made them work.
Those strategies only work in placement cuz you get matched vs bronze players who have never really played the game effectively. THe thing about TLA in Broodwar was the players knew the game kind of they just weren't good at it. Go watch some of the old episodes they were trying to do proper builds but the other player just had way better mechanics and that's tougher to do in sc2 unless you bring in just bronze players. And if every player is bronze then the suspense of "OH will this work?" is gone. It becomes oh what can I bash people with today? It's actually pretty difficult to set up a good TLA and seeing as this is their second try with the new game cut them some slack.
How is it hard to find matches in SC2 where the other player sort of knows the game but doesn't have good mechanics? That's like, 99% of SC2 players right there.
And strategies like carrier rush or ghost nuke rush... well they're not exactly great strategies, but at least I can see how they might possibly work. But an scv rush, or building 1 BC at a time in a TvT just... no matter how bad the opponent is I can't imagine that ever working. Even someone doing their first placement match would probably be able to beat that.
You know that guy who has 1000 wins in bronze? He starts the game sends his workers to attack and leaves (alt + tab) and he's at about a 45% winrate he did it to get the 1000 wins achievement. The problem is bronze players are BAD there is no contest in a player like qxc beating them with anything even a scv rush cuz he has better control. So you have to find that medium area inbetween.
The strategies and ridiculousness is all and well, but it doesn't matter if it doesn't sound like the player is having a good time. Inc and Chill are great and are hilarious, but they don't seem to be able to get the players to relax and get into the spirit of things. Qxc seemed uncomfortable with the constant riffing and didn't really get into the flow of things, and it was awkward for a large amount of the time with Nony as well. The chemistry just isn't there. If you're not going to specifically pick players that will naturally partake in the trashtalking, I think the commentators will have to be a bit more accomodating towards their guests.
On August 22 2010 14:24 Luddite wrote: It's pretty lame when the guest tries to do some wacky strategy and epically fails at it. I mean, I know he's trying to show off how good he is by beating noobs in an entertaining way, but when it backfires and he loses to the noobs, it just looks like 2 silver league players going at it. It should be a prerequisite that the guests are good enough to actually win most of their games.
... What? If qxc isn't good enough to be on this show then you standards are absurd.
I meant, good enough to win even the games where they're using ridiculous strategies. The first game was like, "oh wow an scv rush i wonder how this will turn out? Oh, it turns out that qxc got his ass kicked by a complete noob." There was no chance that could have ever worked against anyone who has played the game before.
For me the most entertaining show was the one with TLO doing placement matches, since not only did he use rediculous strategies, but it was clear that he put some thought into them and actually made them work.
It's like you didn't listen to the start of the stream. They pretty much told qxc to not worry about winning and just do crazy things since Tyler was too concerned about winning and not putting on a show. The point is to put on a show of a lifetime. Your lifetime.
I don't really care if he wins or not, but there should at least be a good chance of him winning. If he's just going to mess around with random nonsense then i mean... i can do that. Let's see what happens when I attack with 1 ling at a time and never build drones! Hmm didn't work? LOL that was fun, show of a lifetime lol.
Aside from the first game I think he had a pretty good shot winning all of them using the strategies he did. It's like you have standards that can't be met. I bet he would have won the first game if the player was different, say the one on the drop map.
I agree with Raelcun, Incontrol seemed to be, well, in control of the whole entire event and if qxc tried to say anything he was instantly bashed and actually sounded upset at some points.
On August 22 2010 15:37 TipperT wrote: I agree with Raelcun, Incontrol seemed to be, well, in control of the whole entire event and if qxc tried to say anything he was instantly bashed and actually sounded upset at some points.
At one point he even tried to say something along the lines of well it's hard to talk with you insulting me but Incontrol talked over him :/
Not to be too negative here, but most of the good players out there didn't get as good as they are, because of their rhetoric. It's a bit much to expect the guest stars to be amazing at the game; good enough to beat very competent players even while doing ridiculous strategies, while being high-class entertainers at the same time.
There's always going to be a certain amount of 'awkwardness' in these shows, because, on top of the fact that (again) the guests aren't there for their public speaking skills, there's always going to be times when the players are actually trying to concentrate on what they're doing, so the casters (Chill and iNc do a great job btw, I actually tune in to listen to them more so than seeing the silly strats) will have to fill a lot of dead air and have a fair few of their questions go unanswered.
The reason I like Chill and iNc's casting thus far, is because they genuinely seem to find those 'dead air' moments funny; those moments where the guest doesn't respond, or just says "nicks!!", for no reason. That's what makes it entertaining, it's only awkward if they are feeling awkward, and they clearly don't.
I would, however, say that it sometimes feels a bit too much like 'impromptu attack', as iNcontrol so nicely called it, because the structure is a little bit lacking at the moment. But it is early days yet. I'm sure it will settle down and the casters and guests (particularly) will be a bit more relaxed and the whole thing will flow a bit more smoothly.
LOL I was laughing my ass off every time Harry said something it was pure gold. -This is boring (said it like ten times) sO TRUE. omg some parts were ok but for the most part this wasn't fun to watch. -I wouldn't date a chick who watched TLA (LOL)
I do not deny nor confirm said stories in part 7. However, I will say this. I wasn't asked to leave the bar, I went outside to look for a liquor store to get some cigarettes (which I just wanted a couple and felt I owed some to my friends who I bummed some off previously). And when I came back I was denied at the door.
some pretty critical criticism guys. You realize this is a really fun event where we are supposed to mock the guests as a distraction right? The accommodation remarks and me being "cancerous" seem a bit overzealous.
Don't get me wrong I will take the fact that I am poisonous to this event under consideration but I feel like a lot of people "get it" whereas those that are like "this was so rude!" and "incontrol was trying to be a star too much" are missing the point
On August 22 2010 21:33 {88}iNcontroL wrote: some pretty critical criticism guys. You realize this is a really fun event where we are supposed to mock the guests as a distraction right? The accommodation remarks and me being "cancerous" seem a bit overzealous.
Don't get me wrong I will take the fact that I am poisonous to this event under consideration but I feel like a lot of people "get it" whereas those that are like "this was so rude!" and "incontrol was trying to be a star too much" are missing the point
Yeah really, you where being funny rude. I laughed! Didn't seemed to notice that QXC was akward about you making fun of him. it's part of the joke.. I LoL'ed
Cause that what the show is a little about, Chill & Incontrol being rude!!!
Will bring in suggestions, ofcourse,
Try and fix the now everybody is talking moments. dunno how, but try something? maybe ask husky and HD.. lol...
Get a pro to micro in team melee and insult the macro player for doing horrible :D:D or maybe do these matches vs bronze players. to bad the show of a life time would then only be 1 hour.. 30 minute delay + a 30 minute show
And will end with some shout out to; qxc for doing is homework and testing some BO before the TLA chill & incontrol for giving us the show of a life time!
On August 22 2010 21:33 {88}iNcontroL wrote: some pretty critical criticism guys. You realize this is a really fun event where we are supposed to mock the guests as a distraction right? The accommodation remarks and me being "cancerous" seem a bit overzealous.
It took me a moment to find the search bar to see if anyone really did call you 'cancerous.' Don't worry about that too much. If you do anything interesting with a distinctive enough style, some people will like it and some people won't. I think that most of your audience enjoys listening to that sort of witty banter, and the reason you're drawing so much flack for it is for two reasons:
1. It made the guest uncomfortable. 2. It was, for most of the show, the only interesting thing going on.
There's lots of ways to fix both of those, and then all the problems people have will go away. I'd much rather think of something to work your style into the show than see you cut out. Despite all the negative feedback, the show was still very watchable (in large part thanks to you) and I don't think I'm alone in saying I'd hate to see the next episode without you.
On August 22 2010 21:33 {88}iNcontroL wrote: some pretty critical criticism guys. You realize this is a really fun event where we are supposed to mock the guests as a distraction right? The accommodation remarks and me being "cancerous" seem a bit overzealous.
Don't get me wrong I will take the fact that I am poisonous to this event under consideration but I feel like a lot of people "get it" whereas those that are like "this was so rude!" and "incontrol was trying to be a star too much" are missing the point
i don't understand what people expect of incontrol. i mean no disrespect to nony or qxc but they aren't entertaining to listen to in the least bit. if incontrol wasn't there insulting ppl and making funny comments i would have stopped watching both TLA episodes after the first video.
On August 22 2010 21:33 {88}iNcontroL wrote: some pretty critical criticism guys. You realize this is a really fun event where we are supposed to mock the guests as a distraction right? The accommodation remarks and me being "cancerous" seem a bit overzealous.
It took me a moment to find the search bar to see if anyone really did call you 'cancerous.' Don't worry about that too much. If you do anything interesting with a distinctive enough style, some people will like it and some people won't. I think that most of your audience enjoys listening to that sort of witty banter, and the reason you're drawing so much flack for it is for two reasons:
1. It made the guest uncomfortable. 2. It was, for most of the show, the only interesting thing going on.
There's lots of ways to fix both of those, and then all the problems people have will go away. I'd much rather think of something to work your style into the show than see you cut out. Despite all the negative feedback, the show was still very watchable (in large part thanks to you) and I don't think I'm alone in saying I'd hate to see the next episode without you.
Very well said. At this point SC1 TLA is very different from SC2 TLA. I don't think you can expect silly openings to work until you actually get some advantage. And for the most part, the difference between a pro SC2 player and a normal plat/diamond player isn't that big.
A few people have mentioned it before, Incontrol is way too dominant. I like his relentless barage of comedic chatter, but he needs to learn his place in an event like this. He should just shut the fuck up at certain points. Part of me thinks that he lacks the required control and should just be replaced with a more facilitating personality. Day9 would also be a horrendous mismatch. I really loved all the old TLattacks. It's a little bit sad to see the quality deteriorate like this.
On August 23 2010 00:10 wadadde wrote: A few people have mentioned it before, Incontrol is way too dominant. I like his relentless barage of comedic chatter, but he needs to learn his place in an event like this. He should just shut the fuck up at certain points. Part of me thinks that he lacks the required control and should just be replaced with a more facilitating personality. Day9 would also be a horrendous mismatch. I really loved all the old TLattacks. It's a little bit sad to see the quality deteriorate like this.
It wouldn't be my place to temp ban you or warn you for this post but saying "needs to shut the fuck up" or "learn his place" can come off as a real dickish way of saying what otherwise would be a completely acceptable criticism in a thread where criticism could be helpful.
Please be less the douche and more the help in the future.
On August 22 2010 21:33 {88}iNcontroL wrote: some pretty critical criticism guys. You realize this is a really fun event where we are supposed to mock the guests as a distraction right? The accommodation remarks and me being "cancerous" seem a bit overzealous.
Don't get me wrong I will take the fact that I am poisonous to this event under consideration but I feel like a lot of people "get it" whereas those that are like "this was so rude!" and "incontrol was trying to be a star too much" are missing the point
No, I did not understand that you had to mock the guest as a distraction. I think you had to distract the guest. The mocking part, or the emphasis on mocking the guest is an innovation, as far as I can tell. Also, you're not going to get any kind of conversation going with a guest if they don't feel they're getting any room to talk the way they usually do, AKA when they're not constantly on the backfoot.
edit: sorry about any earlier dickishness on my part
On August 22 2010 21:33 {88}iNcontroL wrote: some pretty critical criticism guys. You realize this is a really fun event where we are supposed to mock the guests as a distraction right? The accommodation remarks and me being "cancerous" seem a bit overzealous.
Don't get me wrong I will take the fact that I am poisonous to this event under consideration but I feel like a lot of people "get it" whereas those that are like "this was so rude!" and "incontrol was trying to be a star too much" are missing the point
I don't want people to feel nervous to criticize us, but at the same time I never felt like Inc was baselessly or maliciously insulting qxc.
On August 23 2010 00:55 {88}iNcontroL wrote: I want criticism too
I just don't think calling me cancerous or needing to "shut the fuck up" really helps lol
Do the players know that you're going to be mocking them before going in? Obviously older SC1 players would but at times qxc sounded confused or out of his element. I say that because he would be mocked when he talked, mocked if he was losing, when he tried and started to micro he would be mocked for not talking, etc. I'm not complaining, because I enjoyed all of it, but TLA seems more like starcraft's version of comedy central's roasts on celebrities. The selected 'hero's' personality really matters but most high end starcraft 2 players don't usually double as comedians.
If the goal is to put on the show of a lifetime I'd like to see more organization and more of a focus on entertainment. Especially reading this thread it seems like TLA doesn't have an identity. Some people want to see pros do stupid things and win, but complain when it doesn't work out (ie; game 1), and others think the insults were too much as shown in this thread.
Neither you or chill strike me as the kind of people who actually want to do pre-show work but having some kind of screening process would be a benefit. For example, if game 1 was against a true bronze league player I bet qxc would have had a good shot at winning while still putting on a great show.
By the way, my favorite parts are when you mock the opponent's thought process. "I'll get carriers! That's the counter to ravens!"
/edit:
Also, I think the vast majority just enjoy it. Forums are usually just reserved for those people who want to complain or voice their opinion while the other 5,000+ people had a laugh and are waiting for the next one.
I enjoyed this episode of TLA, and wouldn't have come here to make any negative comments unless the hosts had specifically asked for feedback. So having said that,
1. Please issue a torrent for each episode, and make the video higher quality (on youtube and the torrent) 2. I think this week's disorganization made it less entertaining. A certain amount of disorganization is funny, too much of it makes the show drag. 3. Take all opportunities to make fun of the participants. There were a lot of chat messages that went unread and un-mocked during some of the matches. These comments were hilarious in S3E1. 4. Involve the player more during the matches.
Well played by Qxc, he had a plan with some fun builds and I really enjoyed his play.
I think the commentary deteriated a bit from episode 1, it seemed less like mocking and more like being mean especially from incontrol.
It also takes alot of the fun out of it when incontrol was always saying its over, hurry up and leave, etc even when qxc was about to scv rush or when it was a close game like the first one. Qxc fighting from behind after a failed scv rush was an entertaining prospect that was kind of ruined by incontrol prematurely calling it off.
I think the most important point I'm trying to get across is there is a difference between mocking and insulting, I think an understanding of this would greatly improve future TLA's. Also, insulting Qxc is awkard and not funny, insulting the other player is hilarious. They gave up their right to respect when they agreed to play It seemed like most of the insulting in this particular episode was just complaining about how boring it is, complaining about boredom makes it alot more boring.
edit: maybe a poll on favourite game would help gauge the popular parts of the show. Mine were scv rush, mass raven, mass ghost and team game. Oh and I think you should have played twilight fortress or some other unconvential map like qxc suggested.
If the games were casted from replays, then the guest progammer could be more talkative, but that would remove the whole "distracting the pro" during the match. What if you still did the live commentary/distraction, and then instead of posting the VODs right away, cast the replays as well, or more specifically, cast the recorded stream, so you can make fun of your own comments during the live stream? That'd add "value" to the VODs in the sense that people who watch the livestream would have incentive to watch the VODs as well, and it'd give the pro an opportunity to explain their choices or be talkative while not playing.
I think a good basic format for the show could help, say start your pro off against known mid-level players and go up from there. Let him play his game, no crazy strats/unit comps for 3 or so games of increasing competition. This way we're guarenteed to see our pro's excellent play. Perhaps use this as a build-up to him against another pro, which he will know about beforehand, because both smurf matches so far have been pretty lopsided/ handicapped by show induced strategies. This game can then be followed by noob crushing, with a possible smurf mixed in. Just a thought.
I feel that the pro is put in an unwinnable situation, we all want him to win/talk/use crazy strategies all at the same time, and only so many people can do this at a high level. The game is so new, along with Bnet 2.0 that I'm sure it will take some time to flesh things out.
Love the show, zero problems with Chill or InControl as commentators, some people are a little too sensitive around here.
How about a Caster Edition of TLA, where the guest pro plays a bunch of casters, e.g. Day[9], HD, Husky, etc? Then invite everyone to recast the matches. Should be entertaining.
Edit: Showing my n00bness for the moment, does the TL community use "caster" to mean anyone who (broad)casts games, a.k.a. streamers, or to mean those who provide commentary , a.k.a. commentators, or it could mean either based on context? Just curious if my idea should be called "Caster Edition" or "Commentator Edition"...
qxc was a HUGE improvement over NonY(or Tyler w/e), he had alot better personality for TL:A, so i suggest that when you pick future players, your sure that there is a flow and they can talk and have fun with it
or just get Artosis and let Incontrol/Chill have their evil ways, that would be amazing
I enjoyed it. At least inControl and Chill are entertaining enough to replace some of the previous excitement factors like the chat channels.
I think the only change should be a change of the crazy strategies so that they aren't necessarily doomed to fail right away like the BC rush. I did enjoy the matches on weird maps though.
I honestly enjoyed watching the micro in the last game the most. after a series of failed cheese attempts it was awesome just to watch the scv's and mules all die to 2 units.
As for the commentating... good job guys It was enjoyable, I do think InControl took over a bit too much but it fills the silence so I think it's also a needed evil. Still love the random stories though great job guys :D
I think the challengers were actually TOO good for this as well, you need worse players so the cheese does more damage xD
Ya, I also agree the challengers need to be worse, this episode seemed like it was all mid-Diamond and upper-Platinum players. It was missing something, maybe it was the fact it was Terran, I dunno. Time to go all BiggerT, no scratch that, BiggestT and Azzcontrol for next episode to make up for this last one
My favorite TL attack was with Xiaozi (with Chill+Hotbid), who was a very mild mannered player who did funny in-game things to his opponents. Don't feel you need lots of trashtalk to make it entertaining. I also agree with the sentiment that it might be a bit "too soon" to reintroduce TL attack, give the game and the players more time to develop.
I think both commentators did a good job. I think qxc was a good guest too. He went out of his way to play in unusual ways for entertainment value. The other side of this was that sometimes the pacing in the games suffered, as I'm sure you realize. I'm not really sure if there is anything that can be done to remedy that though, short of imposing time limits, but that probably would not be good. Actually, it might be amusing if the guest did a 'ladder' ffa. In my times doing it I've found the skill level to be quite low so I've actually won by doing weird stuff like teching straight to Brood Lords.
Oh, and by the way I made this Ultralisk video a while ago that proves that they are balanced.
I really hate to make negative posts. Usually I'm as diplomatic in my answers as possible, but today I'm going to take a break from that. Anyone who thinks that iNcontroL or Chill were being too harsh on qxc really need to man the fuck up.
For every "poke" that iNcontroL made against qxc, he gave him at LEAST one compliment. By no means was he just "being mean". Part of the nature of TL Attack is making fun of mistakes. If everyone just went into a game, played fine, and then gg'ed and left - it would be boring. It's all in good fun. The pros know going into this event that they are going to be played with - imo they should be prepared to give as good as they get. Sure, the pros aren't on there for their public speaking skills (and the casters ARE), but that's part of the fun.
Some people are saying that iNcontroL was too dominating in his cast ... but he was just filling a void that was there. If the other people in the game started saying something, I can guarantee with 100% certainty that he would have let them speak. The fact that he was confident doesn't mean he was "trying to steal the show". Confidence isn't arrogance. The idea that he's cancerous is absurd. Some people may not understand his type of humor, but that isn't his fault. I'll drop that topic with that.
Some things that I think would really add to the cast would be to either:
A) Add a third caster B) Force the guest to participate in conversation more C) Get a guest on the show that's a little more talkative
qxc was worlds better than Tyler, probably because his mic actually worked
Just wanted to say that I like it the way it is and would enjoy to hear more casting from Incontrol in general, whom I first heard as a co-caster in some MLG matches during Beta. You're fun! (Not that I don't enjoy BiggerT, but it seems Inc got quite a bit of flaming in this thread which I wanted to say I don't agree with.)
As others have said, the player could be included more in the conversation. The interrogation part worked well imo, you could do more of that.
I'm surprised at the amount of criticism in this thread, I thought the episode was hilarious right from the start. The guest and the challengers should definitely be made fun of as much as possible
My only criticism was the fact that there was so much dicking around between games, waiting on players etc. It was fine watching it on youtube because I could skip to the games but it would have been really annoying if I were watching it live. Still at least there was no German rappers.
Another great TL Attack, I don't think the tone was off, but for those of us who do not know how well Inc knows qxc, some things might seem disrespectful/harsh.
For some constructive criticism/suggestions: - I liked a lot the part of having the noobs write something about themselves, shame that was not possible this time. - Some more elaborate assignments might be nice, not just: make this one unit and win, but stuff like (just some random things): block vision of his mineral line with patrolling buildings. Or Yamato 5 zerglings, for sure people can come up with better ideas (maybe suggestions should be posted in the thread?). - Play a 2v2, with the guest and either Chill or Inc, and the other caster and someone else on the other side (melee or not). - I'd love to see you make a team of 4, and do one 4v4 placement match.
But I'm already looking forward to the next one (in 2 weeks?).
On August 23 2010 00:55 {88}iNcontroL wrote: I want criticism too
I just don't think calling me cancerous or needing to "shut the fuck up" really helps lol
Just FYI I meant to say that the way you were handling the show was cancerous to it, not you as a person. In case you did take it personally, which I don’t know you well enough to decide upon, you sound like a pretty cool guy and definitely have a knack with humor, so please don’t take offense. On another note, I did feel like you did a much better job on Nony’s episode than QXC’s, perhaps you were a bit tired or out of sorts, but I digress.
I’ve already written about my disappointment with the newest season of TL Attack but in terms of some suggestions I can give the show (albeit from an uninformed opinion) I can think of a few things (and none of these are specific to you):
- Make the guest the star of the show. In the old TL Attacks, for the better episodes, we got to dive into the mind of the guest and gain insight into how he approaches the game. I’m not saying you guys need to drop the trash talk completely as there is definitely a place for it (although I do think that would be a good idea if it is clear that any given guest is not comfortable with it), but hearing the player talk about his approach to any given game is what makes TL Attack so unique from watching tournaments or replays.
- Use questions and comments from IRC instead of using questions from a thread. The live environment of IRC makes things feel spontaneous and fresh, and just the sheer amount of people online within it will make all parties involved more excited.
- In fact, use IRC for selecting players too. I don’t see the need for having a thread for it when in IRC the guests can choose their players. This benefits the show in three ways, it makes the guest star feel more like a star by giving him more control (also raising his ego by seeing how many people want to play him), makes the viewers more involved, and it also lets the players and commentators catch a break between games. A counterargument to choosing to use IRC to select players would be that it increases time on an already lengthy show but, as I recall in the past, finding opponents rarely took more than 5 minutes.
- Find a sponsor. Here’s where I’m really out of my element. I don’t know the logistics of this or if it is even a possibility with Starcraft II. What I can say is that it added a welcome layer of professionalism to the show in the past and the mousepad provided by razer made things much more intense, and made for quite a few interesting games. An intro would be awesome too but I imagine this would require a LOT of work so it likely isn’t an efficient investment.
- I think having guest commentators would be an interesting idea to explore as well. With Starcraft II there has been quite a few “big names” in the casting community, quite a bit bigger than a lot of the players themselves. Getting some of them onboard could bring an interesting dynamic, as well as gaining publicity that would bring a whole lot of viewers.
These are a few things to think about, but i’ve read several of the comments and it does seem like many people are perfectly happy with a smaller-scale TL Attack, so maybe change isn’t necessary and it is just necessary for me to accept it. That being said I think this show has massive potential, especially considering the huge flock of new players that came with Starcraft II who have never heard of Team Liquid. Chill and a few others have mentioned that the skill deferential between the top players and the average team liquid regular is not wide enough; this could be true, and the only way to overcome that if it is true is to have the absolute top tier of players, by which I mean Idra, TLO, etc. as the guest stars. Or maybe the key is simply to wait.
Anyways I know it’s been a long read (and a long write for me) but hopefully this has been helpful and I wish you guys luck with whichever direction you feel the show should take.
It seems easier for top players to lose to chobos in sc2 than in sc1. In sc1 when you are way better than someone you can go for the most ridiculous crap like a super fast arbiter rush and win. But in sc2 you make one mistake and its over >.<.
On Topic: I don't see the big deal with the complaints about commentary, INC was just being his old self, and so was chill, I like it that way .
This episode was definitely better than the first one. I actually quite like the idea of "The Chill and iNcontroL Talkshow" but this doesn't mean that the players have to be just the background. I don't think that you are doing it intentionally but that's the way it is at the moment. Perhaps you need to do more serious briefing with both the main guest and the randoms. Spontaneity is great but having a script could be great as well as long as you don't overdo it.
Another issue is that for me the episodes feel a bit too long when viewed on YouTube. Watching a live cast is a completely different experience and I usually welcome the breaks between games. However, when watching the recording I found myself skipping through some parts, so I for one would be happy if you start cutting some chunks and uploading an edited version. Of course, someone will have to do the additional amount of work and you might not have the time to, so it's up to you.
Anyway, perhaps the biggest problem you've had for this series is that the guests stop talking when they concentrate. I think I have an idea for a game mode you might actually want to include and I'll try to explain it step by step.
1. Pick a decent Diamond player to play against your guest - but make sure he's not too good - and instruct both of them to try their best.
2. Try your best to distract the guest with a series of questions. They might be on a specific topic, randoms from IRC or anything as long as there is a ton of them. Ideally the questions will be entertaining but that's not a must.
3. Penalise the guest for not answering fast enough or in a satisfactory manner. To be able to penalise him, one of the casters has to start the game from the same team and be given shared control.
A mild penalty could be wasting energy for scans/transfusion/chrono boost. Others could be getting workers on/off gas, putting them on move one after another instead of mining, cancelling shift-commands and upgrades and so on. Accidental storms, decloaking/unburrowing, picking up/dropping units, etc.: the possibilities are endless.
The guest has to be aware that the levels of bullying are dependent on providing fast and meaningful answers. This way he will have an incentive to either be entertaining by talking or by choosing to accept the handicaps and to overcome them with skill. Naturally, the casters have to make sure they're not screwing around too much in order to keep the game balanced.
Playing more than one game like this per episode would probably become boring pretty soon but that's unnecessary anyway. With time both you and your viewers will come up with ideas for other game modes and this will add up to the diversity of the show.
P.S. Oh, and I'd appreciate picking me for the role of "decent Diamond player" in case you like the idea.
I just finished watching the VOD and thoroughly enjoyed this series. Games were entertaining and the commentators were genuinely funny, this was much better than the first series imo.
Awesome to see that qxc was willing to risk losing games to pull off weird strats, that's what makes it more fun.
So just a thought, since there is a lot of 'skill gap not great enough' , i think that has largely to do with the signups coming from TL. I think a way to get a more appropriate opponent for the guest is to just make a custom game (mellee), and ask whoever joins if they mind playing in the match. That way you get a variety of people, many of which will not know whats coming. I play some custom games so I can focus timing down...and I think many of my opponents would have difficulty fending off that SCV push from game 1. just a thought. (also the inevitable rage or amazement from the other party can feed the content a bit ).
The issue is you're pitting low-mid Diamond against high diamond. That isn't that huge a skill difference. It's hard to pull off random bullshit against someone who is actually pretty decent. Need to find more randoms to play somehow. Maybe make a post on Battle.net forums?
I do like Chill and Incontrol. They work well together. Hopefully in the next TLA I can be reminded yet again that Incontrol does in fact have a girlfriend because he's just gotta let the stream know every TLA.
After reading eleven pages of criticism and compliments, I'd like to throw my own two cents out there.
Firstly, I'd like to say that I absolutely love the dynamic duo of Chill and iNcontrol. I've read a lot of people commenting that iNcontrol was overly mean or that he dominated the commentary, but I seriously never thought that even once while I was watching the VODs on YouTube (which I did before reading all of the posts in this thread, so I was just enjoying the show). I really, really like how funny these two commentators are, especially iNcontrol, with his accents and very dry, sarcastic humor. I laughed almost constantly while watching this episode as well as the first one, and really had a great time with it. There were many great jokes, but I think my favorite was during qxc's mass Raven game, where, after he won, iNcontrol said, "Well, here we have a completely passive unit made almost entirely of gas, defeating a Protoss player" (not verbatim, but pretty close) with sort of a shocked, defeated tone, utterly speechless at the Terran imbalance.
Secondly, I really thought that qxc did a pretty solid job too! He was decently talkative (much more so then Tyler) and is a pretty funny guy, but most of all, he was a really good sport. Simply put, if iNcontrol or Chill told him to do something ridiculous, he gladly did so. I remember that at one point in a TvZ, iNcontrol told qxc to mass Planetary Fortress rush the Zerg player, and literally 5 seconds later, qxc had four Command Centers building XD. He was a great sport who went along for the ride, but it was also really impressive to see qxc play seriously too in that last game. It was amazing to see the difference in "messing around mode" and "qxc hero mode", where all of a sudden he just became a mega beast and crushed the two guys playing against him. Really well done in my honest opinion qxc!
Thirdly, since Chill and iNcontrol have asked for some criticism, I'd like to be constructive. Please note that I thoroughly enjoyed the first two shows, and frankly, I don't think that the mean jokes or the mockery need to be turned down at all - leave it as is, and get down and dirty with it fellas!
I think that the biggest thing that I would like to see changed is the "mass one ridiculous unit and crush a noob" sort of approach that was featured in the last couple of episodes. Massing units is fun, but I think that it doesn't showcase the guest's talent enough, and in and of itself, isn't terribly exciting to watch. Personally (and I know that a couple of other people voiced this same opinion), I would rather have certain restrictions placed on the guest each game - different restrictions in different games - and then allowing them to play standard beyond that. An example for one game in the series might be: you cannot use any Command Center abilities, nor can you take more than two extra expansions, or perhaps making the guest star play off-race. Of course I am just spitballing here, but I'm sure better ideas could be come up with after a bit of brainstorming.
I would agree that a bit more structure could be implemented into each show as well, and by that I mean simply reducing some of the randomness of it all. I think that the totally random map selection is a bit dodgy (the island map made the pace of the game go really slow, for example). I don't think a ton of planning needs to go into the show, but maybe simple things like having a specific, pre-determined map set should implemented, as well as having the guest choose the next player over IRC so that you can be sure that the selected players will be present and ready to go. Little things such as these could go a long way toward making the show run a bit more smoothly.
Finally, I would agree that the guest needs to be pre-screened (to a degree) to make sure that they will be talkative throughout the entirety of the show (and maybe even that they'll have a good sense of humor and join in on the comedic banter). Personally, I think that qxc did a great job, but Tyler was a bit quiet due to microphone problems. Making sure that the guest is at least as talkative as qxc was could really help out the show and "make him more of a star" as a few people have asked for. This may not be the easiest thing to do, but I'm guessing that it is possible.
I hope that this criticism helps! Chill and iNcontrol did a wonderful job in both episodes in my honest opinion, and I hope some of these simple changes are implemented that will make the show even more enjoyable than it already is, while keeping the heart and soul of TL:A! the same - wild and untamed. Keep it up guys!
To me, IncontroL does appear to take over the cast and detract from the enjoyment of the match by talking about things completely unrelated to the match and by making all kinds of aggressive side comments. He's a fantastic player and a good announcer as well when he does direct his comments to what is going on in the match. But yes, I have to agree that his aggressive dominance over the cast causes me as the viewer to lose interest in the match. I also understand that these TL Attacks have become somewhat of a 'roast' of the player. But at the same time a 15 minute converstation about how charliemurphy gets plastered isn't my idea of a good time during qxc's matches.
Edit~! I do have to give qxc props on having a good attitude trying out new bizzare strategies that no one has seen before and having fun with it! That was the best part of the TL Attack, how qxc didn't care about winning or losing, but just having fun.
imo, Incontrol is the highlight of TL:A, i know he shouldn't be, but he is like the perfect guy with Chill, and if you can get more guys like qxc(who can talk and be funny/ironic/sarcastic) it works great!
Please, don't listen to those who don't like Incontrol's style. I, like a lot of other people it seems, loved the sarcasm and loved the random stories. There are enough politically-correct casters and there are enough game analysers.
On August 24 2010 04:11 Lglow wrote: So just a thought, since there is a lot of 'skill gap not great enough' , i think that has largely to do with the signups coming from TL. I think a way to get a more appropriate opponent for the guest is to just make a custom game (mellee), and ask whoever joins if they mind playing in the match. That way you get a variety of people, many of which will not know whats coming. I play some custom games so I can focus timing down...and I think many of my opponents would have difficulty fending off that SCV push from game 1. just a thought. (also the inevitable rage or amazement from the other party can feed the content a bit ).
Fixing the skill gap problem shouldn't be corrected by getting worse players to beat, but better players to play. No disrespect to QXC or Nony. For Nony at least, it's more of an issue of where he's not developed enough to know exactly how much he can get away with, I haven't seen this latest episode but I have no idea about QXC.
Watching someone do a joke strategy vs. a helpless bronze, silver, gold, plat player is not the least bit exciting.
Not sure why there is so many negative posts. I think this was even better than the first. I love Tyler but his mic problems was unfortunate. Qxc was in my opinion great, he did some crazy strats and to me it's just what I want from TLA. So good job
Chill was great once again and Incontrol performed well too. Never I got the feeling that he was too harsh on qxc :o He was clearly joking and not intending it in any bad way.
I hope next one can be a zerg player who can try some crazy proxy hatch and double proxy evo strategies :D Nobody have really tapped into zergs cheese capabilities yet so looking forward to it
Great job so far and just don't stop with the crazy strategies and games!
Both episodes really entertained me, lol. Incontrol makes me laugh so damn much, and contrary to many posting that say they don't like the completely random side stories, they're my favorite part lol. The random tangents are hilarious, and so is the "roast" aspect of the show. Keep it up :D I'll continue to tune in, for sure!
wow, this is a fun event and ppl throwing shit all over the place
I thought incontrol and chill are amazing for this event and incontrols ability for witty remarks is hard to find, and chill laughter is so contagious I laugh throughout the cast
but TLA really depends on the guest Tiler in Ep1 was awesome with him being very good at random retard builds and thinking on his feet with it, but no mic bummed it out Ep 2 that guy I've heard of QXC at least had a mic to talk back, but it seems like he dosnt take losses very well and didnt seem comfortable with maybe losing to someone random and just had to play solid throughout and his random retard builds turned it to actually just killing ppl outright. were was the mass hellion / raven builds? 200/200 marine builds?
incontrol and chill have been doing an amazing job and making these casts for the community is top notch
at no point did I ever feel like incontrol was out to verbally abuse anyone
Felby: I'm assuming you haven't seen previous seasons of TLA but this particular episode wasn't as good as most episodes in the past. If you didn't think there was any awkwardness then your social norms detector is a bit off.
EPT![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/pachi/TLA/TLA3_qxc_banner.jpg)
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